General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsNeed DU advice on a new car
Hi there,
Our 2003 SAAB 9.5 might be on its last legs and might need a new transmission. We've already had it rebuilt (couldn't afford another car then) and it's been giving us problems lately.
That said - hubby want another wagon, not an AWD (we do Chicago suburban driving at most) and need room to haul wood (he's a wood worker) and his goalie gear. I'm fine with his wants/needs. My needs are just that - needs: I need to be able to see when I'm backing up (don't trust cameras and sensors) and it has to last at least 20 years. Not joking. We just got rid of our 1987 Honda Accord.
So we're looking at the Subaru Outback (about $35k), Volvo XC70 (about $45k). Anything else we should look at? We just want it to last. I have a personal soft spot for the Volvos (LOVED my 850) and I really like our current VW Jetta (the VW Golf Wagon seems a bit small). We don't want an SUV or crossover (if we can avoid it).
So any suggestions? We're looking now but hopefully can buy by year end.
Thanks!
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)When I first had one I was slow to trust it, and it felt so wrong not to be always looking over my shoulder when reversing. But I got used to it fairly quickly and now I depend on it.
Travis_0004
(5,417 posts)2017 or 2019 I believe. As such most manufacturers are making them standard equipment to get ahead of the regulations.
OriginalGeek
(12,132 posts)I am looking forward to getting one soon. I don't need a big Silverado but I do need to haul stuff. Plus I like the way they look.
Don't know how they would fit into OP's needs but the Colorado is the truck for me.
Rainforest green, please.
B Calm
(28,762 posts)mirrors as your backup camera. Want to laugh your ass off, watch people trying to back down a boat ramp looking over their shoulder.
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)BeyondGeography
(39,377 posts)even though they are smaller. Not telling you anything you don't know since you own one, but our Jetta has almost as much room in the back as the Audi allroad we used to own at about 1/2 the price and almost 2x the mileage. Of course, it's one of those illegal TDI's, but you still get 36 mpg with the gas version.
Our lease is up in August and we'll be sticking with VW. Much better value and I actually like the smaller size because I'm driving/parking in town a lot.
Dem2
(8,168 posts)Sorry, can't help ya...
hamsterjill
(15,223 posts)Only GM products here. Long family history. Never had a major issue with one.
LuckyTheDog
(6,837 posts)I also once owned a Ford and before that, an AMC Matador. I have never had a real "lemon."
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)In my experience Volvos aren't worth the extra $. Subarus are good cars but overpriced to my way of thinking.
Hyundai makes good cars, too.
The Toyotas I would recommend are all either SUVs or crossovers, but in my experience they are definitely cars that are engineered to last. Nissan is the same way.
And I second the thing about the backup camera- they're actually a really good idea.
840high
(17,196 posts)Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)I'm partial to Japanese cars. I admit it.
Hyundais are good, too, though.
malaise
(269,157 posts)womanofthehills
(8,758 posts)My 2nd Toyota -
Zorro
(15,749 posts)Zoom zoom.
Passionate drivers know I'm right. I buy nothing but Mazdas, over 25 years now. At the moment I drive a 2014 Mazda6. It's a gem. And it handles like a sports car.
Plus they survived the nuclear bombing of Hiroshima and came back as the best damn automaker on the planet. I love my cars' Hiroshima badges.
Zorro
(15,749 posts)Don't drive it as much as I'd like to, but taking it out on a sunny day with the top down always puts a smile on my face.
It's been pretty bulletproof over the years, too.
handmade34
(22,757 posts)Spider Jerusalem
(21,786 posts)Demonaut
(8,924 posts)I drive a 2014 3 series
metroins
(2,550 posts)Personally, we're getting an XC90 next year, as they're releasing an autopilot feature similar to Tesla. We're leasing it because in 2020 hopefully they'll be fully autonomous. I'm a huge Volvo fan.
If you're hauling wood or dealing with snow, I'd feel more comfortable personally with the Subaru but Volvo has extreme safety measures. I think the Subaru might be more reliable and better handling in snowy areas. I trust Subaru quality and handling.
I'm not sure if the XC70 has it, but Volvos can actually move the seats sideways during a T bone accident to protect the drivers a little more. They also can send a sound instantaneously before an accident that dampens your hearing loss. I mean Volvo just makes safe cars. We bought a Range Rover a month ago and I'm planning to trade it in on that XC90 next year.
Esse Quam Videri
(685 posts)They have made it a stated goal of zero deaths in their vehicles by 2020.
hunter
(38,325 posts)I like it. I'll keep it running as long as I can. I'm fairly skilled as a shade-tree mechanic.
Cars suck. They are not worth my time or my money, and it pisses me off that I'm expected to own one.
840high
(17,196 posts)knock on wood - going strong. Hate buying new cars.
Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)But I'm a good shade tree mechanic and a former professional electromechanical diagnostician and people are willing to give me a lot of rides or let me use their car because I can and do save them a ton of money on maintenance and minor repairs. I have access to a beat up old pickup about 99% of the time and several other nicer vehicles if I want because of this.
It's a way of not having to own a car if you have the skills and maybe know a few people.
riderinthestorm
(23,272 posts)My 2006 XC pulls haywagons, light horse trailers, and the occasional U-Haul.
It has also packed a 1/2 ton of bagged feed while entertaining 3 boisterous dogs pummelling the interior, and more take-out food.than you can imagine.
In other words, it's been abused lol, and shows little to no problems from it. I'm at 150k on the odometer. I plan on double that before I give it up.
It's the safest car bar none. Love this car and will probably own Volvos from here on out (full disclosure I've also owned Ford and Chevy trucks, Saab,VW and Honda cars).
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)I don't have any suggestions though with what you are looking for.
Kelvin Mace
(17,469 posts)Great gas mileage and decent room. Very reliable.
Freethinker65
(10,036 posts)Is a bit less $ than the Outback and sits up higher on the road with lots of window area to see around. It is basically a wagon. We live in the Chicago area and bought a 2016 Forester last November. It is a lot bigger than our 2006 Forester, with more safety features and better mpg. We splurged on premium packages and it was under 35k (love the rear camera, basic GPS, and eyesight features). The Subarus also take regular gas, while the BMWs, Mercedes, and even Acuras we were considering advised using premium.
WillowTree
(5,325 posts)My last 2 cars have been Hyundai (after driving an Acura for 13 years) and I've been very happy with them. The Santa Fe seems to get excellent reviews from both the pros and owners on Edmunds and the 5 yr/10 yr warranty can't be beat. Just one thing, though....... I don't know where you are in the area, but if you do decide to check them out, feel free to PM me as there's one suburban dealer I'd highly recommend avoiding.
Good luck on whatever you decide to go with.
Doctor Jack
(3,072 posts)My wife has a 1997 outback and it refuses to die. And odds are you can find a used one for quite a bit cheaper than $35,000 that would still last years(although be careful, since Subarus from about 10 years ago had a lot of gasket issues which will cost a few grand to fix). And they are all AWD, which may not seem necessary in June but when we lived in Chicago, it was amazing have AWD in the snow and ice.
Otherwise, I have had a lot of luck with Kia. Affordable and reliable. My 2008 Sportage has 150,000 miles and has gone with me on the many moves that I have taken across the country. I brought it in recently to be evaluated for any problems and the only issue after all these years is that the power steering fluid needed to be topped off.
Abq_Sarah
(2,883 posts)A '97 and a '98, both with over 300K miles each and they refuse to die. If you do the maintenance, replace the timing belts when necessary and keep up with your fluid levels, they just keep going and going and going... And yes, both of them had the infamous head gasket issues but once they were replaced, it's been smooth sailing.
lumberjack_jeff
(33,224 posts)Except that my youngest covets it for when he gets his license.
... Or at least now he does after one of his peers called it "a sick ride, dude". As best I can figure, this was a good thing.
Buy a used one so he doesn't feel guilty loading lumber.
Do they still salt the roads up there?
Ford F-150
(72 posts)Would like to thank all of you for your support...
Egnever
(21,506 posts)I recently shopped cars and I had a lot of motivation to buy a Ford. When I compared them to similarly priced Hondas they didn't come close. Even with a deep discount I was getting if I bought the Ford I couldn't justify it.
Some models are fine but in the sedan class the options were complete crap.
Ford F-150
(72 posts)http://www.autotrader.com/car-reviews/2014-ford-fusion-vs-2014-honda-accord-which-is-better-227629
"When it comes to building a midsize family sedan, Honda doesn't mess around. As appealing as the latest Ford Fusion might be, the 2014 Accord is still the better car."
Lots of opinions out there.
In my opinion the feel of the Honda was and is far superior to the fusion. The leg room in the backseat of the Honda is also superior which was important to me with kids as is the safety ratings on the Honda which are better as well. The resale value on the Honda versus the ford is much better as well.
There are more things I could mention but those alone were big reasons for me to choose the Honda despite a family discount at Ford.
Travis_0004
(5,417 posts)sufrommich
(22,871 posts)Ford F-150
(72 posts)Have representation with worker protections and a guaranteed real living wage?
Travis_0004
(5,417 posts)B Calm
(28,762 posts)pissed me off!
LiberalFighter
(51,044 posts)1939
(1,683 posts)Unless it interferes with their "lifestyles" and then wonder where Reagan Democrats come from.
To that!
OriginalGeek
(12,132 posts)but I'm a little short...
sufrommich
(22,871 posts)their personal choices that killed American manufacturing.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)We didn't all wake up one morning and go "oh, Japanese cars sound like fun" ... the stuff coming out of Detroit was simply not dependable.
And as much as people try to say "they're better, now" - in addition to being an acknowledgement of a problem in the past, which caused the situation ... still EVERY damn time I get an American car as a rental (because the foreign ones are considered the "premium" cars, hmmm) there is something wrong with it. Every damn time.
I was in Tucson not that long ago and I rented... I don't know, it was a Ford Escobar or something*, brand spanking new, literally had like 50 miles on it. Granted, it was Arizona so it was hot, but 10 miles out from the airport the thing just died. Kaput. Pfffffffffffffffffft. Brand new car. Didn't overheat, didn't have anything obviously wrong with it, it just stopped working. Entirely. And yes, it had a full tank of gas.
If this had been a random outlier, okay... but like I said.
If I'm gonna plunk down, like, 30Gs on something, I want it to be dependable and as a bonus I don't want it to steer like a wet noodle.
Sorry.
* I realize that's not the actual name
sufrommich
(22,871 posts)gone with "fuck those UAW workers".
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)The primary one being a reasonable expectation that when you put the key in the ignition the thing is going to take you from point A to B.
sufrommich
(22,871 posts)hanging onto that tired stereotype of American cars and the people who make them.I hear a lot of squawking from so-called progressives who bemoan the death of union manufacturing jobs in the U.S. and call for tougher trade restrictions and yet fail to put their money where their mouth is.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)My "tired stereotypes" are based upon direct experience. You'll note, as well, I've never blamed the workers- I blame the auto execs, the ones in Detroit who coasted along for decades without recognizing they needed to change, because the world had changed.
It's not the workers' fault.
Manufacturing jobs have gone away because the world is changing, and it's going to change more. Most of that stuff will eventually be done by robots, so in the final analysis whether people prefer Ford or Hyundai isn't going to make a whole ton of difference.
The real question is how to we as a society and a species adapt to the world of the future. The past isn't coming back.
But none of that is going to change the fact that an automobile is an important, expensive, and mission-critical enough purchase that I'm going to buy the one I consider reliable, period, end of fucking story.
Ford F-150
(72 posts)I'm sure you can sleep better that way.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)Oh, yeah, that every damn time I rent an american car, it has something funky wrong with it, like a major mechanical problem.
It would appear im not the only one suffering from this "delusion" that certain cars are more reliable, too. Hmmm. Weird.
pangaia
(24,324 posts)Someone has decided you are anti-union, anti-american. and it's all your fault.
Plus, you are dealing with 'plug-and-play' answers.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)That likely will not be for a very long time, though, because....
Ah, never mind.
Travis_0004
(5,417 posts)But American cars are not as reliable.
I blame engineering, R&D the most, but when Im buying a 30,000 car, I want it to last as long as possible.
LiberalFighter
(51,044 posts)Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)ileus
(15,396 posts)with more than 30k miles he'd walk away from.
Today I don't mind buying a 20yo American Truck with 150k miles. Times have changed.
alarimer
(16,245 posts)They failed for years to compete, for whatever reason. And they are still less well-made, with cheaper materials and lousy design. Honda, Toyota, etc usually top the Consumer Reports best buy lists.
In addition, plenty of "American" cars are actually made in other countries. And Fiat owns Chrysler now, which makes Chrysler about as American as Budweiser, which is owned by a Belgian conglomerate. To say nothing of parts, which may come from all over the place.
It is more complicated than simply "Buy American". How much of the car has to be made in the US to qualify?
BeyondGeography
(39,377 posts)Do Americans even make them anymore? Same with compact trucks there, Mr. F-150. Ford used to make a good one until it sucked and they stopped competing. The whole sector was left to Toyota and Nissan for a couple of years before Chevy stepped up with the Colorado.
alarimer
(16,245 posts)Or hatchbacks. I have a Mazda 3, which I like.
Even the Nissan and Toyota small trucks are not exactly "small" anymore.
BeyondGeography
(39,377 posts)Same with compact trucks, which, you're right, aren't compact anymore, but they're nuch smaller than the monsters that Detroit prefers to churn out.
The point is foreign manufacturers are the clear option for many car buyers and trying to guilt them for it is bullshit.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)Demonaut
(8,924 posts)SeattleVet
(5,478 posts)Subaru just seems to keep going, and going. In many areas of the country they really hold their value, too. They have a few new models that seem to be more of a workhorse than the new Outback models (which are MUCH larger than the older ones)...the newer Crosstrek seems to be a suitable replacement for a late-90's Outback, at a decent price.
Recursion
(56,582 posts)If you feel like paying the freight from India...
Ilsa
(61,697 posts)I love my rear camera. It helps me see further around because it's convex, I think. Also, I suspect insurance companies will soon require them on most new models.
aikoaiko
(34,183 posts)I'm a big guy and Volvo seats are luxurious compared to Suburu seats. Even if you only do one or two long trips a year, I'd go for the Volvo.
But Suburus are well made and reliable. They will get the job done and be less expensive to maintain. Plus cost 10K less to begin with.
ileus
(15,396 posts)Especially if you want routine maintenance that's easy and somewhat cheap. There's absolutely zero way I'd be considering a Volvo or VW unless I had an unlimited maintenance budget, and didn't mind the higher risk of getting a 20 year lemon that needs continuous maintenance once you hit 150k.
The Subaru....the only issue I know with their owners is sometime sketchy tire wear. Is it because of the owners? Or the AWD system? I tend to avoid complicated drivetrains once high mileage comes into play (10+ years)
Consider buying a 20yo pickup or something in the 2500 buck range as a second "work / play" vehicle.
rogerashton
(3,920 posts)though you will gather that I am not a guy who keeps his car for decades. Though my wife is determined not to give up her '06 Outback.
I have a 2015 Legacy sedan. All Subarus are AWD -- but the recent ones have a "continuous" chain transmission that saves gas, roughly offsetting the increased gas consumption from applying traction continuously to 4 wheels. I find this more responsive (mostly) than a standard transmission, though not so much at very slow speeds. I do like AWD in a Philadelphia area climate, warmer I think than Chicago, but it is worth having in rain -- and getting off our cul-de-sac can be a thrill. Up-to-date cars have pushbutton ignitions. I pretty much don't like them, but two lessons: Don't let the battery get low. If it is a little low, and the starter is unresponsive, turn the car off, wait 60 seconds for the onboard computer to clear, and hold the button down until the car starts and is running. Then get the battery checked. I don't think that is Subarus in particular, but my only long-term experience with pushbutton start is with the Subaru sedan.
AngryAmish
(25,704 posts)I hope she has 5 more years in her. My next car will drive itself.
Stinky The Clown
(67,817 posts)Every adjustment, every oil change, every timing belt replacement.The dealer, of course, for all work while under warranty, but find an honest, dependable shop and stick with them. That shop can be the dealer or an indy shop.
Yes, some cars may have a better reputation for longevity than some others, but most any car will last a very long time when well maintained.
Demonaut
(8,924 posts)ileus
(15,396 posts)I run oil changes out to 7 or 8k, never replaced a timing belt, most never changed the tranny or diff fluid. Only replaced the coolent and brake fluid on a few.
So far knock on wood I've never had one drive train failure. Wheel bearings, CV joints regular wear items.
Granted I don't keep most more than 10 (though I've had my jeep 18 years now) years and never buy myself a new vehicle instead always picking up something off my Brother or BIL I drive them for 3-10 years then move on usually because they develop rust. (even though I'm crazy on detail work and wash most vehicles 15-30 times a year)
I just replaced the brakes and rotors on my 2005 Sentra Saturday...Next is the shocks and struts. I'd really like to do the timing belt, but the last one I had changed (84 chevette in 1988) it broke 4 days later and had to be replaced again. I'd also like to replace the belt on our Xterra, but again I worry mess with it and we'll be replacing the engine.
Take it easy on a car don't drive it like a race car or an 18yo and I don't think the "well maintained" is as important as well treated driving wise. I can make a 40 dollar tire from Wal-Mart last 40,000 miles. I can take a slipping AT tranny and drive it 5 years.
tanyev
(42,601 posts)We've been very happy with both. Very reliable and the service department at the dealership here is great--quick, competent service and loaner vehicles if something is going to take awhile.
B Calm
(28,762 posts)and I hear the gas mileage is good.
fizzgig
(24,146 posts)dad got me a 740 three years ago and my 82 245 gave up the ghost less than a year later.
nope, don't have an attachment to volvo at all.
PoliticAverse
(26,366 posts)wryter2000
(46,077 posts)My 1992 1600DL ran for over 250K miles. However, the bodies tend to rust out in places where they throw salt on the road. We don't have that problem in Oakland.
LuckyTheDog
(6,837 posts)And they don't rust all that much.
LuckyTheDog
(6,837 posts)Built in Canada, by union workers -- and pretty nice. Built on a Volvo-derived platform.
forthemiddle
(1,382 posts)We want the 6 cylinder, and they are almost impossible to find. Every single time a local dealer had one on the lot that we wanted to test drive, the car sold that day! I am not exaggerating, we have been looking for 6 weeks We are planning to drive to Milwaukee this weekend just to be able to test drive the 6cylinder model.
One thing though, you said you didn't want an AWD? The Outbacks are AWD.
Alex4Martinez
(2,198 posts)If so, I can highly recommend the Chevy Volt, with fold down seats it acts like a Prius, only bigger with big flat storage behind the seats.
Yes, it's also electric all the time for 30+ miles then switches to burning gas to generate electricity.
And, no maintenance. I'm at 40,000 miles and had one oil change. The maintenance schedule requires nothing but tire rotations and an oil change every 24 months.
AND, it will charge on a standard outlet.
I love my Chevy Volt and I'm a person who really loved my Volvo and Camry wagons.
This is better because I can go days and days and never burn a drop of gasoline.
Check it out.
mopinko
(70,197 posts)got a ringing endorsement of the new fords from my very curmudgeonly mechanic. he drives an escape.
i really need the driver assist tech. 61, always was a shitty driver. just got chopped by state farm for too many fender benders.
i have been driving tanks for quite a while, and now that it is just me, i want a nice small, efficient car.
i have never bought a new car, but have a chance now.
and doesnt every middle aged divorcee need a nice sporty car?
ruby red baby.