It's been a while since I asked, so ....

[Scuba]

If we can't afford to educate our children, to heal our sick or tend to our elderly, just what is it the defense budget is defending?

[Half-Century Man]

1. Wall Street.

Much the same that our aggressive interference policies are tools of market acquisition.

[daleanime]

18. +1

[deutsey]

23. Smedley Butler agreed

[Ernesto]

69. My USMC HERO!.................n-t

[Duppers]

92. +100

Yet, try telling this to a winger.

[noiretextatique]

119. War is a racket eom

[Fast Walker 52]

47. BINGO.

[heaven05]

68. +10000

[stellanoir]

98. basic natural law: Any entity that

spends more on its defense than it spends on its self nourishment will eventually exhaust itself, & is investing only in its own demise.

[Duval]

124. +2

[NorthCarolina]

2. The pocket books and net worth of the "fortunate"

and their minions.

[lame54]

3. oil...

the oil that is rightfully ours that happens to be under other countries

[LibDemAlways]

30. How true....The original name of the Iraq War was

Operation Iraqi Liberation. Cheney and his posse weren't fooling around in their quest to liberate Iraq's liquid gold.

[lame54]

31. Check out this vid I made years ago...

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x268em_guns-n-roses-welcome-to-the-jungle_news

[Pakhet]

60. OMG mom? Is that you?

I swear my mother has said those exact words usually combined with "make a parking lot" I swear, I don't think in was born into this family, I was snatched!

[KG]

4. trade routes. as always.

[pampango]

5. It's defending AMERICA, god dammit! It's defending our FREEDOM (to underfund schools,

to not provide the health care that other developed countries have figured out how to do, to not prioritize taking care of the elderly, to provide tax cuts for the rich, to let our infrastructure crumble, etc.)

Those evil ferriners are not going to take away all these FREEDOMS and more if we just pay for a huuuuuuuge military.

[DemocracyDirect]

6. For the empire...

... of Imperial Corporations.

[think]

7. Excellent question. /nt

[tk2kewl]

8. conquest

[tk2kewl]

9. Cost of Wars...

Total Cost of Wars Since 2001 $1,677,917,642,877

Every hour, taxpayers in the United States are paying
$8.36 million for Total Cost of Wars Since 2001.

https://www.nationalpriorities.org/cost-of/

[SCantiGOP]

10. Our precious freedom

To carry guns so we can shoot each other.

[Cryptoad]

11. Policing the World

[Scuba]

17. If that's the case, we suck at it.

[Cryptoad]

20. U got that right,

I blame the GOP for getting the rest of the World "hooked" on us being their police. Why I'm. voting for somebody that will start weaning them off the Big USA Teat!

[Scuba]

22. I don't see the rest of the world welcoming our interference, but the MIC and their stooges ...

... really, really like it.

According to opensecrets.org, Hillary is #4(!) among recipients from the defense industry (i.e., war profiteers), and is the sole Democrat among the top 14 of the list.

http://www.opensecrets.org/industries/recips.php?cycle=2016&ind=D

[Cryptoad]

26. Devils money spends just like everybody else

[floppyboo]

40. who got them hooked? Ask former SOS

Pusherman usually gets put in jail.

&feature=player_detailpage

[Cryptoad]

41. Seems that History

is pretty clear on who should bear the greatest share of the Blame. .. The GOP

[floppyboo]

43. true for the war on drugs, but there have been a few cases in the last years

of military intervention/coups. Unfortunately can't blame the GOP for those.

[Cryptoad]

51. History covers more than last couple of years

GOP's policy over the last 40 years tells me a much different story than ur Standard GOP response.

[villager]

52. ...as does constant Democratic acquiescence to those policies.

which, ironically, has brought us to the tipping point of an unsustainable Empire.

Going to make the next couple of decades all-too-interesting....

[Cryptoad]

62. History

shows for teh last 40 years that any attempts by Dems to make changes that would start the weaning of the world off our Police Teat, has been systematically blocked by the GOP

[villager]

64. Like the Iraq war vote? Passing of the Patriot Act? All those vast defense budgets?

[Cryptoad]

72. Like Democratic Party didn/t get us into Iraq

[villager]

73. You a funny guy.

[Cryptoad]

75. Truth is Funny sometimes.

[villager]

87. Made-up stuff can be pretty hilarious, too. nt

[Cryptoad]

89. I noticed

[villager]

126. During rewrite?

[floppyboo]

54. note I didn't say couple, but let's go back to Jan 2009

[Doctor_J]

95. The last 40 years, Dems have been in control of the Senate for 24 of them,

the House for 24, and the White house for 20. Are they complicit or just useless?

[Cryptoad]

133. U along with most of the GOP

dont understand what it takes to control the Senate,,,,, 60 votes.

[bvar22]

97. Bill Clinton played a BIG part in the whole disaster.

*Harsh mandatory sentencing

*The expansion of For Profit Private Prisons

20 Years Later, Parts Of Major Crime Bill Viewed As Terrible Mistake

"Twenty years ago this week, in 1994, then-President Bill Clinton signed a crime bill. It was, in effect, a long-term experiment in various ways to fight crime.

The measure paid to put more cops on the beat, trained police and lawyers to investigate domestic violence, imposed tougher prison sentences and provided money for extra <privatized> prisons.

<snip>
"We now know with the fullness of time that we made some terrible mistakes," Travis said. "And those mistakes were to ramp up the use of (privatized) prison. And that big mistake is the one that we now, 20 years later, come to grips with. We have to look in the mirror and say, 'look what we have done.'"

"If you're a black baby born today, you have a 1 in 3 chance of spending some time in prison or jail," Turner said. "If you're Latino, it's a 1 in 6 chance. And if you're white, it's 1 in 17. And so coming to terms with these disparities and reversing them, I would argue, is not only a matter of fairness and justice but it's, I would argue, a matter of national security."

Yes. That IS Hillary clapping wildly for this black mark on our history.

[font size=3]
The Clinton dynasty’s horrific legacy: How “tough-on-crime” politics built the world’s largest prison system
[/font]Over the past two decades, the Clintons' version of the "War on Drugs" has inflicted needless suffering on millions

"The explosion of the prison system under Bill Clinton’s version of the “War on Drugs” is impossible to dispute. The total prison population rose by 673,000 people under Clinton’s tenure — or by 235,000 more than it did under President Ronald Reagan, according to a study by the Justice Policy Institute. “Under President Bill Clinton, the number of prisoners under federal jurisdiction doubled, and grew more than it did under the previous 12-years of Republican rule,combined,” states the JPI report (italics theirs). The federal incarceration rate in 1999, the last year of the Democrat’s term, was 42 per 100,000 — more than double the federal incarceration rate at the end of President Reagan’s term (17 per 100,000), and 61 percent higher than at the end of President George Bush’s term (25 per 100,000), according to JPI."



<more at link>
http://www.salon.com/2015/04/13/the_clinton_dynastys_horrific_legacy_how_tough_on_crime_politics_built_the_worlds_largest_prison/

...and this doesn't even begin to talk about the corruption of "Private For Profit Prisons" that burgeoned under Clinton.

[SunSeeker]

107. You are talking about a crime bill that Bernie voted for.

Why do you have to stink up this otherwise unity thread with that divisive Dem Primary partisan shit? Want to talk wasted military dollars? How about the TRILLIONS going to fund your candidate's pet boondoggle, the F-35?
http://readersupportednews.org/opinion2/277-75/24583-bernie-sanders-doubles-down-on-f-35-support-days-after-runway-explosion

All Dems on this board agree we spend too much on defense and not enough on social programs. There is no reason to raise silly Dem primary partisan epithets in this thread to trash the Clintons, because Bernie voted for every defense budget he ever saw in Congress.

[bvar22]

109. So supporting the Clinton Administration...

..is a Black Mark for Bernie according to you?

Got it.

Like most bills, the Clinton Crime Bill DID contain some pieces that I support, even today...like funding to put 100,000 more cops on the street.
Unfortunately, Congressmen can not vote for just pieces of a bill.
They have to vote for the whole tamale.

The MIC and our government does attempt to pass around the money to all states in order to keep them dependent.
Bernie will get a base for the F-35 in his state that will provide many jobs for his state's constituents. The F-35 was/is a Done Deal. The money has already been spent.
I respect Bernie for getting a piece of that action for the workers in his state.
THAT is one of the jobs he was elected to do for the people of his state.

[Phlem]

110. +1 Spot on.

[libdem4life]

61. I believe that qualifies her as a Hawk and her supporters as approving

that fact. Just the facts...please, no one-liners or sarcasm.

[Cryptoad]

74. So by ur logic,,,,

if u accept less fromt eh Devil than somebody else u are the pure one? For Presidential candidates. Bern is only two spots below HRC in accepting Defense funding by a few thousand bucks so he is the Pure one..... geeez

[libdem4life]

77. So, make the case for Bernie as Hawk. I'll read it, think about it

and agree or disagree. He voted for support for the troops who were already in harm's way, as he should. He voted against the war.

Defense funding is not the issue I addressed. It was the political philosophy that Regime Change/War/stealing other's mineral resources/playing global policemen et all is called Hawkish.

Bernie is usually loudly criticized as a Dove/CO/not a Hawk. Boy it comes from both sides.

[Cryptoad]

78. I didnt call him a Hawk

pointing out ur logic for calling HRC is flawed. us are pushing this thread way off topic,

[Phlem]

111. So basically you can't make the case.

Thank You.

That was easy wasn't it.

[rhett o rick]

99. Clinton is the MIC's best friend. And the neocons have all endorsed her. She

will make the loss of 5 trillion over Iraq look like chicken feed. At the recent AIPAC she was rattling her sword, threatening Iran.

Heaven help out troops and their families if she is elected.

[Cryptoad]

103. One would thinkg that if HRC,,,

was MIC bbf , they would given her far more money that Bern,,,not just a few thousand$. As usual more fallacy logic

[rhett o rick]

105. "Hillary Is the Candidate of the War Machine"

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jeffrey-sachs/hillary-is-the-candidate_b_9168938.html

Are you trying to make a case saying she isn't hawkish on foreign policy? Not apt to prod Iran into war? Didn't support the Republicons invasion of Iraq. We know who she is. She will increase the defense budget and cut safety nets, but blame the REpublicons. "I couldn't stop them".

[druidity33]

116. I need a link to that stat if you want me to believe it. nt.

[Cryptoad]

123. ,,,,,,,,,,,

http://www.opensecrets.org/industries/recips.php?ind=D&cycle=2016&recipdetail=P&mem=N&sortorder=U

[druidity33]

130. So...

Over twice as much is "just a few thousand more"?

[Thespian2]

12. Global Corporations

Who need the US military to protect them while they destroy the earth...

[Kip Humphrey]

13. The Military-Industrial Complex.

[barbtries]

14. the lavish lifestyles of the MIC

silly!

[Iwillnevergiveup]

15. Propaganda instead of press n/t

[Cassiopeia]

16. Profit in all its various forms. Or more specifically

the lifestyle of the .1%

[xocet]

19. The system that supports the 1%. n/t

[Punkingal]

21. The 1%.

[AlbertCat]

24. just what is it the defense budget is defending?

Itself.

[padfun]

25. It's for security.

The kind of security that "they" need.

[randome]

27. Inertia is the simple reason the military budget remains so out of scope.

Every politician is afraid to cut because the first terrorist attack will be used as fodder against that politician, as an easy way to say, "See? Look what happens when you cut the military!"

We need a large and long-running demonstration to get the numbers back under control.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]All things in moderation, including moderation.[/center][/font][hr]

[Rex]

102. So the terrorists really did win?

How pathetic.

[Rebkeh]

28. Excellent question nt

[astrophuss42]

29. I honestly have no idea. eom

[Elmer S. E. Dump]

32. I have no response for that question. It is perplexing, eh?

[LibDemAlways]

33. It is defending the oligarchy so that the

1% can continue to amass obscene wealth. I have no doubt that if the 99% took it to the streets, the full force of the US military machine would be brought to bear against us.

[Bubzer]

34. Profits!

Or maybe prophets?
Or Profits for prophets?
Maybe even prophesizing of profits?
Or profits from prophesizing as prophets?

I should stop... I'm enjoying this a little too much.

[onecaliberal]

35. PROFITS for the banks, MIC, and every other crooked corporation under the sun.

[JohnnyRingo]

36. We have to protect the oil market.

Unlike some others, I'm not being flippant about this. When the US left the gold standard in the '60s we began backing our cash on the value of a barrel of crude. I'm sure at the time that seemed like a good idea since we were the major player in the energy game, but more and more oil was discovered in the Middle East and the situation changed.

Now known as the Petrodollar, every global purchaser of oil must first convert their currency to the US dollar at the current exchange rate. That is the only form of currency accepted by all oil producing countries. If something happens to the free movement of oil from the countries that produce it, or if a leader or royal family should lose control of said crude, it directly affects the value of every dollar in our pocket in an adverse way

The only country in the world that has a nuclear aircraft carrier force is the United States, not because we have money to burn, but because we're the only country that needs one to project our influence halfway around the world. We're the reason Sheiks and Kings don't need defense factories to protect their fragile reign from fanatics that would like to wrest control of oil production.

I'm not endorsing the policy, but until we can switch to a marijuana based economy or something, it's what we're stuck with. Oops, there's that flippancy.

[Duncan Grant]

91. +1

Thanks for this nugget of truth.

[Fumesucker]

129. That's the real reason for the Iraq war

Saddam threatened the petrodollar.

http://content.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,998512,00.html

By William Dowell/New York City Monday, Nov. 13, 2000

Europe's dream of promoting the euro as a competitor to the U.S. dollar may get a boost from SADDAM HUSSEIN. Iraq says that from now on, it wants payments for its oil in euros, despite the fact that the battered European currency unit, which used to be worth quite a bit more than $1, has dropped to about 82[cents]. Iraq says it will no longer accept dollars for oil because it does not want to deal "in the currency of the enemy."

[monicaangela]

37. The Plutocrats

[Fast Walker 52]

48. or as Bernie would say, the "billionaire class"

[monicaangela]

79. Same thing.

When people learn no tools of judgment and merely follow their hopes, the seeds of political manipulation are sown.

~~~~~ Stephen Jay Gould

Nothing explains the mind of the plutocrat better than the following quote from this man:

I can hire one half of the working class to kill the other half.

~~~~~ Stephen Jay Gould

If we don't stop maniacal individuals like this and other plutocrats from the billionaire class, we are eventually going to wind up with a violent revolution instead of the peaceful revolution that Bernie Sanders is speaking of.

[Amimnoch]

38. Agree. Let's get a Progressive congress elected, and get the bills to a Presidents desk.

Even FDR would have had no new deal if it hadn't have been for the 73rd congress to make the 100 days of legislation happen.

[libodem]

39. Good Question

[HughBeaumont]

42. Likely to assure all of the things you mentioned never happening.

The U.S.A. is in the victim-blaming, "close the drawbridge" business. They're certainly not in it for US.

[valerief]

44. It's defending the wealth of the war profiteers, of course! nt

[staggerleem]

45. Shipping lanes ...

... through treacherous waters, so the oil tankers can safely reach our shores. Yet another hidden subsidy enjoyed by big oil.

[blm]

46. Perfectly framed.

.

[Madmiddle]

49. After this election season I'm switching to Independant!

Democrats are no longer acting the way they should.

[SunSeeker]

108. Why? What Independent in Congress doesn’t vote for bloated defense budgets?

Certainly Bernie Sanders voted for every defense budget, including defending the TRILLIONS going to fund his pet boondoggle, the F-35:
http://readersupportednews.org/opinion2/277-75/24583-bernie-sanders-doubles-down-on-f-35-support-days-after-runway-explosion 

[tclambert]

50. The defense budget defends arms manufacturers from poverty.

How else can they afford to make overpriced weapons systems that don't work very well, like the F-35 fighter and the B-2 bomber?

[blackspade]

53. "Our way of life"

ie. Corporate profits and political 'donations'

[Martin Eden]

55. The answer seems pretty obvious ...

The oligarchs are defending their own interests. This generates profits for the military industrial complex, and a perpetual state of war keeps the public focused on external enemies. Manipulation through fear, bigotry, and jingoism has a proven track record.

[Scuba]

57. Succint and accurate.

[astrophuss42]

58. It's just so friggin barbaric.

[arcane1]

56. Defense Industry profits n/t

[lark]

59. I know you know the answer to this.

You're just trying to test us.

OK, I'll play. The purpose of our disgustingly large defense budget is maintaining the control of our country by the MIC. That's the entire purpose of our bloated defense budget, keeping the 1% in power.

[ConservativeDemocrat]

63. World peace

And the world is vastly more peaceful than it was even a hundred years ago.

Oh, and before you start whining that not everything is perfect, Syria is a basket case because it's a Russian client state, hosting a Russian military base on it and everything.

- C.D. Proud Member of the Reality Based Community

[Rex]

104. What a bullshit answer.

Do you ever answer anything truthfully? Ever?

[ConservativeDemocrat]

112. Your inability to recognize reality doesn't make me untruthful...

I would pull out some links for you to peruse, but you really don't sound like someone that lets neutral, objective, facts persuade you. So I'll just answer your question and say, "Yes - I answer things truthfully all the time. The proof of which is a google away, for anyone who wishes to research it."

- C.D. Proud Member of the Reality Based Community

[kristopher]

65. The defense budget is defending itself. nt

(bumpty bump)

[DemocracyDirect]

66. Clearly we need 13 nuclear powered aircraft carriers.

What else could be manufactured with such profit?

And there are more past Republican Presidents that need one named after them...

Sailing

Ronald Reagan
George H W Bush

Coming Soon

Gerald R Ford

Apparently they are building a John F Kennedy. Interesting how that is down the road after all the Republicans got one.

[Uncle Joe]

67. The freedom to be ignorant, sick, bankrupt and stressed out.

Thanks for the thread, Scuba.

[OnyxCollie]

70. "National interests"

Those of big banks and oil companies.

[malthaussen]

71. Um, profits. n/t

[AgerolanAmerican]

76. the defense budget is defending

the defense budget

[jillan]

81. Scuba - add voting to that.

[Scuba]

82. You are very wise.

[jillan]

83. Nope - not wise. Just happen to live in Arizona ;) nt

[CrispyQ]

85. I once posted your question on my FB page & I got 4 versions of this:

This is the mindset of so many republicans - the rugged individualist makes it on his own. They forget all the things a community pot pays for that they take advantage of & only think of the things they don't like - the social safety net, cuz you know, they'll never need it cuz they are self-made men. When you mention corporate handouts the response is that it's good for business & it's all back to the self-made men thing again. Their view of community is extremely inclusive & they don't value anyone outside of it.

[Scuba]

86. Sounds like lotsa folks here in Wisconsin. They pipe in right-wing radio to ...

... manipulate people through hate and fear and a whole lot of people fall victim to it. I'm often surprised at what I hear come from the mouths of otherwise seemingly sane and rational people.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

88. Killing children. For their own good...of course.

[Odin2005]

90. The Capitalist Class.

[Initech]

93. This:

For an industry that claims it can't withstand a round of cuts without catastrophe, the companies making up the Defense industry have a habit of showering the CEOs with cash.

The average compensation package for a CEO at one of the top five contractors in the business was $21.5 million. The Project on Government Oversight pored through Securities and Exchange Commission filings to come to the figure, looking at the books of Lockheed Martin, Boeing, General Dynamics, Northrop Grumman, and Raytheon.

This sort of makes their claims that the businesses would be absolutely devastated with forthcoming cuts ring a bit hollow.

Just a few weeks ago, Lockheed Martin's CEO and a number of his colleagues hit Capitol Hill to emphasize that the cuts could cause massive layoffs of their employees.

http://www.businessinsider.com/check-out-these-insane-defense-ceo-salaries-before-you-believe-in-the-tragedy-of-defense-cuts-2012-8

[Duppers]

94. Excellent question, Scuba.

The wise know it's Wall Street.

[oberliner]

96. All children in the US receive free public education

In what sense do you mean the first part of what you wrote?

[rhett o rick]

100. College

[Rex]

101. Wall Street and the Establishment.

And as we've seen these past few years, evidently the enemy is now the American citizen...so our defense budget protects the plutocracy put in place by the same people that own the MIC.

[mnhtnbb]

106. The right to make a buck!

What else?

[ananda]

113. Presumably the rich and their obsession ...

... with exploiting cheap labor and resources in
foreign countries.

[whereisjustice]

114. It's defending the distribution of wealth from the middle class and below to the 1%. As pols like..

Hillary take more and more from us, a strong military/police state makes sure we don't ever protest about it.

[liberalnarb]

115. The rich pricks who are too powerful to be fighting themselves. nt

[Biki]

117. Well ...

Well, that's just do nicely said. Thank you.

[CentralMass]

118. Profit.

[Fantastic Anarchist]

120. The right of the 1% to continue their exploitation

...of everyone else.

[southerncrone]

121. The 1%'s strangle-hold on the world economy with their foot on our necks.

[Silver_Witch]

122. To Make the Wealthy Richer

The Defense Budges serves only to make those who are party richer. It defends none of us - not from within or without. The wars rage on and yet we are not safe. And inside the police kill us - without retribution or righteous protection from our government.

I look forward to the time when Democrats again support freedom, peace and the support of all Americans!!!

[midnight]

125. Absolutely the best question every Scuba…..

[billhicks76]

127. Wall St

They serve bankers not people.

[whereisjustice]

128. Defending the rights of the Clinton class to send jobs to Asia while...

sending our young to prison and poverty.

[Cobalt Violet]

131. corporate socialism

[Kermitt Gribble]

132. Freedumb? n/t