a friend of mine had a terrible tragedy happen Christmas day. Her son killed himself

[demtenjeep]

she called me today asking what kind of service I would hold if it were my son.


she doesn't think she can have a service because of the circumstance and what other people will think.


I told her she only had to do what she needed to do and what she feels in her heart.



Man this world can be so cruel

[beam me up scottie]

1. My s/o's cousin recently killed himself.

We convinced his mom to have a viewing and funeral and hundreds showed up because he was so young.

His mom was shocked, touched and grateful.

I'm sorry for your friend's loss, she should do what she thinks is best of course.

[demtenjeep]

2. can I share that with her?

I think she feels so alone right now

She just doesn't understand that many have gone through this.

Suicide is more cruel than anything. The ones left behind are in so much pain from the death but also from the stigma and mess they are left with

[beam me up scottie]

3. Of course, that's why I shared.

His mom blames herself and was afraid others would judge her but everyone understands.

If she hadn't had a service I don't think she would have been able to live with her decision.

[jwirr]

27. For young people the service is both a closing and a way of

showing their concern for the friend/fellow student. That said where I live cremation has become a big thing and families often have a memorial service long after the death.

[beam me up scottie]

29. It was very hard on everyone, his girlfriend was the one who found him.

I don't think his mother will ever fully recover, it aged her.

[pinboy3niner]

4. A service would be fine, but it's her decision

My best friend killed himself one Christmas. Put a bullet in his head. My first reaction was anger and I nearly got into a fistfight because of it.

I was on the other coast and flew back to D.C. for the memorial service at Arlington Cemetery. The service was at a Ft. Meyer chapel and his ashes were interred in the columbarium at Arlington (he was a Vietnam vet, USMC).

We had a gathering of friends after the interment and that, along with the memorial service, were a huge comfort.

R.I.P. Jim and all those lost in these tragedies.

[KingCharlemagne]

41. I am very sorry for your loss - nt

[uppityperson]

5. A friend killed himself in high school. What we, his friends, thought was sadness and built that we

had failed him. The service was helpful in supporting us, getting us together when we could make no sense and felt so sad and guilty.

Any death of a child is difficult, dealing with all the other stuff with a suicide is awful.

I am sorry.

[BlueMTexpat]

6. A service is generally for the survivors

as a reminder of the good times and a coming together for support. It does not necessarily need to be held at the same time as the burial. Depending on circumstances, it is sometimes advisable to allow some distance.

But when and whether should always be decisions for those most closely involved, no one else.

[leftyladyfrommo]

7. She can have a service.

People will understand. It will give his family and friends a chance to say good bye.

I would if it was my brother or son.

[OldRedneck]

8. She needs a memorial service, or, funeral

Memorial services and funerals are for the living.

Her son did not just wake up one morning and decide to kill himself. Whatever caused him to do this was a long time in coming. In that long time, he made friends, did a lot of good, then, whatever happened slowly killed him.

Have a service. She'll be surprised at the people who remember the good times.

[LuvNewcastle]

9. I hope she's able to have a service if she wants one.

Would some denominations refuse to do a service for someone who committed suicide? I think there are, but hopefully they aren't members of any of those. I hope she's able to find some comfort from it if she has one. They say losing a child is the worst experience. It must be even worse when the child's death was a suicide. My condolences to her and her friends and family.

[Skittles]

10. she should have the service she wants and needs

she needs to think about herself and not about "what other people will think"

[etherealtruth]

11. "people" will think this was a terrible tragedy

My best friend of 45 years killed herself just before her 50th birthday. her family had a service (because they wanted a service). hundreds and hundreds of people attended .... the universal thought among "people" was that this was a horrific tragedy and that her death was a tremendous loss.

[BainsBane]

12. IMO she should have a service that she feels most comfortable with

His suicide in all probability came from Depression, and suicidality is a symptom of that disease. His family deserves to lay him to rest in a way that has meaning for them. The manner of his death doesn't change that.

[mnhtnbb]

13. My oldest son was a senior in high school when a friend of his committed suicide

in early December 2003. The parents of the boy asked my son to be an 'honorary' pallbearer at the service
which they held for him. It was difficult for him and us--because this friend had
come with us to the beach for a week the previous summer so we knew him better
than we knew a lot of our son's friends at that age.

Services and celebrations of life are really for the living and provide an opportunity
for family and friends to come together to grieve and remember. You did the right
thing to encourage her to follow her heart...to not let her son's death overshadow
his life.

[pnwmom]

14. OF COURSE she can have a service for her son if she wants! One of my niece's friends

killed herself and they had a lovely, meaningful service.

A young person who kills himself almost always has a mental illness.

Your friend should gather sympathetic friends and relatives to help her prepare. And not worry what idiots will think.

For example, the Catholic Church used to officially prohibit priests from saying funeral masses for a person who committed suicide, hoping to prevent some people from doing so. But they changed that policy long ago.

The Church's Stance
Although the Catholic Church had long prohibited funerals for suicide cases, dissenters began to challenge the taboo in the twentieth century. Following a discussion within the Church, a papal decree reversed the Church's official position on suicide in 1983, allowing Catholic families to bury their loved ones according to Catholic rites regardless of cause of death. The Church has not changed its official stance against suicide, but it does not wish to cause further aggravation to the family of the deceased. Furthermore, according to the Catholic United for the Faith website, the Church recognizes the role mental health and external factors can play in the decision to commit suicide.

The Methodists and many other denominations have also changed their position on suicide.

Recognizing that the church's historical response to suicide includes punitive measures intended to prevent suicide and that there is no clear biblical stance on suicide, the General Conference of The United Methodist Church strongly urges the employment of major initiatives to prevent suicide, following the guidelines of the National Strategy for Suicide Prevention issued by the U. S. Department of Health and Human Services. Additionally, the General Conference recommends to the boards, agencies, institutions, and local churches of The United Methodist Church that the ministry of suicide prevention should receive urgent attention. Survivors of loss through suicide and suicide attempts should also receive priority concern in the overall ministry of the Church. Harsh and punitive measures (such as denial of funeral or memorial services, or ministerial visits) imposed upon families of suicide victims should be denounced and abandoned. The church should participate in and urge others to participate in a full, community-based effort to address the needs of people at risk and their families. Each annual conference and local church should respond to issues of ministry related to suicide prevention and family-support services.

ON EDIT: This site contains lots of information about supporting families dealing with suicide, including information on views from different religious and cultural perspectives. I hope it might be useful to you and your friend.

http://www.suicidefindinghope.com/content/language_around_suicide_loss

[Snobblevitch]

15. When I was a senior in college

a 15 year old girl suffocated from carbon monoxide in the family garage two streets behind my family's house. Her boyfriend broke up with her. I did not know the girl or her family. Their garage door was always at least up a foot after that.

The older friend of my friend's big brother lost his wife to cancer. He killed himself a year later with a shotgun in his bathtub despite having a 20 year old daughter.

I had a client kill himself with pills, slit wrists, and -20°. He left a wife and three children. A year later, my boss killed himself with a shotgun in his garage. He was single with no children, but he felt responsible for the client's death.

With the exception of physical illness, suicide is a permanent sution to a temporary, or managable, problem.

[rjsquirrel]

18. No not always temporary

A terminal illness or untreatable pain syndrome is not temporary. And that little breezy truism is silly. The reason someone attempts suicide is often because a problem doesn't seem temporary at all. And many problems are not, including chronic depression. It isn't always treatable.

I'm further over on the libertarian side than most on this though. I think suicide can be a morally clear and legitimate choice whether or not you're technically terminally ill. We are all terminally ill.

[Scuba]

16. We had a beautiful service for Tyler, who took his own life in October ...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1018805000


Hundreds of people attended and several spoke about mental illness and suicide.

His father did something that moved me to tears. He brought a bag of pebbles that he and Tyler had collected from a lakeshore and asked attendees to take a pebble and hold it in their hand during a short walk that was part of the service. At the end of the walk they were to give the pebble back along with any guilt they were bearing over Tyler's death.

Later he placed the pebbles - along with the guilt - back in the lake.


Your advice that your friend do only what she needs to do is good, but there should be no shame for mental illness, no shame for suicide.

[rjsquirrel]

19. Suicide is not always caused by

"Mental Illness." Plenty of highly rational people choose to take their own life.

We recoil in psychiatric horror. But in many human cultures there are honorable forms of suicide.

[Scuba]

20. I did not mean to suggest that it was. In fact, my opinion is that it's a human right ...

... and I have long known that I would take my own life before I would allow myself to die a slow an horrific death. I don't think that's mental illness, but rational thought.

[rjsquirrel]

25. We agree about that

My life is my own, if anything else is true.

[ladyVet]

38. I'm with you, Scuba. I decided a long time ago I would not linger for years.

My wishes for termination in case of a diagnosis of no hope, such as being in a vegetative state, have been made clear to my family. My sons have agreed to honor my wishes.

[joshcryer]

21. Missed that thread, sorry to hear about that.

Quite a touching move by his father.

[Vinca]

17. How sad. You gave her good advice.

Tell her she shouldn't care what anyone else thinks. They should mind their own business.

[Stuart G]

22. Very sad, I agre, your advice was exceptional.

[Blus4u]

23. The first funeral I remember was my paternal grandfather's.

I had to be 4 or 5 years old. At the get together at my grandmother's home after the service, I was appalled at the behavior of people telling stories about the old man, and laughing and joking about him and things they remembered.

I asked my mother why they were acting like that, and she told me it was part of the grieving process and they were all sharing stories about the good things they remembered.

This is why a service or celebration of life should be held.

Peace

[karynnj]

24. the service is really for the survivors, so she should

Do what she thinks helps her and other loved ones the most. I think most religions will perform services. Because it is most likely that anyone who commits suicide is depressed, even if a religion considers it unacceptable, they consider it the result of the illness.

I can not think of anything that would make me more in need of the closure that a service, religious or not, would have .... even knowing that this is something that will always hurt.

[2naSalit]

26. My sister committed suicide this year

it was hard to get through but another sister, who handles our elderly mother's affairs, took command of all issues. Together we decided on a simple service, to bury her ashes, family who could get there and several friends of my sister's came. It was the closure we needed, simple and final.

This friend of yours can have whatever arrangement she feels appropriate, large or small. There is a rather high suicide rate in the region where I live, the cause of death is never included in the obits unless it was anything other than a suicide.

My condolences, it's a long road a head for those still here, I hope the worst of the grief passes sooner than later for them.

[annabanana]

35. so sorry

It is still very soon for you.

[2naSalit]

43. Thanks...

I have my days when I need to be alone about it but I'm still here and the world isn't going to slow down for me to get through my existence. I came to some reasonable conclusions and am okay with it now. The was, to me, no question of why she did it... it was just sad that she made that choice the way she did. Obviously, after a hard life, she decided she'd had enough and was going to go on her terms.

[nadinbrzezinski]

28. My condolensces to your friend

...

[itcfish]

30. I don't think any church

today would deny him services. To committ suicide you have to be mentally ill. My Catholic Church held a service for a young man that killed himself. He was my son's classmate.

[Victor_c3]

31. I've been struggling to come up with an appropriate response to this thread all day

I personally am a suicide attempt survivor. I've actually had 3 attempts in the last 18 months and suicide is a thought that is always dancing around in my mind in one form or another.

I don't know what to say or how to help the families of those who lost a loved one to suicide. As a suicide survivor I feel that I should have something insightful to say, but I don't.

[PassingFair]

33. Hoping for peace for you.

[itcfish]

34. I don't know what to say to you!

I can only send you hugs and hope you get the help you need. Peace be with you!

[KingCharlemagne]

42. Hey, if u ever want someone to talk to, PM me for

my contact info.

You are not alone.

[markpkessinger]

32. One thing to keep in mind about funerals/memorial services -- for ANYBODY...

Last edited Mon Dec 28, 2015, 04:01 PM - Edit history (1)

... regardless of the circumstances of the person's death: that is, that these services are, first and foremost, for the benefit of the deceased's family and other loved ones, to help them begin to process their grief and loss. Mind you, it's' only the beginning -- and it is a very long process -- but these rituals or services are an important step for those who are grieving. This is true EVEN if one holds the view (a view I do NOT share, btw) that suicide is somehow shameful. A funeral or memorial service is about commemorating who that person was/what that person meant to those who loved him, and now must carry on without him. That has nothing whatsoever to do with whether or not the person's death was the result of something some people deem to be more or less socially acceptable. Your friend should try, if she can, to put aside any worries about what anybody else will think. And I think, in most cases, she will be surprised at how supportive most people will be.

If the young man's mother, of her own preference, wishes not to have a service, that is certainly her prerogative. But if it is a situation where she is hesitating for fear of what people will think, then I would urge her to try to set those worries aside and to do what her heart tells her to do. Irrespective of the circumstances of her son's death, there is absolutely no reason she shouldn't feel entitled to grieve her loss as fully and completely as anybody else grieves the loss of a loved one. Indeed, if she really wants to have a service, but refrains from doing so out of fear of some kind of social opprobrium, then, in a sense, she will be defining the entirety of her son's life by the tragic circumstances of his death. And that would be a disservice to the memory of her son, as well as to the relationship she had with him.

I simply cannot tell you how this makes me ache for that woman, even though I don't know her in the slightest.

[ucrdem]

36. So sorry to hear this. But she is not alone.

Sad to say but many choose this holiday to take their lives. Ask a cop and they'll tell you

p.s. I'd be surprised if any church except for maybe Westboro objected to such a service.

[demtenjeep]

37. thank you all

I read her some of the comments.

She broke down.

She still hasn't decided what to do but I am pretty sure she will have some sort of service.

Our pastor is awesome and she had made arrangements for him to come to her house to talk. I am sure he will make her feel better and help her decide what to do.

[niyad]

40. holding your friend in thought and prayers. having lost several friends to suicide myself,

please tell her from me to hold whatever service, memorial, whatever. . .that SHE needs. anybody who doesn't understand is not worth her time, energy or consideration.