For the Holidays, will anyone pray for Peace?

[tecelote]

Most of our candidates for President want to continue killing innocent civilians in hopes we get the terrorists.

We even have a women, a mother, running who will continue the killing of innocents. She thinks regime change is part of the American agenda. What happened to her compassion? What happened to her village? It was probably bombed.

We kill people's mothers, fathers, brothers and sisters and we think they will not hate us?

Our solution perpetuates the problem. The only two things it creates is hate and profit. Take the profit out of our wars and they will end tomorrow.

This holiday season, I hope you will pray for peace.

There was once a man from the middle east that promoted peace and people listened. Today, people seem to have forgotten who he is.

[rurallib]

1. Instead of praying, I wouldn't mind seeing some work toward peace

and less belligerence.

Obama is at least headed in the right direction.

Prayer does little.

[tecelote]

2. Let me know what you have done. Maybe I can learn something.

Obama is far better than Bush but we are still killing many innocent people and that is not ok with me.

Here I am, praying out loud, hoping that some people who think getting the terrorists at all costs will realize that we are also monsters killing innocent people in the ME hoping to stop terrorism. Our solution perpetuates the problem.

[cleanhippie]

7. Is your praying out loud accomplishing anything other than making you feel

like you're doing something?

[tecelote]

12. How many people have you helped?

Knocking people down must make you feel important.

[cleanhippie]

13. At least as many as you have with your prayer.

[redwitch]

44. I like to think that my prayers strengthen me to do what is right.

I also work (and vote) for peace. It is possible to do both. Merry Christmas

[tecelote]

59. Thanks and Merry Christmas to you too.

[cleanhippie]

69. That's fantastick!

And as long as you're doing more than just praying, I'll lend you all my support.

[LanternWaste]

75. I too would minimize and trivialize prayer, hope and good wishes

I too would minimize and trivialize prayer, hope and good wishes if compelled to do as such by my biases.

[Bluenorthwest]

35. Problem here is that what you call 'prayer' is actually a sermon, aimed not at god but at other

people.

[tecelote]

38. You could be right.

I am a bit mad at our acceptance of Collateral Damage in our perpetual war and might be lashing out a bit.

I heard how America is in the business of regime change last night and it stoked my ire.

Here's another part of my "sermon"... If we took the profit out of our wars, they would end tomorrow and it would show us the real reason for our callousness.

[TipTok]

43. Change little to nothing and you are right...

It's actually a negative because folks feel like they have 'done something' and it holds them back from actually contributing.

[spanone]

3. K&R for Peace

[tecelote]

33. BTW - Thanks.

[GeorgeGist]

4. Yeah, cause praying for peace has worked so well in the past.

[tecelote]

5. If that is all you do then, yes.

Otherwise, it's an affirmation.

Certainly better than posting snarky remarks making light of the deaths being caused by our war on terror.

[Mariana]

31. Who has posted snarky remarks making light

of the deaths being caused by our war on terror? I only see snarky remarks making light of the idea that praying for peace will actually help to bring it about.

[tecelote]

34. Eh, good point.

[yeoman6987]

123. I'll pray at midnight Mass. Merry Christmas all! 4 days till the best day of the year!

The closer it gets, the more excited I become. We're so lucky for so many thing and need to be thankful for them.

[Mariana]

124. It is a great day.

We start to see the days getting longer after the solstice. Where I live it's full dark well before 5pm this time of year. It's wonderful to begin to see the darkness come later and later each day, a little at a time

[yeoman6987]

125. I love it too so much.

[LanternWaste]

76. No more and no less than has hope

No more and no less than has hope; though I imagine one will hold the two to different standards if bias compels as much.

[cleanhippie]

6. Alternatively, one could actually DO something.

Last edited Mon Dec 21, 2015, 12:34 AM - Edit history (1)

Unclasp your hands, get up off your knees, and DO something. Prayer is a pointless exercise in futility.

[pinboy3niner]

8. Amen

Sorry, I couldn't resist.

[tecelote]

9. Did I say... only pray?

I've supported people displaced by our wars and I actively speak out.

Want to be constructive instead of just spiteful?

Let me know what you have done?

[cleanhippie]

11. Yes, you did. That's exactly what you called for, prayer.

What have I done? More than pray, so I guess that puts me ahead of you.

[tecelote]

15. Like post here.

You're a big help.

[cleanhippie]

16. Just following your lead.

Your prayer is also a big help.

[LanternWaste]

78. It certainly is ethically convenient to predicate your own admittedly petulant actions

"Just following your lead..."

It certainly is ethically convenient to predicate your own admittedly petulant actions on those of someone else.

[cleanhippie]

86. Somewhere a pot is looking for a kettle.

[tecelote]

60. Read post #58

I wasn't going to defend myself but ended up doing it anyway.

[LanternWaste]

77. Like typing a trivial post...

"Alternatively, one could actually DO something..."

Like typing a trivial post... however, I realize bias may instruct you that doing the one prevents doing the other-- except in your case, of course.

[cleanhippie]

85. You realize bias?

But don't recognize your own?

[lindysalsagal]

10. "Some day my prince will come...."

You mean, like that?

So far, it hasn't worked.

Oh- you mean Jesus??? Yeah Right. That's worked out so well so far......

[tecelote]

14. You seem like the reason.

When will someone cut the snark and mention what they have done? Seems like this group just wants to take digs and cheap shots to make themselves feel superior.

[cleanhippie]

17. Until YOU cut the snark a mention what YOU have done...

Seems like you just want to pray to make yourself feel superior.

[tecelote]

21. Got me there. I can be as snarky as the next.

We have been very involved but I'm not going to outline any of it because it should not be the issue. If you think prayer is worthless fine. Why harass someone that may feel different?

Ironically, I'm an atheist but I believe in many religious values and peace is a big one. I also believe in positive affirmation that can be described as prayer.

If you have met the people I have met you would realize that our war on terror is killing many good and innocent people and that is no joke.

[cleanhippie]

23. Because prayer is pointless, regardless how it makes you feel.

It does nothing, accomplishes nothing, other than make the person praying feel as if they are doing something.

[tecelote]

26. Affirmation.

Why tear people down?

What do you expect to accomplish?

[cleanhippie]

41. What do I expect to accomplish?

More than prayer, that's for sure.

[Lordquinton]

57. No, seriously, what have you done?

You've countered anyone who challenges you with that, so it's put up or shut up time.

[tecelote]

58. Beyond pray, you mean?

You've heard Bernie say that Climate Change is a major reason for the growth in terrorism?

Well, whether you believe in global warming or not, there is another related threat to our planet. Over-population.

It took until around 1800 to reach a billion people. Only 200 years later we reached around six billion and in less than 50 years we will reach around nine billion. Our current agricultural systems can not continue to support this many people on our planet.

My team is working with the USDA and the FDA on a supplemental food source packed with vitamins that uses significantly less land and water to grow. It can be harvested multiple times a year and uses no pesticides, herbicides or growth hormones. It can be grown organically and is non-gmo. One acre of arid land may be able to supplement the food supply of an entire village.

I can't get more specific than that but within a few years, I hope you will have heard of it. You'll still drive to the local supermarket for your food but in many parts of the world, this can make a major difference in many people's lives.

My travels woke me up to the need for sustainable agriculture and a respect for prayer.

There are many people here that felt a need to knock down someone who said they pray for peace. I am not a religious person but I have lived with families in houses that are without electricity and have dirt floors. Their families pray together and it is very meaningful to them. They know I am not a Christian but I pray with them because it means something to them.

From these experiences, I have grown to use prayer as personal affirmation. I pray for peace. I work for peace. And, I am vocal about it with everyone I meet.

This post attracted people who feel a need to knock someone down for praying for peace? Where is the compassion?

[lindysalsagal]

18. I told the white bigot at the gas pump this morning that Obama was the best president we ever had.

I said I can't believe I'm paying $2.10 for gas, but of course, Obama won't get any credit for that. He said Obama's ruining the country.

He's gotta get it back in his face that he's wrong, and his hatred is fueling the wars.

So, yeah, I do alot. I also belong to humanist organizations that try to promote rational thought over mindless religious idolatry. That extends to tRump as well these days.

Bogotry and religion go hand in hand, and praying is a dog whistle for "I'm superior to you because I am godly."

It's all horse shit.

[cleanhippie]

20. "...praying is a dog whistle for "I'm superior to you because I am godly."

And BOOM goes the dynamite!

Well done!

[tecelote]

24. So, you can be constructive to a point.

Calling someones religion horse shit is not.

[lindysalsagal]

25. Sure it is. When it's horse shit. n/t.

[tecelote]

29. I'm sure that has helped a lot of people.

You're doing a fine job. Keep it up.

[Bradical79]

19. I don't pray, but I will try to do something -nt

[tecelote]

22. Thanks for the sane response.

[edhopper]

27. "I can assure you that no kingdom has ever had as many civil wars as the kingdom of Christ. "

Charles de Montesquieu

[tecelote]

32. And, it continues today.

Nowhere did I say I was a Christian. Not only Christians pray.

[edhopper]

36. True

my bad.

[REP]

66. Really? Then why this in your OP?

There was once a man from the middle east that promoted peace and people listened. Today, people seem to have forgotten who he is.

This seems to be an allusion to one of the Christian gods, Jesus of Nazareth. It's mostly Christians who either believe in him or follow his teachings.

[tecelote]

67. I respect Bernie Sanders but I'm not Jewish

Why would it bother you either way?

[REP]

71. You're exhorting people to pray at the time of a Christian holiday, reference a Christian god

yet deny that you are religious or Christian.

Bernie Sanders actually exists. No one need share his faith or ethnicity to admire him. Jesus of Nazareth probably did not exist. It takes a leap of faith ... a particular faith ... to believe he existed.

Pray all you like. It is literally the least you can do. The very least.

[JackInGreen]

28. Have been praying any that'd listen all year

It didnt work, so I decided to do something about it instead and vote for Bernie.

[tecelote]

30. Good for you. I'm doing the same.

[Binkie The Clown]

37. If god wanted peace we wouldn't have to try to talk hin/her/it into it.

If god doesn't want peace then none of our begging and pleading will make a bit of difference.

[cheapdate]

39. Not a praying person. Would certainly prefer peace.

[tecelote]

40. That's what matters.

Thanks.

[RebelOne]

53. I don't pray, but I will wish for peace. n/t

[hobbit709]

42. Ambrose Bierce's definition of the word "pray"

“Pray, v. To ask that the laws of the universe be annulled in behalf of a single petitioner, confessedly unworthy.”

[Tanuki]

45. The legendary union organizer Mary "Mother" Jones said,

"Pray for the dead, but fight like hell for the living."
Those who aren't inclined to pray could at least visualize peace and spend some time thinking about what they could do each day in the real world to make it a reality.

[tecelote]

61. Yes.

I am not religious but I believe prayer is affirmation.

"Pray for the dead, but fight like hell for the living."

That's great.

[mnhtnbb]

46. I have been writing a holiday letter to send with our cards for 23 years.

I almost included a comment this year that the "peace on earth good will toward men" thing doesn't seem to working
out so well.

I thought better of it.

[cherokeeprogressive]

47. I'm sorry that your prayers for peace are met with derision and snark. That's DU though I guess...

[Goblinmonger]

49. So saying "you're awesome for wanting to pray for peace" is what we should do?

That seems really productive.

And how about you recognize how shitty of an OP this is to tell people that the problems of the world are because enough people aren't praying for peace. So atheists are the new terrorists in this scenario?

[cherokeeprogressive]

50. Why don't you go back and read the OP again, and then you can tell me where the poster said

"...the problems of the world are because people aren't praying for peace."

I guess it's more important to attack though than it is to just go your own fucking way and let someone who's doing NO HARM WHATSOEVER say something about wishing the world were a better place.

[Goblinmonger]

51. Wishing it were a better place and asking people to pray are two different things.

If the line about prayer weren't in the OP, I would have no problem.

Assuming that words have meaning, why was that line put in there if not offering it as a solution?

[cherokeeprogressive]

52. "the problems of the world are because enough people aren't praying for peace." Still not seeing it.

I guess attacking posts like this OP are what gets some people through the day.

Power to ya.

[Goblinmonger]

54. I guess not see privilege helps some people get through the day.

Just because someone calls one on their privilege doesn't mean one is attacking.

Power to ya and your privilege.

[tecelote]

64. Thanks for the intelligent comments and support!

Why people feel a need to knock someone down for praying for peace, I will never understand.

[Goblinmonger]

48. So god runs the universe based on polling?

Presumably the logic of your post is that there just haven't been enough people praying for peace at this point and god is like "well, I'd like to intervene and cause worldwide peace but I need 200 more people to pray for it before I do it." Sounds like an asshole god.

Also, reminds me of the old saying "You can shit in one hand and pray in another and see which fills up first."

[WhaTHellsgoingonhere]

55. I'm going to vote for the least hawkish candidate

praying had mixed results, and I never could figure out if something turned out good because I prayed since things were more likely to turn out like crap.

So, with that said, because we have hawkish candidates on both sides, I'm going to vote for the candidate who never wants to go to war. If it matters that much to you, I suspect you'll do the same. If there are higher priorities than "peace on earth", you'll vote for someone else, cancelling out your prayers (Jesus's message was prayers without actions = 0, where actions = voting).

[tecelote]

63. Read post #58

I never said I was a Christian. I am not. My other comments lay that out.

[WhaTHellsgoingonhere]

82. Read this. You're reactive

My response stands alone, i.e., remove Jesus and you still need to reconcile voting for the hawk when you had an opportunity to vote for the (proactive) then resolving yourself to pray for peace (reactive). People who put prayer over action are reactive.

Vote for the dove, or peace isn't that important to you, which is what I suspect.

[tecelote]

88. And where did I say I was voting for Clinton?

[WhaTHellsgoingonhere]

91. I read you!

You bailed out on my post when you saw Jesus.

That was a tell. I would clean you out in poker.

[tecelote]

94. Say what?

[WhaTHellsgoingonhere]

95. This is easy. I responded to your post and all you had to say was "I'm not a Christian"

What do you think that says about you?

[tecelote]

96. I believe in many Christian values and those of other religions.

But, I am certain that we are responsible for ourselves. There is no higher power.

[WhaTHellsgoingonhere]

97. Like I said, my response stands alone. You're still fixated on Jesus.

Someone who knows you has probably seen this pattern before. They might say...You know, he's got a point, tecelote. You start a discussion but when you get a response that you don't like, you find some red herring to argue about.

[tecelote]

98. ok

[mr blur]

56. No. Talking to yourself might make you feel better, I guess, so you go ahead.

I' m sure you could get Ms Clinton and Mr Trump to join in, the bible being their very favourite book and all.

[tecelote]

62. Read post #58

If you read my other comments you'd see that I am not a Christian.

[Logical]

65. If there is a god he is pretty much a careless jerk. To many bad things happen. nt

[Katashi_itto]

68. I want a Zebra.

[Arugula Latte]

70. Nope -- prayer is ineffectual.

Nobody's there to hear the prayer, nor act on it.

[RedCappedBandit]

72. Why should I? I have work to do. nt

[tecelote]

73. Please. Go do it.

[Arugula Latte]

84. Why are you pushing religion on people?

Not everybody believes in this lunacy, you know.

[tecelote]

93. I never said I was religious.

Read post #58 - I got tired of this crap and spelled it out.

Why do you feel the need to put someone down who wants peace?

[Arugula Latte]

99. Prayer implies religious belief.

We all want peace; I don't see why you are scolding people about praying.

"Hey, why aren't you sacrificing a goat to Zeus for peace?! Are you anti-peace or something?"

[tecelote]

103. Holy cow!

Now it's come full circle.

[Arugula Latte]

110. I like to discuss this stuff.

I am not angry or hateful.

Peace to you. (pun intended)

[JEB]

74. No need. Our tax dollars

are killing for peace.

[NCTraveler]

79. First.

"Most of our candidates for President want to continue killing innocent civilians in hopes we get the terrorists."

All of our candidates. There. Corrected if for you.

Second.

"There was once a man from the middle east that promoted peace and people listened. Today, people seem to have forgotten who he is."

What man are you talking about?

[tecelote]

92. Hillary says we can't afford Bernie's proposals but we can afford regime change in the Middle East.

Priorities.

Bernie's are the best for Americans. Hillary's for the people profiting from war.

[yawnmaster]

80. You know tecelote, I can see from this thread why, perhaps, peace is so fleeting. Negativity...

seems to prevail in today's society...probably in the past, too, as human nature doesn't really change, in my opinion.
We can survive if there are enough willing to work to bring people together rather than by creating distance and alienation.

I am still hopeful that there are enough in the population of man to stabilize us.

Thank you for your positive attitude.

[Arugula Latte]

81. It's not negativity for negativity's sake, it's fatigue with the irrational.

Studies show prayer does nothing. Zip. Zilch. Nada.

There's no evidence to support the existence of a magical, supernatural realm and a ruling creature/being of the realm. The insinuation that of course we all believe in this nonsense and should act on it for a specific purpose is condescending -- and ridiculous.

[PasadenaTrudy]

83. +1

I grew up in an atheist household, and the idea of a prayer or a thought sent out into "the universe" to change something, cracks me up!

[yawnmaster]

87. It is, nevertheless, negative, and the easy, non-constructive path. I would hope that people...

try to understand each other and come together and be tolerant.
Take the harder path of being happy with other people and their beliefs, whether rational or irrational.
Is getting upset (and becoming fatigued) over another's belief in itself rational?

[Arugula Latte]

100. I'm not upset with people having beliefs. But I get tired of being told to pray,

which implies belief in some sort of magical creature who must be a giant asshole if it allows or causes death and destruction and war and famine and torture and murder to happen in the first place.

Example: "Pray for Paris." Well, why did this monstrous deity allow the bombings in the first place? Why didn't it stop it before people were killed and maimed?

Sense. It makes none.

[yawnmaster]

118. I still don't understand how it makes you upset when one says "pray for whatever"...

why not just just ignore it, shrug it off...why be upset whether another's belief makes sense to you or not?

[Arugula Latte]

119. People can pray if they want. They should not demand that others pray.

Why do so many religious people feel it is fine and dandy to tell other people what to do?

It gets old.

[yawnmaster]

120. Aren't you asking people not to ask people to pray? It's words. A demand?...

If it is a demand and I don't believe it is, it is an empty, powerless demand, and as such, if one disagrees with it, it should be ignored as one ignores a tiny gust of wind; although one sees it briefly, it is easily forgotten.

Ignoring behaviors, such as simple requests, that one disagrees with, is much better than getting angry or trying to change another's ways.

[tecelote]

89. Prayer is affirmation and it has been proven to help people. Doesn't have to be religious.

I'm an atheist. Post #58 tells you my views on prayer.

[tecelote]

90. Yes.

Shocked me how many people need to put down someone who says they pray for peace.

Thanks for the support!

---

"I am still hopeful that there are enough in the population of man to stabilize us."

Me too!

[lovemydog]

101. Yes, I'm praying for peace.

Happy holidays to you and yours tecelote.

[tecelote]

105. Thanks.

Happy holidays to you and yours lovemydog.

[Scootaloo]

102. "There was once a man from the middle east that promoted peace"

Bahá'u'lláh? Hammurabi?

[tecelote]

106. I'll have to look that one up.

'Got a lot of criticism for that sentence.

Most people were upset that I called the flying spaghetti monster a he.

[madinmaryland]

121. There once was a man who took a....

Nevermind. That would get this thread locked!

[randys1]

104. So this is NOT a thread about prayer but a way to BASH Hillary...

[tecelote]

107. Sorry.

Voting for Bernie is one action I take towards peace.

I don't hate Hillary. I will be proud to vote for her if she wins. She will be a powerful President.

But, we have disagreements that make Bernie my choice.

To me, supporting Americans is a higher priority than regime change. Hillary claimed we couldn't afford Bernie's plans but she's all for regime change. That's a big one for me.

[randys1]

108. The say THAT, for crying out loud. Say THAT while you support Bernie. See how

different that is?

thanks

[tecelote]

112. I just did.

If someone had called me on it earlier I would have. I was asked about Bernie a number of times previously.

[randys1]

113. Sorry...I just see so many and I mean hundreds of threads here attacking Hillary

And none of them are telling me anything I dont already know and in most cases agree with, other than the email nonsense.

But, like I keep saying, we are stuck with a corrupt two party system, one party is connected at the hip to Wall Street and for the most part doesnt care all that much about their constituents, and the other party is the Republicans.

The Republicans are so vile and disgusting that what we really have is a one party system with an insurrection of assholes on the other side.

Bernie is not liberal enough for me, but he is my choice.

I suspect Hillary has a better chance of winning the nom and therefore I will be not just voting for her but I will work for her as if your daughters or granddaughters very life depends on it, because if she ever needs reproductive healthcare, it does.

[tecelote]

115. Yes. We do have a corrupt system.

"Bernie is not liberal enough for me, but he is my choice." - first time I've heard that - good one! I agree.

My daughters are important and I will also work hard for Hillary if Bernie does not win.

Everyone should. If a Republican wins, I just might start believing in the end times.

[randys1]

116. Yeah., as to liberal. I believe individuals owning land/dirt is absurd

All energy should be nationalized, gas/oil/electricity, etc

All access to the internet along with of course healthcare.

For starters

[tecelote]

117. I used to want to run away and join a commune many years ago. Never did.

It would be a long road.

I'm not sure how far I believe it should go but I'm ready to turn that direction and start down the road.

[tecelote]

109. Also, this was supposed to be about peace. It turned in to being about bashing prayer.

Baffled by that.

[randys1]

111. Well, as someone who doesnt believe in the invisible man or Woman in the sky, I kinda

get that.

But I also believe prayer, while meaningless as to praying TO someone, does have a positive force behind it that can help healing.

[tecelote]

114. Yes.

Absolutely. And, if it seems to help someone, whether you believe in it or not, why not let them have it?

I use the word prayer because people I am around understand it. They pray.

My basic belief is that we are responsible for ourselves. There is no higher power. We are it.

Makes all of this even more important to be involved in.

[Thor_MN]

122. Does Groundhog Day count?