What do you think ISIS's goal is?

[ZombieHorde]

They provoke by attacking civilians and filming themselves burning people alive. They seem to want to escalate war, but why? What do you think their ultimate goal is? What is their vision? What are your thoughts?

[doc03]

1. Armageddon n/t

[ZombieHorde]

2. Why do you think they want Armageddon? nt

[doc03]

9. By that I think they want to draw the western nations and Russia into

a war with each other. I don't think they would care if the world gets destroyed in the process, they will think they will go to paradise.

[ZombieHorde]

16. So you think they want to die as martyrs so they can have a happy afterlife?

You think a happy afterlife is the goal of ISIS? Just clarifying.

I hope that is not their ultimate goal with all this violence, because that is extremely difficult to stop.

[bettyellen]

28. "the fighters of the Islamic State are authentic throwbacks to early Islam and are faithfully

reproducing its norms of war. This behavior includes a number of practices that modern Muslims tend to prefer not to acknowledge as integral to their sacred texts. “Slavery, crucifixion, and beheadings are not something that freakish [jihadists] are cherry-picking from the medieval tradition,” Haykel said. Islamic State fighters “are smack in the middle of the medieval tradition and are bringing it wholesale into the present day.”'


http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/03/what-isis-really-wants/384980/


they believe they are fulfilling the end time prophesies, and all this violence is a big part of it.

[doc03]

45. There are also many Christians that want to bring about

the end times. They believe when the world is destroyed they will enter into heaven.

[Scootaloo]

27. because they literally say they want the final days?

hell, the title of their magazine is a reference to that. They hold that the "armies of the west" will meet them on the field of Dabiq, where the "Caliphate" will triumph, and lead to the final days.

[Yorktown]

3. They told you: they want a worldwide Caliphate

It's an idea which has a strong resonance in the proverbial 'Arab Street'
(and in Pakistan, Indonesia, etc)

[Warren Stupidity]

4. They've been pretty clear about that.

This is also the same goal al Qaeda had.

[840high]

7. -They've told us many times.

[uppityperson]

6. To provoke the ultimate (oxymoronic) holy war and rule the world?

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

8. They're exploiting western vulnerabilities to terrorisim by provoking us into retaliation.

It's PR to provoke us into another crusade. And, it's working unless cooler and smarter heads prevail.

[madokie]

10. They remind me of our own 'CONs

republiCONs that is. They want to be in control even if they don't have any answers they still want to be out front.

[HereSince1628]

11. IMO it's the same reason humans have been warring for millennia

For thousands of years was has been a means of gaining wealth and thereby power from others.

All the talk of crusades and jihads has typically boiled down to expansionism. Even when it seems that's -not- the thing that started the war, it usually turns out to be what the war accomplishes as in the rise of American military hegemony following WWII. Once we ended up around the world, it was too good a thing from which one can walk away.

Somewhere in the midst of ISIS relationships is one or more persons who seek the expansion of power and the joy of the wealth that brings.

[LittleBlue]

12. If you want to know the real reason, read this

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/03/what-isis-really-wants/384980/

Rather than asking "experts", the author simply asked Isis supporters what Isis is about. They were candid.

By far the best piece on Isis ever written in the mainstream media.

[HuckleB]

24. Everyone should read that piece. It's good, indeed.

[ZombieHorde]

25. I'm reading the article.

It's very interesting. Thank you for sharing it with us.

[LittleBlue]

26. Hopefully it's informative

[renegade000]

13. at the risk of using a bit of a cliche pop culture reference:

Hell, the comparison is something of an insult to the Joker.

Some of the previous posters have definitely identified reasons that they ostensibly give, but ultimately I think the ISIS phenomenon is a sad and horrifying glimpse into how pathetic and twisted the human id gets. I mean, what were the ultimate goals of all these school shooters in the US? It's just a sick way for lost individuals who feel insignificant to satiate their needs to feel significant and to get a sadistic rush out of death and destruction.

Add to the mix the element of self-righteousness and "ecstasy in the afterlife" that co-opting concepts from religious upbringings gives you...and you have one hell of a dangerous drug.

[yuiyoshida]

15. I seem to remember a quote...

"Some men just want to watch the World Burn"

[renegade000]

18. yup, definitely sprung to mind

But then I was like, "hmm, maybe two Dark Knight quotes in one post is a bit much"

[yuiyoshida]

22. I wonder how

The Batman would deal with Isis ... maybe that will show up in a DC comic one day.

[renegade000]

29. Well...be careful what you wish for...

Frank Miller tried to do something like that (thankfully not tainting the Batman character): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Terror_(graphic_novel)

As I understand it, Miller turned into a bit of a right-wing crazy some number of years ago, so this comic is a trove of nuance and cultural sensitivity. Honestly, I've never read it myself (not much of a comic book person), but I have seen some critical commentary (e.g.

)

Hell, it's probably where Donald Trump is getting his information about "the Muslims."

[yuiyoshida]

37. That was pretty entertaining

and yeah, I never liked Frank Miller either, i was always like... wth??

[dlwickham]

33. never

[ZombieHorde]

17. Though of course the Joker had very detailed plans.

He was lying to Dent in order to help twist him away from his "good self."

I imagine the different school shooters have different motivations. Some may just want people to hurt as badly as they hurt. Some may just be willing to die for the joyful experience of shooting a bunch of people.

[renegade000]

23. ah, that's right... my analogy does break down a little haha

And yes, it's hard to distinguish between satiating a retributive urge and a purely sadistic one. It's likely a combination of multiple things. I suspect that ISIS also satiates more neutral need to belong to a community as well on top of the more hedonic ones, which is why you've got all those young men and women trying to leave their homes to join up.

[ileus]

14. Caliphate...

[OkSustainAg]

19. This is IMHO

A political pressure group that nation states put into play. It is truly a horrific one. But supported by governments none the less.
Unhappy people being manipulated by a horrible radical religious sect that has been influencing for their nation state benefactors a long time. There is no endgame. The benefactors will simply find others to fight and other names to give them.

[WillyT]

20. Did You Catch THIS:

DULink: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10027435877

[JI7]

21. i don't think most of them have a goal other than killing, raping, hurting ,destroying

others .

some of the higher ups may wish to rule over large areas of land and people. but i think most who join do so because they are losers or bitter and want to hurt others.

[bettyellen]

31. I think that makes them more likely to believe in the old time religion, but.....

the prophesy for how the end of the world happens has been around a long long time.
Read the Atlantic article linked above, it is pretty amazing.
I do agree there would be less interest in the end times if here and now was easier. but the ideas are very old.

[Agnosticsherbet]

30. They are an endtimes cult who want to provoke the WEst to attack so when ISIL defents them...

the Mahadi will return.

[VanillaRhapsody]

32. They have a prophesy that they will start a worldwide caliphate

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2786039/The-1-300-year-old-apocalyptic-prophecy-predicted-war-Islamic-army-infidel-horde-Syria-fuelling-ISIS-s-brutal-killers.html

[jamzrockz]

34. Their goal is to bring the US into the war

How this is not obvious to anyone watching the moves throughout the years. France contemplating whether to join the war? bam!!! they kill a french citizen and video tape it, Britain thinking about doing the same? bam!! another beheading of a British citizen. They seem to be doing everything to make western audience support a war in Syria.

Just think how the poll numbers in favor of military boots on the ground has been rising since they've been acting up. Just about every move they make is to provoke western audience. It makes a lot of sense if you look at how they leveraged the US bombing of Libya into creating their small enclave in Africa.

[GreatGazoo]

35. the Islamist themed butchery is a smoke screen

the goal of ISIS in Syria is a pipeline for natural gas from Qatar to Europe to replace the Soviet supply.

Assad, Putin and Iran don't want that pipeline built.

ISIS is a bunch of merchs and militias backed by Qatar, the Saudis, and Turkey...the group that DOES want the pipeline.

Everything else is theater IMHO

[kwassa]

44. excellent conspiracy theory! Thank you!

DU would be so boring without them.

[GreatGazoo]

47. Um..was I rude to you or something?

NBC: ISIS funded by "Angel Investors" from "Gulf States"

Stavridis and other current U.S. officials suggest that the biggest share of the individual donations supporting ISIS and the most radical groups comes from Qatar rather than Saudi Arabia, and that the Qatari government has done less to stop the flow than its neighbors in Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates. One U.S. official said the Saudis are "more in line with U.S. foreign policy" than the Qataris.

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/isis-terror/whos-funding-isis-wealthy-gulf-angel-investors-officials-say-n208006

The Qatari Pipeline is much discussed by those who are following the conflict more closely:

It all started in 2009, when Qatar proposed to Damascus the construction of a pipeline from its own North Field – contiguous with the South Pars field, which belongs to Iran – traversing Saudi Arabia, Jordan and Syria all the way to Turkey, to supply the EU.

http://www.counterpunch.org/2015/12/08/syria-ultimate-pipelineistan-war/

https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/syria/2015-10-14/putins-gas-attack

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-09-10/competing-gas-pipelines-are-fueling-syrian-war-migrant-crisis

Ten thousand more:
https://www.google.com/search?q=qatar+pipeline&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

Sarcasm is the least efficient form of communication since it tells us only what you don't believe. DU would be better without it.

[roamer65]

36. Just like extremist fundamentalist Christians.

Daesh wants to bring on the end times.

[arthritisR_US]

40. Thank you for addressing them as they should be. People

who continue to refer to them as ISIS or ISIL are giving them legitimacy that they don't warrant. The Daesh designation does not legitimize their existence or their caliphate and they find it to be a slur and disrespectful so it is totally befitting them.

[arthritisR_US]

38. They have set up their caliphate so now it's to bring on Armageddon. nt

[madville]

39. Higher oil prices

That's probably what the people funding them want anyway, a return to $100+ a barrel oil.

[Captain Stern]

41. I think it's what they say it is

They're pretty clear about what they want. They actually have a magazine:

http://www.clarionproject.org/news/islamic-state-isis-isil-propaganda-magazine-dabiq

[951-Riverside]

42. Murder any resistance, destroy middle eastern history, destroy any form of advanced cultures...

in the middle east, etc, etc so the us neo-cons and other anglo-saxon interests that are training and funding them can easily divvy up the land, steal the resources and make it another one of their territories.

By the way, the ISIS "fighters" who participated in this will all be hunted down and killed when all is said and done. Dead men tell no tales.

[forsaken mortal]

43. They're basically an end-time cult

They want to get attacked by all of the Western countries because they believe it will trigger the great last battle. That's what their propaganda magazine Dabiq says anyway.

[area51]

46. nihilism. n/t

[Marrah_G]

48. They want to rule the muslim world

They have said over and over what their goal is. They want to turn the middle east into a kingdom where people are forced to adhere to their extreme version of Islam.