Should Ally Bank Penalize Me for 6 Months over a $1.63 Mistake?

[bondwooley]

I’d really like your opinion on this. I feel like Kafka just took over the banking system and the first thing he did was gag Elizabeth Warren and lock her in a closet.

I opened an online Ally bank account because they claim to have a quick check clearance policy and not many hidden fees – and I don’t have a lot of money or the cash flow to let checks linger or to pay crazy bank fees for a simple checking account.

But it turns out that Ally can play a few tricks. Like, if you are overdrawn for any amount they will penalize you for the next six months.

I was overdrawn by $1.63 and didn’t even realize it until I made a subsequent deposit and was told that I was being penalized for being “frequently overdrawn.”

Now, according to “Regulation CC” of the Federal Reserve Board, being overdrawn allows a bank to delay clearance of a subsequent paper check deposit, and being overdrawn once is considered “frequently overdrawn”.

Okay, that’s fine. The bank can make some money back for the $1.63 it spotted. It is, after all, my fault for having no idea whatsoever that they spotted me $1.63.

But what Regulation CC doesn’t seem to say is that every check the customer deposits for the next six months will be held for 5 business days (which, of course, means 8 days because the day of deposit doesn’t count and there’s always a weekend in there).

Got that? Because of a $1.63 miscalculation, no check I deposit with Ally will clear for 8 days, regardless of the amount of the check – now through May of 2016.

Does this seem right to you? After trying to get a rational explanation from Ally for two days, I really need a reality check. (No pun intended.)

By the way, if you think it’s wrong of them to do this -- and you’re on any form of social media -- send out something with hashtag #Dollar63 @ally. They will know exactly what that means and maybe I'll get a response.

Most importantly, though, let me know if I’m crazy for thinking there’s something wrong with this picture.

[-none]

1. Sounds like you need a new bank.

Or even a Credit Union.
I know I would not put up with that BS. By holding deposit checks for 8 days, they are guaranteeing more over draw accounts.
Are they even allowed to do that? Maybe the local TV station has a Fraud Alert segment, that would check into them for you.

[bondwooley]

3. Not a bad idea.

I fully understand that banks can be jerks, and often they can be jerks quite legally. But this just seems beyond me. Definitely, I will find another bank -- but if this is an issue that a lot of people are dealing with, I think some attention should be drawn to it. Think of the person who has a dollar in their pocket, makes a deposit that is supposed to clear the next day, and then they find they have to live a week on that dollar....

Just a horrible thought.

[yeoman6987]

17. When you pick another bank or credit union even better,

Please make sure to get a line of credit even 500 dollars will save you from pretty much every scenario that happens in our financial lives.

[bondwooley]

27. Good to know. TY. nt

[Nay]

50. Or find a bank/credit union with overdraft protection. I don't know if that would

cost you more than you'd like, but it's an option. Oh, and credit unions are the least expensive option generally.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

53. Credit union is my vote, if possible.

Mine has an automatic policy to sweep out of savings if you screw up and don't have enough in checking. And no overdraft fee if you've got enough in savings to cover the overage.

[edgineered]

2. I'll start. No doubt that most here agree with you,

but in saying so somehow seems to overstate the obvious. Better alternatives are found with credit unions or USAA; it's worth a phone call to see if you're eligible. Thank you for not using all caps in yelling about the bastards!

[bondwooley]

5. Based on your comment and

the previous one, I guess I'll be looking into a credit union. But I still want this "Regulation CC" figured out. It's the same regulation that says $100 of any deposit has to clear immediately.

I'm glad I resisted caps. I couldn't resist the boldface though. Sorry about that.

[edgineered]

7. When you can finally close the account

remember to wear some mistletoe on your shirt tail. When they ask if there is anything else they can do for you, point it out!

[spooky3]

10. Haha! That's the first I've heard that expression!

[edgineered]

13. 'Tis the season!

Taking about three or four seconds for it to sink in before their jaw drops makes it a keeper.

[fayhunter]

45. Well put. nt

[bondwooley]

12. Ha!

I'll remember that. But this bank is completely online. No branches. So there are no humans who can physically kiss my a$$.

[No Vested Interest]

34. In banking and with prescriptions, I find it's better to deal with a human face.

It may take a few more minutes to drive through, etc., but worth it.

Also, with prescriptions - it's better that a human you recognize scans and evaluates your various prescriptions. A pharmacist knows the interactions between various drugs and can prevent problems.

Sometimes, technology isn't the best answer.

[fayhunter]

46. Technology is fantastic

until it isn't. We live in a world where expectations are irrationally set. Just because something can, in theory, be done faster and better, does not guarantee that it will always be done faster or better. Yes, FedEx can deliver my gift tomorrow, but that doesn't mean I can get to FedEx today.

[Igel]

59. First, the penalty is by algorithm.

The computer is programmed, and isn't programmed with discretionary authority.

Being "repeatedly overdrawn" can include, according to the regulation you cite, when "On six or more banking days during the previous six months the account had a negative balance, or would have had a negative balance had checks and charges been paid".

You view that as one instance, the act of overdrawing your account. But if the overdrawn status is reviewed nightly and isn't an act but a state: On day one your account is overdrawn, on day 2 your account is overdrawn, on day 3 your account is overdrawn. So the status of your account is repeated day after day, and that's "overdrawn."

Yes, it's semantics. Searlean, in fact, and types of verbs. Do you regard "overdrawn" for a week as the result of a single action or is it a state that is determined daily? The regulation is clear: It's the state. For most people there's little enough awareness of how their own language works to see the difference, often even after working at it.


Put this into the "zero tolerance" movement. There have always been regs like this--back in the '80s there were regs like that, my roommate was often hit by fees he deemed excessive. We're zero-tolerant of "them," and so they're zero-tolerant of "us."


My sister-in-law worked as a bank manager and this kind of stuff left her really pissed off. Because most of the people complaining about fairly small consequences over fairly small infractions treat them as major events. She routinely suspended penalties for people who once in a year would overdraw their account by a small amount if they came in, presented their case in a clear and non-combative manner, and asked if something could be done. She'd routinely scowl and say "no" if they came in on the rampage and treated her as a personal enemy. That's where the lack of computer discretion meets reality and customer relations and the fact that the people on both sides of the counter or desk are actually people. Except that by and large those who knew the system could use the system, while a lot of people assumed that the banks and managers were enemies and either went in with claws out and teeth bared or simply refused to even entertain the idea.

More than once I've missed my credit card payment deadline, very seldom by more than a few hours. That said, we're talking perhaps 8 or 9 times in a dozen years. I've never had the credit card company fail to reverse the interest payment or reset the credit card interest amount back to "good client" levels when I've called, explained, and asked. (Again, my roommate's experience was different, but when you call the poor woman on the other end a "bitch" and "whore" working for a "cut-throat" and "greedy" company, you don't promote the kind of humanist solidarity that engenders a willingness to bend the rules even a bit.)

You catch more flies with honey than with M-16s. The easiest way to reap a truckload of ill-will is to go in and dump a bushel of ill-will on another person with little warning.

[SusanCalvin]

4. Incredibly wrong.

Made worse by the fact that there's no human on the spot to complain to.

Please consider a credit union.

[bondwooley]

9. Credit union

seems to be the consensus so far... I always thought though that there are very specific criteria you have to meet to get an account at one.

[nilram]

30. Yes, eligibility depends on the credit union but

sometimes it's as simple as living in the particular county you're living in already. Or, like mine, you can work for this particular set of companies, or, here, join this association and--boom--you're eligible. Good luck with it all. (I agree, too, that if you can get a line of credit for even 3-500 bucks and only use it when you're short by amounts like 1.67, it'll be totally worth it.)

[scrubthedata]

51. Good point.

And I'm not being sarcastic here -- but complaining to someone who works in a bank has become an American Tradition.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

6. They should change their name to Frienemy Bank.

[bondwooley]

14. If they did,

at least consumers would know what they're in for.

[fayhunter]

47. All most all of them should. nt

[spooky3]

8. It's a heavily regulated industry for a reason.

As you have discovered someone is always looking for a way around the system to squeeze consumers.

Years ago when interest rates were high, I took a chance and (I thought) locked in a high rate for a 30 month certificate of deposit. When the period was up (and interest rates had since dropped) I contacted the bank to redeem the CD and collect my interest. The bank claimed that it had tried to pay my interest annually and that it couldn't find me when I moved (even though everyone else's mail had been forwarded, and since I was not expecting annual payments I didn't take action). After year 1, the bank had converted the CD to a lower rate because it claimed it couldn't find me, and refused to pay me the right interest. I still lived in the same city and was in the phone book. what a scam.

[bondwooley]

11. Oh, wow, that's...

screwed up. I mean, honestly, how can a contract (you give the bank x money for y years and they do z) be violated because you moved? That really really sucks. Would you share the name of the bank or is that just inviting trouble for yourself?

[spooky3]

32. Yeah, I don't want to take that risk--but it's a large

Bank operating in the Midwest.

It's a good thing Elizabeth Warren has been able to get some progress made, but we have a little long way to go.

[JonLeibowitz]

24. What a scam.

They effectively treated your CD contract as a callable bond. Which guarantees you a same-or-lower yield. I can assure you that if rates had risen they wouldn't have renegotiated your CD.

[spooky3]

31. That's exactly what I thought.

i hope the OP fights back.

[Snobblevitch]

15. We moved our checking account because

our bank charged us $60 twice in the same day for being overdrawn. I asked them to not give us the cash at the ATM if it was unavilable on the account. I was told that was not possible. (My wife and I each tried to use our cash cards for fuel at the same time before my check was deposited.)

We cancelled our account with that large bank. We opened an account with a local credit union.

[bondwooley]

18. I guess computers

no longer run on IF/THEN functions.

Time was it would "if balance zero" "then no cash dispensed."

Now it's "if balance zero" "then you've got an opportunity to f them"

[Snobblevitch]

74. Banking laws were passed making these kinds of overdraft charges illegal.

[Fuddnik]

16. I have a credit union, and my funds are available immediately.

Unless I deposit a very large amount, something like $5,000. Even then, at least 50% of it is available.

Plus free online banking, and ATM usage. The only negative is they don't have many branches, or ATM's, so if I use another bank, I pay their fee. We do have free ATM's at Publix though.

Fuck Ally. I have a car loan through them (they're formerly GM Financial) and they don't take payments through my bill pay, and they fish for all kinds of fees to tack on. And if you mail a check, they claim that the mail service there is lousy, and it takes almost 10 days for them to credit your account, hoping to get late fees. I stay about 6 months ahead on the payments, just in case.

[bondwooley]

21. It's not that I'm happy to hear that

that you've had BS from them, there is some comfort in knowing that I'm not the only one has found their practices fairly ... well, let's just say "odd."

[PatrickforO]

19. Dear Bondwooley,

I have two words for you: Credit Union.

Seriously, banks suck. They charge too much and do greed head junk like what just happened to you. I've been with my credit union for nearly 35 years and I've never, ever regretted it. Ever.

[bondwooley]

22. Any recommendations?

I live in NYC and the only credit union I ever saw here disappeared about 8 years ago.

[PatrickforO]

25. Well, I did a quick Google search and found these three:

Municipal Credit Union
Credit Union
350 Jay St · [phone]

Municipal Credit Union
Credit Union
2142 Ralph Ave · [phone]

Progressive Credit Union
Credit Union
131 W 33rd St #7 · [phone]

But NYC is a mega-city and I've never been there, but according to Google you've got a bunch, more than just these three. The thing I do know about NYC, though is that it has become what Joel Kotkin calls a 'luxury city,' meaning that you've basically got the rich, and the service people and it's getting harder and harder for the service people to live. Same with San Francisco.

Maybe you should think about moving where there's better jobs and the cost of living isn't so high. I mean, it's a possibility. I would resist that because I love (and am a native) the city in which I live. Some good books to read for guides to cities that still offer educated workers good jobs, and the opportunity to get ahead - the ones by Richard Florida - he's the guy who wrote all those books about the creative class. He's not full of shit.

[bondwooley]

26. I really appreciate

the advice and that you took the time to look those up.

It's true, however, I am somewhat bound to my city. I've been here 30+ years through thick and thin, have created more than 500 jobs for fellow NYC'ers, and risked my health/life for the city and it's people in the cleanup of 9/11. Very hard to leave a place one has dedicated most of their life toward helping.

[rjsquirrel]

35. TD bank

All over NYC, low cost, relatively nice folks work there, great customer service.

Been with them for years and have zero complaints.

Credit union mantra is popular with progressives. They're just banks, though.

[Gormy Cuss]

38. Credit unions are not banks, although they provide similar services.

Credit unions are not-for-profit, member owned institutions. That lack of a profit motive is the reason fees are lower than at most commercial banks and why "banking" with one is usually a better deal.

There are bad credit unions out there so doing a little research before joining is a good idea. Credit unions aren't covered by FDIC insurance but should have similar deposit insurance from the NCUSIF.

[rjsquirrel]

62. They serve the same functions

from a consumer perspective. The question is whether ownership and regulatory differences make them better in an objective sense, presumably by removing the profit motive and adversarial relations between institution and customer. Both enjoy a broad monopoly on consumer financial services in exchange for supposedly tight regulation as a public good.

As you say there are good and bad credit unions. They can be ideal for many consumers. But for many they are not the only rational choice. The idea that if consumers just knew about credit unions the banks would be in trouble is not realistic in practice. Consumers choose banks for reasons other than inertia.

I live where I could join several credit unions, including my employers'. Instead I have accounts with three commercial banks for different purposes. I'm not dumb. It's my money. I did a cost/benefit analysis.

Anyway my daily retail bank in NYC has been TD for years. I travel a lot and have various needs they meet much more cheaply and efficiently than the other major retail bank where I keep a backup account, again for specific reasons.

The idea of using an online only bank for a primary daily account strikes me as hardly worth a few fees or a few basis points of interest in this interest rate environment with low inflation. Banking is a service. One way or the other you pay for it. There are many options.

OP: your power over Ally is to tell them you're closing your account and then do it if they don't charge back the fees you say are unfair. They have no power over you greater than your power of walkking away. It's a competitive industry. Use real cost numbers. Banking costs money. Get what you pay for.

If you do, and want a regular working-class and decidedly customer-friendly attitude, all-over NYC (and many other areas) bank with great hours and a pet friendly policy and lollipops for the kids, that has never once screwed me over in years now (I routinely need to do international interbank transfers, for goddess' sake) and is backed by a Canadian company (important to me also for various reasons), I recommend giving TD a look.

[Gormy Cuss]

66. On a cost/benefit basis credit unions are almost always better for small depositors.

Lower minimum balances in accounts, fewer and lower fees than commercial banks.

The more money one has, the less likely that a credit union will be your best choice for all banking activities because commercial banks do want retail customers with more assets (and "more assets" doesn't mean rich, it just means that your accounts aren't hovering near empty most of the time.)

[smirkymonkey]

64. I agree. I have been with them for about 15 years and have NEVER had a problem

with them. Always very nice, great customer service. I am very happy with them.

[Binkie The Clown]

20. Resistance is futile. You have been assimilated. n/t

[bondwooley]

23. As much as I know you are right

I really hope that you are wrong.

[JonathanRackham]

28. No.

Call their customer service number and specifically ask to speak to a manager. Ask for names and write them down. We get jerked around by our cable company and our cell phone company all the time. Plead your case but don't threaten or be a jerk, but be firm. More than once we've had late charges dismissed when payments are a day or two late
.
It's usually a computer program that puts you in a a bind. Rank and file customer service people usually don't have the authority. When you hit the manager level the odds are you might actually find a person with a heart.

Damn programmers.

[edgineered]

37. With these calls, push 0 everytime you hear a non-human.

Only in a very few instances has it failed to get a person without having to listen to menu. The more poorly a company operates, the more likely that the menu options will return you to the first menu by excluding an option for your specific issue.

[JonathanRackham]

39. In my office that's called phone mail jail.

Smack the "0" button a dozen times in a row and you usually get a live body. I swear it's guerilla warfare in order to do business some days.

[scrubthedata]

29. I had an Ally account and it sucked

At first, I loved it -- it is almost completely electronic, and I loved the fact that you almost never had to deal with a human being who works at a bank. But eventually, the humans appear and ruin everything, mostly because their system is completely screwed up and the humans can only say that they "can't control anything in the computer system."

Terms like that scare me to death. You and everyone in reading distance with an Ally account should run for the hills and put your money in a mattress. Ally is an evil company owned by GMAC and tries to pretend that it's your next door neighbor who figured out a great app that can same you time and money.

Nope.

[CountAllVotes]

56. Ally is an evil company owned by GMAC

Last edited Mon Nov 23, 2015, 02:36 PM - Edit history (1)

Exactly and they reek of the odor of Michael Milken. See my post below for more info. re: this rich pig that ended up IN JAIL!

More about Ally Bank & their great (!) reviews here:

http://www.mybanktracker.com/Ally-Bank/Reviews

[bondwooley]

69. Point taken

and it's a very very valid point.

[zalinda]

33. My credit union

will pay the check even if there isn't enough money in the checking account. I think you get a couple of oops moments and then they charge you. You do have to have a savings account with most credit unions though, but at mine it's only $5 minimum.

Z

[forsaken mortal]

36. What is the motivation for a bank to do that?

Are they hoping you'll overdraw again so they can pile more fees on you? Is it an excuse to hold the money so they can earn some interest on it? I don't see the logic to holding the check instead of clearing it asap.

[scrubthedata]

52. The longer

they hold onto a check the more interest they make from the funds, and the lass interest they have to pay the depositor.

One check doesn't mean much, but thousands a day, 365 days a year can be a big chunk of their income. And it's all thanks to some government loopholes that don't care about the effect on consumers.

[hobbit709]

40. Credit union.

[Orrex]

41. You're getting screwed, but...

You note:

But what Regulation CC doesn’t seem to say is that every check the customer deposits for the next six months will be held for 5 business days (which, of course, means 8 days because the day of deposit doesn’t count and there’s always a weekend in there).

Well, there's this:

For certain types of deposits, Regulation CC permits financial institutions to delay, for a "reasonable period of time," the availability of funds. A "reasonable" time period is generally defined as one additional business day (making a total of two business days) for on-us checks, and five additional business days (total of seven) for local checks; your institution may impose longer exception holds, but you may have the burden of proving that they are "reasonable."

And if you're a new (less than 30 days) customer::

Deposits into accounts of new customers (open for less than 30 days)--Next-day availability applies only to cash, electronic payments, and the first $5,000 of any other next-day items; the remaining amount from next-day items must be available by the ninth business day. You may choose any availability schedule for deposits of other checks into the accounts of these new customers.

So, yes, you're getting screwed, but what they're doing seems to meet the requirements, and another bank might very well treat you the same. Have you considered a credit union? They're generally less inclined to abuse their customers.

[dembotoz]

42. it is time to leave

i had an abusive relationship with a bank for years..finally left

you can be happy again

[fayhunter]

48. Takes guts

but worth it.

[Vinca]

43. This is one of many very good reasons to bank locally.

Find a small town bank or credit union and open an account there. If you make a mistake like the one you described, you can walk in, speak to a living and breathing person, and most of the time be given a second chance with no penalties. Every bank and credit union follows similar procedures for processing checks and almost all deposits clear overnight. As for Ally, if they've got any kind of rule or regulation in their favor, they'll continue to screw you for as long as you let them.

[panader0]

44. I'm sorry to hear that.

I had thought of transferring my savings account to Ally. My bank pays .01 percent interest.
Ally pays .83---83 times as much--with no minimum required. Only online banks can offer
that kind of interest, but now I may re-think my plan.

[bondwooley]

49. I was sorry too

For 4 months they seemed to be really good and easy to work with. In fact, as long as you had a smartphone, you didn't have to work "with them" at all. But soon as you need a human....

If you go with them, I'd suggest making it a backup account that you just don't really interact with much and occasionally deposit something in there.

[CountAllVotes]

55. Barclay's Bank has an online savings account

It pays 1.0% and it has an "American Dream" account that pays a bit more. I'm like you and yes, I want something more than a measly a tenth of one percent for a savings account, I mean seriously, what is the point?

Read more about it here:

https://www.banking.barclaysus.com/online-savings.html

I have an account with this place and so far so good!

[CountAllVotes]

54. GMAC Bank has become Ally Bank

Last edited Mon Nov 23, 2015, 02:39 PM - Edit history (2)

The same GMAC that embraced the likes of Michael Milken, rich pig that he was/is:

>>Michael Robert Milken (born July 4, 1946) is an American former financier and philanthropist. He is noted for his role in the development of the market for high-yield bonds ("junk bonds&quot ,[1] for his conviction following a guilty plea on felony charges for violating U.S. securities laws, and for his charitable giving.

Milken was indicted for racketeering and securities fraud in 1989 in an insider trading investigation. As the result of a plea bargain, he pled guilty to securities and reporting violations but not to racketeering or insider trading. Milken was sentenced to ten years in prison, fined $600 million, and permanently barred from the securities industry by the Securities and Exchange Commission. His sentence was later reduced to two years for cooperating with testimony against his former colleagues and for good behavior.[2]

His critics cited him as the epitome of Wall Street greed during the 1980s, and nicknamed him the "Junk Bond King".

Supporters, like George Gilder in his book, Telecosm (2000), state that "Milken was a key source of the organizational changes that have impelled economic growth over the last twenty years. Most striking was the productivity surge in capital, as Milken...and others took the vast sums trapped in old-line businesses and put them back into the markets."[3]

Since his release from prison, Milken has funded medical research.[4] He is co-founder of the Milken Family Foundation, chairman of the Milken Institute, and founder of medical philanthropies funding research into melanoma, cancer and other life-threatening diseases. A prostate cancer survivor, Milken has devoted significant resources to research on the disease.[5] In a November 2004 cover article, Fortune magazine called him "The Man Who Changed Medicine" for changes in approach to funding and results that he initiated.[4]

Milken's compensation, while head of the high-yield bond department at Drexel Burnham Lambert in the late 1980s, exceeded $1 billion in a four-year period, a new record for U.S. income at that time.[6] With an estimated net worth of around $2 billion as of 2010, he is ranked by Forbes magazine as the 488th richest person in the world.[7][8]

And if this doesn't "rich pig" you out, then there is this (Ally Bank has NO location!).

https://www.scamguard.com/ally-bank-limited-international/

Some of their other great deals, like CDs with minimal crack fees are also a joke as they have no provision for an early withdrawal (aka "crack fee&quot available if you are disabled and/or become disabled with is standard fare for just about any other CD you can buy (read the fine print please!).

The essence of all of this is to stay far far away from these crooks best I can tell. If I as the OP I'd get away from these sorry sacks o'shyte ASAP!

[scrubthedata]

60. GM?

I remember GM Capital. If Ally is the same thing, then they are behaving here just as one should suspect.

[CountAllVotes]

73. Sorry for any confusion

I tend to get GE mixed up with GMAC.

More about the Ally Bank/GMAC connection here:

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2010-09-20/gmac-mortgage-halts-home-foreclosures-in-23-states-including-florida-n-y-

[ryan_cats]

57. Isn't

Isn't it wonderful that banks in 2015 can still take advantage of check float? Even though 99.9% of checks clear by midnight the day they're deposited and it has been that way for many years.

Try counting on that float as a consumer like it was the 80s and 90s and you'll find yourself overdrawn.

Great that the bank is able to exploit a loophole doing it on their customer's backs. I applaud the audacity.

[Holly_Hobby]

58. Ally bank is one of the worst, in my experience

We financed a car lease through them - never again! Very difficult to deal with. We traded in the car early to get them out of our lives - and we never missed a payment or were late. To this day, I now ask who the lender is. If there is no choice but Ally, we walk away and go elsewhere.

[scrubthedata]

63. Did you also have

a savings and checking account with them? Or was auto your only experience?

[Holly_Hobby]

65. Just auto -

this was in 2009 after the collapse and auto leases were difficult to get. I initially didn't want to sign the contract because I'd never heard of Ally Bank, but my husband told me to check my paranoia and I signed. He has learned to trust my "paranoia".

We got phone call after phone call as payment reminders - 4 or 5 the week before it was due. I asked to be removed from the call list, they refused. I couldn't make on-line payments like you would normally do for other banks - I had to go through a 3rd party that cost $3.50 extra each time. At the time, I didn't have on-line banking to avoid this extra cost, which totaled $105 for 30 payments. We had 6 payments left, but traded it in to stop the excessive phone calls and payment charges.

Within a month of signing the contract and forking over our phone number, address and email, the junk mail, email and phone calls soliciting for every kind of auto insurance imaginable started, and continues to this day. Their privacy policy states we've given permission, but we weren't furnished that until it was a done deal.

[scrubthedata]

70. Sounds like a horror story.

Thanks for sharing. Good to know.

[meaculpa2011]

61. Many years ago I deposited my paycheck...

which was drawn on a Chase payroll account, into my Chase checking account and then wrote a check to pay my Chase credit card.

You guessed it. They bounced the check for "uncollected funds" because I hadn't waited the requisite five business days.

That was in 1972, so the "Tricks & Traps" business model has been in force for decades and none of the accomplices in government will ever do a thing about it except bluster.

[dembotoz]

67. same thing happened to my kid

between the overage fees for money that was actually in his account it cost him a planned vacation
the bank manager kept telling him they could have charged him even more...

went to a credit union
much happier

[fayhunter]

68. Yeah, good old Chase

After my mother died, they they sent a collection agency after her -- not because there was a balance left when she died, but because they charged her an annual fee after she died, and she was too dead to know that they renewed her 'membership".

[Facility Inspector]

71. If you're a high income customer

and have cash flow, banks treat you a lot better and you don't have to keep a constant eye on the clock.

[fayhunter]

72. Hoping that

I can experience that after opening my Christmas stocking this year.