General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWho was more evil: Kissinger or Cheney?
I'd post this as a poll, but am not eligible to, so will just put it out here as a question--who's worse? My answer, after agonizing for a week, would be Cheney...but it's close...
SummerSnow
(12,608 posts)geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)annabanana
(52,791 posts)is pretty damaging
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)Iraq . . .
A one-man wave of war crimes rolling across the entire planet.
annabanana
(52,791 posts)You have a fair point.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)So on March 25, 1971, the Pakistani Army launched a devastating crackdown on the rebellious Bengalis in the east. Midway through the bloodshed, both the C.I.A. and the State Department conservatively estimated that about 200,000 people had died (the Bangladeshi government figure is much higher, at three million). As many as 10 million Bengali refugees fled across the border into India, where they died in droves in wretched refugee camps.
...
Nixon and Kissinger barely tried to exert leverage over Pakistans military government. In the pivotal days before the crackdown began on March 25, they consciously decided not to warn the Pakistani generals against opening fire on their population. They did not press for respecting the election results, nor did they prod the military to cut a power-sharing deal with the Bengali leadership. They did not offer warnings or impose conditions that might have dissuaded the Pakistani junta from atrocities. Nor did they threaten the loss of American military or economic support after the slaughter began.
Nixon and Kissinger were not just motivated by dispassionate realpolitik, weighing Pakistans help with the secret opening to China or Indias pro-Soviet leanings. The White House tapes capture their emotional rage, going far beyond Nixons habitual vulgarity. In the Oval Office, Nixon told Kissinger that the Indians needed a mass famine. Kissinger sneered at people who bleed for the dying Bengalis.
They were unmoved by the suffering of Bengalis, despite detailed reporting about the killing from Archer K. Blood, the brave United States consul general in East Pakistan. Nor did Nixon and Kissinger waver when Kenneth B. Keating, a former Republican senator from New York then serving as the American ambassador to India, personally confronted them in the Oval Office about a matter of genocide that targeted the Hindu minority among the Bengalis.
After Mr. Bloods consulate sent an extraordinary cable formally dissenting from American policy, decrying what it called genocide, Nixon and Kissinger ousted Mr. Blood from his post in East Pakistan. Kissinger privately scorned Mr. Blood as this maniac; Nixon called Mr. Keating a traitor.
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/fighting_words/2010/12/how_can_anyone_defend_kissinger_now.html
Kissinger quote:
Hitchens spoke for me (re: Kissinger):
Cheney is a royal asshole, but Kissinger is demonic.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)three decades ago for crimes against humanity. A true monster in human form, and a practitioner of pure evil on a scale only one step down from Hitler and Stalin.
That Hitch quote is bang-on the mark.
Gregorian
(23,867 posts)I fall into the category of men who were chasing after women during his tenure. My knowledge is only in retrospect. That's a scary list to present to the owner of your next lifetime. I killed a few spiders, but.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)Gidney N Cloyd
(19,840 posts)I feel a Walter Sobchak quote coming on.
darkangel218
(13,985 posts)MiniMe
(21,717 posts)Jon Luc Picard
(4 posts)Quackers
(2,256 posts)The Velveteen Ocelot
(115,732 posts)It's a tough call.
Hepburn
(21,054 posts)No doubt about it. He would have sold his grandchildren into sexual slavery to get the nod to go to war.
EVIL, MOTHERF*CKING EVIL...no redeeming value and no soul.
FLPanhandle
(7,107 posts)nt
annabanana
(52,791 posts)geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)That's profoundly evil.
valerief
(53,235 posts)tartan2
(314 posts)Wounded Bear
(58,662 posts)Most of Kissinger's worst crimes were un-reported. Americans were rather unconcerned about foreign affairs, and the Internet made it easier for Cheney's crimes to leak out.
So, I guess Kissinger. He was the model Cheney followed.
Gregorian
(23,867 posts)roscoeroscoe
(1,370 posts)All of the above...
mvd
(65,174 posts)Both extremely arrogant, war criminals, wrecked the areas where they started wars. But Cheney started the longest war activity ever in a region, so he does have that on Kissinger.
elleng
(130,964 posts)merrily
(45,251 posts)hifiguy
(33,688 posts)mainly because his total body count is much higher. Approximately 2-3 million Vietnamese and Cambodians - w/o Henry the K there's no war in Cambodia and no Khmer Rouge/Pol Pot takeover, tens of thousands of Argentinians, Chileans, Bangladeshis, Timorese. Am I forgetting anyone? I have to be. Biafra, maybe?
Cheney's havoc was more geographically concentrated and in the end Kissinger (a "defender of human rights" according to HRH) stands alone.
randr
(12,412 posts)Not only all that but he paved the way for Cheney. Cheney would not had his own killing field if Kissinger had not interfered in the middle east.
Hekate
(90,714 posts)And I say that having lived through the Nixon administration.
tularetom
(23,664 posts)He's evil just for the sake of being evil, whereas there was a profit motive to Cheney's misdeeds.
That being said, I think there's a much better chance that Cheney, rather than Kissinger, is actually a zombie.
XemaSab
(60,212 posts)malaise
(269,045 posts)Both are equally evil - both should be locked up in the Hague or a Federal prison.
I will pop champagne when they croak.
Blue_In_AK
(46,436 posts)but my vote goes to Cheney, the personification of evil.
Herman4747
(1,825 posts)Kali
(55,013 posts)but kissinger is more so
Skittles
(153,169 posts)Little_Wing
(417 posts)Having lived through both:
Kissinger betrayed this country in an unfathomably silent and fatal fashion, laying waste to Vietnamese, Cambodians, U.S. sons and daughters, plus unaccounted for citizens in other overseas locales I will probably not live to see revealed. He is evil personified. He lusted for a place in history. He's evilly iconic, somehow. Right up there with the worst.
Cheney seems more a like a B-movie thug, unable to focus on anything outside of his self-serving ego and completely unemotional. Too bad for the middle east, as it devolves into chaos. With him, it is/was strictly dollars. He sneers at our empathy for those left behind. He doesn't get our repulsion. At all. More psychopathic than evil, somehow. Plus it is satisfying to deny him the title of most annoying anything save cynicism.
Kissinger.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)The Axis of Evil.