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seafan

(9,387 posts)
Tue Nov 3, 2015, 05:52 PM Nov 2015

Salon: How Jeb Bush cheated America & helped deliver the presidency to W

Thank you immensely, Heather Digby Parton, for this EXCELLENT review, on the anniversary of the hostile takeover 15 years ago today.

“Your little brother is not the ultimate authority”: How Jeb Bush cheated America & helped deliver the presidency to W, Nov 3, 2015

Fifteen years ago, America voted for Al Gore. Unfortunately for Gore, he didn't have a governor for a brother



(Credit: Reuters/Jim Young)

When some of us hear Jeb Bush’s new slogan, “Jeb can fix it,” we don’t think of a mechanic getting under the hood and fixing the nation’s problems. We don’t even think of Jimmy Savile, the notorious British pedophile, whose show was called “Jim’ll fix it,” although some people sure will. No, we think about Election 2000 and the Florida recount, where Jeb proved that his slogan isn’t all hot air. Whatever else he did as Governor of Florida, when it came to that election, Jeb fixed it.

Anyone old enough to remember that election night, which was 15 years ago today, will remember that the outcome of the electoral college depended on that one state. And what came next is exactly what anyone would have predicted would happen when an election is so close it triggers a recount in a state in which the levers of power and the electoral machinery are run by one of the candidates’ brothers. That candidate was the one who became president.

The road George W. and Jeb Bush took to get there was complicated and difficult, and in the end had to be decided by a couple of Supreme Court justices who happened to have been appointed by the Bush brothers’ dad when he was president. (Who says that dynasties have no clout in American politics?) But Jeb proved himself to be particularly adept at getting the job done without getting his hands dirty.

.....

The media played an interesting part as well. The networks first called the election for Gore based on exit polls which later turned out to correctly predict for whom the people actually voted that day. Fox News, with one of its earliest political coups, was the first to call it for Bush. A consultant by the name of John Ellis, who later admitted to being on the phone with Jeb and George W. Bush throughout the evening, is the fellow who made that initial call for Fox. If his name sounds familiar it’s because John Ellis, is also Jeb Bush’s name; “Jeb” stands for John Ellis Bush. Ellis is George W. and Jeb’s first cousin.

The Bush campaign knew that once they had established their “lead” they needed to keep it. The key was to be able to declare victory and then portray the Gore campaign as being sore losers who refused to accept defeat. On election night, they almost succeeded in getting Gore to capitulate without a fight. He was on the way to make his concession speech when his team told him to hold up, that the margin was ridiculously tight and that a recount would be mandated by state law. The phone call that happened next was a very telling exchange:

.....

Jeb may not have been the ultimate authority but he had plenty of influence on the state’s electoral machinery, particularly the Secretary of State Katherine Harris who was in charge of the recount and who also happened to be one of George W. Bush’s campaign co-chairs. According to Jeffrey Toobin’s book “Too Close to Call” an angry Jeb awakened Harris at three in the morning to chastise her for allowing the assistant director of elections to go on TV and discuss Florida election laws, which required recounts and a standard of determining the intent of the voter. Jeb had this foolish bureaucrat yanked from the air immediately and he assigned her a political advisor by the name of Mac Stipanovich, a close political associate and master of Florida politics and electoral machinery.

.....



Village Voice:

Baker was practically announcing that Brother Jeb had put the legislature in play. With Feeney’s majority approving the Bush slate the very day that the U.S. Supreme Court weighed its final decision, the First Family of Texas and Florida was making it clear that it was even prepared to circumvent a 7 to 2 Republican court if it didn’t like the ultimate decision.



Digby again:

That may have been the single most important move by Jeb Bush during the whole recount period. By getting the legislature to provide the final backstop the media began the drumbeat that there was little point in further pursuing the recount. With the Florida Republicans prepared to use the arcane rules of the legislature to install George W. Bush no matter what the vote tally ultimately showed, the press now assumed Bush would be president. This was when they began to pat America on the back for being so civilized in the way it handles such disputes (there were no tanks in the streets!) and to tell Democrats to “get over it.”



More from my own research here. And here.


Jeb should be hammered with this at each and every opportunity that comes.

Just like Daddy, always keeping his own hands clean, Jeb Bush is a long-time fixer.


He is one of the leading bad actors responsible for the ongoing catastrophe draining the life out of our country today.




46 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Salon: How Jeb Bush cheated America & helped deliver the presidency to W (Original Post) seafan Nov 2015 OP
kick his ass-----evil family Angry Dragon Nov 2015 #1
And for this, we are NEVER letting this bastard go. seafan Nov 2015 #2
Are you losing the election to Al Gore? Don't worry Jeb can fix it. Johonny Nov 2015 #3
k n fucking r cui bono Nov 2015 #4
yep, Jeb can fix it! napkinz Nov 2015 #5
PLUS ONE, a whole bunch! Enthusiast Nov 2015 #7
Damn, these are good! Thanks for posting them! nt TrollBuster9090 Nov 2015 #13
Although, I suppose that pointing this out will only INCREASE his poll numbers with GOP voters? TrollBuster9090 Nov 2015 #14
Is his team THAT clueless? Jerry442 Nov 2015 #15
May I ask you a question about 2004? I vividly remember Laura PourMeADrink Nov 2015 #6
Hi, Laura. Yes, I remember that too. seafan Nov 2015 #17
thanks so much for gathering that. wish there was a video of that Laura PourMeADrink Nov 2015 #27
"Start with Broward", Governor Jeb Bush told Karl Rove, on Election Night 2004. seafan Nov 2015 #31
The Bush clan is unethical. Enthusiast Nov 2015 #8
Unethical? That's a nice way of stating what they are! smirkymonkey Nov 2015 #22
But at least everyone, even in the right wing media, should admit they're unethical. Enthusiast Nov 2015 #26
Looking back, we should have demanded that Jeb recuse himself - somehow. nt Laura PourMeADrink Nov 2015 #9
Jeb! can certainly fix elections. nt valerief Nov 2015 #10
Jeb Governor 1999-2007 Laura PourMeADrink Nov 2015 #28
The November Criminals Chasstev365 Nov 2015 #11
Duh! That's What He Means By "Jeb Can Fix It." TrollBuster9090 Nov 2015 #12
I will never forget how awful I felt when Scotus stopped the recount. Punkingal Nov 2015 #16
That doesn't stop him chapdrum Nov 2015 #18
Kick kick kick kick kick kick kick Jeb's entitled ass. Hekate Nov 2015 #19
After a while, we become numb.. mountain grammy Nov 2015 #20
I seem to recall reading... gregcrawford Nov 2015 #21
Paging Octafish. seafan Nov 2015 #23
Russ Baker's book on the benighted Bushes chapdrum Nov 2015 #35
"it blames the actual perpetrators; in other words it blames our Republican allies MisterP Nov 2015 #24
Yes, the Florida legislature did threaten to send a Republican slate to the Electoral College Samantha Nov 2015 #25
Not sure how true that is... davidn3600 Nov 2015 #30
Yes, the legislature determines the slate, but the Florida state constitution stipulated that the Samantha Nov 2015 #33
Jeb Bush shoved the heist into the FL legislature. But he didn't keep his hands clean this time. seafan Nov 2015 #43
How stupid of Trump to tweet that nasty stuff about Jeb last night Laura PourMeADrink Nov 2015 #29
Too bad for Jeb that Dubya is not in a position to repay the favor. nt Nitram Nov 2015 #32
K&R emsimon33 Nov 2015 #34
Hey! You're supposed to be lookin forward here! grahamhgreen Nov 2015 #36
JEB Crow Shrub "should be hammered with this...every opportunity"!1 If TRUMP hammered Shrub UTUSN Nov 2015 #37
Trump, at next week's GOP debate, should zero in on Jeb!'s role in Election 2000. seafan Nov 2015 #39
The fix was in. yardwork Nov 2015 #38
Please read Greg Palast's book The Best Democracy Money Can Buy Midnight Writer Nov 2015 #40
This... ^^^ Gumboot Nov 2015 #41
CRIMINAL BASTARDS John Poet Nov 2015 #42
k and r niyad Nov 2015 #44
In this vein, and what happened in the intervening 8 years, Jeb destroyed America. IHateTheGOP Nov 2015 #45
The Bushes have double-crossed America. seafan Nov 2015 #46

seafan

(9,387 posts)
2. And for this, we are NEVER letting this bastard go.
Tue Nov 3, 2015, 06:05 PM
Nov 2015

It is a nightmare that never ends for Floridians, especially, because we couldn't overcome the Bush Machine. It was the kind of darkness that overtook everything around you, as you witnessed a presidential election stolen from the country in broad daylight.

I still think about it in the present tense. And I mourn for the many thousands of lives destroyed because of this one Family.


But, for these criminals, things are different now.


Johonny

(20,851 posts)
3. Are you losing the election to Al Gore? Don't worry Jeb can fix it.
Tue Nov 3, 2015, 06:19 PM
Nov 2015

He certainly fixed the 2000 election...

 

Laura PourMeADrink

(42,770 posts)
6. May I ask you a question about 2004? I vividly remember
Tue Nov 3, 2015, 07:24 PM
Nov 2015

the footage of the Bush family in a hotel on election night. And something like W said what's going on in the 1-4 corridor and Jeb said he would "make some calls"

Last time I looked I couldn't find anything on this episode. Have you ever seen it?

I remember it stinking to high heaven.

I am much more upset about 2004. We weren't savvy in 2000 - but had no excuse in '04. Kerry was ahead in pre-election polls - believe by 2-4? Then Bush "won" by a swing of 6. As long as I live I will never believe it wasn't rigged. Especially since exits said most people made up their minds weeks before and not days before.

P.S. Don't forget Jeb's felon purge I - luckily felon purge II was averted.

seafan

(9,387 posts)
17. Hi, Laura. Yes, I remember that too.
Tue Nov 3, 2015, 08:12 PM
Nov 2015

Last edited Tue Nov 3, 2015, 10:01 PM - Edit history (1)

Laura PourMeADrink, your question about 2004 reminded me of what Karl Rove bragged about:


By STEVE BOUSQUET, Times Staff Writer
June 2, 2006

Rove, who is under investigation in the leak of a CIA operative’s identity, thrilled the partisan audience with behind-the-scenes anecdotes in the West Wing or on Air Force One. He recalled his sophisticated computer program to track returns on election night 2004 that contradicted exit polls showing Bush losing in Florida.

“I’ll never forget. The first county I clicked was Hernando. Then Pasco. And about that time, Jeb called in,” Rove recalled. “I started working my way down the east coast and he said, 'Start with Broward.’ … It was clear, we were running well ahead of where we needed to run, and Jeb said, 'We’re going to win, and we’re going to win big.’ ”
--snip



And here they all were, grinning from ear to ear.


November 2, 2004, Bush Family


One thing to remember about Jeb Bush. He is a micromanager in everything he does.

He was acting as a direct liaison between Rove, cousin John Ellis at the FOX election desk in 2000 and all the various operatives, attorneys and judges in both 2000 and 2004.

Here are two more valuable links:

Jeb Bush's Recount Role Examined, July 14, 2001, LA Times

WASHINGTON — When it became clear that the disputed Florida election could deliver the White House to his brother, Gov. Jeb Bush immediately recused himself from any official role in the recount, promising to avoid even the "slightest appearance of a conflict of interest."

He directed his staff to spend their time on government business and pledged to do the same. Vowing that no political work would be done on the taxpayers' dime, six staffers took unpaid leaves to volunteer on the recount.

Despite that hands-off policy, the Florida governor's office in Tallahassee made 95 telephone calls to the George W. Bush presidential campaign, its advisors, lawyers and staffers during the 36-day recount period, records show. At least 10 calls came from an office number used primarily by Jeb Bush, including one call to a private line in George W. Bush's gubernatorial office in Austin.

Another call from Jeb Bush's number went to Karl Rove, his brother's campaign strategist. One went to the Texas governor's chief of staff, Clay Johnson. Another went to Michigan Gov. John Engler, who soon flew to Florida to monitor the ballot recount in Broward County. Additional calls were logged to cell phones assigned to Bush campaign staffers.

In an e-mail this week to The Times, Jeb Bush said he could not recall the purpose of the calls. "I have no clue what these calls were about," he wrote.

"They most likely were return phone calls," Bush added. "In the alternative, they could have been my assistant passing on a request for an invitation to speak or an autographed picture. They might have been answering a request on where to eat in Tallahassee for the hoards [sic] of Austin folks that made their way here. They could have been for many reasons. I don't remember."

.....







Jeb Bush's elephant in the room: Role in Bush v. Gore recount, April 16, 2015, Des Moines Register

Little noticed among Jeb Bush's recently released emails, published on jebemails.com, is this one (Dec. 6, 2000) offering thanks to his brother's future Supreme Court Chief Justice Appointee, John Roberts, for legal advice during the election. "Thank you for your time today. I really appreciate your input on my role in this unique and historic situation," he wrote.

If Bush wants to run for the presidency in 2016, he should answer questions about his involvement, and the media should fact-check and obtain the truth.

Jeb Bush may have a problem in the primaries with his family name because of his father and brother's legacies of the Iraq war and the 2008 recession —issues that may have been handled very differently in a Gore presidency — and now attempts to distance himself from them with the widely covered statement, "I'm my own man." The media has not, however, even mentioned what may be his biggest problem: his level of responsibility in Florida for taking the 2000 election from Gore and the national repercussions.

Bush's communications director in July 2001, Katie Baur, said, "While he recused himself from any involvement in what happened after Nov. 7, he did not recuse himself from his role as a brother." What's not known is that the level of direct involvement was, frankly, enormous. The Los Angeles Times reported on July 14, 2001, "The Florida governor's office in Tallahassee made 95 telephone calls to the George W. Bush presidential campaign, its advisors, lawyers and staffers during the 36-day recount period, records show. At least 10 calls came from an office number used primarily by Jeb Bush."

At least one call from Jeb Bush's number "went to Karl Rove, his brother's campaign strategist. ... One went to the Texas governor's chief of staff, Clay Johnson. Additional calls were logged to cell phones assigned to Bush campaign staffers."

Bush emailed in July 2001: "I have no clue what these calls were about." He had "no clue" of what his own calls were about while his brother was on the cusp of winning or losing the presidency?

.....


Hope this doesn't raise your blood pressure too much, Laura PourMeADrink.....






 

Laura PourMeADrink

(42,770 posts)
27. thanks so much for gathering that. wish there was a video of that
Wed Nov 4, 2015, 10:04 AM
Nov 2015

night in hotel. That comment by Jeb "Start with Broward" ...wonder what the meaning of that is? I know Broward was our stronghold with lots of votes - so start there? Or something more nefarious?

Have you wondered why they allowed Obama to take Florida in 08 and 12 - guess maybe it shows that since Jeb's last year of governorship was 2007 it wasn't worth it to him to finagle or let a couple real result years kick in so when he runs for prez - it won't be so obvious?

seafan

(9,387 posts)
31. "Start with Broward", Governor Jeb Bush told Karl Rove, on Election Night 2004.
Wed Nov 4, 2015, 12:00 PM
Nov 2015

Broward County, Florida is the largest population of Democratic voters in Florida; it was and is a goldmine of Republican vote theft. With the VERY LARGE numbers of reliable Democratic votes in that county, many thousands of those votes could be shaved away from Dem totals and added to the GOP column, and it would never attract attention. Broward still goes Democratic in the end, but large numbers of Dem votes are nefariously flipped to the Republican tally. All of this quite under the radar, you see.

That is the secret of "Karl's numbers". Oh, yes, he was proud of his "numbers".



Here are Karl Rove and his accomplice Susan B. Ralston, busily "crunching the numbers" on Election Night 2004.
Hat tip to DUer bleever


From 2006, here are two posts of mine on this subject:

Paper ballots and NOT paper trails! This is critical.

"Paper trails" are ONLY used for recount IF, and this is a BIG IF, the election is close or the results questioned. Otherwise, the paper trail records are never examined. This does not help ensure that the machine count is accurate at all.

All the GOP needs to do is skim enough electronic/optically scanned votes from heavily Democratic/minority areas and add them to the GOP column to go undetected. Just like they did in Ohio. And Florida. And New Mexico. And other states. This type of theft would never trigger a recount in the first place, so voila! The paper trail is never examined. And another election is stolen from the people.


I cannot emphasize this enough, because it is the answer.


We MUST vote on a paper ballot in the first place. Then, the paper MUST BE HAND COUNTED at the precinct.


NO MACHINES.

NO MACHINES.


ABSOLUTELY NO MACHINES.




We must have accurate exit polling that's NOT *corrected*

in the wee hours of the next day, *to fit Karl Rove's new numbers.*

I will NEVER forget that as it happened after midnight on election day, 2004.


Pen and paper ballots.

Unadulterated exit polling.

Hand counts at every precinct.



NEVER Forget.




Jebbie says we got it! Jebbie says we got it!

"It was just the three of us guys handing the phone back and forth--me with the numbers, one of them a governor, the other the president-elect. Now that was cool." ---John Ellis, Bush cousin, working the Fox News Channel election desk on November 7, 2000, as the network unilaterally proclaimed a Bush win at 2:16 am.
(Link no longer active)



'There will be blood: Prepare for nasty Jeb Bush — but don’t expect any fingerprints'



 

smirkymonkey

(63,221 posts)
22. Unethical? That's a nice way of stating what they are!
Tue Nov 3, 2015, 09:08 PM
Nov 2015

Hell, it's practically flirtation. They are the most corrupt family this country has ever seen.

Enthusiast

(50,983 posts)
26. But at least everyone, even in the right wing media, should admit they're unethical.
Wed Nov 4, 2015, 05:23 AM
Nov 2015

We know they are murderous thugs.

 

Laura PourMeADrink

(42,770 posts)
28. Jeb Governor 1999-2007
Wed Nov 4, 2015, 10:21 AM
Nov 2015

Presidental Election Results - Florida

Jeb Bush Years

1996 - Dem 48% + 6 !!
1996 - Rep 42%

2000 - Rep 48%
2000 - Dem 48%

2004 - Rep 52 %
2004 - Dem 47 %


2008 - Dem 50 % +2 !!
2008 - Rep 48 %

2012 - Dem 50 % + 1 !!
2012 - Rep 49 %

Chasstev365

(5,191 posts)
11. The November Criminals
Tue Nov 3, 2015, 07:41 PM
Nov 2015

There should have been a general strike in this country when the SP Court stole the presidency for the Bush family
, but the American "Sheepeople" just excepted it. How sad.

TrollBuster9090

(5,954 posts)
12. Duh! That's What He Means By "Jeb Can Fix It."
Tue Nov 3, 2015, 07:42 PM
Nov 2015

When it comes to fixing elections, or 'fixing' the Florida voter registration rolls to make sure only plutocrat lapdogs can get elected, he's the man who can FIX IT!

 

chapdrum

(930 posts)
18. That doesn't stop him
Tue Nov 3, 2015, 08:29 PM
Nov 2015

from running for preznit.

As if the average American gives a rat's patootie that Jebbie did this.

Hey, you're a winner or a loser, baby.

Hekate

(90,690 posts)
19. Kick kick kick kick kick kick kick Jeb's entitled ass.
Tue Nov 3, 2015, 08:44 PM
Nov 2015

Some of us have not forgotten the coup d'etat, and it will remain a bitter memory as long as we draw breath.

mountain grammy

(26,621 posts)
20. After a while, we become numb..
Tue Nov 3, 2015, 08:52 PM
Nov 2015

the media keeps us uninformed and sedated. It's not good for the corporate sponsors to upset the consumers. We just might not buy as much of the crap they're selling us every 15 minutes.

gregcrawford

(2,382 posts)
21. I seem to recall reading...
Tue Nov 3, 2015, 08:54 PM
Nov 2015

... that Allen Dulles pulled Grampa Prescott Bush's fat out of the fire when he was caught laundering money for the Nazis through his bank in the Netherlands. I believe the old bastard was connected to the attempt to overthrow FDR in '33, but Smedley Butler dropped a dime on the bunch of 'em.

Bush treachery probably goes all the way back to the Stone Age.

 

chapdrum

(930 posts)
35. Russ Baker's book on the benighted Bushes
Wed Nov 4, 2015, 04:37 PM
Nov 2015

is er, interesting.

Your comment about the reach of treachery:

And following not far behind, the gullibility of millions of Americans in taking
any of this family seriously.

MisterP

(23,730 posts)
24. "it blames the actual perpetrators; in other words it blames our Republican allies
Wed Nov 4, 2015, 02:16 AM
Nov 2015

instead of Nader, who causes storms and childbed fever; please revise"

--Likud-Way MisterP

Samantha

(9,314 posts)
25. Yes, the Florida legislature did threaten to send a Republican slate to the Electoral College
Wed Nov 4, 2015, 04:15 AM
Nov 2015

regardless of the outcome of the recount. People believed it would live up to that threat. However, it would have been a violation of the U.S. Constitution to do so and the Electoral College could have refused to count Florida's votes. David Bois made this point about two years after the election, but no one publicly said this in court and the press seemed ignorant of the fact.

If election law is changed, it cannot be done so and applied right after an election -- it can only have impact at the time of THE NEXT election. A state cannot change the rules that close in order to change the result of the election.

Additionally, the Constitution delegates the conduct of Presidential elections to the states provided the state has its election laws defined in its state constitution and abides by those rules. Florida did have its election laws outlined in its State constitution, it just was not going to abide by them. That too would have made it possible for the Electoral College to throw out Florida's slate.

But if that is not bad enough, there was a Constitution lawyer who during the election volunteered his time to assist Jeb Bush with election problems. One might rationally assume the expert knew these threats being made were illegal, but obviously that did not matter. "Win at all costs" was indeed the rule of the day. That expert's name is John Roberts, the same John Roberts who George W. Bush* eventually gave a Supreme Court seat and made the Chief Judge. To the victor does indeed belong the spoils.

Although 15 years have passed since this truly damaging election theft occurred, it appears the Bush family assumed that was a long enough time for people to have forgotten and 2016 would be a good year to run Jeb. This will never be forgotten, and it will never be a good year to run Jeb.

Sam

 

davidn3600

(6,342 posts)
30. Not sure how true that is...
Wed Nov 4, 2015, 10:34 AM
Nov 2015

The Constitution says in Article II, Section I,

Each State shall appoint, in such Manner as the Legislature thereof may direct, a Number of Electors, equal to the whole Number of Senators and Representatives to which the State may be entitled in the Congress: but no Senator or Representative,



So the legislature has ultimate authority in how the electors are chosen. That means they can split up the electoral votes. They can decide to choose the electors themselves. Now, I don't know the legality of doing it after an election. And the Florida state constitution may have a role also. But the US Constitution does NOT guarantee a citizen the right to vote for President. It is not in that document anywhere. The states vote for the President, and the states give you the right to play a part in that process. It's weird, but that's how the founders set it up.

But even if Florida's vote isn't counted...let's say that for whatever reason the Florida slate is tossed. Gore still doesn't reach 270 either. That means the whole electoral college is tossed out and the House of Representatives picks the president. So again you are stuck because the House would have picked Bush.
That's actually happened twice in our history. Thomas Jefferson was elected President by the House. And it was one hell of a political battle.

Samantha

(9,314 posts)
33. Yes, the legislature determines the slate, but the Florida state constitution stipulated that the
Wed Nov 4, 2015, 02:35 PM
Nov 2015

makeup of that slate would be determined by the outcome of the popular vote. So if the recount had in fact been allowed to be completed as the Florida Supreme Court had ordered, whatever the result of that recount turned out to be as far as Republican votes and Democratic votes, the Florida legislature had by its own law to assemble the composition of Electoral College Votes to reflect the results of the popular vote.

So the Legislature has you say the ultimate authority, but it was required to determine the law by inserting the rules in the state Constitution prior to the election (which it had done). It is not allowed after the election if one did not like the results to ab-lib in the moment and verbally make new laws. That is Unconstitutional. Florida is among the 48 states that is "winner take all." So if a Democrat were determined to have been the winner of the election after the recount, all of the slate would have been Democratic. Same if the recount reflected a Republican winner. The Legislature at that critical point had no legal backing to step in and change the rules.

The winner does not have to reach 270. The winner must win a majority. If the Florida slate were thrown out (discounted), the winner of the majority would have been Gore. I know there are those that say what your words reflect above, but experts at the time said 270 was the number needed only if Florida's votes were counted (electoral college votes). If they were excluded, that number would have been reduced by 25 and Gore would have held the majority. The election would have gone to the House of Representatives had there been a tie.

http://www.npr.org/sections/itsallpolitics/2012/10/31/163950264/presidential-race-what-if-there-are-two-winners

There's a small chance that the Electoral College could wind up in a tie, throwing the election decision to the House of Representatives. And there's a greater chance that one of the candidates (likely Obama) could carry the Electoral College — and with it, victory — even while losing the popular vote nationwide.


All of this being said, I am not an election law expert nor an attorney, and I do not play one on DU. For every fact you and I have both written, the other can refute it with examples in our electoral college history which ended up in an unorthodox manner.

But the best thing is, I believe, it is very healthy to hammer some of these questions out and what the basic law is because we might need a lot of sudden familiarity with this issue in 2016, and it is guaranteed that all the "experts" we hear commenting will be saying different things. This is what happened in 2000, so we need to know the laws ourselves.

Sam

seafan

(9,387 posts)
43. Jeb Bush shoved the heist into the FL legislature. But he didn't keep his hands clean this time.
Thu Nov 5, 2015, 01:31 PM
Nov 2015

All of the information below is from one of my old threads documenting Jeb Bush's actions in the aftermath of Election 2000.

I compiled a lengthy narrative in that thread, that has some missing links now, but are included in the text below, to identify the original source. The important excerpts from them are preserved.

I feel that this information is important to highlight again, for review and summation of what was going on at the time, now that "The Fixer" himself is lusting for the presidency, 15 years later into this criminal coup.



[font size=5]...................................[/font]

Now, returning to the cataclysmic days during the 2000 recount, the Republican strategists worried mightily about the heavy political damage that would ensue if Jeb Bush signed any highly partisan legislation to award the state's electoral votes to his brother, especially "if it looks like we are forcing this down people's throats".


But Jeb Bush's intent to push onward was exemplified:


Bush took another aggressive step on Sunday, when he signed a "certificate of ascertainment" formally naming Florida's electors for his brother almost immediately after the state canvassing commission certified George Bush as the winner. Only a handful of other states have delivered those papers to the federal government yet, and Democrats here believe Jeb Bush moved so quickly in part to help his brother argue that the Florida results are no longer realistically in dispute.

No state legislature has ever directly named a slate of electors in an effort to supersede those chosen through the popular vote--as Florida legislators would be doing if the courts order further recounts that give Gore the lead. That the candidate's brother could ultimately sign that historic legislation only intensifies the threat of a public backlash against both men, many Republicans acknowledge.

"It has the look of a South American political system," the senior GOP operative said.

.....




They further fretted that Jeb Bush's actions could undermine the legitimacy of a George W. Bush presidency.


What Jeb Bush wanted to avoid entirely was taking the risk of signing a partisan bill that would be seen as overturning the will of the people, especially if Gore took the lead in the recount.

If Bush had signed legislation awarding the state's electoral votes to his brother, and it somehow had survived a court challenge, the matter would have then proceeded to Congress for a decision between a slate of Bush electors chosen by the GOP-controlled Florida legislature, and a slate of Gore electors as authorized by the Florida courts.

The U. S. House was Republican-controlled. The Senate was split 50:50, with Gore to cast the tie-breaking vote as VP.


.....

That's when Jeb Bush would return to the spotlight: Under federal law, if the two chambers of Congress split on which slate of electors to recognize, the decision is handed back to the governor of the state that sent them. Which means that sometime in January, Jeb Bush may be able to personally cast the tie-breaking vote that makes his brother president of the United States.



Meanwhile, the recount process was working its way through the Florida courts in later November and early December 2000, to the great fear of Republican operatives, in the event the vote tally would put Gore into the lead.



But, Jeb Bush knew that his signing legislative intervention that would award the state's electoral votes to his brother would command a heavy price, not only for the legitimacy of his brother's presidency, but perhaps for his own national ambition in the future.

How would Jeb protect himself?


The only way to ensure that George W. Bush would be declared the winner, was to stop counting the votes.



This is where his fellow partisans at the U. S. Supreme Court stepped in, against the will of the people, to stop the Florida recount, by issuing a ruling that was worded specifically to be never used as future precedent, and would effectively declare George W. Bush as president.

Thus, Jeb Bush was insulated from heavy political fallout as his friends on the U. S. Supreme Court came to the rescue, ordering a halt to counting votes in Florida in a U. S. presidential election, an election in which Albert Gore led the national popular vote by more than 500,000 ballots.




.....

When a group of news organizations conducted an unofficial recount of Florida’s disputed ballots in 2001, Gore came out narrowly on top regardless of what standards were applied to the famous chads – dimpled, hanging or punched-through.

Gore’s victory would have been assured by the so-called “over-votes” in which a voter both punched through a candidate’s name and wrote it in. Under Florida law, such “over-votes” are legal and they broke heavily in Gore’s favor. (See Consortiumnews.com's "So Bush Did Steal the White House" or our book, Neck Deep.)

In other words, the wrong candidate had been awarded the presidency. However, this startling fact became an unpleasant reality that the mainstream U.S. news media decided to obscure.

The tally wasn’t completed until after the terrorist attacks on 9/11 and the prevailing view among senior news executives became that it would be harmful to the nation’s need for unity if the press reported that Gore was the rightful winner of Election 2000.

So, the major newspapers and TV networks hid their own scoop when the results were published on Nov. 12, 2001. Instead of stating clearly that Florida’s legally cast votes favored Gore, the mainstream media bent over backwards to concoct hypothetical situations in which Bush might still have won the presidency, such as if the recount were limited to only a few counties or if the legal “over-votes” were excluded.

The discovery of Gore’s rightful victory was buried deep in the stories or relegated to charts that accompanied the articles.




As our history unfolded after the broadsided assault on our democracy that happened in Florida on December 12, 2000, engineered by those who do not have the well-being of our country as a priority, what we got in return was:

...two catastrophically aggressive, illegal and unjustified wars, two massive tax cuts for the wealthy, Medicare Part D prescription drug benefit --all of this spending off the books-- , an economy subsequently driven into record levels of deep debt, a destroyed international and human rights reputation, a demolished election system, a secretive web of warrentless spying on Americans, a calculated assault on our civil liberties, two new radical U. S. Supreme Court justices and now, their Citizens United ruling in 2010, allowing unlimited corporate money to buy our political system from that day forward.




And now, another Bush lusts for the White House.


We will not stand by to allow this jackal's stealth attack to proceed.

[font size=5]........................................[/font]



All of that was documented in 2012, but still holds the roadmap to proceed with Jeb Bush's defeat.




 

Laura PourMeADrink

(42,770 posts)
29. How stupid of Trump to tweet that nasty stuff about Jeb last night
Wed Nov 4, 2015, 10:23 AM
Nov 2015

Jeb was nosediving - why act like a two year old about it. Trump is a dipshit - he is self-imploding.

UTUSN

(70,695 posts)
37. JEB Crow Shrub "should be hammered with this...every opportunity"!1 If TRUMP hammered Shrub
Wed Nov 4, 2015, 05:45 PM
Nov 2015

for 9-11, *this* is what he should use on JEB!1 Crow Shrub.

seafan

(9,387 posts)
39. Trump, at next week's GOP debate, should zero in on Jeb!'s role in Election 2000.
Wed Nov 4, 2015, 06:13 PM
Nov 2015

With the yuuuuuuge ratings following him around, this is a platinum opportunity for Trump.

Just the info in this thread, he'd have most of what he'd need to hit the ground running.

Jeb! has NO defense. None.

Whining that he didn't know the reason for 95 telephone calls that he made to his brother's campaign, advisers, attorneys and staffers during the 36-day recount is ludicrous.

People across the country need to know Jeb Bush for the things he has done to destroy our democratic system.

Enough of the balderdash he's peddling about his **leadership** in Florida. He dug this state into a hole that will require decades to get out of. Much more on that to come.





Midnight Writer

(21,767 posts)
40. Please read Greg Palast's book The Best Democracy Money Can Buy
Thu Nov 5, 2015, 02:38 AM
Nov 2015

A very detailed, shocking and well documented account of JEB!'s role in the 2000 election debacle.

Gumboot

(531 posts)
41. This... ^^^
Thu Nov 5, 2015, 10:01 AM
Nov 2015

... Is how I found aout about the FLA2000 heist. Brilliant investigator Greg Palast opened my eyes to the vile character of the Bush clan.

for 2016, Jeb is over already - unless somebody swaps vote counts in the IA / NH races...



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