Microsoft Admits Windows 10 Automatic Spying Cannot Be Stopped

[FLPanhandle]

http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2015/11/02/microsoft-confirms-unstoppable-windows-10-tracking/

Last week changes to the Windows 10 upgrade path mean it is going to become increasingly difficult for any non-techy users to avoid being pushed to Microsoft MSFT +0.00%’s new operating system. But given Windows 10 is better than Windows 7 and Windows 8, why would that be a problem? Because of policies like this…

Speaking to PC World, Microsoft Corporate Vice President Joe Belfiore explained that Windows 10 is constantly tracking how it operates and how you are using it and sending that information back to Microsoft by default. More importantly he also confirmed that, despite offering some options to turn elements of tracking off, core data collection simply cannot be stopped:

“In the cases where we’ve not provided options, we feel that those things have to do with the health of the system,” he said. “In the case of knowing that our system that we’ve created is crashing, or is having serious performance problems, we view that as so helpful to the ecosystem and so not an issue of personal privacy, that today we collect that data so that we make that experience better for everyone.”


So how concerned should users be about Windows 10's default data collection policies? I would say very.


By default Windows 10 Home is allowed to control your bandwidth usage, install any software it wants whenever it wants (without providing detailed information on what these updates do), display ads in the Start Menu (currently it has been limited to app advertisements), send your hardware details and any changes you make to Microsoft and even log your browser history and keystrokes which the Windows End User Licence Agreement (EULA) states you allow Microsoft to use for analysis

[LiberalArkie]

1. If you are on measured service (satellite or cellular) it is a killer. Overtime I turn my Win 10

machine on if sucks all of my bandwidth for the month.

[saturnsring]

2. glad i didnt upgrade - we'll have to wait until some kid figures out how to stop that

[RKP5637]

3. Ubuntu or Mint Linux to the rescue!

http://www.ubuntu.com/desktop

http://linuxmint.com/

[FLPanhandle]

5. I'll be replacing Windows with Linux over the weekend

Should have done it long ago.

[RKP5637]

7. Linux just keeps getting better and better. I've been using it for years now. n/t

[dixiegrrrrl]

17. Firefox and Linux...win/win.

tho I do use Chromium browser for commercial sites, like Amazon, cause FF hiccups over them.

Best part about Linux..it is 'self cleaning" in that it does not leave copies of files all over the OS, thus does not get bogged down like Windows.
And it traps malware, so that it does not get into rest of system, I have heard.
Been running it for several years and no need for any anti-virus program.
Plus you can set Firefox to not snoop, its "about:config" tool lets you change behavior, as long as you know what you are doing.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

40. "Best part about Linux..it is 'self cleaning""

This helps in Ubuntu:

sudo apt-get autoclean && apt-get autoremove

[dixiegrrrrl]

43. An early birthday present...thank you!!!!!!

Will share with Mr. dixie to check out since he is the chief of puter stuff in our house.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

45. You are quite welcome.

[Binkie The Clown]

9. Win 10 is what finally convinced me to go Linux Mint.

I still have a Win 7 machine I use for aps I can't get on Linux, but mostly Linux does everything I need.

[Locrian]

15. Me too

I'm changing over to MINT for most usage (internet, open office, etc) and keeping a separate boot drive that will be OFFLINE Win7 for my music stuff (midi, vst, etc stuff just is not there for linux yet)

[Logical]

10. The average non techy struggles with linux. Nt

[d_r]

67. i struggle with windows

the modern flavors of linux are simpler all around. look at something like xfce, easier than windows 8 to me for sure.

[Logical]

72. Too many friends calling me too many times about linux. Driver issues, etc. I love it....

but I think it requires more tech knowledge.

[TheBlackAdder]

11. I use both XP and Mint--Mint effortlessly installed. Ubuntu runs on top of MS Azure... sending data.

.

Stay away from Ubuntu, it sends your directory searches to Amazon's cloud.

You will be direct marketed.

.

[hifiguy]

19. I've been meaning to migrate to Linux for quite a while.

This bullshit cinches it.

Fuck Microsoft.

[RKP5637]

24. It's also simpler than one might think. It's also a far more robust operating system.

Things simply work, and work well. Also, updates could not be easier. They are fast and you do them when you want. I do about 95% of my work in Linux, and then I have a virtual system for Windows 10 that I only use for a couple of Windows only applications. I've been using Linux for years.

[SecularMotion]

69. Yes, and no more restarts after updates.

As a Linux (Mint/XFCE) user forced to work in Windows on occasions, I find the restarts and waiting for system to complete updating to be the most annoying thing.

[RKP5637]

71. Yep, it definitely is, it's bizarre. Untold times I've sat here watching Windows on my VM system

updating and updating when I try to close out.

[MohRokTah]

35. The Luddite tendencies on display here are asounding. eom

[Crunchy Frog]

41. Proud Luddite here.

I'm sticking with Win 7 as long as possible, then I'll be looking into Linux.

[MohRokTah]

48. Guess what, Win 7 DOES THE SAME THING!

Did you turn it off in Win 7?

I bet you didn't.

You're at more risk posting on DU that from the automatic crash data transmissions from Win10.

[Crunchy Frog]

50. I appreciate your intense concern over what I do with my computer.

Honestly.

[RKP5637]

46. IMO Windows 10 is a superb release! Far better than 8.1. n/t

[hobbit709]

51. So was ME.

The PR said so.

[RKP5637]

53. I've been using Linux for years and years since we were first playing with it in Silicon Valley.

My use of Windows is for some apps that are strictly for Windows via a VM. The only stable OS IMO MS ever did was Windows XP.
Also Win98 SE was pretty good IMO. Since then Windows 10 is the only MS OS I've found to be decent. Of course, I only make minimal use of it via a VM.

[bhikkhu]

75. I agree. I was ambivalent about 8.1, and hated all the earlier versions

People can wax nostalgic over XP, but that was the last older windows system I owned and it was slow, crashed all the time, barely functional. When a virus toasted my hard drive in 2000 or so I installed Ubuntu and have been using it happily ever since on my home computer.

But I had to get a windows laptop for work, and dealt with 8.1 until the upgrade. After the upgrade, I have to say it seems like windows has finally gotten it right - Windows 10 reminds me of the ease and functionality of Ubuntu.

[RKP5637]

77. I've run Linux for a very long time, but I still need Windows for some apps. I've suffered

Last edited Wed Nov 4, 2015, 09:25 AM - Edit history (1)

through a number of ghastly Windows releases. I went from 8.1 to 10 and I've been presently surprised. It's really stable. It was like someone at MS said we've got to get our sh** together with Windows 10 or we're not going to endure the long haul. I was running 8.1 under a virtual machine and the upgrade to 10 was remarkably smooth, also thanks to Oracle's virtual Machine VM VirtualBox.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

57. I have my 'working' machine - linux, and my 'gaming machine' - windows 7.

Because I just never got LoTRO to work under linux, using the emulators I tried. OF course, it's been another 5 years or so, maybe it's time to try again.

[RKP5637]

61. Here's an interesting thread ...

http://www.gamersonlinux.com/forum/threads/lord-of-the-rings-online-installation.1151/

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

64. Thanks, I've bookmarked that to browse over later :)

A brief glance looks pretty promising, although I'm not currently using a mint distro.

[hobbit709]

4. Fuck M$ and the horse they rode in on.

[Lizzie Poppet]

6. Sticking with Win7 on my desktop.

It was about as serious a gaming rig as could be had back when I got it (one of the last I could find with Win 7, after I realized what a turd Win8 was via my little "travelling companion" netbook), so unless it goes belly-up, I won't be hurting for power for a while. Microsoft can take this Big Brother bullshit and shove it.

[arcane1]

33. Me too, though I turned off Automatic Updates

I read earlier this week that eventually Windows 10 will become an update, and automatically install itself unless that feature is turned off.

[Lizzie Poppet]

37. Same here.

I've always had things set to prompt me to select updates. I'm a gamer, so I like to be able to update when I'm not playing (bandwidth...). And a bunch of every given update batch is stuff I don't use (example: Internet Explorer updates...I use Chrome).

[Old Codger]

8. No Thanks microsoft

Staying with 7 until it is beyond help then go to Linux for sure...Maybe sooner..

[Egnever]

12. So?

I'll take it. I wan't a more stable OS. You want to wear a tinfoil hat be my guest.

[nc4bo]

30. Quick ? For you...

I have win7 pro and wouldn't mind tryinh out 10pro but want a fresh install preferably an image I can install on either a separate partition or a separate hd.

How can I do this with this upgrade?

Thanks!

[Egnever]

52. Several different ways to do that

My suggestion would be to image the partition that you have win 7 on then do the upgrade. After the upgrade your machine should be authorized for win 10 at that point you can do what you want with it and if you don't like 10 you can just put the old image back on.

Honestly though 10 is 7 with extras. Voice search easier to access settings and a whole lot more.

I have seen problems with some of the upgrades I have done with little wierd bugs here or there but a clean install has solved them every time.

As far as i know the free upgrade has to happen on an eligible OS. I don't think you can use the upgrade on a clean disk. I heard the other day someone say you could do a clean install on a fresh disk using the win key on your computer when the install asks and it works but I havent tried that yet so I can't confirm that will work.

If it does work then you should be able to do pretty much what you want as far as separate partitions and what not.

[nc4bo]

58. Thank you so very much!! nt

[MohRokTah]

36. Windows 10 is the best version of Windows ever. IT blows Win 7 out of the water.

People complaining about this who use any search engine, Facebook, or even post here demonstrate a ridiculous level of ignorance.

All this is doing is taking any OS or application crash data and sending it to Microsoft instead of asking if it can be sent to Microsoft. It operates quietly in the background and causes no performance degradation.

All in all, Windows 10 blows any prior version of Windows out of the water. Windows 7 blows chucks compared to this and you know what? Damn near everybody who is complaining about this being done in Windows 10 who are running anything above Windows Vista are ridiculously stupid because without going deep into the Control Panel to shut it off, they are still automatically transmitting this data in the version of Windows they are already running!

Yes, that's right, this was done via updates to Win 7 and above long ago. The only difference is, you can't dig deep to turn it off in Windows 10. For the vast majority of users, that means they are refusing to update to a superior OS because of something that is already happening with the OS they are running!!!!

[Rex]

38. More stable? Windows 7 never crashes, but yeah have fun on the bandwagon.

[MohRokTah]

39. That;s a load of bullshit.

I can crash Win 7 easily, but Windows 10 has yet to crash on me in the 45 days I've been running it.

[Rex]

42. Kewl story bro.

Your thread is garbage.

[MohRokTah]

47. BE a Luddite.

I really could not care less.

[Egnever]

60. Neither does win 10

Windows stopped crashing for the majority of users with XP.

Have fun on the resistant to change wagon. 5 years from now you will be here saying you wont ever move from win 10.

[MynameisBlarney]

13. I wish I'd known this before I installed it.

But, seeing as how it somehow managed to fuck up my internet connection, I rolled back to 7, but now I'm getting "this version of windows is not genuine, you may be a victim of counterfeiting, blah, blah, blah".

I just KNEW there had to be a catch.

[starroute]

14. You need to make sure you don't get upgraded against your will

http://www.computerworld.com/article/2999548/microsoft-windows/microsoft-to-get-pushy-about-upgrading-to-windows-10.html

Come the beginning of 2016, Microsoft will get much more assertive in distributing Windows 10 upgrades to consumers and small businesses, the company's top OS executive said Thursday.

Rather than wait for customers running Windows 7 and Windows 8.1 to request a copy of the new OS -- the practice since June -- Microsoft will instead begin to automatically send the upgrade to PCs via Windows Update, the default security maintenance service.

The push -- which some will see as too pushy by far -- will be a two-step process, with the first kicking in this year, the second in early 2016.

There's a small program you can download and run to both get that annoying Windows 10 update icon out of your system tray and change your settings to prevent the automatic upgrade. Link at http://blog.ultimateoutsider.com/2015/08/using-gwx-stopper-to-permanently-remove.html

[polly7]

21. I downloaded that program and still had the icon.

I had to keep telling a popup with an install schedule to 'postpone' - didn't matter if I said one week, it would pop up again in an hour. I had thought, going by a message from Microsoft when I first clicked to see what that update icon was, it would stop bothering me after a month, so just kept postponing.

I went out to cut grass one day and came back in ........ it was half-way installed. I didn't want to shut it off, fearing what a mess I'd have so I let it continue and then frantically searched until I found a way to go back to 7. No idea what sort of junk it left behind, my friend is a computer tech and is coming for a wedding and visit from Montreal .. so I'll have to wait until then and cross my fingers, I guess.

[arcane1]

34. THANKS YOU!!!!!

[kentauros]

70. I used the following instructions with success:

[font size="4"]How to stop/delay automatic upgrade to Windows 10?[/font]

Canadian Tech replied on August 24, 2015

Reservation not needed. You will be able to download the ISO for months to come. Besides, doing an upgrade to an OS is simply a bad idea. No good techie worth their salt would install an OS that way.

I have advised my clients to do what I have dreaded doing for years -- turn off Automatic Windows Update.

The problem is compounded by an incessant drive by Microsoft to install Windows 10 on your computer with out your permission. They keep re-installing KB3035583 (that is the enabler) on your computer, even if you uninstall it. The result is the huge download and then constant nags without an apparent way to say no.

So I have advised my clients to shut down WU. Once a month on the 2nd Tuesday, they will get an email from me advising to turn on WU and then to reject specific updates like KB3035583. After updating, they will turn automatic updates off again.

If you see the Windows flag on the bottom right of your screen, chances are pretty high, your computer already has the Win10 file. Even if you do not, it may be on your computer by now anyway. Here are instructions on how to rid yourself of it:

It is likely Win10 has already downloaded to your PC. If you are using windows 7, and have not installed win10 and do not want it, here is a procedure that I have used many times and it works.

1) Take Windows Update off automatic -- Never check
2) Task Manager, processes, find and end GWX.exe
3) Control Panel, Uninstall a program, View installed updates, WAIT a long time till you see the green bar completes its long trip to the right
4) Now, search for KB3035583, uninstall it
5) Restart the PC
6) Disk cleanup, do the 2nd step for System -- this takes a while
7) You should find a file there that is anywhere from 4 to 8 Gigabytes. It is the Win10 downloaded file. Put a check mark on that item.
8) OK, Delete Files
9) Restart
10) The startup will take a long time while it finishes cleanup

[Fuddnik]

16. I built a new system and installed an OEM Windows 10.

I started reading all the shit they were doing, and didn't really trust Microsoft to allow you to turn it off.

I deleted and reformatted the hard drive, then installed an OEM of Win 7 from my last system. I have a second hard drive, and I'm going to partition it, and put Linux on it.

Microsoft....the virus that just keeps infecting.

[BeanMusical]

22. I have Win 8.1

After they stop supporting it, am switching to Linux.

[dixiegrrrrl]

25. Once we dumped Windows, I was amazed at all the free time I had

No more constant upgrade messages, crashes, nanny nagging to reset things, etc.
Plus much much faster loading and surfing.

[blackspade]

18. Windows 7 for my future computer then.

You can still get it on 'business' machines, thankfully.

[BeanMusical]

20. That's so creepy!

[Doc Holliday]

23. Win10 has given me the mental equivalent

of the Death of a Thousand Cuts. A little aggravation here, a little more there, and pretty soon you're standing at the door of Migraine Central. A friend of mine says that Win10 "is the shit that's gonna jack us all into Skynet."

After no small amount of aggravation, I said "fuggit" and went, reluctantly, back to Win8. If that doesn't tell you what a pain in the arse Win10 was for me, I don't know what will.

[Gore1FL]

26. I'm deploying to my environment it as soon as I get a deployable image built.

This article is mostly misleading scare-bait.

[merrily]

27. And every ten minutes, my computer tries to seduce me into installing it.

Okay, that's an exaggeration. I admit it.

Microsoft, Google, et al. get creepier and creepier. Soon the NSA will go "Ewwww."

[nc4bo]

28. Eeeeewwww. Nm...that's quite enough ty.

[HassleCat]

29. I'm tempted to get Windows 10

And then write a bunch of provocative stuff, hoping it causes a big stir. But it wouldn't work, I'm sure.

[Initech]

31. And that's why I not install Windows 10 on any more computers.

I've actually rolled a couple of systems back and I will be purchasing a couple of Windows 7 lcenses while I still can. Fuck the spyware and adware.

[MohRokTah]

32. Crappy article headline does not match facts in crappy article.

No personal information is being transmitted whatsoever. All that is being transmitted is the same crap they used to ask you to transmit whenever Windows or an application crashed so they could work out solutions to roll out in future updates.

Geez, this has become LudditeUnderground these days.

[Goblinmonger]

44. This is fundamentally no different than what Apple and Google have been doing.

We'll all be fine. Everyone on this thread is on the internet and if you think what you are doing, when you are doing it, and what you did before and after isn't being tracked, you're crazy. I hope everyone pissed at Microsoft is dumping Facebook and other social media, too.

I'm no Microsoft fanboy (admittedly, I likes me the Googles), but this doesn't bother me. And Windows 10 has been marvelous on my machine.

[MohRokTah]

49. FINALLY!

Somebody who understands what's going on with this!

[RKP5637]

56. I run it as a virtual machine under Linux and I've been quite impressed with

Windows 10. I did the free upgrade from 8.1 to 10 and it worked flawlessly. I prefer Linux, but I certainly cannot knock Windows 10. I use both all the time. I have some applications that require Windows so I use Windows 10. I also don't mind crash reports and the like sent to MS. If I were working in dev. at MS I would love to have crash reports! Someone really did their homework with the release of Windows 10!!!

[MohRokTah]

63. Linux is aweome for many purposes and reasons.

For gaming, I'll never be capable of beating Windows 10 with any other OS, including all prior versions of Windows.

For all home server applications, Linux is my OS of choice.

[RKP5637]

66. Yep!!! Agree!!! n/t

[Lurker Deluxe]

74. Gaming

I am currently shopping for a new laptop gaming machine and am hesitant to pull the trigger do to gaming issues. My desktop is running 7Pro and I can use most of my older games with it. The online games concern me not, as obviously those games will have to keep up with whatever Windows does to stay in existence.

I travel alot and sometimes, actually more often than not, bandwidth is sold by the MB and is costly. So in order to kill down time I play offline games. Some FPS titles, some SIMs, and some old games that I have played over and over ... StarCraft comes to mind.

Will Win 10 run the same programs as 7? Or am I looking at having to give up on some of these older titles?

Thanks for any help you can offer.

[MohRokTah]

76. I've had no problems with any games I play. eom

[Agnosticsherbet]

54. I continue ot resist using Windows 10.

[matt819]

55. What's remarkable is that there have been any upgrades

I'm in a office building with a share tech support service. A few weeks I asked it was "now safe" to upgrade. The response was not only no but hell no, especially for the business user. It may be robust and beautiful and all of that. But it's riddled with security issues. So, it looks like I'll stay with Windows 8.1, well, for the rest of my Windows life.

[Egnever]

59. Riddled with security issues?

Good lord the FUD

[MohRokTah]

65. Windows 10 is NOT "riddled with security issues"

The reason businesses do not upgrade to newer operating systems has more to do with unsupported legacy applications than anything else.

[Mnpaul]

68. Most of our business software won't run on 8

10 is definitely out of the question. We even use 98 on one laptop. I saved all my emails in Windows Journal in Vista and can no longer access them due to "security improvements in 7 and 8. I'll pass on 10.

[Catherine Vincent]

62. I haven't downloaded Win 10

...on my home pc, so I guess I should keep it that way

[krispos42]

73. I'm still on XP

Suck it, Microsoft.