when a good friend calls you midafternoon and is drunk...

[CTyankee]

I knew from the way he was talking and asked him what was going on. He had injured his bad knees and shoulder helping my partially handicapped husband pack up stuff for a football game. He was in pain and hitting the bourbon. He said he wouldn't help again next year but would keep helping this year for the remaining games.

I told him that he was to stop immediately and tell my husband why, that he would understand. He didn't want to do that and disappoint him. I said he would be our honored guest at the game, no "entrance fee of duty" required!

So I told husband when woke from his nap. Of course he doesn't want to hurt our friend.

I wish I knew how to counsel a friend with a real problem when he calls up impaired (and in the middle of the afternoon!). He didn't even really hang up...I think he just passed out...

I am sick at heart from this call. He had stopped drinking months ago and reported feeling better and being happier. I don't know why this happened...

Wish I knew what to do...

[femmedem]

1. Sometimes there isn't anything a person can do

when a person relapses. Sometimes there is no rational reason for a depression; sometimes it just descends.

But I do know that your friend is going to feel ashamed when he wakes up, and more depressed, and it will be good for him to have a caring friend.

This was on DU recently, I think, but I'm linking to it in case you missed it.

[CTyankee]

3. I know about this and with my friend I think it is mostly true. His "cage" is his loneliness

and regret for screwing up his marriage through his own actions. We have had conversations about regret after our long lives and lost marriages and what we have learned. My husband and I have had conversations about what we would do "differently" to avoid that. But our friend has no one to really talk about it when the loneliness sets in.

But we are great friends and a friend's pain hurts us. He's a good guy...

[smirkymonkey]

5. I love that video - "The opposite of addiction is connection"

I think that is why 12 steps groups work for a lot of people. It takes them out of isolation and gives them a fellowship. I think many addicts are just self medicating their mental illnesses and lack of connection to others and the world around them.

[Warpy]

29. That's exactly it. No one is lonelier than an addict

even though they're surrounded by other addicts. There is no real connection, just a shared focus on the substance of choice.

Everybody I know, in my family and outside it, who got sober did so through AA, at least once they realized their higher power was the people there who would call them on their bullshit while supporting them to get past it.

The sad thing is that there's not much you can do about another person's addiction but make it worse through trying to control it.

[elleng]

2. Very VERY difficult situation, yank.

Hate to say I'm somewhat familiar. Nothing you can do but be his friend, and HOPE when he 'recovers' from this immediate situation he'll recall how much better he felt when he stopped drinking.

IF he went to AA, he would have received a 'buddy.' Anyone who might have 'held his hand' during that process could help.

[CTyankee]

6. thanks, ellen. He never went to AA. I know there are people on both sides of whether AA

is right for every drinker...

[elleng]

9. Right. One good thing about AA is there are lots of 'comrades.'

Always helps to have a friend. "Cold turkey" alone is rough, and can be dangerous.

[CTyankee]

14. I know. He lives alone and that scares me. He has had a rough emotional life anyway

due to an alienation from his kids, now partially remedied. I think he'll be better and come back.

[Old Codger]

13. He is missing

A chance to "connect" with people that understand what he is going through and are more than willing to go way out of their way to help him through AA, but he has to be willing to take the first steps to get it started... the help is there, whether that is the help he needs/wants is totally up to him but it is there..

I know this from personal experience that started over 30 years ago and continues today...

[CTyankee]

15. I can't tell him this even tho what you say is so true...

If I say he should go to AA, he'll translate that I am judging him. That's the conundrum.

[Old Codger]

25. Sometimes

that is what it takes... it is hard to deal with people on that level.On one hand you are his friend and do not want to "insult" him, on the other hand you are his friend and maybe that is what he needs...Choices in these situations can very hard to make... in the end he is the only one who can decide if he is truly an alcoholic and in need of help.. your opinion and mine do not count.... But the definition of an alcoholic is someone for whom alcohol is causing problems in their lives... In my life as a recovering alcoholic I have faced that choice many times, I have had to let friends go because they were detrimental to my own recovery, over the years some have come to realize they were indeed in need of help and got it, others not so much.. some have died some are still alive. In the end the truth is he is in charge...

[Initech]

28. One of my good friends went to rehab last year.

He got clean, and I guess it was really difficult, but he went through some real medical treatment and is better off for it. AA works for some but not all.

[kentuck]

4. He'll be a different person when he wakes up...

Talk to him then.

[CTyankee]

7. I just hope he isn't so filled with remorse and shame that he doesn't just go into

his shell. Hope my husband makes other arrangements on the game day stuff and calls him to say it's all ok and that he is always our honored guest if he still wants to attend.

[kentuck]

8. I hope it works out for you...

..and your friend. I know alcohol can create unpredictable situations.

[CTyankee]

11. thanks, kentuck.

I won't push it and call him. I'll wait til he's ready to "come alive" again...and I certainly don't lecture anyone. I just listen.

[madville]

10. I am familiar with that shame or remorse he may feel the next day

I quit and relapsed for 20 years on my own, a month or a couple of weeks dry and I was right back at it. It was actually very shameful and embarrassing behavior/conversations I had during my last drunk that caused a new low for me in my mind at the time and that triggered what I can only describe as a spiritual moment shortly after that (I wasn't very religious). Something clicked but I knew I needed to seek out a different approach and others had suggested programs to me in the past but I wasn't ready and just plain stubborn thinking I could do it alone.

Just "not drinking' isn't enough for me, I still had the issues that I used drinking to "correct". There are groups out there that maybe can help him if he needs it but that is entirely his decision if that's right for him.

I know listening to others tell their similar stories and sharing mine is a tremendous help for me, it's actually a necessity.

(I'm not endorsing any particular program or suggesting you should even approach him about it. I just know many alcoholics have that turtle mentality where they draw up in their shell and no one could possibly ever understand or relate to how they think and that is simply not the case.)

[CTyankee]

12. my sense is that his feelings led to his alcoholism which led to his feelings of remorse

and so on, a kind of endless wheel...it is, IMO, also an inheritable issue physically. My brother was an alcoholic and it killed him. I was not. Why? I am not morally superior. We had the same upbringing in the same family with the same family issues. But there is alcoholism in our family and I just pray that my kids kids will be OK. So far, no problem with my grown kids...I am relieved...

[GummyBearz]

16. So its the drinking you are trying to help him with?

As a partially recovered alcoholic I can say the alcoholic has to want to stop. No one could convince me to stop. One day I just decided for myself this was getting out of hand. I didn't give up drinking, and probably drink more than most would consider normal. But I scaled back a LOT. I hope one day I decide to scale back further... I know that sounds odd. But developing a chemical addiction is hard to explain to people who haven't experienced it for themselves

[CTyankee]

17. He self identified the drinking as a problem. I did not. He did what you did, decided himself.

But he said at the time that he knew he would "test" himself and sure enough that day came. That was a while back.

We had brunch with him Sunday and he had a couple of Bloody Mary's. I had one and a cup of coffee. It was a nice day, celebrating my husband's birthday...

[GummyBearz]

19. I see

Its a tough thing. There probably is no right answer. Encouragement and understanding are good starts though. Best of luck to him, you, and your husband.

[CTyankee]

18. He has also volunteered on a few occasions that he wishes he had met me before I

met my husband, which is a bit uncomfortable to me and my husband. He said it again on Sunday. I made light of it and said he was just trying to flatter me. But it was a bit awkward.

[wordpix]

31. he has a crush and you need to crush that

I would say to him what I said to a man who was hitting on me regularly, who's a friend b/c he's the BF of one of my girl friends. It went something like this, "I don't think it's appropriate for you to give me a close hug every time we see each other. You have a good thing going with _________(my friend). You don't want to mess that up, and I don't want to be involved in a triangle."

I didn't tell him I wasn't interested in him, even if he was single. Overall, he's a kind man, but he has a little screw loose.

[CTyankee]

32. well, we are too old for that and I don't think it is a crush. I think it comes out of the

fact that all three of us had had a failed marriage, but my husband and I were able to eventually find each other and our friend has not been able to. So he feels like a failure and probably thinks that he never met his ideal mate. Maybe he translates that into thinking he's too flawed to have a good relationship with someone. I don't know. But he also knows that we are mutually monogamous and always have been.

[AngryAmish]

20. Hey, don't shame us day drinkers!

[CTyankee]

21. Naw, I had a Bloody Mary at brunch Sunday!

Nobody is judging. It's all good.

I find it difficult to handle. One Bloody Mary, even with a cup of coffee, and I have to go nap in the afternoon. My internal clock just says "no."

[Initech]

27. Happy hour is the best time of day!

[nomorenomore08]

22. I'd be hoping this is just a one-time binge. Unfortunately, it may very well not be.

Some people can successfully cut down on their drinking, others have to go cold turkey. I don't know what this man's situation is so can't really comment further.

[CTyankee]

23. We both cherish him as a friend and so accept him no matter what.

That doesn't seem enough for him to overcome his feelings of self doubt and remorse over his past problems. Letting go of stuff is difficult. I know and I had some letting go to do with my first husband and lo and behold, that happened a year ago! I told our friend about that, hoping him to find some hope in the same thing but it didn't work.

We'll reconnect later but I hope he will have had the time to think this all through and come to some resolution, even a partial one. I hope he has the kind of breakthrough I had with my ex (who actually said to me "I don't think I ever apologized for screwing up our marriage" in one interesting conversation at our daughter's Christmas dinner last year). But, come to find out he was on Seratonin at the time...good drug, that...!

[madokie]

26. You said what is important

"We both cherish him as a friend and so accept him no matter what." This will be the stepping stone that he will find that will ultimately lead to his sobriety

I'm going on 8 years now and I just went cold turkey.
friends suggesting to me to go the AA route kept me drinking for years cause I'm not the crying in your drunk kind nor do I hang around those kind once they start. My secret was to buy a small bottle of my liquor of choice, Peppermint schnapps, I know nasty shit but that was what I drank. Anyways I put it up on a high shelf in the dining room where my wife has some knick knacks of hers, (her kitchen theme or whatever its called is strawberries,) so I could see it was right there any time I felt I just had to have it. Knowing full well if in a moment of feeling I just had to have a drink if I went to the liquor store and bought a bottle I'd have drank it up right now and been right back where I started. Luckily I never got that feeling and at some point my wife removed it to under the sink and from there I guess to the trash. I never did know what she did with it, don't really care. Right now there is three different kinds of liquor under the sink that friends brought over that they drank but didn't want to drive home with an open bottle so they left it. When I'm rummaging under there for what ever reason looking for this or that that my wife keeps under the sink I simply move them out of the way. I think it helps me knowing I have that crutch if I ever feel I need it. Going on 8 years and I know I'll never go back to being the drunk I once was.

From time to time I still have a red beer though but never more than one at a time. I keep reading that a little etoh is good for the heart and its not a threat to me by drinking one from time to time.

There hasn't been a drunk in my home in almost 8 years now, since I quit.
With you and your Husbands support your cherished friend will soon be like I am today, sober

[Throd]

24. Often there is little or nothing you can do.

I say this as an alcoholic myself.

If he is willing to be helped, by all means support him.

If he isn't, then let him know you'll be there if he changes his mind.

If he is bent on destroying himself, you might just have to let him go and hope for the best. Don't be collateral damage.

[UTUSN]

30. I'm a drunk. *AND* I love my friends. Beyond that, I don't know what to say. n/t

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

33. Not your fault, not your husband's fault,

Most people who hurt a knee or shoulder will grab some ibuprofen/advil and wash it down with water.

As for how to counsel a friend, I don't know, but maybe http://www.al-anon.org/

Best of luck

[CTyankee]

34. He has pain meds but won't take them. I can't blame him. Some of them are just

vile. I've had to throw out more than I have been able to take for my osteoarthritis and I have to say that a glass of white wine ain't a bad relaxer itself as long as it doesn't become 3 or 4 glasses of wine...

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

35. A glass of wine is a good way to wash down some Advil ...

... but I'm guessing you don't have a problem with alcohol. It sounds like your friend has a problem with it. Hopefully I'm wrong and he's just doing a little mid-day self-medication.

[CTyankee]

36. I can't take Advil...label says not to take it if you have high blood pressure and I do...

even tho I treat it with strong bp meds.

He probably was self medicating. He was in lots of pain.

I drink pretty moderately. We both have a glass of white before dinner and a glass of red with dinner. It hasn't led me into perdition yet...

[GreatGazoo]

39. alcohol and advil don't mix, can lead to stomach or intestinal bleeding

http://www.healthline.com/health/pain-relief/ibuprofen-alcohol#Overview1

Study out yesterday showed a big spike in deaths of people 45-54 due to alcohol and medications, eg "poisoning".



https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/a-group-of-middle-aged-american-whites-is-dying-at-a-startling-rate/2015/11/02/47a63098-8172-11e5-8ba6-cec48b74b2a7_story.html?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-main_whitedeaths-319pm%3Ahomepage%2Fstory

[CTyankee]

37. I went to an Al-anon meeting when my brother was going down the tubes...

but I found it too religious for me. Of course, that was years ago so maybe they are better now for those of us who do not want religion mixed in it. I would imagine that for the religious minded, it would be good. Our friend says he is a Christian and likes to attend Easter Sunday services (he is somewhat ecumenical about which denomination he visits and was brought up Baptist).

[ohheckyeah]

38. I agree

with the Al-Anon suggestion. It is of great benefit to those who care about an alcoholic. Wish I had a group nearby - I miss the support and help I got. I think most everyone could benefit from some Al-Anon meetings.

All groups are different. I found a number of groups that weren't religious. One woman tried to turn a group into Sunday school and I called her out in front of the group. The group handled the problem.