ROBERT REICH: "Perhaps we’ve got to face the fact we’re really two nations"

[kpete]

?oh=ddea3c8659854ee84856f1f64092a962&oe=5614A79D

.....John Russel Houser opened fire in a Lafayette, Louisiana, movie theater, killing two young women and seriously injuring seven others before turning the gun on himself. Just before the Lafayette shooting, President Obama gave an interview in which he described the lack of gun control in America as one of the most frustrating parts of his presidency.

Perhaps we’ve got to face the fact we’re really two nations – one that loves guns, hates abortion, abhors gay marriage, dislikes immigrants, and is so suspicious of the federal government it won’t even take free Medicaid funding for its near poor. The other America is exactly the opposite. Instead of trying to shoehorn these two Americas together, maybe they should be separated. Say, a two-thirds vote by citizens of a state will determine which America it joins. The two Americas will remain friendly and maintain a joint foreign policy, but their domestic policies will be separate. And we'll need passports (and have to go through metal detectors) in order to get from one to another.



I’m being facetious, of course. But is it a totally crazy idea?


https://www.facebook.com/RBReich/photos/a.404595876219681.103599.142474049098533/1040248855987710/?type=1&permPage=1710/?type=1&permPage=1

[Xipe Totec]

1. Good. When do they leave? nt

[meow2u3]

3. Good question

Another question is, do we kick them out or do they have to leave the Union on their own?

[passiveporcupine]

33. Maybe some of the states can split in two.

Like here in Oregon, and in Washington, the east is red, and the west is blue. But dammit, I'm right in the middle and my town better side with the blue, cause I'm not moving again.

[BillZBubb]

2. We need a constutional amendment that allows states to secede.

One part would allow secession, the second part would prohibit rejoining the union. All federal property inside a seceding state would have to be paid for by that state.

Once you leave, you're out for good.

[Flying Squirrel]

20. It's actually not such a bad idea:

Kinda like when your kid threatens to run away, and you call their bluff. Then when they don't, it's understood that they'll follow the rules.

When these tea party types put it to the test, it'll quickly become apparent that the rest of the state does not agree with the idea of leaving the country, and that would really take the wind out of their sails.

[BillZBubb]

23. If we had that amendment, we could shut up right wing Southerners for good.

Let them try to run a few elections cycles favoring secession.

[WhaTHellsgoingonhere]

4. Yay! A legitimate voice is brave enough to speak...

and the legitimate threat of cutting ties will put the politicians of the nuts in full on panic mode that they'll have to stop manipulating their base. Then we'll see the truth, which side they're really on: they side that gives them huge federal handouts. Right now, it's a kabuki theater. I'm certain we'll go the way of Europe eventually. Cultural divide: we're two cultures.

[AlinPA]

5. Hard to implement. I'm afraid he is right, though.

[Nay]

6. It works for me. I am beyond tired of the crazies; they need to have their

own country. Maybe the rest of us can have some peace.

[KentuckyWoman]

7. I'm one who believes eventually we'll break apart.

Not in my lifetime but looking at history...... Exile or murder of the jackasses seems to have always been the end result for the greedy, selfish, and just flat out crazy few.

We'll either turn Texas into an exile colony and ship them all there or else we'll end up in another civil war and break apart under treaty with border wars constant.

That's my prediction.

[n2doc]

8. So the likely result would be an east coast America, A West Coast America

And a nutcase neo-theocracy in the middle. Just how long do you think it would be before the fundies invaded the coasts?

[hifiguy]

12. We Minnesotans would join up with Canada, I think.

[n2doc]

24. At least northern Minnesota, Twin Cities, Duluth...

But The part that elected Bachmann and voted for T-Paw, maybe not.

[BillZBubb]

25. What makes you think they'd have you?

You did elect Norm Coleman after all...

[hifiguy]

26. He wouldn't have beaten Wellstone, had Wellstone lived.

And his death is another can of worms altogether.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

27. We also elected Paul Wellstone and Al Franken and Keith Ellison.

So there's that.

[BillZBubb]

29. I know, I was just having a bit of fun.

[jeff47]

13. Invade with what?

The neo-theocracy you describe would have far less money than the "America". They'd also have far less people.

An invasion would not turn out very well for them. Of course, after the invasion was beaten back we'd be stuck with governing them again.

[n2doc]

15. There are a lot of military bases in the South and west

Everyone seems to think that blue america would just take whatever they wanted from the red states. Didn't happen in 1861. Wouldn't happen now. The people in the red states paid for those tanks too.

This is all a bunch of infantile fantasizing. Everything sounds great until you start to think about the details.

[jeff47]

17. I'm not talking about money just for weapons.

I'm talking about money for everything.

The people in the red states paid for those tanks too.

Given that the people in the red states net more money from the federal government than they pay, that is a debatable assertion.

[n2doc]

22. That's not how they would see it

And how do you think the blue states would take their weapons back? Which military would control them? Who would the pilots and soldiers answer to? A lot of the military were born and raised in red states.

The Red states produce most of the oil and gas in the USA. Much of the food.

Anyway, this is again useless fantasizing. A split ain't gonna happen, for the reasons we are already arguing about and more.

[uponit7771]

18. More red states economies DEPEND on federal funds to exist, without federal funds they fall apart...

... they're dependency on the federal government is gob smacking

[WiffenPoof]

9. Got me to thinking...

I know it can't be done, but the idea made me realize for the first time that there may be no way we would ever come together again. It almost makes sense.

[snot]

10. I think the division is urban v. rural, rather than state by state.

[Marr]

14. I think there's a lot too what you said.

There are certainly regional differences as well, but in a lot of ways, the red/blue division on the national map is a reflection of the rural/urban balance of the individual states.

[dougolat]

21. A bit like the India - Pakistan separation?...nt

[uponit7771]

19. Federal government through USDA kept many blacks and Hispanics and Native Americans from farming

... and out of rural America during the 80s and 90s

http://www.southernstudies.org/2010/07/the-real-story-of-racism-at-the-usda.html

[hifiguy]

11. They cannot leave soon enough.

Idiot America, as Charile Pierce so aptly calls it, should be a separate country.

And it just might happen sometime in the next 50 years.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

16. They've always needed to be dragged (kicking and screaming) into the future.

[Baitball Blogger]

28. One Law For All.

Robert Reich is not thinking this through. I usually agree with him, but I don't think he understand the systemic advantages that conservatives have built into the system. A Constitutional Lawyer combined with a Civil Torts lawyer (and loads of money) would be able to level the field again.

[HereSince1628]

30. No no more of 2 nations in one country. That's what justified segregation

that's what justified school, wealth and health inequality

Equality is hard to achieve and it can never be taken for granted.

It must be defended at every turn.

It must be defended where it's easy and most of all in places where it's surprisingly hard, like Wisconsin.

No Mr Reich, don't you remember JFK's rallying cry? We choose to do these things NOT because it will be easy, but BECAUSE it will be hard, very hard.

[IphengeniaBlumgarten]

31. Scary!

Even red states have sizable liberal minorities. This fantasy of being abandoned by the rest of the country is not at all comfortable.

[davidn3600]

32. It's typical of larger nations

When you look at history, larger countries have increasing problems maintaining unity.

Many of the socialistic-thinking countries in Europe are rather small, have stronger cultural bonds, and have stronger central governments. So those socialistic policies tend to be more successful there. The US by design has a weak federal system and a melting pot of various cultures. It's actually kind of amazing we have only had 1 civil war. Chances are there will be more in the future if our economy goes into the toilet. Our economics has largely been strong and stable enough throughout our history to maintain unity and keep people happy enough. But if the economy completely blows apart and people start starving, things can unravel very quickly.

There is the reality that perhaps a reason we have so much deadlock in Washington is some of our laws being passed on the federal level do is not being viewed that they benefit everyone equally. Gun control for example....the large urban centers see it as a way to reduce the crime rate and mass shootings. The rural areas though see it as the federal government trying to take their Constitutional rights. These are two fundamentally different beliefs that conflict. And that conflict results in deadlock. Lots of issues are the same way. And it's a reason Washington never seems to be able to get anything done anymore.

A person who grew up in rural parts of the south did not live the same life as a person who grew up in the center of Philadelphia. These two people have different life experiences. The bigger and more diverse the country gets, the harder it will be to get everyone to agree. No two people in this country think exactly the same way.

[Hoyt]

34. Well, at least he has the gun fanciers pegged, except for roughly 2% who aren't like that (just

delusional, and don't care about society).

[Hydra]

35. There are actually 3 Americas

Possibly more. 2 of those ideologies have to die. We are not one nation, under greed. Nor are we one nation, home of the uneducatable.

Or maybe we are, and we're screwn. I sure hope not.

[patricia92243]

36. Would individuals who are liberal but stuck in a red state be bought out - so they can move!!

[daredtowork]

37. If North/South split, how to get the rightwingers to move South

For instance, what about Scott Walker and his ditto heads? Surely we would want to keep Wisconsin: we just want to get rid of the Koch brothers and their poison that's infecting it.

Also we need a way to convey liberals/progressives up into "safe" territory.

[WMDemocract]

38. A bipolar nation

It's scary to see how polarized we're becoming.

[zeemike]

39. And their is a third nation...the powerful elite.

Who love the division and do their best to maintain it.
It is profitable and insures that they stay in power and control.

The other alternative is to just stop...but neither side wants to be first.

[lobodons]

40. Illegal Immigration

After a few years, you just know the new "Blue" United States would once again face a new illegal immigration problem of "Red" US citizens trying to cross the border!!