Charleston is such a cool city...

[DemocratSinceBirth]

My favorite memory of Charleston is from 1992. I was staying at the Omni Charleston the day after the 1992 elections and there are two African American gentlemen , probably in their sixties, who were part of the hotel staff sitting and reading the newspaper. One turned to the other and said "He (presumably Clinton) kicked (presumably Bush's) his ass."


I remember meeting a nice young African American woman at the tour of Fort Sumter.


Better times will return, God bless...

[pangaia]

1. You actually met 3 African Americans when you were in Charleston?

And one of them was a " nice young African American woman at the tour of Fort Sumter."

Wow. That's amazing.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

2. ...

[pangaia]

10. I've played Spoleto there a number of times.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

13. Never got to see it...

I was in Charleston 11/1992, 9/2000. and 11/2009.


The change between 00 and 09 was dramatic. Lots of chain stores behind Charleston Place.

[KingCharlemagne]

3. If one's taste goes to unapologetic treason and chattel slavery, I guess one can make a case

for Charleston. I wish Sherman had seized all private property in Charleston and distributed it with title free and clear to the freed slaves of South Carolina. Forced those traitors (the secessionists) to actually have to earn a living by the sweat of their brows.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

4. It actually a pretty progressive city with a Democratic mayor now.

And there are lots of art stores and coffee houses like you would find in any trendy city.


I do agree the North failed the freedman... Blame it on the Grand Bargain when the federal government removed federal troops from the south in return for the south ratifying the election of Rutherford B. Hayes in his disputed election with Samuel Tilden.

[KingCharlemagne]

5. My heart's all a-flutter for Charleston's hipster-dufosity. Excuse me if I don't

think charitably of those treasonous motherfuckers.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

8. I don't believe many business owners are the progeny of slave owners.

In fact I don't believe many of them are even native South Carolinians.


BTW, I am sorry if my tastes are too plebeian for you... I am the progeny of bartenders and itinerant laborers and not monarchs.

[romanic]

11. I take it you won't be visiting Charleston anytime soon.

:/

[KingCharlemagne]

12. Not until there's a socialist revolution in this country. :) - nt

[romanic]

14. So....

you'll never visit then? Okie dokie, the people of Charleston will be just fine with or without ya.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

16. I don't know why the people of Charleston need to be punished for the sins of others....

I don't know why the people of Charleston need to be punished for the sins of others, especially others they weren't even related to.

[KingCharlemagne]

17. The wealth of Charleston was largely built upon the backs of chattel slave labor and

theft of land from indigenous people. So while you're touting Charleston's bona fides, it would do for you to remember Balzac's observation that "behind every great fortune lies a great crime," okie dokie?

[romanic]

18. And I'm sure

the town or city you live in and the land your house/apartment is sitting on is pristine and free of any morbid history? Get off your high-horse and join the real world with the rest of us pal.

[Pooka Fey]

19. +1

[KingCharlemagne]

21. Note: poster endorses profiting off the theft of labor and land of others. - nt

[Bluenorthwest]

25. That's not what the other poster said, you are being dishonest. It was suggested that many places

have such dubious histories, in the US and around the world. It was suggested that the place you live might have some past events that are less than sterling. I assume you are afraid to state where you live, so you take mendacious pot shots at those in discussion with you?

What is your city? What is your State?

[KingCharlemagne]

27. Los Angeles, CA. Stolen from the Mexicans in 1848. Fortunately, though, never a slave state whose

wealth was built upon chattel slavery, like more than a few.

BTW: have the victims of that labor theft ever been compensated for said theft? Or are we simply going to pretend it didn't happen while we laud Charleston for her charms?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

29. The Mexicans appropriated the land from the Cahuilla Indians.

Were they compensated?

I know all this because there are murals at the Universal City Metro Station depicting the founding of California.

[KingCharlemagne]

30. What's your point? - nt

[DemocratSinceBirth]

31. You should find a descendant of the Cahuilla Indians and share with them everything you own.

Jesus answered, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me."

[KingCharlemagne]

33. How about's I just work for a real socialist revolution? (See my comment upthread). From each

according to his or her ability, to each according to his or her need. I'm pretty sure the Cahuilla would sign on to that manifesto in a heartbeat.

BTW: what actions are you taking to rectify wealth and income inequality (aside from posting here)?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

35. BTW: what actions are you taking to rectify wealth and income inequality (aside from posting here)?

BTW: what actions are you taking to rectify wealth and income inequality (aside from posting here)?

Not having any of the accouterments of a bourgeoisie lifestyle like having a checkbook. I refuse to propagate a system built on land theft and stolen labor.

[cwydro]

24. Thank you.

These posters carrying so much hate...

[cwydro]

22. Nobody alive there now

is a "treasonous m-f*cker" as you so crudely put it. That war ended in 1865.

Pretty sure the "treasonous mf*ckers" are dead now.

That's a lot of hate for a weekend. Goodness me.

[KingCharlemagne]

26. Well, I'm pretty sure that Roof lumpenprole is a treasonous m-fker, to name just

one. And methinks a deep look at the Charleston PD's ranks might expose a few more treasonous motherfuckers in its ranks.

That's ignoring the fact that the wealth in Charleston is built upon a base of theft of labor from chattel slaves. Were the victims of that theft ever compensated?

[dawg]

36. Roof isn't from Charleston.

The victims were.

[CherokeeDem]

37. For someone who seems to think....

the citizens of South Carolina and of the South continue to fight the Civil War, you seem to be doing a fair job of it yourself. I'd like to remind you this is 2015... the war between the states has been over for a very long time. The majority of those who live in the South and elsewhere recognize that fact. Those who paint all peoples of the South with such broad and hateful comments reflect on their own prejudices. The people who purport that the Confederacy lives today are but a very small minority.

FYI... Charleston is a progressive and beautiful city... You forget that the history of Charleston and of South Carolina includes a pivotal role in the American Revolution. Perhaps you need to brush up on your history to realize the Civil War is only part of the history of the state.

[KingCharlemagne]

38. Yes or No: Charleston's (and South Carolina's) wealth is built upon the backs of

uncompensated slave labor and stolen indigenous lands?

Roof doesn't appear to have gotten the memo about the Civil War being over:

[CherokeeDem]

39. You do love pushing that meme, don't you?

Charleston's wealth was built not only on the plantations founded by wealthy landed gentry from England, but also as a port city where much wealth was gained from shipping. (Before you start screaming, yes... slave traders used the port of Charleston.) During the early period of the Colonies leading up to the Civil War, much of the wealth of many prominent citizens in this country including some future presidents "was built upon the backs of uncompensated slave labor." The South was not the only area of this nation that utilized slavery.


"...stolen indigenous lands." I am part Native American... don't presume to use that argument with me. What the earlier settlers of this country did was heinous, but it does not reflect on those who are alive now. We are not responsible for the sins of our forefathers. To continue to use such hateful language against people you do not know and choose to lump together as bigots and hatemongers is beyond reason.

The Civil War is over.... you can stop fighting it now...

[KingCharlemagne]

40. I'll stop 'fighting it' as soon as people stop trumpeting how cool a city the

erstwhile seat of sedition is, while failing to mention the origins of said hipster-dufosity and coolness. (See the OP.)

FWIW, the wealth of this entire benighted land is based upon those same two monumental crimes, slavery and land theft, thereby proving Balzac's observation once again.

[sufrommich]

41. Well,someone's playing hipster doofus here. Charleston is 30%

African American ( or maybe you thought those people in the church were just visiting). You should put on your big White Leftist Savior hat and go tell those AAs how very wrong they are for choosing to live in Charleston.

[CherokeeDem]

42. Just keep on fighting then....

but it's going to be lonely fight buddy....

Don't forget to start trashing the other seditious states of the South, too.... might as well become an equal opportunity purveyor of hate.

Sorry, you aren't going to be able to visit some of the most beautiful places in the US.... your loss, not theirs.

[aikoaiko]

6. Charleston's Spoleto Festival should be on everyone's festival to-do list.

Its usually in late May and early June. Its a wonderful 2-week collection of performance art.

http://spoletousa.org/current-season/shows/


Having said that I'm partial to Savannah.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

9. Having lived in FL for most of my life I traveled the southeast pretty extensively./NT

[mnhtnbb]

32. We were there for the Spoleto Festival this year...and 2012, 2013

and have booked our favorite place to stay for next year...although not sure
we'll go. Other things may happen...such is life...will know better by January.

I posted a few Charleston photos that I took this year in the Photography group

http://www.democraticunderground.com/103642977

[sufrommich]

7. It really is one of our beautiful,historical cities.I loved walking

around the historic district and peeking in at the courtyard gardens beyond the gates.

[mcar]

15. One of my favorite cities

Rich history (good and bad), amazing architecture, mostly wonderful people as we saw in the hearing.

[Pooka Fey]

20. "Blessed are the peacemakers,

for they shall be called the children of God." (Matthew 5.9)

Thanks for your positive, non 'Southern Bashing' OP. I sure hope better times return.

[madokie]

23. I have to rec this

He kicked his ass up one side of the street and down the other. The BFEE has never gotten over that either. LOL
If poppy would have won that race we'd be in some kind of deep hell here in the USA today.

[Warpy]

28. To this day, I'm creeped out by the slave market there

and I saw it when I was about ten. That people thought that way about other human beings was so foreign to me then and remains so, yet there it was written down in ledger books in fine copperplate handwriting.

If you get back there, take a side trip away from the fine houses and their secret gardens and go to that museum.

[merrily]

34. Never been. But, from photos and videos I've seen, it's lovely to look at.