General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsOK, Bernie, I give up.
I have looked at three presidential hopefuls for 2016: 1) Elizabeth Warren; 2) Martin OMalley; and 3) Bernie Sanders (Hillary is right out for obvious reasons if you research fracking, TPP, Wall Street coziness and the Iraq War Resolution for starters). The first three potential candidates are acceptable to me even though each one has warts (as does every politician I have ever studied).
Elizabeth Warren is not running and I do not believe the American electorate is sophisticated enough to respond to a draft movement. Martin OMalley is running and has the potential to be a great president. I gravitated toward him a couple of months ago and considered supporting him for the long haul, but his decision to wait to declare at the end of May was a strategic blunder. Bernie Sanders has gained momentum since entering the race and is starting to garner some positive press.
Initially I shied away from Bernie because I believed in the political expert perspective: Sanders cannot win the nomination and even if he could, he couldnt win the general election. Here is my list of original reasons for rejection and my current thinking:
1) Hes old;
2) Hes funny looking and has a funny accent;
3) Hes Jewish;
4) Hes not the right physical type for the TV age; and
5) His socialist ideas are too radical.
Bernie is 73 years old, so hes no spring chicken. Reagan was 69 when he first ran. Bernie is much more vigorous than Reagan and in terms of gerontological progress, the age of 74 today is perhaps relatively younger than 69 in 1980, when Reagan was running.
Bernie sounds and looks funny to many people I suppose, but I dont think that is a show stopper for being taken seriously. Ross Perot sounded and looked much funnier than Bernie, but until Perot started acting crazy in the 1992 campaign, it seemed likely that he would win the election (he was ahead in the polls until his meltdown).
He is Jewish, but after a black president and viable women candidates, is this a big deal? I dont think so.
In anthropological terms, Bernie may be whats called an endomorph. He doesnt look like the mesomorphs commonly elected (e.g. Reagan, George H.W. Bush, Bill Clinton and Barack Obama). However George W. Bush is a little short by presidential standards, and also see the comments above about Ross Perot.
So it all comes down to his radical political beliefs. Bernie is a self-described social democrat, favoring the policies of Scandanavian countries. Whats radical about it is that it is largely the way American policies were headed before Ronald Reagan. Northern Europe provides college education for whoever wants it, without any cost. Everyone is guaranteed adequate food, clothing and shelter. Medical care is free. They can do this because they do not try to police the world and the rich and corporations are required to pay their fair share.
Except for health care, America did most of this before Reagan and still had enough wealth left over to engage in a very expensive cold war. Scandanavian health care costs less than half per capita compared to American health care. They insure everybody, while we have tens of thousands who die every year because of a lack of health care. His radical idea is to tax the rich and return to the values which gave America the largest, most robust middle class in the world.
Bernies other radical idea is that he believes in science. Scientists tell us climate change is our greatest threat and we need to get serious about it.
Bernie is gaining momentum because he is telling the truth and people are listening to him, another old-fashioned, radical idea. They are not reacting to his image. He walks the talk. He has fought his whole life for the 99%. Because of Reagan and the morons who have followed him, wealth inequality is at its worst level in history, rivaled only by the end of the Gilded Age. Americans have become radical because they have been layed off, pensions lost, homes foreclosed and no way to send kids to college. Meanwhile bankers not only dont go to prison, their profits are bigger than ever. The American people have had enough and so have I. OK, Bernie, thats it. Im in.
RobertEarl
(13,685 posts)Welcome to the future. Bernie is the Real deal.
fredamae
(4,458 posts)Response to Admiral Loinpresser (Original post)
1000words This message was self-deleted by its author.
BuelahWitch
(9,083 posts)of choice. Bernie is lucky to have him on board!
Response to BuelahWitch (Reply #13)
1000words This message was self-deleted by its author.
HassleCat
(6,409 posts)I just saw a comment by Muriel Volestrangler. Not bad. Not bad at all.
Admiral Loinpresser
(3,859 posts)How are you? Can you PM me a phone number? Lori is in Albuquerque for work but she wants to talk to you as well!
BuelahWitch
(9,083 posts)Check your DU PM!
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)came to his decision and I guess that is pretty much how I came to be a Bernie supporter also.
Wilms
(26,795 posts)Well written too.
Thank you.
blm
(113,065 posts).
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)blm
(113,065 posts)I guess the beauty of simplicity and positivity just isn't 'sexy' enough for some forums. ; )
Good thing I don't listen to the cynicism of others.
I identify with CommonSenseSanders.
peecoolyour
(336 posts)I argued with myself for awhile about it, then said, "Fuck it, Bernie rules."
Jackpine Radical
(45,274 posts)The thing that is totally obvious about Bernie is that what you see is what you get. There is no not-there there, if ya track me.
peecoolyour
(336 posts)FSogol
(45,491 posts)Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)N_E_1 for Tennis
(9,744 posts)appalachiablue
(41,146 posts)all of this, except for healthcare prior to Doomsday and Dutch, Jan. 20, 1981, a day we will never forget. TJ's proudest accomplishment was founder of the public University of Virginia. Land grant colleges in America were fostered by President Lincoln. No one was indentured for basic college education until Reagan, as our collective institutional memory recollects.
staggerleem
(469 posts)... is essentially identical to the platform that Eisenhower ran for re-election on in 1956 - as a REPUBLICAN! America has changed, drastically, since then, and not all for the better.
immoderate
(20,885 posts)Think about how the Vietnam War changed our national priorities. Where did the first wave of deficits come from that caused the diversion of revenue from education and infrastructure? It played into Reagan's exploitation of paranoia and ignorance, which set the stages for prison-industrial and education-industrial complexes.
Reaganomics has not been rejected by any administration since Carter. I think people can be awoken.
--imm
truedelphi
(32,324 posts)And we have already heard the argument that no one will vote for:
One) A practicing Roman Catholic, who would let the Pope in Vatican City run the nation.
Two) A man whose father was African American.
And not only did people vote in a man whose father was African American, they did so the very November that was initially deemed to be the month of Hillary's ascension to the Presidency.
So, so much for inevitability.
JimDandy
(7,318 posts)He was not an American citizen. His mother was American.
Obama is a true "African American."
ETA: everything else you wrote is spot on!
Volaris
(10,272 posts)Is because Jr. fucked up so incredibly badly and was so inept at nearly everything he tried, that the Electorate basically just said 'you know what fuck it, the smart black guy can't possibly make this worse, let him have his shot and see if he can do something with this trainwreck of a national agenda were in now.'
And if Bernie wins the White House and this country moves back toward a New-Deal-like economic and social agenda and the Morans in the Tea Party weep for the decline and death of 'murica, THAT WILL BE BUSH'S FAULT TOO, and they will have no choice but to finally admit it.
Their political pain will be exqusite, and their tears will be a FINE delicacy.
(Can we have a 'Republican Tears' smiley, because that would be awesome.)
staggerleem
(469 posts)In order to have an Education-Industrial Complex, wouldn't a nation need to have a manufacturing base? We HAD a manufacturing base, once upon a time, but we've pretty much allowed it to erode.
immoderate
(20,885 posts)--imm
staggerleem
(469 posts)But they are not, or at the very least shouldn't be, educating their students for the Industrial jobs that no longer exist in this country.
immoderate
(20,885 posts)Education is only incidental to the process.
Also I wouldn't confuse education with job training, except that real education is training for jobs that don't exist yet.
--imm
WillyT
(72,631 posts)MissDeeds
(7,499 posts)SoapBox
(18,791 posts)But I think it's Bernie for me until we have our final candidate. At that point I'll decide whether I help/campaign full bore or...hold my nose, gag, cough and cast my vote.
Feel the Bern!
DeeDeeNY
(3,355 posts)And that shows.
polichick
(37,152 posts)NorthCarolina
(11,197 posts)I certainly trust his judgement on whomever his VP choice may be.
DrBulldog
(841 posts)Why? He doesn't do things like taking a speaking tour of Canada to grab $1.6 million like Hillary did last year . . .
HassleCat
(6,409 posts)It's refreshing to see a politician who has a net worth in the same galaxy as the people he represents.
L0oniX
(31,493 posts)azmom
(5,208 posts)Paka
(2,760 posts)Great step-by-step evaluation.
Ed Shultz encapsulated it very nicely when he stated Bernie brings "clarity" to the discussion. It's not any one vote or any one issue, but when all put together they demonstrate outstanding judgment in analyzing data. Bernie is simply on the right side when all is said and done. We can trust him.
Dustlawyer
(10,495 posts)They have no idea how much the regular folks have had it with everything! A class of people and corporations above the law, owning politicians so you can write the laws to your favor and suck up all of the U.S. tax revenues, leaving none for social welfare, education, infrastructure, destroying the environment with no thought to our future generations, and spying on us like we are common criminals, climate change... They try to make Bernie out to be popular mainly with the collage crowd when in fact he appeals to all ages.
I don't really know Martin O'Malley except I heard that he is running a more liberal campaign than the way he governed, not that he was very conservative though. Maybe he would be Bernie's running mate if EW won't do it. She has to feel pretty powerless going after Wall Street with only a few other Senators in her corner. That would be the dream ticket and it appears to be just that, a dream.
Bernie is the only one talking about these issues, with the history and track record that back up what he says. It will be hard watching Hillary's surrogates and the MSM attacking Bernie since he will be defending and not counter attacking with the negative ads that American voters seem to believe. If anyone can pull this off its Bernie. He will counter with policy arguements and the patience of Job. I couldn't do it! I wanted to rip off the MTP hosts head off and shit down his neck! In that respect, Bernie has the bearing and temperament to be POTUS.
Obama was elected because he said much of what Bernie is saying, but only delivered to us what the Plutocrats either didn't care about, or wanted as well. We didn't know him long enough, and didn't take a close enough look at who was backing him (at least I didn't, I wanted to believe to badly). He was infinitely better than the rest of his field and we still got screwed in many ways. I will gladly credit him with the Affordable Care Act though! The Plutocrats and insurance/hospitals wanted it too which didn't hurt.
Great analysis!
ms liberty
(8,580 posts)Great summation of your decision process. Welcome! I've been following Bernie for nearly 20 years and he really is the real deal. I believe he's going to surprise a lot of people, and I believe he can win. We may be in the midst of one of those rare times when the candidate we need is appearing at the time we need them.
Cryptoad
(8,254 posts)I don't think he has a chance in Hades to win. However the more votes he gets the more HRC will be inclined to not forget us Progressives completely when making policy!
malokvale77
(4,879 posts)I have come to the conclusion that it is Bernie Sanders or I don't give a damn.
I am being killed on every front (low wages, SS, healthcare, food, utilities, phone service, internet and everything else across the spectrum). Bernie seems to be the only one who get's it.
Go Bernie.
Thespian2
(2,741 posts)Well-judged...very well stated...
Hepburn
(21,054 posts)Thank gawd for large favors! Matzel tov!
LiberalElite
(14,691 posts)Bernie Sanders Group: http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=forum&id=1280
rosesaylavee
(12,126 posts)and well put. We agreed on a candidate last few times in 2008 an 2004 as I recall --- I like Sanders a lot. If for no other reason, he will elevate the debates to real ideas and not just posturing. He's real. He responds like a human to real ideas and problems. That is very appealing. I can't see him as being persuaded to NOT do the right thing...
I think I am again leaning toward supporting him... would like to resist a little longer to just make sure tho.
Iwillnevergiveup
(9,298 posts)I guess I took Elizabeth Warren at her word from the beginning that she wasn't running. That put me in a funk, especially watching her fiery speeches. I ruled out Bernie until he began talking about taking the temperature of the electorate. He is exactly the right person for this time in our history...I believe in my heart he is capable of righting many simmering wrongs. I'm happy you are onboard, too.
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)I think a lot of people are thinking the same thing: my views are closest to Sanders, but he can't win, for the very same reasons. If Bernie can do well in the early caucuses, prove he can win, we might see a very interesting race.
You might like this bumper sticker that shows the campaign knows this too:
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)Stardust
(3,894 posts)Admiral Loinpresser
(3,859 posts)n/t
SamKnause
(13,108 posts)Jester Messiah
(4,711 posts)CrispyQ
(36,478 posts)People are waking up & realize that "politics as usual" isn't working.
Purchase here: http://www.redbubble.com/people/jrstees/works/14122148-bernie-sanders-for-president-hair?grid_pos=1&p=t-shirt
tymorial
(3,433 posts)The more the merrier. Sanders needs all the support he can get if he wants to defeat the political juggernaut that are the Clintons.
PatrynXX
(5,668 posts)doesn't like Hollywood Jews because they are in love with awards.
think she'd be great for vice president oh and she's smart as fuck. "harvard"
Someday if she doesn't run eventually it'll be Natalie Portman ???? The Actress??? (ie Reagan) and BTTF turning 30 yrs old ack I'M OLD faint...
My cousin because her Mother is Jewish is well Jewish. Her dad my blood uncle is not. ie if your mother is Jewish your Jewish doesn't work the same with with males I don't understand that part and I went to my cousins wedding to a Catholic Hispanic born in Mexico so.... ignoring my tea party dad and brother fairly deversified and really don't care about what religion people are. Even Muslim. Yes because I can't have a proper discussion with blacks asians etc we are all a bit racist. (ahem Hispanics Latino etc) have a discussion with family members of different races on a candid basis and some of this racism will work it's way out of our words. Like Democrats bouncing their mouth with their hand. Indian. Native American I'm a drop Native American. Some say that makes me a Native American (some tribes say this.) If I have Indian blood flowing through my veins I'm Native American. True I love Native American stories. Oddly I played I can't spell this right 1. because it's racist and 2. I really don't know) Engin Joe Ingin Joe in the Huckleberry Finn Novel where he's trapped in a cave to die. Think had I known I was a drop Indian I might have had issues but hey it was just an Operetta. and it's best to keep such plays in action with a disclaimer . ie we forget the past we are doomed to repeat it. Right now I don't trust Hillary I consider her to be a Conservative. Who for sure is in bed with Big Oil. As many of her staff from secretary of state went to work for the XL Pipeline X_X TransAmericaFucks broke treaty and ran their trucks thru Native American land a few years ago. She'll never get my vote. ie I will not unlike Republicans break my principals for any party. Except of course my cousin. The principle back then was I was changing my beliefs around illegals. They officially married in June 2011 with a judge. The public wedding was August 2011. What do I take from that? Wedding was in August and the Visa expired before that. He plans to be in law. So he's in law school. Who's paying for this. I'm told my uncle (via my dad, who I can't really trust as a news source) do I agree with this method No. people from Mexico used to be heavily Republican. For Decades. This is a principle I broke to go up for their wedding. I went for my cousin. And as no other Bartholomews were going. Because as dad said the Hispanics would (I quote) outnumber the whites, he did not go. Guess what. The White Jews (my cousin as I said is Jewish) showed up in droves. Massively so. The Hispanics were in a small corner and hard to find. Packed. The Kramers were the biggest crowd there. Table my brother and I sat at (he would not go now) was 2 parents exe's he was Jewish. I got along great with a cousin in laws mother and the cousin in law. Probably why we were put at that table. So you ask me would I vote for someone who wants to be President who really isn't Openly Jewish? I give you this story. Utterly embarrassed the crap out of my tea party dad who for whatever reason is now Pro Israel X_X Which of course makes no sense. Course my favourite part. He said it wouldn't last a year. (which was the reason he told his brother not to send wedding invitations to me let alone my brother) Grrrrrrr That was not his choice it must be mine.) they were sent I went. We had a great time. And they are still married. think officially 4 yrs now almost more than a year and they've been in just about every state. Hello Hispanic in Idaho anyone?? oh wait Hispanic and a Jew in Idaho Go Bernie
JackBeck
(12,359 posts)BlancheSplanchnik
(20,219 posts)KamaAina
(78,249 posts)I'm pretty sure that disqualifies her as a "presidential hopeful".
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)See?
pablo_marmol
(2,375 posts)GREAT post. Go Bernie!