Top Democrat sounds ‘alarm bells’ over Obama rhetoric on Islamic State

[KamaAina]

https://www.yahoo.com/politics/top-democrat-sounds-alarm-bells-over-obama-119369403841.html

A senior House of Representatives Democrat said Tuesday that the White House’s description of supposed progress in the war against the Islamic State should ring “alarm bells,” and called the fall of the city of Ramadi to the extremists “a very serious and significant setback.”

“I don’t think we’re losing the war, but I don’t think we’re making tremendous progress either,” Rep. Adam Schiff, the top Democrat on the House Intelligence Committee, told reporters at a breakfast organized by the Christian Science Monitor....

“I wouldn’t use the metrics of the number of sorties or bombs dropped or anything, and to the degree you hear administration officials use those metrics, alarm bells should be going off,” Schiff cautioned.

The lawmaker also warned against using measures like the amount of territory controlled by the Islamic State, also known as ISIL or ISIS, because in some cases the group has been replaced by other extremist militias hostile to the United States.

[True Blue Door]

1. I notice he doesn't say what metric he WOULD use to judge progress.

[stevenleser]

2. Agreed. It's a broad front. It's possible to be making progress in 2/3rds of the Iraqi theatre

and 2/3rds of the Syrian theatre, but have setbacks in other parts of both countries.

[Maedhros]

3. You know, if we're going to have Congressmen talking about "losing the war,"

shouldn't we actually declare one, legally, at some point?

[KamaAina]

4. How could we?

There is no country called "ISIS".

[Maedhros]

6. Actually, they have declared a caliphate in ISIS-occupied Syria and Iraq, so I think we could

manage it.

[KamaAina]

18. Does anyone else recognize them?

Anyone? Bueller?

[Maedhros]

19. The point is that if we want to claim all the "benefits" of being in a war,

such as "collateral damage in the form of dead civilians from drone strikes gone awry is a regrettable but necessary part of War" then we'd better declare an actual war.

Otherwise, we're just killing civilians in another country, and that's a war crime.

[KamaAina]

20. My point is that there is no entity for us to declare an actual war against.

[sabrina 1]

5. What 'war' are we 'not losing'? I thought we got out of that ill-conceived, massive war crime in

action?

I guess with all those powers Bush grabbed for himself that WE on the Left were so outraged over, are all that is needed now to go to war, to negotiate trade deals etc.

And amazingly we have people on the Left now either very quiet about all of this, or actually defending what was once viewed as law breaking at the highest levels.

[Maedhros]

7. Outrage over elective wars is a rhetorical tool used only against Republicans.[n/t]

[sabrina 1]

10. Apparently. But at least back in 2002 we still were told when the country was getting ready

to go to war, not that it mattered, but we still maintained a semblance of democracy.

Now apparently we started another War in Iraq without a even a whisper.

All those Bush 'laws' actually DID give the POTUS the powers of a King.

I suppose we can feel good about being RIGHT at least.

[Maedhros]

11. Who wants to talk about another pointless war,

when there are obscure Republican back-benchers to ridicule?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017266457

[jwirr]

9. I really agree with you. I was just setting here thinking about what would happen if we just walked

away from the whole mess like we did in Vietnam.

Unfortunately I don't think it is going to be that easy this time.

There is Israel setting like a duck in water right there in the middle of so many enemies.

And then there is a vicious group called ISIS that is of our own creation and what they are doing to the people of the area when they take over territory is horrible.

And then there is ISIS recruiting people all over the world to take out targets where they live.

I would love to walk away but considering these things I don't think we can get ourselves out of this that easy. I do not have the slightest idea what to do in this mess. I do know that this is not a new war. It is still the old war started for all the wrong reasons.

[Maedhros]

12. When has our military involvement in the Middle East ever resulted in something good? [n/t]

[jwirr]

15. No and that is why I was thinking about getting out. We have done nothing but trash the place,

kill people, steal the oil, make more enemies and create ISIS.

[Maedhros]

17. It will be tough to exit. Many vested interests want us to fight there, forever. [n/t]

[sabrina 1]

13. Well, considering the TOTAL failure of ALL our interventions so far, I think we SHOULD get out

of the way before we make things even worse.

Imo, people who FAIL at important jobs, should not be called upon to do that same job again. In fact it would be insane for any business who is still dealing with the disasters created by a former employee to have the bright idea of calling that individual back to FIX what is even worse now due to that disastrous failure.

We failed, in Afghanistan, in Iraq, in Libya, in fact things were far, far better and everyone was way safer, before we decided to go in and 'save' anyone.

As for all the 'news' about Isis we hear on the corporate media, it all sounds like the old Al Queda rhetoric to me.

I should add that what is a failure for almost everyone, the American people, the people of Iraq etc, has been a resounding success for those who started all of this. They are making BILLIONS and have accomplished the goal, in case anyone forgets of 'TURNING THE ME INTO A GLASS PARKING LOT', I believe that Michael Ledeen speaking for the neocons.

We should just leave and we would, but we have 'interests' there, we are not there to save anyone.

[jwirr]

16. I also think we should leave but this is just us. The MIC, the politicians including ours, the rich

all want to continue the game. I am where I was before Vietnam ended - sick and tired of war.

[hifiguy]

22. + a brazilian.

There are no "good guys" and the notion that this country is the sheriff of the world has caused unspeakable and untold misery for tens of millions. Time to retire that BS.

[DisgustipatedinCA]

8. He's right that we aren't making much progress, but there's no need for alarm.

We do need to get used to the idea of Iraq being an Iranian client state, since that's what's happening on the ground now. But that's George Bush's fault.

[Cali_Democrat]

14. ISIS is Bush's baby...

frankly, I think Obama should just ignore them.

It's not our fight.

[hifiguy]

21. His Chimperial Majesty broke it,

and it is gonna have to play itself out. Not a damn thing the US can do would be useful. People have got to get it through their thick skulls that the US can't be the world's cop.