Howard Dean accuses the New York Times of sloppy reporting.

[sufrommich]

Dean was there to defend Hillary Clinton against charges leveled in a new book and reported out by the Times that the Clinton Global Initiative took undisclosed funds from a Russian oil company as that company was securing State Department approval for deals in the U.S. The article is part of access deals secured by the Times and others to Peter Schweizer’s Clinton Cash. Clinton surrogates have spent the past few days criticizing Schweizer as a conservative ideologue funded by right-wing Clinton opponents.

“In general New York Times has been sloppy,” Dean said. “Particularly their political writers. I use the Times as an example in journalism classes, because by the fifth paragraph in any political story…they’re substituting their judgment for news.”

Peters wasn’t having it. “I think that is an overly broad generalization that maligns my colleagues and it’s unfair of you,” Peters said. “I’ve dealt with you an awful lot, and I don’t think you would call me sloppy.”

“I would not, but there are plenty of people who write for the New York Times and every other paper that I think are incredibly sloppy and I could name a lot of them,” Dean said, not doing so.

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/ny-times-reporter-hits-back-at-howard-dean-for-calling-paper-sloppy/

[still_one]

1. nope, NY Times isn't sloppy. If it wasn't for them we would not have known about the WMDs in Iraq

[karynnj]

2. humm - not sure that is a good example of "sloppy" - it was intentional, focused and done

to facilitate a shared goal of the NYT and the Bush administration.

I disagree that the NYT is "sloppy" and I think Dean should have rested his case - not on "sloppy" - but that some of their journalists do bring an agenda into what should be balanced reporting. (I think their neocon bias often colored their descriptions of people like Dean and Kerry especially -- and the CW that the NYT was "on our side" made it hurt more than it would have had the real bias been identified.)

On this issue, I wish he would have been given something by the Clinton people that actually answers this question. This will be a really ugly election if every question is responded to by attacking the messenger.

Here, one real question is why the NYT is using Sweitzer's research. In 2010/2011 60 Minutes gave him an undeserved illusion of credibility on Congressional insider trading. His research was shabby - and while including some high profile already identified as corrupt Republicans - it smeared a large number of Democrats, some of whom had taken every precaution possible to avoid conflict of interest. This show then led to people from Gillibrand to Scott Brown writing legislation in response that Obama called for in his SOTU. Altogether, between the bipartisan elected official response and the news media, it was kind of lost in the shuffle that he was part of Palin's "posse" and the methodology in the book was indefensible. (Even here on DU, I was attacked for attacking him.)

[sufrommich]

4. Dean hints in the article that it goes beyond sloppiness.

" I use the Times as an example in journalism classes, because by the fifth paragraph in any political story…they’re substituting their judgment for news.”

[karynnj]

9. True - and that is why I said he should have rested his case on the bias

I think Dean should have rested his case - not on "sloppy" - but that some of their journalists do bring an agenda into what should be balanced reporting.

[newthinking]

21. There is no such thing as "balanced reporting" left in the MSM. News used to be a money looser,

until they loosened standards. We have been trained on emotion filled entertainment. The only way to keep audience is to make all the news "edgy", or emotional. And don't piss off people by telling them their "gut" is wrong, rather, you can make more money by reinforcing the societal narratives, regardless if they are accurate or not.

And don't even get me going on the depth of "investigative reporting". Most of the field staff is there for the atmosphere, not to expose the truth. And a good portion of "stories" are regurgitated and reframed work from government, lobbies, or from "syndication", none of which are interested in sending on stories that don't fit a certain criteria.

There are still investigative reporters but most of that is smaller independent media that the mass media won't work with and is posted in online magazines and the "blogosphere.

The MSM is, simply, Tabloid.

[lewebley3]

40. The Messengers in this Case, has history of being Wrong and leaving out factS

The email story of they put out about Hillary left out many
essential facts, if the NyT would have included the facts they
would have a story tell. Which is the fact of the matter they didn't have
a story: they were trying create a story by leaving facts out!

[Cha]

31. Right the NYT is NEVER SLOPPY... and the beat goes on and on and on..

"It takes ten paragraphs before New York Times mentions its latest Clinton hit-piece is speculation"

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/04/23/1379692/-It-takes-ten-paragraphs-before-New-York-Times-mentions-its-latest-Clinton-hit-piece-is-speculation#

"5 Points On The Conservative Author Dishing Clinton Dirt To NYT and Fox News"

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/fivepoints/peter-schweizer-clinton-cash-5-points

[Gidney N Cloyd]

3. Someone must have put pineapple juice in Mika's pineapple juice this morning. She went on...

...the attack against Dean for his daring to question the Times article's author. Normally in these situations she just sits there, periodically making her little "hrmph" and "ugh" sounds to suggest she might have the first fucking idea what anyone around her is talking about.

[One of the 99]

5. Mika hates Hillary Clinton

In 2007 she sat there silent when Hillary was said to look like 'everyone's first wife standing outside probate court'. Yet she was a big supporter of Sarah Palin. Remember Mika is not a liberal. She only plays one on TV.

[Gidney N Cloyd]

7. I wonder what inspired that?

I know Mika's not really a liberal. I'm not sure politically she's much of anything. She's a newsreader with a room temperature IQ who's been peter-principled into a talk show host.

[sufrommich]

10. God, that's a perfect description of her. nt

[lewebley3]

39. Mika is a dormant: Any woman with Brains is someone Mika wouldn't like~~

Hillary is just someone Mika could not get her head around:
Joe treat's her like battered host.

But, maybe Joe pays her well to take the abuse.

[CTyankee]

8. I noticed that, too. Why was she being so snarky?

I expect it from Joe but usually she is a little more reserved in her judgment. But she and Joe were just going at it strong against Dean. But Jeremy Peters was downright pissy with Dean.

Joe was accusing Dean of being like James Carville and Dean laughed at the thought that he could do it any better than "James." It was kinda funny...

When Lawrence O'Donnell came on next segment he didn't jump right in. I think he saw what happened with Dean and decided to play it middle of the road...

An interesting morning on MJ...

[karynnj]

13. Thanks for the description - I didn't see the show

I don't envy Dean the task he has taken on. He clearly has opted to be a high profile surrogate for HRC - maybe to get back in the game. He has known her and worked with her for years - going back to when he was governor and she was doing healthcare as first lady. In 2008, he was impartial as he agreed to be when he took over the DNC.

Not having seen the segments, I think that O'Donnell would naturally come down more middle of the road on something like this. While others have often been frustrated with what I think is his integrity, I have always liked that he is not knee jerk with ANYONE - not Obama, not Clinton, not the left CW. Here, he has a different role than Dean. Dean is an active HRC surrogate or is auditioning to be one. O'Donnell is a liberal Democrat, but not a surrogate - though he obviously is not neutral when it is right wing versus left wing.

Reading the NYT article, there is nothing that says that the Foundation did anything illegal or shady. It is frustrating that maybe through incompetence, the staff has created this appearance of trying to hide government contributions for three years - the last three years she was SoS. Note that foreign contributions was PRECISELY the concern that was raised when the Senate had hearings to confirm her. One question may be whether the inaccurate information PUBLICLY available on the Clinton Foundation might also mean that Obama himself was blindsided. (One question that may be asked is whether she violated the agreement with Obama.)

Proving quid pro quo is always extremely difficult, but using this opening to now have a series of "was this special treatment" is extremely easy -- even when there is NOTHING there. This is not going to be a fun year and a half.

[CTyankee]

14. Interesting take on this, karynnj.

I noted there was a revival of Benghazi on the show today, altho brief. What is similar in both issues is the raising of suspicion levels with absolutely NO shred of evidence to suggest anything different from before. Sort of dark hints at wrongdoing. So this seemed like a doubly whammy on HRC and this show becomes a conduit.

[Cha]

32. Dean is absolutely right on this.. I don't always agree with him but I do on this.. two links if

you're interested, karyn.

"It takes ten paragraphs before New York Times mentions its latest Clinton hit-piece is speculation"

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/04/23/1379692/-It-takes-ten-paragraphs-before-New-York-Times-mentions-its-latest-Clinton-hit-piece-is-speculation#

"5 Points On The Conservative Author Dishing Clinton Dirt To NYT and Fox News"

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/fivepoints/peter-schweizer-clinton-cash-5-points

[lewebley3]

41. Dean will do just fine for Hillary!! He is very smart, and very cool underfirer

Dean is great, I love him being out there for Hillary, she couldn't
find a better defender.

[Kelvin Mace]

6. The NYT hates the Clintons

This is news?

[AuntPatsy]

11. We have a short attention span IMO because there are just so many issues and the public

Becomes overwhelmed with decisions on which ones deserve more time and fight..

If the 99 percent would stand side by side we'd be unbeatable despite corrupt politicians owning the media...

[DemocratSinceBirth]

12. Well, we don't get to see Morning Joke on the Left Coast unless we are insomniacs./NT

[ChairmanAgnostic]

15. one of the few advantages you have out there.

As least in the Muddle West, we have free entertainment - Scott Walker, Pence, Brownback, Jindahl, and other neotwits who cannot figure out which end of the teabag to dunk.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

16. Are they fixtures on Morning Joke?/NT

[chapdrum]

17. Dear Dr. Dean

If you support Hillary (instead of promoting the ideas of Bernie and Elizabeth W.), maybe you are as loopy as they made you out.

[SidDithers]

18. Welcome to DU...

Sid

[asjr]

19. Dr Dean is not in any way "loopy". He says

what he thinks and is not afraid to say it. When he entered the race for president a few years back I was ready and willing to vote for him. He is extremely intelligent.

[hrmjustin]

23. Oh lord!

[Hekate]

25. Right out of the gate. Enjoy your stay. nt

[McCamy Taylor]

30. Only took 17 posts for someone to attack Dean for defending Clinton.

[Cha]

34. With extreme insipidness.

[Cha]

33. So you're agreeing with corpmedia against Howard Dean? That's an insipid insult you've lobbed at

the Gov.

[gratuitous]

20. Well, that didn't take long

The question degenerated from sloppy New York Times work to whether "sloppy" is the right word, and let's all discuss that instead of what the Times has done to earn the sobriquet.

Well played, Jeremy Peters. I'm sure you'll get a cookie right from the Sulzberger Family Jar.

[rpannier]

22. I've never considered Dean a Clinton surrogate

He may be a supporter, but I doubt that he is doing this because HRC called him and told him to get out there
Dean has defended numerous Democratic politicians and policies against lies and misinformation

[SleeplessinSoCal]

24. Eric Boehlert of Media Matters on w/Chris Hayes

also ripped the NYTimes for leaving out vital info.

I'm beginning to wonder if this a concerted effort. The "librul media" after all is completely unreliable.

[Hekate]

26. Thank you, Governor Dean

[Purveyor]

27. Have they 'deployed' Lanny Davis yet?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

28. What Democrat would you have them deploy?

What Democrat would have them deploy or would you rather they deploy Trey Gowdy, Marco Rubio, or Rand Paul?

[Cha]

35. Sorry, lame attempt at distracting what the OP is about.

[Purveyor]

44. Ding, ding, ding.... I found the answer!~

Fox News Sunday With Chris Wallace Author Peter Schweizer ("Clinton Cash: The Untold Story&quot . Clinton controversies: Lanny Davis. NIH progress; science and religion: NIH Director Francis Collins. Panel: Brit Hume, Julie Pace; Karl Rove; Ron Fournier.

[hrmjustin]

29. Thank you governor Dean.

[Cha]

36. Dean is absolutely right, Justin..

"It takes ten paragraphs before New York Times mentions its latest Clinton hit-piece is speculation"

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/04/23/1379692/-It-takes-ten-paragraphs-before-New-York-Times-mentions-its-latest-Clinton-hit-piece-is-speculation#

"5 Points On The Conservative Author Dishing Clinton Dirt To NYT and Fox News"

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/fivepoints/peter-schweizer-clinton-cash-5-points

[OKNancy]

37. He's right. Not just sloppy, but dishonest

Here is a debunking thread that tears apart several of the many lies.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026555879

Sample:
The main Clinton Foundation donor that the Times suggests stood to gain from the sale of Uranium One to the Russians had actually sold his stake in the company three years earlier. In its article, the Times focuses on Frank Giustra, a Canadian businessman and known philanthropist whose donations to the Clinton Foundation date back to 2005. It is true that Mr. Giustra was the owner of a predecessor firm to Uranium One, the company whose sale was being reviewed by C.F.I.U.S. But by the time of Uranium One’s proposed sale in 2010, Mr. Giustra no longer held a position with the company. In fact, as he told the Times, he had liquidated his stake in Uranium One entirely back in 2007 and thus had no reason to have sought any favor from Clinton’s State Department.

[lewebley3]

38. Agree with Dean: He is the one Hillary should have on her Team!!

I think Dean should work for Hillary as liason to the DNc for her:

He ran the fifty state campaign for Obama, he should be put
in charge with working Debbie Wasserman.

The New York times as turned into a rag!!

[KingCharlemagne]

42. What's amazing to me is how far the Times has fallen in just 50 years. Remember that the NY Times

published the Pentagon Papers and the first story about My Lai. Now they're peddling ridiculous smears based on little more than cheap innuendo, following on their genocidal propaganda campaign that helped lead to the deaths of 1 million innocent civilians in Iraq. They shall never get another penny from me. Cancelled my sub to them back in October 2002 and haven't looked back once.

[lewebley3]

43. Corporations and Greed, are infection few can keep away from!

The newspapers should be selling on the truth, but they don't
there stories are written to make money.

Journalism for profit, is not a good idea, except for my part I find
the truth fascinating.

The truth is not going to found in New York times!!