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madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 02:43 AM Feb 2015

Stunning to read Joe Bageant's critique of the Left Behind series.

What the 'Left Behind' Series Really Means

Before he begins he showed these two quotes about the LeHaye series.

"Jesus merely raised one hand a few inches and a yawning chasm opened in the earth, stretching far and wide enough to swallow all of them. They tumbled in, howling and screeching, but their wailing was soon quashed and all was silent when the earth closed itself again."
-- From Glorious Appearing by Tim LaHaye and Jerry B. Jenkins

"The best thing about the Left Behind books is the way the non-Christians get their guts pulled out by God."
-- 15-year old fundamentalist fan of the Left Behind series


That is the sophisticated language and appeal of America’s all-time best selling adult novels celebrating the ethnic cleansing of non-Christians at the hands of Christ. If a Muslim were to write an Islamic version of the last book in the Left Behind series, Glorious Appearing, and publish it across the Middle East, Americans would go beserk. Yet tens of millions of Christians eagerly await and celebrate an End Time when everyone who disagrees with them will be murdered in ways that make Islamic beheading look like a bridal shower. Jesus -- who apparently has a much nastier streak than we have been led to believe -- merely speaks and "the bodies of the enemy are ripped wide open down the middle." In the book Christians have to drive carefully to avoid "hitting splayed and filleted corpses of men and women and horses" Even as the riders’ tongues are melting in their mouths and they are being wide open gutted by God’s own hand, the poor damned horses are getting the same treatment. Sort of a divinely inspired version of "Fuck you and the horse you rode in on."

This may be some of the bloodiest hate fiction ever published, but it is also what tens of millions of Americans believe is God’s will. It is approximately what everyone in the congregation sitting around me last Sunday at my brother’s church believes. Or some version of it. How can anyone acquire and hold such notions? Answer: The same way you got yours and I got mine. Conditioning. From family and school and society, but from within a different American caste than the one in which you were raised. And from things stamped deep in childhood -- such as coming home terrified to an empty house.

One September day when I was in the third grade I got off the school bus and walked up the red dust powdered lane to my house only to find no one there. The smudgy white front door of the old frame house stood open. My footsteps on the unpainted gray porch creaked in the fall stillness. With increasing panic, I went through every room, and then ran around the outside crying and sobbing in the grip of the most horrific loneliness and terror. I believed with all my heart that The Rapture had come and that all my family had been taken up to heaven leaving me alone on earth to face God’s terrible wrath. As it turned out they were at the neighbor’s house scarcely 300 yards down the road, and returned in a few minutes. But it took me hours to calm down. I dreamed about it for years afterward.


And then the Bageant ties the author to the John Birch Society.

Scratch LaHaye and you’ll find an honest-to-god surviving John Bircher. In the 1960s when LaHaye was a young up-and-coming Baptist preacher fresh out of Bob Jones University, he lectured on behalf of Republican Robert Welch’s John Birch Society. We are talking about a man who believed Dwight Eisenhower was an agent of the Communist Party taking orders from his brother, Milt Eisenhower. Along the way LaHaye extended his paranoid list of villains to include secular humanists who "are Satan’s agents hiding behind the Constitution." And the only way to destroy them is to destroy their cover.


Joe Bageant passed away in 2011. He called things as he saw them, did not mince words.

RIP Joe Bageant.
88 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Stunning to read Joe Bageant's critique of the Left Behind series. (Original Post) madfloridian Feb 2015 OP
Interesting. cui bono Feb 2015 #1
Now that is creepy world wide wally Feb 2015 #2
A great prophet and wit. DeSwiss Feb 2015 #3
what...the Bible? trumad Feb 2015 #10
'The slaves are free to elect their masters, KG Feb 2015 #15
He once said this in reference to DU: DeSwiss Feb 2015 #88
Joe was wonderful and he is very much missed. haikugal Feb 2015 #4
wow. but somehow, not so surprising. ND-Dem Feb 2015 #5
Violence porn cloaked in religion.... Spitfire of ATJ Feb 2015 #6
What I find interesting from these who purport a "sola scriptura" literal translation of the bible Drahthaardogs Feb 2015 #17
Exactly. I did not read them because of what I heard people saying about them. I did not realize jwirr Feb 2015 #23
Anything can "become the truth" if you have the money to hifiguy Feb 2015 #67
I hear you. Especially the 3rd fact. jwirr Feb 2015 #80
Yes, I've noticed that as well, how these books fabricate a version Pooka Fey Feb 2015 #24
Try reading "The French Lieutenant's Woman"..... Spitfire of ATJ Feb 2015 #35
some folks sure are safeinOhio Feb 2015 #7
thanks for the link n/t flygal Feb 2015 #8
You're welcome. I love his work. madfloridian Feb 2015 #11
I have always thought these books should be subjected to "hate crime" laws Pooka Fey Feb 2015 #9
And the writing . . . Jesus . . . hatrack Feb 2015 #13
I'll take your word for the writing, I never could stomach actually opening one of these Pooka Fey Feb 2015 #20
At its deadened heart, AS is the same sort of revenge narrative JHB Feb 2015 #36
Feel free to have a book burning. Dr. Strange Feb 2015 #14
Actually my plan is to mail out free copies of the entire series to every registered democrat Pooka Fey Feb 2015 #21
AutoJoe BageantDURec KG Feb 2015 #12
"The best thing about internet quotes is they are easy to manufacture" Bonx Feb 2015 #16
Well you'd have to talk to Joe about that. madfloridian Feb 2015 #18
Looks like he might have gotten it from... Pacifist Patriot Feb 2015 #26
I think you may be right. madfloridian Feb 2015 #84
Left Behind Series = Snuff Porn for Christians ChosenUnWisely Feb 2015 #19
If you can be Muslim and yet NOT Taliban, you can also be Christian and NOT a Fundie Left-Behinder Pooka Fey Feb 2015 #25
Sure one can, sure one can ChosenUnWisely Feb 2015 #28
Dig a little deeper, your prejudices are showing Pooka Fey Feb 2015 #29
Christianity nor Islam would not be as popular if it were not for forced conversions by sword ChosenUnWisely Feb 2015 #32
Latest Wackjob shooter was a Militant Atheist cleansing Evil Religious people from the Earth Pooka Fey Feb 2015 #33
Post removed Post removed Feb 2015 #34
This message was self-deleted by its author LanternWaste Feb 2015 #38
And you are so happy about it you can't stop grinning.. Fumesucker Feb 2015 #51
You are slandering me and because the post was deleted, I can't prove it. Pooka Fey Feb 2015 #55
Post removed Post removed Feb 2015 #63
AS I SAID BEFORE it was thoughtless and immature but I can't touch it now Pooka Fey Feb 2015 #65
The Chapel Hill thread posts are unbecoming Cosmic Kitten Feb 2015 #69
I bow my head before your obvious moral superiority. NOT Pooka Fey Feb 2015 #70
We can read the hidden posts you know? Cosmic Kitten Feb 2015 #71
Since it is hidden, I can't touch it now as we ALREADY DISCUSSED BEFORE THREE TIMES NOW and counting Pooka Fey Feb 2015 #72
Hmmmm... Cosmic Kitten Feb 2015 #73
Not surprising that you refuse dialogue Pooka Fey Feb 2015 #74
Count this Christian out. mwooldri Feb 2015 #77
"celebrating the ethnic cleansing of non-Christians" G_j Feb 2015 #22
Scratch deeper - Much of LaHaye's funding was from Rev Moon, the Korean cult leader. blm Feb 2015 #27
Yes BLM. I had forgotten that. Found a post of yours... madfloridian Feb 2015 #40
hey to you, old buddy blm Feb 2015 #42
You should repost that as a companion to your current OP blm Feb 2015 #47
Matter of fact... madfloridian Feb 2015 #49
He explains the right wing hatred for education. hunter Feb 2015 #30
The Slacktivist is a blogger who has been taking these evil books apart for years ProfessorPlum Feb 2015 #31
+1000, and hand that man a telephone! JHB Feb 2015 #37
Thanks for the link. Great site. madfloridian Feb 2015 #41
You are very welcome, MF, and thank you for the OP and all of the wonderful posting you have done ProfessorPlum Feb 2015 #43
Almost forgot about Patheos. Thanks for reminding me! LongTomH Feb 2015 #52
This malaise Feb 2015 #39
lol Tsiyu Feb 2015 #44
I also found that line to be hilarious. Curmudgeoness Feb 2015 #76
True believers are scary. Not the believers who have adapted to real life. The other ones. nt valerief Feb 2015 #45
I gave you a heart angel823 Feb 2015 #46
Isn't it a great site? I go there a lot. madfloridian Feb 2015 #50
I worked with Joe on a project once... gregcrawford Feb 2015 #48
That must have been fascinating. madfloridian Feb 2015 #87
wow, thank you for this. BlancheSplanchnik Feb 2015 #53
One of my (former) friends who believes the "end-times" shit no longer speaks to me OldRedneck Feb 2015 #54
Anybody see Nicholas Cage's version of Left Behind? Is it worse than the Kirk Cameron version? blkmusclmachine Feb 2015 #56
I could not believe he made that movie. madfloridian Feb 2015 #58
My daughter and I have seen both. Just for laughs azmom Feb 2015 #61
Want to know how to kill a series? Just cast Nicholas Cage in it. Initech Feb 2015 #57
Ah, the internet! As if we had nothing better to do, we sit around outraged about some silly series struggle4progress Feb 2015 #59
You do know they are making movies now about it? "Cheering a dead man"? Whoa madfloridian Feb 2015 #60
"... Left Behind has very little to do with the novel it’s based on. In many ways, struggle4progress Feb 2015 #68
It is my distinct impression that the people who read these books SheilaT Feb 2015 #62
Yeah, to anyone who reads more than five (adult level) books a year, they're poorly written. n/t X_Digger Feb 2015 #81
I'm also aware that many fundamentalist Christians SheilaT Feb 2015 #85
I tried to read those books. I made it through the first one and that was enough for me. iscooterliberally Feb 2015 #64
I miss Joe as much as Molly Ivins. hifiguy Feb 2015 #66
Koch's Belief System. zentrum Feb 2015 #75
I read all these books too, and...... bluedeer71 Feb 2015 #78
Very moving post. madfloridian Feb 2015 #79
my turning point azureblue Feb 2015 #82
Xtians. Diremoon Feb 2015 #83
When the first book came out I decided to read it. indivisibleman Feb 2015 #86
 

DeSwiss

(27,137 posts)
3. A great prophet and wit.
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 04:04 AM
Feb 2015
- Which is why is wasn't accepted in his own country in his own time -- as with so many others.

K&R

Liberty nonetheless abounds in a totalitarian democracy. Open elections verify majority rule. The slaves are free to elect their masters, and that is enough to satisfy most folks in the land of the free. That, along with 100-plus cable channels to keep us entertained inside the cage. We know we are powerless, but better the devil you know than evil socialism, where you are not allowed to take out a second mortgage on your cage.

So here it is, top of the ninth round, and Gaia is on the ropes with cuts over both eyes, and no referee on the mat. Homo sapiens are moving in for the killer punch. It's been an ugly fight. But the truth is that there will be no winner. Certainly not man, considering that his triumph results in the specter of human self-extinction, dieback or die-off, or at least by massive die-back.

Call me a grim old fatalist, but I just do not see the human race turning things around. Not because humans are inherently evil (although pimping Gaia to death comes close), but because we are what we are. In any case, we are not going to stop eating, shitting, burning up stuff to stay warm, or following the genetic imperative to breed. How can we solve the problem when we are the problem, other than by self-extinction?

~Joe Bageant

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KG

(28,753 posts)
15. 'The slaves are free to elect their masters,
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 10:50 AM
Feb 2015

and that is enough to satisfy most folks in the land of the free....'

damn, that explains a sizable segment of DU

 

DeSwiss

(27,137 posts)
88. He once said this in reference to DU:
Thu Feb 12, 2015, 03:03 AM
Feb 2015
Big AI and the Tuscaloosa sprinkler man

Life is lived anecdotally, not algorithmically. And anecdotal evidence is not allowed in the new digital corpocracy. As one poster on Democratic Underground put it, “Anecdotal now has this enforced meaning such that no one is supposed to believe what they experience, what they see, hear, taste, smell, etc. The Powers That Be have basically extinguished the notion of inductive reasoning. Everything has to be replicated in a laboratory and since 90% of all the labs in this nation are operated by Corporate Sponsored monies, not much truth comes out of them."

The trouble with the algorithmic age is that life is not a finite sequence of steps that define and contain the algorithmic concepts used. Even when created with the best of intentions -- and we can all agree by now there were few good intentions at Goldman Sachs when they were creating and bundling these mutant investments -- they cannot account for our uninsured sprinkler installer getting cancer, or divorcing the other half of the household income -- or the end of America’s residential construction orgy.

The digital folly is never ending. The knock-on effect just keeps rolling. The latest is the rising scandal of millions of illegal foreclosures created by MERS (Mortgage Electronic Registration Systems), which enabled the big financial firms to securitize and swap mortgages at super high speed. But not to worry. Nancy Pelosi and Christopher Dodd are on the case, and there is sure to be a Congressional committee appointed. Whoopee! Have one on me.

Meanwhile, we have our social networking software to better weave us into the hive. Social networking software, now there’s a term that should scare the piss out of anyone with an IQ over 40. It means the database as hive reality. Facebook, online banking, shopping, porn, years of one’s life playing electronic games or whatever, online dating and reducing romance and companionship to fit the software. Or 4,000 Facebook “friends,” data on 4000 Americans voluntarily collected for Facebook corporation. The concept of “friends” is cheapened, rendered meaningless as it passes through a database. In fact, all human experience is cheapened by that process. Information is not reality.


~Joe Bageant, Algorithms and Red Wine

haikugal

(6,476 posts)
4. Joe was wonderful and he is very much missed.
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 04:14 AM
Feb 2015

Voices like his keep us from bouncing off the insanity cliff...or maybe I'm just saying too much about myself. In any case, thanks for bringing him here tonight.

 

Spitfire of ATJ

(32,723 posts)
6. Violence porn cloaked in religion....
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 04:34 AM
Feb 2015

Wonder how many old assholes smugly walk around town looking at young people being,....well,.....young people and thinking of how their vengeful Sky Spook will make them pay,.....for having the good time they never had.

It's only a small step to thinking since you are the "Enlightened One" than it is your Calling to be God's Holy Instrument.

A visit to the gun shop follows and soon all the neighbors are saying, "He seemed like such a nice man, he went to church all the time."

Drahthaardogs

(6,843 posts)
17. What I find interesting from these who purport a "sola scriptura" literal translation of the bible
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 11:05 AM
Feb 2015

is that there is no Rapture described anywhere in scripture. It is an interpretation only held by a select group of Born-Again Christians. Catholics, Orthodox, and main stream Protestants do not accept this belief. This is very Jerry Falwell type stuff.

Another interesting point is that Jesus clearly says in the Gospels that HE will not judge. The Father will judge and condemn, not Jesus. Jesus is the redeemer, not the condemner. The very act of Jesus opening the earth and destroying souls into hell is almost sacrilegious. The nearest Jesus comes to condemning is sorting the people in Mathew, but even then, he only sorts The Father has already determined who is blessed and who is not.

I see that as a fundamental flaw in these books. Plus the fact they are the most boring ready in the entire world. I find them worse than John Updike, and I really really cannot stand John Updike's writing. I find him to be the cure for insomnia.

jwirr

(39,215 posts)
23. Exactly. I did not read them because of what I heard people saying about them. I did not realize
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 11:37 AM
Feb 2015

that they have a direct connection to the John Birch Society. When I was growing up this group was seen as anti-American. Today the Koch brothers are passing it off as totally pro-American.

I need to make sure that my family knows that they should avoid the Left Behind series like the plaque.

 

hifiguy

(33,688 posts)
67. Anything can "become the truth" if you have the money to
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 07:16 PM
Feb 2015

repeat it loudly enough and often enough in every conceivable medium. Absolutely anything.

Charlie Pierce explains it in his Three Great Premises of Idiot America:


1. Any theory is valid if it sells books, soaks up ratings, or otherwise moves units
2. Anything can be true if someone says it loudly enough
3. Fact is that which enough people believe. Truth is determined by how fervently they believe it

In my mind these stand with Einstein's Theories of Special and General Relativity in terms of the truth to the greatest extent we currently know it. And they will kill this society, if not human civilization as a whole

Pooka Fey

(3,496 posts)
24. Yes, I've noticed that as well, how these books fabricate a version
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 11:37 AM
Feb 2015

of Jesus that doesn't exist in the Gospels, and is indeed sacrilegious to my cultural faith, Roman Catholicism.

 

Spitfire of ATJ

(32,723 posts)
35. Try reading "The French Lieutenant's Woman".....
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 01:26 PM
Feb 2015

At one point there's a scene on a train where there is suddenly this scheming character looking over the protagonist as if they are trying to figure out how best to use them.

Just when you try to figure out who this guy is the author writes, "Perhaps you are wondering why I have inserted myself in the story at this point."

No, but I stopped reading at that point.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
11. You're welcome. I love his work.
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 10:20 AM
Feb 2015

He's hard to quote because he spares no one at times.

This one really hits home in today's world.

Pooka Fey

(3,496 posts)
9. I have always thought these books should be subjected to "hate crime" laws
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 07:18 AM
Feb 2015

and banned. Imagine a leftist writing such a thing on DU. I would see these books stacked up in used bookstores in AZ and my flesh would crawl.

hatrack

(59,593 posts)
13. And the writing . . . Jesus . . .
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 10:47 AM
Feb 2015

I think it was Bageant who said (paraphrase) that "The characters speak dialogue that sounds like it was written by Ostrogoths."

At least there's only one Atlas Shrugged - there's volume after volume of this shit.

Pooka Fey

(3,496 posts)
20. I'll take your word for the writing, I never could stomach actually opening one of these
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 11:24 AM
Feb 2015

My bullshit sensing field never allowed me to approach the book displays close enough to pick one up. However, the cover art did make quite an impression on me.

And I did consider and worry about the number of volumes in the series, providing hours and hours of brainwashing content to format the RW Christian Fundie Army for the coming Apocalypse.

I'm glad to know Joe Bageant wrote about this, I always appreciated his writing.

JHB

(37,162 posts)
36. At its deadened heart, AS is the same sort of revenge narrative
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 01:30 PM
Feb 2015

The "saved" hole up in Galt's Gulch while "unbelievers" and their world burn.

Pooka Fey

(3,496 posts)
21. Actually my plan is to mail out free copies of the entire series to every registered democrat
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 11:28 AM
Feb 2015

because I feel that I, as a loyal member of the RW American Christian Taliban, need to prepare my minions for the coming Apocalypse.

Do I need this? Probably...

Bonx

(2,075 posts)
16. "The best thing about internet quotes is they are easy to manufacture"
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 10:54 AM
Feb 2015

- Hans Christian Andersen

The books are ridiculous, but i can't find a source for that 15-year old fundamentalist fan quote anywhere.

Pacifist Patriot

(24,654 posts)
26. Looks like he might have gotten it from...
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 11:56 AM
Feb 2015

page 198 of "End-Timers: Three Thousand Years of Waiting for Judgment Day" By Martin Ballard. It's got a citation, but I can't get to the footnote to find where Ballard got it.

 

ChosenUnWisely

(588 posts)
19. Left Behind Series = Snuff Porn for Christians
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 11:21 AM
Feb 2015

Lots of Christians have woddies, so to speak, reading and watching vary bad movies, about how all the non Christians get killed and are made to suffer.

.

Pooka Fey

(3,496 posts)
25. If you can be Muslim and yet NOT Taliban, you can also be Christian and NOT a Fundie Left-Behinder
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 11:52 AM
Feb 2015

I know these fine categorical distinctions are so very hard on one intellectually and require actual critical reasoning skills, which modern education has abandoned in favor of high stakes testing. It may not be your fault that you're having trouble with this.

 

ChosenUnWisely

(588 posts)
28. Sure one can, sure one can
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 12:29 PM
Feb 2015

If that is what one wants to believe, that is their right but that does not make it true.

History proves, time and time again with ALL religions, eventually, it always ends up with someone holding a sword or gun up to your head forcing one to convert or die that is just the way it works.

 

ChosenUnWisely

(588 posts)
32. Christianity nor Islam would not be as popular if it were not for forced conversions by sword
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 01:19 PM
Feb 2015

and that is a historical fact jack.

Religious BS can't even be sold on it own merits, conversion by the sword, it is all ya got.

Pooka Fey

(3,496 posts)
33. Latest Wackjob shooter was a Militant Atheist cleansing Evil Religious people from the Earth
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 01:23 PM
Feb 2015

Is it one of your buddies?

Response to Pooka Fey (Reply #33)

Response to Post removed (Reply #34)

Pooka Fey

(3,496 posts)
55. You are slandering me and because the post was deleted, I can't prove it.
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 05:09 PM
Feb 2015

My post was thoughtless and immature. Your post is despicable and dishonest and malicious.

Response to Pooka Fey (Reply #55)

Pooka Fey

(3,496 posts)
65. AS I SAID BEFORE it was thoughtless and immature but I can't touch it now
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 07:05 PM
Feb 2015


I'll stay here all fucking night if you want to keep accusing me of advocating criminal activity. You don't like people saying anything about atheists, that is for sure and certain.

Pooka Fey

(3,496 posts)
70. I bow my head before your obvious moral superiority. NOT
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 07:45 PM
Feb 2015

Did you NOT NOTICE WHEN I wrote TWICE that I AGREED that one of my posts was IMMATURE and THOUGHTLESS.

Do you wish to alert on any other of my posts? You are free to do so. And then we will discuss openly and objectively what is objectionable, so that we may learn from the exchange.

Or is your intention to state that atheists are a protected group on DU, immune from criticism, unlike all the faithful of the other 3 main religions?

Cosmic Kitten

(3,498 posts)
71. We can read the hidden posts you know?
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 07:54 PM
Feb 2015

It's more than "one of my posts".

The issue is not of "protected group" status.
It's about rude, insensitive, hurtful posts.

Your admission of being "IMMATURE and THOUGHTLESS"
should give a rational person pause....

Pooka Fey

(3,496 posts)
72. Since it is hidden, I can't touch it now as we ALREADY DISCUSSED BEFORE THREE TIMES NOW and counting
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 07:56 PM
Feb 2015

Might I be the rational person you are referring to, who recognizes immature and thoughtless and gives pause?

Speak plainly, Cosmic Kitten. Don't be shy.

Pooka Fey

(3,496 posts)
74. Not surprising that you refuse dialogue
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 08:01 PM
Feb 2015

My decoder ring is in the shop this week. The passive aggression comes through loud and clear though.

mwooldri

(10,303 posts)
77. Count this Christian out.
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 10:13 PM
Feb 2015

There's a reason why it's called Left Behind. I left it behind at the store and didn't purchase it. Or read it. I sorta saw some made-for-tv movie about this book series and it just wasn't my cup of tea at all.

blm

(113,100 posts)
27. Scratch deeper - Much of LaHaye's funding was from Rev Moon, the Korean cult leader.
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 12:24 PM
Feb 2015

They were aligned since the 70s, when both were considered to be mind control experts.

Rev Moon's alliance with Poppy Bush(CIA) goes back to the 60s.

blm

(113,100 posts)
47. You should repost that as a companion to your current OP
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 04:25 PM
Feb 2015

You get far more eyeballs than I do.

; )

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
49. Matter of fact...
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 04:51 PM
Feb 2015

you got me started looking up some oldies but goodies. BTW some of those eyeballs ain't so friendly.

hunter

(38,328 posts)
30. He explains the right wing hatred for education.
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 01:00 PM
Feb 2015

Ignorant uneducated fuckwits are easier to manipulate.

ProfessorPlum

(11,277 posts)
31. The Slacktivist is a blogger who has been taking these evil books apart for years
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 01:04 PM
Feb 2015

His archives start here: http://www.patheos.com/blogs/slacktivist/tag/left-behind/page/41/ and move forward through the series. He is a Christian whose analysis of these awful books is both religious and artistic.

Some of the most important cultural criticism I've ever come across.

ProfessorPlum

(11,277 posts)
43. You are very welcome, MF, and thank you for the OP and all of the wonderful posting you have done
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 03:15 PM
Feb 2015

on this site. I have really appreciated it over the years.

LongTomH

(8,636 posts)
52. Almost forgot about Patheos. Thanks for reminding me!
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 05:01 PM
Feb 2015

My cousins, on my mom's side eat this shit up! I think that's why my mom and I both stopped going to church.

Thanks again for the reminder and link!

malaise

(269,186 posts)
39. This
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 01:40 PM
Feb 2015
Yet tens of millions of Christians eagerly await and celebrate an End Time when everyone who disagrees with them will be murdered in ways that make Islamic beheading look like a bridal shower


Freaking perfect

Tsiyu

(18,186 posts)
44. lol
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 03:48 PM
Feb 2015

Sort of a divinely inspired version of "Fuck you and the horse you rode in on."






But seriously, folks, this is why it's terrifying to live around the Rapturists.

Now, I have never harmed them, would do anything to help them, but because I don't buy their religious claptrap, they are going to rejoice in my any-minute-now-our-god'll-be-here-to-validate-us excruciating death.

Hell, if they think the end is near, they may just decide to preemptively gut me open, since that's "what Jesus would want us to do to a nonbeliever."

I love my neighbors, but they don't love me back the same way, I fear. I never fantasized about their deaths, that's for sure.

SICK SICK SICK people who read and enjoy that violence porn.





Curmudgeoness

(18,219 posts)
76. I also found that line to be hilarious.
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 09:22 PM
Feb 2015

I think that you may be mistaken about your neighbors. These people love the idea of "heathens" being tortured by their God in the End Times, but I have a suspicion that the reality will be much harder for them to take. They rejoice in the belief that they would be Raptured, therefore they will be saved from all the suffering.....but they are not really thinking of the reality of what they are wishing for. Their own children may be tortured. Friends, like you, would be tortured. People that they love and adore will suffer. Good people who have helped them in times of need will be tormented. The reality of it will not be so much fun for them to watch.

angel823

(409 posts)
46. I gave you a heart
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 04:24 PM
Feb 2015

Just to thank you for reminding me about Joe and his website.

Great stuff there, coming from a fellow progressive southerner.

Angel in TExasperated

gregcrawford

(2,382 posts)
48. I worked with Joe on a project once...
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 04:37 PM
Feb 2015

... shortly before he died (I've got an inscribed copy of "Deer Hunting With Jesus&quot He was a good man.

BlancheSplanchnik

(20,219 posts)
53. wow, thank you for this.
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 05:06 PM
Feb 2015

I'd never seen any material from that garbage series before.


xtian fundies = islam fundies

 

OldRedneck

(1,397 posts)
54. One of my (former) friends who believes the "end-times" shit no longer speaks to me
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 05:07 PM
Feb 2015

One evening, sitting on my deck, he went into his "end-times-rapture" routine. I listened patiently as I had for several times in the past, then, I asked him if he would have a spare set of keys made for his Mercedes so I could take it when he is raptured. Also asked him if he would leave his ATM card in an envelope on the kitchen counter with his PIN -- I could use the money.

He blew his stack, stormed back home, hasn't spoken to me since.

His wife got so tired of his bullshit that she left him around Thanksgiving last year after 42 years of marriage. Their daughter asked her what took her so long.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
58. I could not believe he made that movie.
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 05:29 PM
Feb 2015

I hear it got terrible reviews. Almost nobody is worse than Kirk Cameron.

azmom

(5,208 posts)
61. My daughter and I have seen both. Just for laughs
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 06:23 PM
Feb 2015

We laughed more with the Cameron version. We saw the one where they go after the anti-Christ.
It was a riot. At one point Jesus freezes time so Cameron and his crew can make an escape.

The Nicholas Cage one was funny but there was nothing much to it. People disappeared, leaving their clothes behind and everyone freaks out. The end.

oops, I guess there was a message that I missed. Fro the interwebs.

Anticipation Of The Rapture – This was the biggest lesson of the movie for me. While watching the film, you are literally on the edge of your seat because you know the rapture is coming. You just do not know when. As a Christian, I fell under conviction because God had me deal with the question, “Why am I anticipating the rapture so much in a movie but not in real life.” I should anticipate the real rapture even more because I also know it is coming. I just do not know when.

struggle4progress

(118,356 posts)
59. Ah, the internet! As if we had nothing better to do, we sit around outraged about some silly series
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 05:35 PM
Feb 2015

of books published a decade or more ago and cheering a now-dead man for denouncing that silly nonsense back then, as if nothing more important had happened since

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
60. You do know they are making movies now about it? "Cheering a dead man"? Whoa
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 05:54 PM
Feb 2015

I feel like responding more to that but I won't.

struggle4progress

(118,356 posts)
68. "... Left Behind has very little to do with the novel it’s based on. In many ways,
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 07:21 PM
Feb 2015

that’s a very good thing. The first book in LaHaye’s series follows two protagonists: "revered" airline pilot Rayford Steele and superstar journalist Cameron "Buck" Williams. Unexplained disappearances rock the world, and a charismatic Antichrist rises to power, while Rayford, his daughter Chloe, and Buck prepare to survive the end times as part of the guerrilla "Tribulation Force." This all sounds tremendously exciting, until you realize that both men are arrogant and vindictive bores, the Rapture is forgotten within a few chapters, and the Antichrist is a minor Romanian politician jockeying for leadership of the UN. With its unpleasant characters, glacial pace, and bizarre preoccupation with phone calls and travel plans, Left Behind may be one of the dullest books (and most cynical money grabs, since its story would be stretched over 15 more volumes and a young adult series) to ever hit the bestseller lists. A 2000 film adaptation, starring Kirk Cameron of Growing Pains, didn’t redeem it. I’m reasonably confident guessing the original script for this version of Left Behind was not written for Tim LaHaye’s megafranchise at all. The characters and basic setup of the book are channeled into a disaster movie about Rayford (played by Nicolas Cage) struggling to land his plane amid the chaos of millions of people inexplicably disappearing. It’s more Langoliers than Leftovers: runways have gone dark, fuel is running low, and the remaining passengers are growing more paranoid by the minute. There’s no UN, no Antichrist, and in fact the whole plot of the movie covers 25 pages in the book — although, granted, they’re probably the most exciting 25 pages ... Unfortunately, Left Behind has bigger problems as simple entertainment. It starts with an aimless, meandering half-hour of pointless banter and earnest discussion between major characters, interspersed with almost completely extraneous vignettes of people who will never be seen again. Chloe and Buck are introduced with a forced meet-cute, and the passengers on Rayford’s plane are thinly drawn cliches created to fill supernatural-disaster-movie quotas ... Left Behind bears some of the hallmarks of a made-for-TV religious movie, including a bland, schmaltzy, and often totally inappropriate score ..."
A terrible book about the apocalypse gets even bleaker
By Adi Robertson on October 9, 2014 10:00 am

 

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)
62. It is my distinct impression that the people who read these books
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 06:46 PM
Feb 2015

have read little or no fiction before they found this crap.

When the very first book came out I picked it up and started reading, but only made it about one chapter in before I realized where it was headed and knew I didn't need to waste any more of my time. I seem to recall it was not well written in the first place, but it was so long ago I've thankfully forgotten any specifics.

 

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)
85. I'm also aware that many fundamentalist Christians
Thu Feb 12, 2015, 02:10 AM
Feb 2015

strongly disapprove of regular secular fiction, because since it's not based on the Bible, is lies, pure and simple. They lack any sort of understanding of the memes of fiction, or why fiction even exists. Now, I understand people who simply don't like reading novels (even if I personally think they're weird), or those who read only one sort of fiction -- I have a good friend who only reads mysteries -- even though I can't imagine such a limited outview of life. But still, I do reasonably well understand such people. But those who generally read the Bible and only the Bible (it's the only part that stops me in my tracks) have a profound lack of understanding of the uses of fiction. I'm not talking about sophisticated literary analysis here, lord knows I don't do that sort of thing very well. What I'm getting at is to be able to read a piece of fiction and say something beyond, It was good. Or it was bad.

I would love to read a genuinely well-written book based on the notion of the Rapture. Doesn't matter if I believe in such a thing or not. A good book on that topic would be quite fascinating. Unfortunately, such books are only written by the True Believers, and they have few if any skills at writing interesting fiction.

iscooterliberally

(2,863 posts)
64. I tried to read those books. I made it through the first one and that was enough for me.
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 07:02 PM
Feb 2015

My mom and my sisters raved about them. They are religious. I thought they were boring and the characters were not interesting. There was one named 'Buck' because he 'bucked the system'. How creative - NOT! The book covers looked great though!
Thanks for this post. These guys are even nuttier than I thought.

 

hifiguy

(33,688 posts)
66. I miss Joe as much as Molly Ivins.
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 07:07 PM
Feb 2015

Both had hair-trigger bullshit detectors and an enviable way with both common sense and words.

zentrum

(9,865 posts)
75. Koch's Belief System.
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 08:54 PM
Feb 2015

Never forget that Fred Koch, father of the Koch brothers, the current force overtaking Congress, was a founding member of the Birch Society.

I'd say the apocalypse of fire is going to be ecological disaster urged on by this, may I say—Satanic family.

bluedeer71

(15 posts)
78. I read all these books too, and......
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 10:30 PM
Feb 2015

Yes, I did read the entire series. In fact, I was once an "evangelical christian". Even when reading the books as a "believer", I knew something was amiss. I got so tired of people in "positions of authority" telling me what to think and how to act. Even when I was a "believer", I questioned this authority. Finally, I decided that if there was a God, he wasn't going to hunt me down and kill me if I doubted the church. When being honest with myself, I questioned just about everything with the church. The hypocrisy of the evangelical church was so overwhelming that I finally left. Now, if someone professes to be a christian, particularly an evangelical christian, I find myself disgusted by it. Maybe that's an over-reaction, but I just can't deal with it. To me, they are all deluded. To me, they have all given up all control over their own lives, basically because they are afraid of God. I do not and will not "serve" a God of whom I should live in fear. If there is a God, surely he is not like that, and if he is, I don't need him in my life.

I threw the books in the trash a few years ago.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
79. Very moving post.
Wed Feb 11, 2015, 11:03 PM
Feb 2015

I could relate to so much of it. I was raised Southern Baptist, but left when they called Iraq a holy war and said we were unpatriotic.

Good point:

"If there is a God, surely he is not like that, and if he is, I don't need him in my life"

So true.

azureblue

(2,152 posts)
82. my turning point
Thu Feb 12, 2015, 12:53 AM
Feb 2015

was, as a middle schooler, being told the story of the Biblical flood again, how everything perished that wasn't on the Ark, etc., and I had the nerve to ask, "but what about the fish?' I well remember the stunned look on the person's face who was teaching the story, then the pivot from a older Christian to a hateful person who spit out the words, "how dare you doubt the Bible!" And I thought I had asked a reasonable question. That was the moment when I got that nagging feeling that something was very wrong here. And i was right.

Diremoon

(86 posts)
83. Xtians.
Thu Feb 12, 2015, 01:26 AM
Feb 2015

I came to the conclusion that I did not believe the bible stories at a very early age, but I was always aware that to not claim to be a true believer was to place myself in danger from those around me. Six decades of watching xtians has left me pretty will disgusted by them. At one time I thought that maybe their religion gave them comfort. Now I see it just helps them rationalize their hate. To hell with them.

indivisibleman

(482 posts)
86. When the first book came out I decided to read it.
Thu Feb 12, 2015, 02:23 AM
Feb 2015

I got to chapter two or three as I recall. It was so poorly written and so absolutely stupid I was astonished that so many people were reading it.
The Omen was a hundred times better.

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