Bernie Sanders Grills Obama's Budget Chief: Why Should Huge Companies Pay ZERO Federal Income Taxes?

[Triana]

Last edited Sun Feb 8, 2015, 03:23 PM - Edit history (1)

If Senate Republicans are serious about reducing the deficit and the national debt, “I hope they will join us in making sure that some of the largest, most profitable corporations pay their fair share in taxes,” Sen. Bernie Sanders said at a Senate Budget Committee hearing on Tuesday. “Each and every year, we lose $100 billion in revenue because large corporations and the wealthy are stashing their profits in the Cayman Islands, Bermuda and other offshore tax havens. That has got to stop,” Sanders said.

He cited examples of some of the most profitable corporations in America which in some years paid no federal income taxes. General Electric made nearly $34 billion in profits in the United States from 2008 through 2013 but paid no federal income taxes. Instead, GE received a tax rebate of nearly $3 billion from the Internal Revenue Service. Verizon made more than $42.5 billion in U.S. profits during the same period, paid no federal income taxes and got $732 million from the IRS. And in 2013, Citigroup made $6.4 billion in profits, paid no federal income taxes and claimed a $260 million rebate from the IRS.

“Instead of cutting programs for some of the most vulnerable people in our society, we have got to make sure that the largest, most profitable corporations pay their fair share in taxes.

The panel heard testimony from Shaun Donovan, President Barack Obama’s budget director. In an exchange with Sen. Sanders, Donovan outlined the White House plan to close corporate tax loopholes.

"Many of my Republican colleagues believe that what is best for the country in the future is basically to cut, cut, cut, cut, cut," Sanders said. "Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, nutrition etc. ect. others of us don't think that is what is best for working families in this country."

WATCH:

LINK: http://www.sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/recent-business/corporate-tax-loopholes

[NoJusticeNoPeace]

1. Imagine a world without Bernie...we would truly all be completely farked

[BrotherIvan]

2. Imagine someone speaking like this from the bully pulpit

He's not saying anything radical; he's just saying that companies should pay their fair share. No political expediency, no 'corporations are people' pretzel logic. Just fair is fair. Simple really. It would take Fox a whole lot of overtime to spin all the plain logic that would come out of President Sanders mouth.

[NoJusticeNoPeace]

3. I think Obama says some of that here and there, but no matter what they say, they know it aint

gonna happen.

[BrotherIvan]

5. Unfortunately Obama is not very clear about what he means or intends

That's why we always play the What Obama Really Meant game all the time. On the other hand, I've never had to do that with Bernie.

[Aldo Leopold]

16. Nailed it.

[VanillaRhapsody]

26. because he keeps his cards close to his vest...

Its called having a "poker face" you fault him for that?

[BrotherIvan]

43. That is not a leader's job

A president is meant to lead the nation, to represent and communicate with the people of this country. By sharing his vision and his values, that's how a leader leads. We are not supposed to guess what he or she really intends to do. Communication is a common characteristic among the very successful presidents. And I would expect it from someone who campaigned on transparency. The constant obfuscating is one of the very exasperating things about President Obama.

[VanillaRhapsody]

59. In the case of an opposition that is as ridiculous as his....OH YES it is!

Its part of the reason he succeeds against them.

Sorry he doesn't do your will!

[BrotherIvan]

60. Not surprised at your answer

Politics for politics' sake is sinking this country. Don't bother answering this post.

[VanillaRhapsody]

61. Why because I am a Democrat that supports her successful Democratic President...

And don't tell me what to "bother" to do!

[tech3149]

32. There is a difference between words and actions

I think Obamas actions speak much louder than his words. That doesn't make me a happy camper.

[cui bono]

41. +1

[1StrongBlackMan]

53. Imagine if folks actually acknowledged that ...

President Obama has been saying the same thing (albeit with slightly different words) for his entire Presidency?

Cut inefficient and unfair tax breaks.
Cut tax breaks that are inefficient, unfair, or both so that the American people and businesses spend less time and less money each year filing taxes and cannot avoid their responsibility by gaming the system.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/economy/reform/tax-reform

[ChosenUnWisely]

63. Bernie "Puts it where the goats can get it" Pres Obama not so much

See the difference?

[1StrongBlackMan]

65. Yes ...

Bernie's speeches are better than President Obama's, even though they're saying the same thing.

[lark]

68. Not even close

Bernie is pushing back against the TPP every bit as much as Obama is pushing for this corporate boondoogle.

Bernie is consistent, Obama isn't.

[billhicks76]

45. I Thought Companies Were People

[Initech]

4. If we taxed churches and billionaires' profits at 50% or more...

We could pay off the deficit in like 10 years. The free ride is over. Go Bernie, make 'em pay!

[Populist_Prole]

11. +1000

You nailed it solid.

[hifiguy]

14. BRAVO!!!

This times a googolplex.

[calimary]

17. Or - let's hijack that slogan from The Lorena Bobbitt of hog tenders!

Let's make THESE human "hogs" squeal!!!

[Indydem]

31. Truly dellusional.

Try some math.

Current Debt is 18.1 Trillion dollars.

So, to pay off the debt in 10 years, you would have to collect 1.81 trillion dollars in taxes each year.

At 50% tax rate, that would require the "churches" and the billionaires to make 3.62 Trillion dollars a year.

Thats the entire federal budget.

So you think that the churches (which no politician will ever agree to tax - ever) and half the profits from billionaires is going to raise as much capital as the entire rest of the federal government?

[quakerboy]

35. Lets do the math

the budget of the government is irrelevant to the math, so im not sure why you brought it up.

As best I can determine, the total income of people in the US is 13 trillion per year.
http://www.google.com/publicdata/explore?ds=a7jenngfc4um7_#!ctype=l&strail=false&bcs=d&nselm=h&met_y=personal_income&scale_y=lin&ind_y=false&rdim=country&idim=country:US&ifdim=country&hl=en_US&dl=en_US&ind=false

And the top 10% received over 45% of the total income.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/101025377

So that would be nearly 6 trillion per year. If we were to tax them at the proposed 50%, that would be.. 3 trillion per year. So your 18.1 trillion would take 6 years to pay off.

The mind boggles at what we could do with the other 4 years worth. For 12 trillion, you can build some pretty major infrastructure, forgive a whole lot of student loans. The possibilities are pretty extensive. And then.. its not like they would suddenly stop having income. Although they might stop stripping businesses and start building instead, so the numbers might drop a bit. Although it would mean more income for everyone else, and a wider tax base over time.

[Initech]

37. That 10 years part was a joke, maybe 20 years at minimum.

But think about this:

- Religious institutions and mega churches make billions every year. They pay no taxes.

- Religious institutions own businesses that pay no taxes.

- Publicly traded corporations stack trillions in overseas bank accounts and pay no taxes.

- CEOs make 475:1 what the average employee makes and pay no taxes.

We could collect taxes on all of these and pay down the deficit. If we're going to get serious about paying off debt, we need to bring in revenue. That's how it works.

[Indydem]

51. Are we talking about profits, or incomes?

Because religious institutions don't profit that much - they have plenty of expenses.

Same with religious owned institutions.

Trillions in overseas accounts? Really? Amazing. I'd love to hear more about these magical trillions.

CEO's pay taxes. They may not be at the rate you desire, but most pay taxes. If you don't like the tax code, elect a president and congress to tackle it. Oh wait, we did and they did jack.

[SomeGuyInEagan]

54. Remember back before Bush Jr., when Greenspan warned of paying off the debt TOO FAST?

All warm and fuzzy for some parts of the old days ...

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/07/07/992184/-Greenspan-in-2001-We-re-paying-down-the-debt-too-fast-VIDEO

[BeanMusical]

6. Kick and R.

[aspirant]

7. Go President Bernie

It's time the 1% gives back involuntary contributions to the IRS.

[whereisjustice]

8. the 1% consume most of the nations resources, why shouldn't they pay the highest tax rates? eom

[navarth]

23. this!!!!!!!

[Enthusiast]

47. A progressive tax structure would constitute the politics of envy.

I kid.

[rhett o rick]

9. Thank goodness for Sen Sanders. nm

[Omaha Steve]

10. Go Bernie

K & R!

[Major Nikon]

12. The reason is because people no longer hold their elected representatives accountable

When people found out that Nixon and Agnew paid almost no taxes despite having million in income, even Republicans got pissed off enough to demand changes to the tax code.

[Populist_Prole]

13. Great post. Loved the comic too

Points the irony out with rapier-like wit.

[ChazInAz]

15. I'm no mathematician.

But given that there are about 300,000,000 people in this country, if Verizon's rebate had been divided equally to every citizen (All of us having done just as much as Verizon to earn it!), every one of us would have gotten a check for about $2,000,000. We could have really made the economy soar with sort of spending power.
But then, I'm just a cranky old socialist who's tired of all this bullshit.

[FrodosPet]

19. You are correct!

You are not a mathematician.

$732 million divided by 300 million = $2.44

$2 million per person would be $600 TRILLION. And I disagree that giving everyone $2 million would make the economy soar. Unless you consider mega inflation as economic soaring.

"Hey, everyone has $2 million!" "Hey, Subway is selling $500 footlongs!"

[freshwest]

30. Are you trying to tell people who aren't good at math that the lottery isn't a retirement plan?

Not that I play. Since I know I absolutely suck at math, but not at logic...

[Indydem]

33. Not only that - but thats a refund over 5 years.

How would you spend your $.49?

[ND-Dem]

40. but giving big corporations the same money makes the economy soar and doesn't cause inflation?

why's that?

[MaggieD]

20. The rebate was $720 million

So that's about $2.33 per person. But I take your point. My small business paid hundreds of thousands in taxes. Tired of these greedy corporations paying nothing.

(I was doing math in my head. $2.44 is correct).

[ChazInAz]

55. Thanks.

There are times the "Do Math" part of my brain refuses to function. Low caffeine levels are often involved.

[Lurker Deluxe]

56. Guess we have a different view of "small business"

I'll be generous and say you make a 20% profit on everything you do.

I'll assume you pay an effective tax rate of 40%, again pretty generous.

To get to "hundreds of thousands in taxes" you would need to be pulling in several million in revenue. I would not consider that "small business".

[MaggieD]

58. Guess you know nothing about owning a business

Look, I have never voted for a republican in my life. But that doesn't mean I don't recognize the know it all attitude that some Democratic voters express about business when they actually have zero experience owning a business.

I am NOT pulling in several million a year. In fact not even pulling in ONE million a year. You have no clue how many different taxes small businesses pay. None.

As soon as you are ready and willing to give almost half of what you make to the government (as you work 50-60 hours a week for decades on end, with no real vacation because a business owner is ALWAYS on call) then let me know.

In the meantime I would like to see multi-billion dollar corporations pay some fricking taxes.

[Lurker Deluxe]

62. Actually

I have owned several.

Last one was a welding/machine shop.

I know all about the taxes a small business pays. I also know that to pay "several hundred thousand" in taxes you would need to be doing well over the million mark in revenue. That is revenue, not profit. You pay taxes on profit. Sure you have all sorts of things that cost you money, even taxes that individuals would not pay ... these all all expenses that are tax deductible, lowering your income taxes.

So tell me, since I know nothing. You incorporated and filing SubS, or just running as a DBA? Just throw out some general numbers that show me how you get to $300,000+ in taxes doing under a mil in revenue. I think you need a CPA.

[Lurker Deluxe]

64. Just to look at your profile

Either you have no idea the difference between revenue and profit, or you're lying.

You say in a different post, "It made me nervous as hell to have 20 plus people depending on me to pay their paychecks every 2 weeks"

Then, "good jobs. 2.5 to 3 times WA state minimum wage".

WA state min wage = $9.47. 2.5X$9.47=$23.67. 2080 hours in a year = $49,244 X 20 employees = $984,880. Damn near a million in payroll not even including matches on SS, insurance, and "29 days PTO. 100% employer paid health, dental, vision, life insurance, plus quarterly bonuses".

You've busted the million in costs just in basic payroll, so I damn sure hope you are pulling in several million in revenue otherwise you are crazy broke.

But then again, "I only expanded to a new business because I thought people are hurting".
So, I am assuming you have that kind of cash laying around to cover all these costs for the first few months ... or was your business profitable from day one?

[MaggieD]

66. Okay - since you're so smart

Give me a list of all the different taxes I pay at the specific percentages. Don't miss any now. Also list all the government fees. Keep in mind that I run a service business and 90% of my costs are labor.

When you're done with that give me a list of all the tax breaks I can take advantage of. If you can come up with one I'll fire my CPA and hire you.

I don't believe you've ever owned an actual business that employs anyone except yourself. You can call being self employed a "business" I guess, but you really don't seem to understand what running a real business costs.

The problem many Democratic voters have is that they want workers treated well, but hate the small businesses that bust their ass to do that. You think we should sacrifice our lives working our tails off and give 90% of the revenue to workers and half the profit to the government.

WE DONT NEED TO RAISE TAXES. We need to make multi billion dollar companies pay some.

[Adam051188]

18. Answer:

Huge companies should pay zero federal income taxes because they control everything the government does. That's how democracy works.

[stillwaiting]

21. Not only pay zero; they get refunds/subsidies from taxpayers.

Working class taxpayers are funding ridiculously wealthy corporations that give nothing back in return.

We are so past what would be fair by any stretch of the imagination (unless you're a 1%'er, a sociopath, or both).

[ND-Dem]

39. +100. little known to the general public, i think. why isn't it more widely known? why doesn't

our party publicize this fact?

oh, yeah...don't bite the hand...etc.

[cui bono]

42. +1

[Triana]

22. RELATED: How US Companies Stash Billions Overseas—Tax-Free

Once again, the Obama administration has set its sights on American companies that stash untaxed revenue abroad. Its 2016 budget, unveiled earlier this week, proposes to stick a one-time "transition toll charge" of 14 percent on the more than $2 trillion in corporate earnings parked overseas, regardless of whether they're brought back stateside. The estimated $280 billion in tax revenue would be earmarked for upgrading highways and infrastructure.

The proposed one-time tax is aimed at just one of the various loopholes and maneuvers that domestic businesses use to offshore their profits, beyond the reach of Internal Revenue Service. The best known trick is so-called tax inversions: US companies can move their headquarters abroad, avoiding the taxman while keeping executives stateside, scoring government contracts, and taking full advantage of public benefits for employees. Walgreens, which makes a quarter of its money from Medicaid and Medicare, proposed moving to Switzerland last year, only to change plans following a public outcry.

. . .

FOREIGN AFFAIRS

Inversions aren't the only way to dodge the taxman. Foreign profits aren't taxed until they are "repatriated," so companies can hoard earnings in subsidiaries or divisions abroad. (Ireland just shut down the "double Irish" offshoring trick used by Apple, Google, Twitter, and Facebook.) Between 2008 and 2013, American firms held more than $2.1 trillion in profits overseas—that's as much as $500 billion in unpaid taxes.

Accumulated offshore profits at end of 2013:

General Electric: $110 billion
Microsoft: $76.4 billion
Pfizer: $69 billion

. . .

THE REST:

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2015/02/foreign-overseas-tax-inversion-evasion-obama

[Ramses]

24. Sanders for President

Imagine a politician actually standing up for Democratic principles is a sea of sell out frauds. And that he would be considered a moderate in many European countries speaks loudly how far right the 1% have bought off and shoved this country

[RoccoR5955]

25. We need

99 more Bernies!

[AtomicKitten]

27. Bernie the truth-teller.

Excellent post, k&r.

[red dog 1]

28. Bernie For President!

(Running as a Democrat of course)

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2013/sep/26/bernie-s/sanders-one-out-four-corporations-pay-no-taxes/


Bernie is on the Thom Hartmann Show one hour every week,
in a segment called called "Brunch Wth Bernie"

http://www.thomhartmann.com/

[red dog 1]

29. K&R...Thanks for posting, Triana

How about a Sanders/ Warren ticket in 2016?

[demigoddess]

34. K&R

[JDPriestly]

36. K&R.

[ND-Dem]

38. k&r

[Populist_Prole]

44. Keep the pressure up Bernie: You rock

The narrative, the baseline, the "conventional wisdom" has shifted steadily rightward when it comes to matters of economics. I don't like it, not one bit. Social issue bullshit doesn't even come close to assuaging the gutting of the working class.

Senator Sanders is a national treasure.

[Enthusiast]

46. K&R! This post deserves hundreds of recommendations!

I agree, Bernie. But President Obama has repeatedly stated that American corporations have the highest tax rate in the world. He has made it clear that he is no fan of making corporations pay their fair share.

[blkmusclmachine]

48. "The banks own the place."

[Chemisse]

49. Someone who dares to state the obvious

Too bad everybody is already paid off by these tax evaders.

[antigop]

50. Thank you, Bernie. nt

[Overseas]

52. K&R. Thank you Bernie!

[CaliforniaPeggy]

57. A big, fat K&R!

[vkkv]

67. Sanders / Warren 2016 !

Run Bernie run!