Whenever the President speaks the historical truths, Christians understand, Evangelicals

[mfcorey1]

are offended, and the media makes a big deal of it. JUST COLLECTING MY THOUGHTS!

[MohRokTah]

1. Best quote for this.

Using the Crusades to remind ppl not to discriminate b/c all religions are flawed is Christian. Being mad at history is Christian Supremacy. -- John Fugelsang

https://twitter.com/JohnFugelsang/status/563737459406536706

[ChosenUnWisely]

2. Evangelicals ARE Christians and Christians ARE Evangelicals

Can't separate the 2 groups when they are part of the whole.

If one is Christian Own it, they are YOU and represent YOU and Your Religion.

[JHB]

3. Tell that to evangelicals who blurt out "Catholics aren't Christians"

[still_one]

5. Or the Catholics who persecuted the Jews during the inquisition, etc. etc. etc.

[ChosenUnWisely]

11. I don't care what they think of Catholics, they are Christians too

just like they are.

If it were up to me I would put all Christians in a room and you can fight it out to determine who is the real Christian.

So until Christians get their act together Evangelicals and Christians are joined at the hip.

As a courtesy to those of us who can't tell you all apart, perhaps some form of distinctive wear would be appropriate otherwise the so called good Christians will get painted with a broad brush.

[JHB]

13. Funny, I'm not a Christian and can tell them apart

I also don't make really bad assumptions based on too little information. Or at least try not to.

I recommend it highly.

[ChosenUnWisely]

15. How can you tell them apart, I can't they share many similer views for example the Pope

who many say is a Good Christians shares the same views on gay marriage as Rick Warren who many say is a bad Christian.

On hatred of gays they both agree.

[jwirr]

26. Maybe a yellow star?

[ChosenUnWisely]

39. If you like

[jwirr]

48. That says more about you than it says about anyone else.

[ChosenUnWisely]

52. Funny yet you are the one who brought it up in the first place

[brewens]

51. Don't leave the Mormons out. Now there's one where you know Christians think they

are just a cult. They have to keep their mouths shut about it where politics is concerned though. I don't see much difference. There probably wasn't much other than Joseph Smith is a well documented historical figure.

[noel711]

6. How do you define "evangelical"?

That's like saying all women are feminist.

The term 'evangelical' is ancient and literally means, from the Greek: spreading good news.
The concept 'good news' is always broad: to the middle eastern ancients, the 'good news' was 'Caesar is Lord.'
but I digress..

The recent appropriation of the word 'evangelical' as a proper noun: Eeevangelical
is a political statement driven by a fundamentalist, conservative social doctrine.

Not every Christian is part of that political group.
It's a label for a particular, very narrow, religious interpretation.

You can't ask a broad group (Christians) to take responsibility for a small group for which
it has little to no influence.

Is every Jew a Zionist? Is every Moslem ISIS?

[ChosenUnWisely]

14. So you are comparing Fellow Christians who are Evangelical to ISIS who's members happen to be

Muslim but the President has called a group of thugs.

I am am down with a comparison of the 2 groups, they are both very similar, but the Christian thugs have political and legal protection in the USA, however the USA has only provided arms and training to ISIS.

[noel711]

19. I'm simply asking for clarification...

when you paint with broadstrokes, you need to clarify.

Not all muslims are radicalized bombers; not all Christians are fundamentalist thugs.
But that's how your words paint them.

And if you believe that, I believe you need to get out more. Just sayin'..

[ChosenUnWisely]

20. Well if ya all don't want the broad brush as you say, then you and your fellow travelers need

to do something about the so called bad ones.

The Christians have hundreds if not thousands of sects because ya all can’t even agree on how each group wants to do things and who is the real Christian.

As I see things, ya all are same and share the in the same delusion, ya all have rightly earned the broad brush and until ya all get your shit together and actually follow your book, well that maybe something ya have to work out too because there are hundreds perhaps even thousands by now, versions of the Bible, with each Christian Group arguing which book is the true book.

If ya all don't want the broad brush as you say, then you and your fellow travelers need do something about it. Which will be tough because the Pope is on the front lines right now spreading his message of hating on the worlds LBGT community in the name of the Christian God.

If I belonged to a formally organized group that had members who were making the group look bad, I would do something about those who were making the group look bad otherwise everyone will think all members of the group are bad. But that is just me and I am not a member of the Christian or any other religious group either. I have solutions to solve the problem but I am sure the Christians would not like my solutions. So I would suggest that the Christians solve the problem before enough people finally get fed up the nonsense and implement an effective and permanent solution that will solve the problem once and for all.

The Christians created the problem themselves and they need to own the problem and fix it or get the brush.

Your choice.

[quaker bill]

21. A tired old argument

spoken as if there was a process or authority "to do something".

There is no threat of anyone doing anything like "an effective and permanent solution" within or outside the faith.

The form of fundamentalist faith you likely find most objectionable absolutely thrives on oppression. When it is not oppressed, it invents stories of oppression to strengthen itself. It you want it to end, the only approach is to ignore it and treat it as not relevant.

Getting wrapped around the axle over what the Pope or some other preacher says about anything is the wrong approach. The correct approach is laughter.

[ChosenUnWisely]

22. So you choose the brush, fine by me

[quaker bill]

24. There was no choice

For there to be a "choice", two viable options must exist. You are the one choosing as you have the viable options.

I can't keep them from calling themselves Christian. I cannot prevent you from finding their actions relevant, and objecting.

[ChosenUnWisely]

31. Silence is consent

That is fine it is your choice.

[quaker bill]

33. Quakers are not silent (except in worship)

and we have been beaten, imprisoned, and hung for it back in the day. Today we generally avoid the hangings, but some still choose to go to prison.

350 years and the Puritans are still Puritans, they just choose different names for it.

[ChosenUnWisely]

34. Wait let me guess it was your fellow Christians who did that to you too!

I highly doubt the Atheists, Muslims, and those of the Jewish Faith were running around America abusing Quakers.

Or was it some other group?

[quaker bill]

40. We came here to escape the anglicans

and moved to what became Pennsylvania to escape the Puritans. This is where we wrote the first "freedom of religion" clauses that eventually became part of the US Constitution.

Imagine this, Christians wrote freedom of religion into law.....

[ChosenUnWisely]

42. Puritians, Quakers, Anglicans are all Christians so you were abused by your fellow Christians

Their Christian charity was so Christ like they even gave you your own state

Sure you have a freedom of religion as I have a freedom FROM religion and the only way to meet that lofty goal it to keep ALL religion out of secular law, keep all religion on PRIVATE property, period.

[quaker bill]

46. A bonus round question

Which groups of Christians collaborated to form the ACLU?

Extra credit....

Why did they do so?





.
.
.
.
.
(Quakers and Methodists)

.
.
.

(because their members and preachers were being imprisoned by the secular US government for speaking out against war under the Alien and Sedition act...)

[MFrohike]

30. This is wisdom

Invented stories of oppression exactly describes the whining over being prohibited from legally discriminating against minorities they don't favor.

[ChosenUnWisely]

36. Even tho I do not agree with Christians, the Quakers were abused by other Christians

Factoid Nixon was a Quaker and pretty much a Dick too, which is strange because most Quakers are not that way.

I will admit Quakers are not really an in your face bunch, they pretty much quietly go about their religious lives so in general I do not have a beef with the Quakers however they are part of the large Christian whole and as such they have a duty to do something about the bad ones else they get the broad brush.

[quaker bill]

44. Nixon's Meeting tried to write him out

but since all thing are only done in unity, they never got there.

Where is this place that you imagine exists where something could be done about the "bad ones"?

Folks who study religion call us at most "quasi-Christian". Many do not call us Christian at all. Everyone is welcome and there is no creedal test.

[quaker bill]

37. Exacty

there is no oppression. Same gender marriage is no threat to my mixed gender marriage, and never will be.

Oppression stories drive attendance higher and raise more contributions. They will always be a popular stop in the annual cycle. Preachers are judged by attendance counts and contribution totals.

It is just like how there are annual food drives around the holidays. People are hungry all year, but the annual cycle stops here around thanksgiving.

[jwirr]

27. "Do something about the bad ones" - you mean like the religious wars that were fought in Europe

before most of our ancestors immigrated to America? That did not work out so well. We came to America because of those wars and when we became a nation we legislated the right to believe in our own faith. How do we allow for freedom of religion if I can go into someone else's church and tell them what to think? The way we have handled this from the beginning of this nation has been to stay out of any religious wars and try to live together in peace. The rw evangelical churches know that we do not agree with them but we do not have the right to do more than that. You would be happy to know that they do not consider us as Christians because we (liberals) do not share their views.

[ChosenUnWisely]

32. I am well aware of the religious wars started by the Christians

So because the so called good Christians are either too scared or unwilling to confront the so called bad Christians the bad Christians can continue to do what they want but the good ones will complain that they are not us.

So today you claim to be a good Christian but tomorrow it is convert or die, because that is the way ALL religions roll.

So until all the Christians get their shit together ya all are getting the broad brush I refuse to attempt to figure out who is good and who is bad, your own bible tell ya it is OK to lie and kill those who are not part of your or refuse to convert.

This country had to be divvied up by Christian Sect at the state level because the CHRISTIANS could not get along with each other.

The Christian brought their hateful nonsense from Europe to America and it still continue today.

The religious have NO interest in peaceful coexistence with anyone except themselves based upon their religious rules. This is a proven historical fact.

[quaker bill]

35. Once again

you argue as if there is a venue where the "good" could confront the "bad". It is an interesting fantasy, but no such place exists. It is no more available to the "good Christians" than it is for the "good non-Christians".

Nobody can get there from here.

Attempts to correct them, regardless of who does it, is interpreted as "oppression". They live to be "oppressed for righteousness sake" as that is an almost holy state, "oppression" to them is proof that they are on the correct path. The greater the oppression, the greater the glory....

So go for it and the debate will outlive you.

The far better choice is to not feed the Dysfunctional psychology, love who you love, marry who you want, and move on with life.

[ChosenUnWisely]

38. When good men do nothing, evil triumphs.

[quaker bill]

45. Where would one do something?

we have been marrying same gender couples for 30 years. We led woman's suffrage, went on the freedom rides, were most of the stops on the "underground railroad", a black gay Quaker arranged most of MLK's events, created the first co-educational and integrated schools in this country....

[ChosenUnWisely]

56. Start confonting those who christians who are causing the problems

else ya all get the brush

Otherwise this the current face of Christianity:




and this



and this



and this

[jwirr]

47. So you want us to do something about the other bad Christians and at the same time get along?

Make up your mind.

[ChosenUnWisely]

55. I could careless if you do or do not get along with your fellow christians

that is your problem.

The issues from my POV a large majority of Christians are using their religion to spread their hate and deny others the same rights they enjoy. Christians in America have been using their religion like a club even before this country was a country, religion is why they burned women, religion is why they justified slavery, religion is why they denied rights to African Americans today is just bigotry, religion is why they deny rights to LBGT people, Christians even uses their status as the majority to deny rights to other religions.

So until the Christians stop acting basically like arseholes all get the big old broad brush from me.

Course all the so called good Christians could do something about the so called bad ones if ya all is tired of getting painted with the broad brush.

[Fla Dem]

50. Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn what you think or what you would do.

Your best bet is to just avoid all people, for who knows what organized group they may belong to, but "ya all" have a nice day now.

[ChosenUnWisely]

53. Yes you do give a damn because otherwise you would not have wasted you time to post to

a complete stranger on the internet who did not know or even care about your existence on the planet.

Enjoy not giving a damn!

[cherokeeprogressive]

7. In my scant 53 years, it has become painfully evident that the broadest brushes are wielded by the

narrowest minds.

This post reinforces that in spades.

[mfcorey1]

9. Insults in a post add little to the discussion. It makes one question who really has the narrow

mind.

[ChosenUnWisely]

12. Sorry you feel that way

but they have defined themselves

[mfcorey1]

8. A MATTER OF OPINION. Evangelicals are fanatics and true Christians

live a life of compassion and love for others. I have to separate the two. If it suits you to define them as you have, so be it. To each his own.

[BubbaFett]

16. No true Scotsman

[Bradical79]

17. Catholics arent true Christians either from your definition.

Assuming we are judging everyone here by the actions of the leadership and public face. The reality though is they certainly are Christians. Many just happen to take much more of the bible seriously at face value leading to some pretty serious mental gymnastics and warped ideas to make it all fit together. I don't see how taking select quotes from Jesus and throwing out/theorizing away the rest makes you more of a Christian. It makes you a more easy to live with Christian, and certainly makes the modern world easier to deal with, but it's a convenient self deception in the no true Scotsman vein rather than any kind of theological truth.

[Cha]

43. I hear ya, mfcorey.. I think you are right on.. and I'm speaking as

someone who does not subscribe to theism of any kind.

But, my sister is a Christian and she is one of the compassionate, loving kind. I'm sure there's many many more, and they are nothing like the hate squad that uses religion as a cover for evil.

[hedgehog]

23. By your standard, IS represents Islam.

[jwirr]

25. Have you ever heard of denominations? They originated in order to separate religious cults from

mainstream churches. And it is still happening. I am a Christian but I AM NOT an evangelical. The rw has redefined the word evangelical to fit their interpretation. We are NOT one.

[ChosenUnWisely]

41. How do we know? Do you wear a tag that clearly states that you are not a

lunatic Christian?

[jwirr]

49. I wear NO tag - that is their thing. Flags on their lapels, baby shoes on their necklace, etc. My

faith is personal - I do not have to advertise it but I do defend it from the likes of you.

Now I am done with you. You have a closed mind very much like the rwers. You do not want truth but what you want is your way. Have it.

[ChosenUnWisely]

54. I have a big open mind much bigger than most in fact so big I do not have to live my life in fear

of being punished for all eternity by an invisible sky being for being naughty according to an ancient and heavily modified an edited book of rules .

[still_one]

4. Hell, what about the inquisition? We don't have to go back that far either, how about the KKK who

did their racism and anti-Jewish attacks in the "name of religion". How about invading a country based on a lie and killing over a million people. I remember some of our illustrious commanders telling their troops this was for "christianity"


As was said "In a few good men"

"They can't handle the truth"

[Bluenorthwest]

10. This is a difficult position to take considering the President has counted as

Christians such people as Rick Warren and Donnie McClurkin who are Evangelical evangelists. Obama called Rick Warren 'America's Minister' around the Inaugural, which took place just weeks after Warren in a TV interview equated LGBT people to pedophiles and our relationships to incest.

Warren two days ago:
"We have far more in common than what divides us,” said Pastor Warren in an interview with Catholic News Service. “When you talk about Pentecostals, charismatics, evangelicals, fundamentalists, Catholics, Methodist, Baptist, Presbyterian, on and on, they would all say we believe in the Trinity.”

Warren, along with leaders of other faiths and denominations, attended a conference at the Vatican in November – the “Complementarity of Man and Woman” -- to discuss and defend the family and marriage as being between one man and one woman, and related topics. He made his comments in the video in December.

At the conference, Warren re-emphasized that “marriage can only be between a man and a woman, explaining that marriage reflects Christ’s love for the church."
http://www.cnsnews.com/blog/michael-w-chapman/rick-warren-protestants-catholics-must-unite-defend-life-sex-marriage-we-re

[jwirr]

29. Yes, and Warren is an evangelical redefining religion. It is true that there are things that we all

agree on but they were decided hundreds and hundreds of years ago and are not the thing that separates us. What separates us are two things: actions - the way we treat our fellow human beings - and how we believe we are saved. This last is often spoken of as salvation through works vs salvation through faith alone. The good old boys that the poster above wants us to do something about is talking about the works salvation (obedience to strict rules - today often illustrated by hate theology) churches. They also got their marching orders years ago.

What needs to be done about them is that we need to mock them, quit electing them to government positions and ignore them. They are already losing their power through the ignorance they show in their views. As people begin to realize that they are being hurt by them I hope they will finally lose the power to hurt the rest of us.

[DearAbby]

18. These are the debates we should be having

instead of Swiftboatghazi, birth certificates and shit, thanks for the thread.

[Populist_Prole]

28. How about we refer to them as fundamentalists instead?

That's who we're really wanting to kick the asses of anyway: Far-right nutjobs wanting to install a theocracy.

Jerkweeds, the lot of 'em.