Remember "pink slime"? The 2012 scandal about feeding us ammonia-treated scraps?

[woo me with science]

You have to watch these corporate vultures like hawks.

After widespread public outrage and solemn public avowals by many grocery stores in 2012 not to sell pink slime ground beef to us anymore, "pink slime" is now quietly making a comeback.

True to corporate ethics of profit, the only guiding principle on decisions like this is to make widely-publicized speeches promising you won't do it anymore, but then quietly wait for public outrage to die down for a little while...before starting again.

A Review: Pink Slime = slaughterhouse scraps deemed unfit for human consumption in other countries, but here doused in ammonia to kill the e-coli and salmonella and then processed into a cheap paste....then sold as "finely textured" ground beef.





The US Department of Agriculture said its school lunch program would stop serving “pink slime” to students in response to the 2012 outcry.

However, in 2013, they slipped it back into many school lunches:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/09/10/pink-slime_n_3900851.html

And now it's coming back to grocery stores, too...although they decline to say which ones:

What You Need to Know About the Return of Pink Slime ("LFTB&quot
Morgan Korn, Yahoo
August 21, 2014
https://www.yahoo.com/health/what-you-need-to-know-about-the-return-of-pink-slime-95387880152.html

BPI announced this month that it would start making LFTB again at a factory in Kansas. The company sued ABC for $1.2 billion in 2012, claiming the network misled consumers over its “false and misleading and defamatory” reports; the suit is still pending.

Patty Lovera, assistant director at consumer advocacy group Food & Water Watch, says in the video above that “pink slime” was still part of the national food chain even after the panic in 2012. Cargill sells “finely textured beef” to nearly 400 retail, food-service, and food-processing customers, according to The Wall Street Journal. Cargill executive chairman Gregory Page told the newspaper that sales of finely textured beef have “rebounded sharply from their 2012 lows” and that Cargill’s sales “have risen about threefold from their lowest point.”
....
“The demand is not coming from consumers … consumers have not changed their mind [on pink slime],” adds Lovera. “It’s economics." ...Lovera... says “pink slime” is a “high-risk” meat byproduct that is more likely to be contaminated with harmful bacteria such as salmonella and E. coli. According to Lovera, meat processing companies treat the meat trimmings with ammonium hydroxide gas and citric acid to kill bacteria.
....
“The reason for the outrage was because people felt duped … there was no disclosure,” she notes. “Retailers, grocery stores and fast-food chains have a lot of thinking to do if they want to use it. [But the question is if consumers realize it’s back.”

Yahoo asked Cargill and the American Meat Institute to name the food retailers that are using the FTB and LFTB products. Both declined to answer.

Corporate ethics in a corporate state. "Both declined to answer."

[marmar]

1. Makes you want to scream.

[woo me with science]

12. I looked this up purely out of curiosity.

I was in a different grocery store than usual and noticed a display of huge tubes of ground beef. All of a sudden I remembered the "pink slime" scandal and how this long parade of grocery stores came out in 2012 and proudly announced that they wouldn't be selling the stuff anymore. Everybody was passing around the lists of "the good guys."

But it's been three years now. And we live in a corporate state where profit reigns supreme. So I wondered if those promises might have....expired.

Funny the associations you get, too. My thoughts immediately went to the scandal of unnecessary medical stents that we had in this area and several other cities a few years ago. Someone brought a lawsuit against some physicians or hospitals regarding the placement of expensive, invasive stents that were entirely medically unnecessary.

After the story of the lawsuit was published, rates of stent placement went down across the entire region...temporarily.

I stood there in the grocery store and thought, "I bet they're ramping it up again by now..." So I came home and did an internet search.

Sure enough...

[840high]

63. I want to vomit.

[Arugula Latte]

191. ^this^

[world wide wally]

2. Which food group does ammonia belong to?

[MohRokTah]

5. That will be in the "natural preservatives" listed on the label. eom

[dilby]

8. Not sure, how is it listed on cheese? n/t

[Spitfire of ATJ]

24. Not sure but I've been in a fight where I made someone eat some floor.

[workinclasszero]

113. Corporate Frankenfood group

Its those killer capitalists again.

[leftofcool]

3. You should read what they are putting in the dog food and treats

Think Purina.

[phylny]

35. I have been cooking food for my dogs for months now.

After having one premium dog food that was recalled, and another that my vet told us she had dogs on that food who were having urinary tract infections, I said "enough!"

I'm not doing raw, but once a month I cook their food and they get it, some pureed vegetables, a supplement, and some oil. Their breath is great, coats are thick and glossy, and their stools are reduced. I won't look back.

[Sunlei]

48. for dogfood, everything one can imagine that make it to the renderers cooker of 'meat & bonemeal'

that includes rotten grocery store foods (package & all), sweepings/gore from the slaughterhouse floor/blood from the pit tanks.

dead animals of all types, including dogs & cats.

[sabrina 1]

51. We have, after our dog who was just one year old, began losing her fur. We though she had mange,

all she did was scratch and the bald areas, her rear end and legs, her black fur turned brown, she looked a mangy stray no one cared about. We took her to the vet three times. First we thought she had mites, treated her for that, then for mange. We got medications, nothing worked.

Then one day a woman who is a dog groomer told me 'that looks like a food allergy'. She gave me the name of a food that she said, had none of the harmful ingredients of commercial food.

We began feeding it to her, along with home cooked food, and within a few weeks the itching stopped and her fur began to grow back.

Natural Balance combined with home cooked food, cured her completely.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

120. thank you....

I thought the food I was giving Shrimpy was a pretty good one. But if Natural Balance is specifically recommended, I'll try it.

Shrimpy's not having any problems, but I want to give her the best.

[sabrina 1]

124. We have cats also. Two of them, the older ones, had problems throwing up, and loose bowls, or

diarrhia. One of them lost one third of her weight, I took her to the vet, they tested her and said she had the beginning of kidney disease. They gave us some food supposed to be for cats with kidney problems. It caused to projectile vomit, so we stopped it immediately. Very expensive btw.

I put her on Natural Balance also, the small, stew cans. She can't digest hard food. I did a lot of research, wondering if I could feed her baby food, beef, chicken. And baby rice to give her something solid.

That was about a year ago. She has gained back three of the four pounds she lost, her fur looks great. She loves the baby food, and I mix the rice with her canned stew, or chicken soup when I make it. I also give them chicken livers, boiled in water.

All of our animals are now off commercial food completely.

I learned that it can cause kidney problems. We have eight, so I make chicken and chicken liver soup to save some money on the canned food.

The other older cat had stomach problems for years, with loose bowls and when I switched her off the regular commercial food, she finally had solid stools and I am assuming, felt a lot better.

Like you I was buying what I thought was a good brand also. And would never have connected my dog's problems to food if that groomer didn't tell me.

Vets don't seem to be aware of it as our vet never suggested it either. And they sell commercial food mostly.

I am glad your Shrimpy isn't having problems. Nat. Bal canned food isn't that expensive either, the hard food is a bit more expensive but if it's just one dog or cat, it's worth it, imo.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

125. thanks!!

Shrimpy's a Fussbudget. She only eats canned (soft) food. The only crunchy thing she'll chew are Jones Natural sticks. They're pricey too, but....it's good for her teeth
teeth.

[sabrina 1]

186. Lol, they can be very picky about their food.

[MrMickeysMom]

192. Mr. Mickey is now 18 and has kidney disease… but he gets his baby food, too...

We waste most of the "KD" from Science diet, as it's tasteless, and frankly, since he's this old, we give him non-commercial stuff, cause, like, who can live forever when you can be taken care of and loved till the end?

Loved hearing about this, but the pink slime is the awful news.

[LeftyMom]

196. Same thing happened with my cat.

She was eating off her own fur because her skin was so itchy. She went on steroids until we found a food she wasn't reacting to, and then we could take her back off of them.

She's also on Natural Balance, but can only eat the "Ultra" formulation. The Indoor and Limited Ingredient Diet versions trigger her symptoms.

[MohRokTah]

4. Bet they fight labeling it, too.

Can't have consumers knowing what's in the food they eat.

[BrotherIvan]

98. Uh oh, the Woo Warriors of DU will be very upset!

"People are too stupid and irrationally fearful to make decisions about what they eat, so food should not be labeled." --DU GMO Cheerleader/Shill

[BlancheSplanchnik]

121. someone here said that?

[BrotherIvan]

126. Ayup

[dilby]

6. I would have a problem if there was a scientific proven danger to the product.

But there is not, it's just people who don't like the idea they are consuming scraps. I personally prefer to eat every part of an animal that is edible including organ meats, if an animal died no part of it should be wasted. I have no issue with pink slime and I think it's great we are not wasting perfectly good meat that can feed people.

[MohRokTah]

7. Amonnium hydroxide as an anti-bacterial agent.

YUM!

[dilby]

9. It's used in making cheese all the time.

Also some cheeses produce it naturally like brie and stilton, it's why you get that wonderful whif of Ammonia when you unwrap some cheeses that were sealed in plastic and did not get the opportunity to breath to release the gasses they produce.

[Demit]

11. Didn't like Brie exactly for that reason.

I guess ammonia is an acquired taste.

[dilby]

15. You should go to a cheese shop

Where the cheese is stored properly and they wrap it in wax paper after you purchase it. It would truly change your mind on brie, there is a huge difference in getting a good piece of cheese that was allowed to breathe compared to the stuff you purchase in the super market where the cheese is tightly wrapped in plastic and left to sit in its own gasses.

[Demit]

17. I like it well enough. To be more specific,

it's the rind I could taste the ammonia in, mostly. I'm remembering from way back, in the 70s and early 80s, when people would put out a whole wheel at parties. The ammonia flavor stayed in the rind.

I love cheese! And blue cheese, I bond with people over blue cheese. I have a recipe for Stilton soup that's to die for.

[dilby]

33. Blue cheese has much higher levels of ammonia than brie

but brie is mostly in the rhine while the blue cheese is spread throughout the cheese. Stilton is very similar, I love it but have a hard time eating it when I get it from a store that had stored it for an extended period in plastic wrap. mostly it's the edges that taste very ammonia.

[Demit]

69. My father-in-law told a story from WWII...

He said his unit was walking thru a farmer's field in France at the end of the war, and the farmer was so grateful to the Americans that he dug up a prized cheese to give to them. I don't remember what kind it was, just my FIL's description of everyone's faces when the farmer scraped off the mold & whatever else was clinging to it so that he could proudly present it to the liberators.

[dilby]

85. Did they eat it?

I would probably have totally been down with eating some stinky French cheese with a nice wine. Unless the guy had a German accent then I might have questioned the safety of the cheese but may have still tried it.

[Demit]

89. Yes, as I recall. They knew they were being honored.

My FIL (as I recall) told the story as an illustration of how some food is aged & how it tastes good precisely b/c of that method.

Btw, I eat & love scrapple. so yeah, sometimes I'm totes fine staying in the dark about how something is made.

[Drahthaardogs]

103. Mold, yeasts, and bacteria have been manipulated for centuries to produce wonderful food

Try talagio cheese if you kind of like brie. It is the italian counterpoint to brie and is just amazing. I make my own wine and salumi and understand all about these things. A good salami will have an ammonia smell to it to some degree. It goes away when the curing is complete. The shit you buy in the store is all fast fermented with dextrose and is nothing like a real slow dry cured sausage from france, italy, or spain.

[Demit]

109. Best steak I ever had was aged, from a steakhouse in NYC

where you could see them hanging up in a room, all kinda green.

Talagio cheese, huh. I'll remember that. Only cheese I tried & just couldn't do was Limburger. I like a lot of weird things but just couldn't do that.

[Drahthaardogs]

142. I mispelled it. It is Taleggio

but it is so good. Even the owner from the New England Cheesemaking Supply admits it is one of it not her top favorite. Best soft cheese ever!

[BumRushDaShow]

106. "Btw, I eat & love scrapple."

Just cooked up a package of Habbersett scrapple tonight.

[Demit]

107. High heat so it gets crispy on the outside, mushy inside?

Also, ketchup, right? Not syrup, I hope!

[BumRushDaShow]

108. I hate to admit

that I have been cooking it in the oven @ 425 for about an hour to get it crispy on the outside (and it does stay soft on the inside). But I grew up with it cooked up in a cast iron frying pan with some Crisco. lol

I am a ketchup person! Ketchup goes on everything. Although I have slowly started trying sriracha on stuff. Gives it that extra kick!

[bhikkhu]

122. Ketchup contains ammonia

...not to endorse pink slime in any way but ammonia isn't something to be overly afraid of: http://grist.org/list/ten-foods-with-more-ammonia-than-pink-slime/

I'll still avoid pink slime like the plague, being more fond of veggies myself.

[merrily]

131. Then, ammonia should be listed on the catsup label, preferably in plain English.

Disclosure does not solve all problems, even though Washington often wants us to believe it does.

However, for someone like me, who does investigate the ingredients of every food item I purchase, even if stated in daunting gobbledygook, disclosure sure helps some.

[BumRushDaShow]

138. "Ammonia" is a gas that dissipates.

Aqueous ammonia is almost as volatile (as the gas evaporates), and like aqueous chlorine (or hypochlorite like Chlorox) or acetic acid (vinegar), it rapidly loses strength over time.

The bigger issue with this slime is with pathogens and whether this type of product produced from this ridiculous processing should qualify as "beef" and sold to look as if it is lean ground beef. To me, it's like taking corn cobs with fragments of corn left, drying them, pulverizing them, and then making "corn flakes" out of the powder and claiming the main ingredient of the flake is "corn".

And as a side note to indicate the difference here in the discussion, when it comes to products made from meat "scraps", "Scrapple" isn't claiming to be or is sold as ground pork!

[merrily]

140. Missing your point. Is it that no one should disclose that my food has been treated with ammonia?

No clue what scrapple has to do with catsup or ground beef, either.

[BumRushDaShow]

143. You missed the point because

you responded to someone who replied to my post about "ketchup" and "ammonia" when I Demit and I were discussing a particular product popularized by the Amish ("Scrapple&quot that is a Philly favorite. In a way, like this pink slime, it is made from "scraps" (but of pork).

But pragmatism requires that you decide whether the label suddenly becomes TMI (like the endless pages in the inserts of prescription drugs) and should now include every "process" that occurs during manufacture.

The "label" is supposed to represent an "ingredients" list, from highest to lowest concentration. It includes enough info as an attempt to be meaningful to an average consumer (serving size, calories, vitamins/minerals, etc) without crowding the packaging.

When it comes to "whole meat" products, there is a different threshold to labeling that is slowly being addressed (including the issue of CO2 treatment that would make meat look "fresh" and the use of other unsavory processing that may mask something else). But when it comes to "packaged" processed foods, the labeling could become a book if every chemical or additive used during the process is labeled.

Which is why many in the natural/whole foods community eschew any "pre-processed" packaged foods and "process" their own (canning, preserving, dehydrating, smoking, etc), like was done before WWII.

And as a note about "ammonia" in processing, anyone who uses advanced (although originally considered "old fashioned&quot baking techniques, has used "baker's ammonia" (ammonium carbonate) to get a "crispness" to chocolate wafer cookies. I expect that most of the processed "hard" cookies out on the market use this process. I actually tried baker's ammonia for the first time a couple years ago and you do get the ammonia gas release, but you also get a "crisp" cookie without the need to almost burn it in the oven.

[merrily]

145. Um, you posted a reply to my Reply 131 to bhikkhu. So, I asked what point your reply

to my post was trying to make to me.

But pragmatism requires that you decide whether the label suddenly becomes TMI (like the endless pages in the inserts of prescription drugs) and should now include every "process" that occurs during manufacture.

As a general observation lot of crap and bs gets rationalized in the name of pragmatism. I check every item on a food label before purchasing.

[BumRushDaShow]

151. The point was "ketchup"

and "ammonia". And if there is little or no residual "ammonia" in a product (because "ammonia" is a gas that dissipates), then what is the point of declaring it when it isn't there or is undetectable?

When people dismiss "pragmatism", which relies on COMMON SENSE and the outcomes of that common sense, then they lose all credibility, IMHO.

I and tens of millions of people ALSO read labels. The difference is "tolerance" for what is done to make for "convenience" of buying and preparing a food, including shelf-life and what remains to be done by the consumer to make it ready for final consumption.

If you purport to have issues with "processing" and knowing every "process" that happens to "processed foods", then you are definitely a candidate to go au naturale, and end your relationship with processed foods. Many people agree with you and have done this. There are many initiatives out there to help people find local farmer's markets and local meat/fish monger shops that use minimal "processing". You also learn to "eat in season" and get accustomed to purchasing perishables daily as was done for millennia and is still done worldwide in most countries (including developed ones with large rural populations). And thanks to the internet, lots and lots of websites are available to show people how to do their own "processing" and know exactly what is in the foods they consume (assuming the raw ingredients were not treated with pesticides or antibiotics).

[merrily]

152. Dismissing claims of what pragmatism supposedly demands is not the same as dismissing pragmatism.

[BumRushDaShow]

158. Am afaid it is. nt

[merrily]

159. Then you just don't get it.

[BumRushDaShow]

163. I get it more than you think. nt

[merrily]

170. If you think your post 158 is a sensible reply to my post 152, you don't get it at all.nt

[BumRushDaShow]

172. Since you have ignored what others have posted, have the last word as it will be a non sequitur. nt

[Major Nikon]

185. Lot's of very old recipes call for hartshorn

Which is nothing more than ammonium carbonate. It's still available as a leavening agent for people who want to duplicate old family recipes. It's also used by some in modern recipes for the properties you describe or to eliminate the off-tastes associated with other leaveners like baking soda or baking powder. I'm also convinced it's still used in the commercial baking industry as well for those properties.

[BumRushDaShow]

137. As a chemist by education

I know that "ammonia" is a natural product in the environment. When you urinate, there it is. It (NH3) is a critical component in many reactions. Since the components are all gas, it's the aqueous form that people tend to think of as "ammonia" (NH4+OH-).

[brewens]

164. I find this cheese shop to be delightful.

[Major Nikon]

38. I suspect some people might not want to know where rennet and gelatin come from either

The picture in the OP isn't "pink slime". It's simply a picture someone dug up of who knows what and used it to produce an emotional response about the product. Most people don't know they've been duped. So-called "pink slime" looks like any other ground beef.

[jmowreader]

92. I used to think that picture was of hot dog batter

It's the wrong color to be hot dog batter, so that's out.

It's either chicken nugget batter or strawberry ice cream.

My position still stands: if we are going to ask an animal to give its all for our benefit, we have the obligation to use all of it.

[merrily]

139. I suspect it's more that vendors don't want them to know than it is consumers not wanting to know.

[Major Nikon]

146. The vast majority of consumers don't bother reading the labels that are already in place

All mass produced food is already required to have all sorts of nutritional information including ingredients, calories, carbohydrates, protein, vitamins, and nutrient content. There's even smart phone apps that make keeping track of everything that goes into your body ridiculously simple. Yet people still want to blame corporations for making them fat and unhealthy.

[merrily]

147. I check every item on a food label. If I am unfamiliar with a term, I google it.

If others don't bother to do anything like that, that is their choice, which they are entitled to make, just as I am entitled to know what I am paying for and ingesting. It's not my fellow consumers fighting to keep that info secret or hard to follow. So, I stand by my Reply 139.

[Major Nikon]

148. Which has very little to do with your previous assertion

Some want to know everything, but the vast majority are apathetic. If you care enough to google it, you can find out more than could ever fit on any label.

[merrily]

150. It had everything to do with replying to your assertion in Reply 146, as well as

having to do with my assertion in my Reply 139. Again, it's not my fellow consumers fighting against labeling and that did relate directly to my Reply 139. Sorry if you missed the nexus. I thought it was obvious.

[Major Nikon]

154. This was your assertion:

I suspect it's more that vendors don't want them to know than it is consumers not wanting to know.

My reply was that the vast majority of consumers could care less. You responded by saying something to the effect of you want to know more, which I'm sure is true, but is no less anecdotal and no more applicable to the average consumer.

[merrily]

168. No, you are mischaracterizing one part of my reply 147 and omitting the other part entirely.

[Major Nikon]

169. You stole my line!

[merrily]

171. Interesting. I didn't purport to be restating your posts

[BlueJazz]

37. Actually, I do believe it's the same as >>

[merrily]

141. OT, but I had Newman's own version of Oreos for the first time this week.

I thought they tasted better and fresher than other versions.

[BlueJazz]

155. I buy them at Publix super markets here in Fl. They're quite delicious.

[merrily]

157. .....

[denverbill]

16. Well companies should be able to hide ground pork in beef as well.

There's absolutely no scientific proof that it would be dangerous, and hey, I eat pork. So what if billions of people have religious objections. They have no right to know what they are eating. Beef/pork/whatever, it's all just amino acids anyway.

[dilby]

18. Except they are not hiding pork, its beef, that is being added to beef and listed as beef. n/t

[MynameisBlarney]

20. That sound you just heard...

was the point flying over your head at Mach 10.

[Major Nikon]

41. Mine as well

I'm not sure where any point came in. If manufactures include pork products in ground beef, then they are required by law to provide an ingredients list. So the poster made up an illegal hypothetical scenario to create a false equivalency of a legal product. Whatever point was in there seems to be lost among the logical fallacies.

[denverbill]

34. It's beef only under the loosest definition of beef. It's dog food in my household.

Scraps of contaminated beef that is heated, centrifuged, sprayed with ammonia, and frozen to try to destroy e coli and salmonella? That 'beef' used to be called 'salvage' and was always used...as dog food. If you want to eat it, by all means you should be able to buy a package. If I don't want it, I should have a right to know it's there.

[dilby]

36. It's beef, it's not pork or fish or chicken.

It's from the trimmings which was heated to remove all the fat then ground and exposed to ammonia gas, the product is perfectly safe and there is nothing wrong with it. Much better to use it to feed humans than dogs if you ask me.

[denverbill]

40. Well I say screw the Jews and Muslims. Pork is perfectly safe to eat too.

And it's cheaper than beef. I know better than them what's good for them. Mix in whatever the hell is cheap and 'safe' and call it ground beef. Lamb, shellfish, tofu, insects, whatever. Unless you can give me a sound, scientific basis not to add that stuff in as well, your opinion is useless. You're no different from an anti-vaxxer.

[dilby]

45. That makes zero sense.

They take pink slime and add it to beef products or products that already have beef listed in them. It's not like they are putting into sausages listed as pork to fool Hindus.

Seriously you are the same as an anti-vaxxer, you are not using science period other than you don't like it so you think there is something wrong with it.

[erronis]

72. Zero sense - the food processors will throw anything they can into the mess

I hope we aren't offending anybody's archaic ideas about what should be eaten (or otherwise interacted with), but the butcher shops, meat wholesalers, slaughterhouses, etc. really don't give a rat's (and yes, they're in there too) @ss about your sensitivities.

Profit is king. Customers are to be taken for a ride, given whatever they demand at a price point that they will pay.

Cripes, we even sell soybean products masquerading as pink slime masquerading as ham-burger.

I'd really hate to have real food allergies, let alone the manufactured religious ones.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

99. My religion says no ammonium hydroxide.

Why shouldn't I have the right to know about it?

Ironic that you are tolerant of goofy religious objections but then castigate the other poster for being anti-science.

[bhikkhu]

123. Cheese, onions, ketchup, peanut butter, potato chips...all sorts of things have ammonia

in lower concentrations than pink slime. I'm not in favor of pink slime at all, but I don't see a reason to avoid it for its ammonia content.

[dilby]

193. So your religion is against your own body because it produces ammonium hydroxide?

Sounds a little anti-science to me.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

194. My body produces poop too. That doesn't mean I want to eat it.

[woo me with science]

60. Yes, and considered unfit for human consumption

in other developed countries. But here in the US, decisions about what we eat are driven by a metastasizing corporate-government machine that increasingly makes decisions based on a profit motive alone.

This stuff wasn't even legal to sell for human consumption in the US until 2001.

So much changed in this nation after 2001.

Nutrition: America awakens to the sour taste of 'pink slime'
http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/food-and-drink/news/nutrition-america-awakens-to-the-sour-taste-of-pink-slime-7593484.html

Take a cow. Chop it into pieces. Sell the edible bits to supermarkets, ship its hide to a handbag factory, send leftover bones and organs to a rendering plant. Now, what's left? In most of the developed world, the answer is simple: pet food. The sinew, gristle and fat regarded as unfit for human consumption are taken away by Mr Pedigree Chum and turned into something the salmonella-resistant stomach of your average Labrador will find vaguely digestible.

But in America, they do food differently. Here, in the land of GM corn, 26 per cent obesity and a government which classifies pizza as a "vegetable", scientists have discovered a way to turn bacteria-ridden scraps from the abattoir floor into a substance called "pink slime", which is then sold to unwitting consumers of hamburgers, tacos and other beef-based junk products. The process involves sticking bovine off-cuts in a heated centrifuge, so they separate into a mixture of liquid fat and a putty-coloured paste. That substance is then treated with ammonium hydroxide (a chemical used in household cleaners and home-made bombs) to kill off salmonella and e-coli. Then it's mixed with regular beef and – hey presto! – you have "all natural" mince.

In 2001, it became legal to sell "pink slime" in America. Today, more than half the ground beef sold in America contains the stuff. The US Department of Agriculture (USDA), which supposedly regulates the food industry, does not require it to be mentioned on ingredient lists. Since its provenance is a cow, they insist, you can call it "beef". If you think that's a bit rum, you're not alone. For years, US foodies have earnestly cited "pink slime" as exhibit A in the list of liberties taken by a rapacious food industry.

Not for nothing, they argue, has the stuff been banned in Europe, where mechanically-separated meat from cows and sheep has been prohibited since the era of BSE.

[dilby]

67. Many of those devoped countries eat horse meat, you ready to join them?

Just because a country finds it unfit does not mean that it's actually bad or unsafe, it most likely comes down to social norms.

I personally have had horse meat and it's actually really good and I wonder why it never took off here in the US but it probably goes back to the whole western migration and cowboy situation.

[woo me with science]

71. Absurd attempt at comparison.

Dregs and scraps from the floor of a horse processing plant, gassed in ammonia to kill the e-coli and salmonella, and pureed into a cheap paste to be sold as horsemeat would be rejected by Europeans for human consumption, just as this "beef" is.

[dilby]

75. Going a little extreme to say treating with ammonia gas is the same as soaked in ammonia. n/t

[woo me with science]

77. Leaping to a quibble to avoid the dishonesty of your attempted comparison.

Yes, the dregs and scraps from the slaughterhouse floor are GASSED in ammonia to kill the bacteria, the e-coli and salmonella.

I wrote "soaked" in haste and have now changed it to "gassed." That does not change my point.

Now, let's return to the point:

Dregs and scraps from the floor of a horse processing plant, gassed in ammonia to kill the e-coli and salmonella, and pureed into a cheap paste to be sold as horsemeat, are not sold for human consumption in Europe.

[Pathwalker]

87. What about those of us who are allergic to pork?

Just another reason I don't eat beef either.

[denverbill]

90. I hope you realize my post was just to make a point, not to actually suggest adding pork to beef.

My point is that people have a right to know what is in their food. No corporate hack or bureaucrat should decide what kind of crap can be added to food and hidden from the public. If dilby wants to eat bacteria laden crap which has been washed in ammonia to attempt to sanitize it, it's fine by me. I just want the information. Tell me what you are feeding me. Don't hide the fact that you are serving me this shit and pretend it's just wholesome ground beef by not mentioning anywhere that it's contaminated beef rescued from the dog food bowl.

[Pathwalker]

94. I think my point helps prove your pint.

People are allergic to many food products and additives, some so much so that it's a matter of life or death for some. I agree that we need to know what is in the food, regardless of what the corporations want. Glad I don't eat beef.

[MynameisBlarney]

19. Fine

You go right on ahead and eat that shit then.

[A Simple Game]

29. Much ado about nothing, people ate it for years and didn't even know it. Nobody suffered. n/t

[dilby]

31. People who are anti pink slime are just like anti-vaxxers to me.

No scientific reasoning other than they did a google search and saw a picture.

[Major Nikon]

44. Not to mention the picture isn't even "pink slime"

[dilby]

47. Even if it was.

I would be fine with it, people should look at what bologna looks like when its being made.

[Major Nikon]

70. The whole thing is a first world argument

It pretends that commercially produced ground beef should only be made from known and accepted primal cuts (even though it never has been), so that people "know" what's in their food.

Meanwhile in the rest of the world and even in many parts of the US, people happily prepare and eat intestinal organs, brains, eyeballs, fish heads, and all sorts of other things deemed too icky for mainstream American consumers.

[tabasco]

110. This picture is! Yum!

[Major Nikon]

111. Have you ever seen primal cuts being butchered from an animal?

[tabasco]

176. I butcher animals every hunting season

I throw the garbage out in the woods for the coons and skunks. If you want to eat that shit, have at it.

HOPE IT HELPS!

[Major Nikon]

179. Then why the freak out over a bit of subcutaneous fat?

Sausages are like laws. It is better not to see them being made.

[NickB79]

177. This is how we butchered cows on the farm

This represents how we did it on ours:

On edit: I see you replied that you butcher deer ever year.

[woo me with science]

49. So predictable.

The defensive, pro-corporate postings *always* turn personal. It has become wholly predictable that pro-corporate posters shift to disparaging other DUers from the topic at hand.

It's a tactic,

(1) to divert from the actual content of the OP,
(2) to foment division, and
(3) to make discussions of corporate abuse at liberal sites ugly, personal and unpleasant.

It serves the same purpose as pepper spray at Occupy rallies, and it's become as predictable as the sunrise.

Done responding to this sort of posting...just wanted to point out the very familiar pattern.

[Cali_Democrat]

55. Defensive, pro-corporate postings?

Because someone said pink slime is no big deal?

And if they say pink slime is no big deal, they are pro-corporate posters?

Who is the one here fomenting division and making it personal by slinging these accusations directly at other DUers?

Looks to me like it's actually you.

[bbgrunt]

117. Someday we will all really prefer soylent green to pink slime

[ctsnowman]

174. X 1000

[A Simple Game]

54. They probably love sausages, bologna and other deli meats.

If pink slime bothers you then if you learn about how most meat is processed you will probably swear off all of it.

Hamburger for the most part has always been made from trimmings and scraps, same with stew meats. I have seen hamburger labeled sirloin or porterhouse and sold for a premium price. Why would anyone pay extra for sirloin hamburger? It's ground up meat made from scraps and it's all going to taste the same as ground chuck when you slather ketchup on it or put it in your spaghetti sauce. If by some remote chance it was actually made from meat that could be made into sirloin or porterhouse steaks I would bet it came from a downed cow or one so old the steaks would be inedible. The other chance is that it was steak with the use by date ready to expire so it was reprocessed in the store and the date extended.

Do most people know that the best beef has hung so long that it has formed a mold on the exterior of the meat?

I'm sure many go to restaurants and eat pieces of scrap meat glued together to form steaks and rave about how tender they are and why they can't duplicate that tenderness at home.

You are exactly right, people should educate themselves about what they are eating. Bring on the pink slime, I'll eat it, it's no worse than the rest of it.

[MynameisBlarney]

68. What a ridiculous analogy.

Anti-vaxxers are indeed ignorant and their refusal to vaccinate their kids is based on bogus "science" and they are causing actual harm.

People who are against the practice of having pink slime added to certain food products with deceptive, or zero labeling, because they don't want to fucking eat it is completely different than anti-vaxxers.

Your analogy is bad and you should feel bad.

[dilby]

74. What is deceptive about finely textured beef?

I have not seen instances where it's not labeled at all?

[Sunlei]

53. mad cow & prion diseases in general are a reason to not used a mixture like pink slime.--

Many other first world countries will not even buy USA beef if its near the age or grade where there is risk to their citizens of mad cow.

[dilby]

62. Can you explain how mad cow and prion disease is more dangerous in pink slime than lets say

a T-Bone steak?

[Sunlei]

78. because pink slime is made from 'scraps' from thousands of animals, hopefully beef.

Trust a pink slime corp, that every single scrap is beef?,

Trust a slaughterhouse that every single rotten scrap has been soaked enough in ammonia to kill off the bacteria from manure or decomisation

Trust a slaughterhouse or the pink slime corp that some of the 'meat scraps' didn't come off of diseased cattle?


There is a huge difference between the quality of cattle and meat from the cattle- between a T-bone steak and the cheapest chubs of grocery store/school lunch/prison food- 'ground beef'

[dilby]

81. Ground beef is made from thousands of animals.

And all beef has been rotting from the moment the animal dies and pink slime has not been rotting any longer than a t-bone. And if pink slime came off a diseased animal the same animal was used for the choice cuts of steak that were taken off it.

[Sunlei]

83. most american cheap ground beef comes from spent dairy cows. They don't have a enough meat for

a T-bone

[druidity33]

100. It wouldn't surprise me

if there was spinal column/ brain stem and even bovine brain matter in pink slime. Doesn't that make it more likely to transmit BSE? Because of how it's treated, it's difficult to tell upon inspection what its composition might be. As for the idea that all waste should be used... well, even the First Peoples fed their dogs.

[Sunlei]

181. I can't see a reason why not a typical usa slaughterhouse wouldn't add as much weight as possible

add as much weight as possible to their shipping containers of 'pink slime destined scraps'

In the USA, there's little to no inspections and even after processing who checks its even 'beef' in that pink slime.?

[NickB79]

178. Now that is a logical, scientifically based argument against finely textured beef

Thank you.

[Major Nikon]

182. Zero cases of vCJD have been attributed to eating US beef

There's only been 200 confirmed cases worldwide and almost all of those came from the UK.

Personally I worry a lot more about drowning in my bathtub. YMMV.

[TheKentuckian]

88. I have no issue with you being able to buy slime. I want it labeled and priced appropriately for you

This will allow you to be a crafty consumer and get meat you think is great at what I suspect will come at a lovely price point and folks wanting ground chuck or whatever get exactly that.

Now, I think it is kinda gross but if it is safe then I have no issue with those desiring to save money or making sure waste is minimized harvesting an animal for food but I want it declared openly and let people decide if they want it in their diet or not.

[truedelphi]

97. I agree, we really need scientific proof before we change our behaviours.

Mr Delphi and myself have been tossing babies out of our vehicles, for several decades now, as we race down the freeways of California, as no one yet can point to a peer reviewed paper on the dangers of doing this!

[xocet]

116. You should remember your point the next time you fish with worms. Make sure the bait is not wasted.

n/t

[merrily]

130. By any chance, do you know why they have to treat with ammonia?

Besides, if you don't care about labels for what you pay for and put into your mouth, you don't need to read the label before purchasing. I do care and I want to know.

[Major Nikon]

133. They don't have to treat it with ammonia

They can also use citric acid or other antimicrobials and some manufacturers do. The reason why they do it is because during the production processing the meat is heated which causes many strains of bacteria to reproduce faster, including pathogens like certain strains of e coli. Antimicrobials bring down any potential pathogens to safe levels. For the same reasons, the USDA recommends consuming cooked leftover meats within 3-4 days if not frozen.

[merrily]

135. They are the parts of the animal most contaminated by feces.

No matter how you slice it, no pun intended.

The reason why they do it is because during the production processing the meat is heated which causes many strains of bacteria to reproduce faster, including pathogens like certain strains of e coli.

In other words, they do need to treat it with ammonia.

If they could use something that sounds as innocuous as citric acid, they would.

Bottom line, though, I want disclosure.

[Major Nikon]

144. Kinda like fruits and vegetables, no?

Except fruits and vegetables actually have the feces dumped on top of them. Unlike LFTB, people actually do manage to die on a fairly consistent basis because of it, not that there's any real danger from organic vegetables.

In other words, they do need to treat it with ammonia.

If they could use something that sounds as innocuous as citric acid, they would.

Some manufacturers like Cargill do and it's approved by the USDA either way. Both methods accomplish the same thing and neither is unsafe.
http://www.cargill.com/news/company-statements/cargill-finely-textured-beef/index.jsp

Bottom line, though, I want disclosure.

If you want that you should petition your political representatives for changes to the food regulation code, but keep in mind you've never had it before. Beef labeled as "ground chuck" does not have to contain ground chuck. Butchers have been using scraps to make ground beef for as long as there has been ground beef.

[merrily]

149. You know that is not the same, right?

Beef labeled as "ground chuck" does not have to contain ground chuck.

If so, that seems right, honest and as it should be to you?

[Major Nikon]

153. True. Produce is not typically treated with antimicrobial agents

And beef is not deliberately treated with feces.

If so, that seems right, honest and as it should be to you?

Ground beef that has 20% fat content is labeled as ground chuck because recipes that go back 100 years or more say "ground chuck" instead of 'ground beef with 20% fat content by weight'. Long before there was any government labeling requirement, butchers figured out they could add scraps of lean and fatty meat to produce a product that was identical in texture, taste, nutrition, and performance. It's been that way for decades and nobody has complained, so I'd have to say yes, it is as right and honest as it should be. How many people go beyond those labels and actually figure out how those terms are defined? I reckon it's considerably less than those who actually bother to read labels in the first place.

If you really want more information, you should read this. It's a handy guide that I use all the time:
http://www.fsis.usda.gov/OPPDE/larc/Policies/Labeling_Policy_Book_082005_2.pdf

[merrily]

156. Mislabeling for decades is not my standard for what is good and right and as it should be.

I doubt if it's really yours, but that's up to you. It's my standard for having gotten away with consumer fraud for far too long.

Because consumers were unaware for decades that the "ground chuck" label was being put on meat that was not gound chuck at all doesn't mean it was right to mislead them and to continue so to do. Nor does it mean that it should continue.

If you really want more information, you should read this. It's a handy guide that I use all the time:
http://www.fsis.usda.gov/OPPDE/larc/Policies/Labeling_Policy_Book_082005_2.pdf

You use that all the time?

[Major Nikon]

162. Fortunately the standards are written by people who understand beef

Not everything is as cut and dried as you seem to think. Where one primal starts and another begins depends on where the individual butcher makes their cut. What is scrap or is left on the primal is also the prerogative of the butcher. Government labeling requirements are there to insure a consistent product from one butcher to the next so that the consumer is actually getting what they are paying for.

You use that all the time?

When I have a question as to what a label means, I go to the official source that defines it. If it's undefined, it can mean pretty much anything. If it's defined, it's required to mean what is specified.

[L0oniX]

10. What's next? Brown slime made from ammonia-treated human shit?

This is what happens when corporations own the country.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

25. They'll try to use that for fertilizer for the vegans.....

There is no escape.

[BubbaFett]

28. but human shit is 100% natural

so no problem.

[merrily]

136. Um no. Human feces is not ground beef, so you would still have quite a disclosure problem,

same as you do with pink slime and ammonia.

[BubbaFett]

167. sarcasm

[misterhighwasted]

76. Soylent Green. Secret Trade Deals. Who will be allowed to report the truth after TPP is signed?

All I gotta say about it.

[melman]

13. Go veg

and you won't have this problem.

[MynameisBlarney]

21. I think I am going to start

eating FAR less meat, that's for sure.

[Rex]

14. We have to let corporations control everything, it is in the Constitution somewhere.

That was the Founders original intent, for stock holders and CEOs to own everything in America. Yep.

[blkmusclmachine]

22. http://www.yourfaceisa.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/The-Stuff-video-poster.jpg

[cascadiance]

95. Anyone remember that old B Sci-Fi Flick "Green Slime" from their childhood?

I remember singing this song as a little kid then... Perhaps someone should do a cover of it with updated lyrics and new video sequence to highlight what will happen to us with the attack of the "Pink Slime" instead!

[project_bluebook]

23. They are just getting us ready

when they get rid of food stamps, SS, and 80% poverty becomes the norm then the slime will look damn good!

[2naSalit]

26. Pink Slime always reminds me of

Soylent Green!!



But seriously, I stopped eating meat unless it's elk of deer from one of my friends who hunt... but I shy away from that too because I can't get my mouth and stomach to enjoy or see any benefit anymore. Dairy products work just fine and don't require killing anything to get it. I avoid corporate food as much as possible and buy from small providers in my region. If someone invites me out to eat or is cooking and invites me over, I always ask what's on the menu.

Sad world we live in.

[Fred Sanders]

27. There is a recent thread bashing PETA, for the meat lovers to post on.

Seriously, a 69 cent hamburger actually has beef in it?

Pretend Meat for a Pretend nation.

[annabanana]

30. I don't think it ever went away.

I think they waited until the uproar died down then they started renaming and reclassifying and getting laws that would let them not disclose....

[libodem]

32. Imagine the private prisons

Feed this to prisoners. And nursing homes. Yuck.

[ChosenUnWisely]

56. I take it you have never been to prison, ya get lots of beans and pasta, meat maybe

[libodem]

96. You are right

It's just that it looked so gross I figured that's the type of place it went.

[young_at_heart]

39. If Thom Tillis gets his way, it will get worse

My disgusting senator doesn't care about restaurants requiring hand washing so I'm sure he won't care about pink slime!!

[Bradical79]

42. So what are the dangers and disadvantages

I mean, it looks and sounds gross, but so does most meat when you go into detail.

[Major Nikon]

50. This is what it really looks like

This is what it's made from:



This is what the finished product looks like:

[dilby]

59. The only danger I found was it has a higher chance for ecoli and salmonella.

due to the meat coming from the outer parts of the carcass. However treating the meat with ammonia (a lower amount of ammonia than found in cheese) and freezing it makes it perfectly safe to eat. During the entire time this product was out there, they never were able to attribute any type of ecoli or salmonella outbreak to the beef additive. So as far as science is concerned it's just as safe as eating the choicest cut of steak from your favorite grass fed, organic, all-natural, no antibody, free-range farm.

[Kali]

105. thanks for staying calm and factual for the most part

these threads always irritate me. on the one hand, I tend to avoid it other than at the occasional junk-food drive through, and it is pretty easy - stay away from processed "foods" or the cheapest hamburger. On the other hand I know it is perfectly safe and a fair use of meat that would otherwise be a waste product that allows for inexpensive food that many people enjoy.

Pretty sure it has always been labeled so I don't understand what the freak-out is. The biggest bummer of the whole controversy was they quit putting it in the cheap mixed-meat hot dogs and they went from acceptable to gross. Pork and poultry NEED that pink slime to get a decent texture in a hot dog. Now you have to buy all-beef dogs at the same price as a good steak -

I think it was all about the video/visualization. looking at food processing can be kind of off-putting. I bet if most people could see all the bugs and shit and gross dirt in ALL of their food they would up and choke. Food comes from the earth and nature, folks. It is messy, dirty, involves death and decay along with the idealistic growth nutrition and flavor.

[Major Nikon]

129. I suspect the people who are making half-fast exaggerations have never seen an animal butchered

All they see are the steaks and roasts in the butcher case without giving much thought about how it got there.

There's a lot of quality lean meat that comes off when primal cuts are trimmed which unless processed and turned into hamburger or sausage simply goes to waste. That waste simply insures that prices are higher and more cows need to be used.

As far as labeling goes, if it just says hamburger, it can certainly be a certain percentage of scrap, but this has always been the case. Beef labeled ground chuck doesn't have to come from chuck roast either. It just has to have a 20% fat content. The ONLY way to insure ground beef comes from any primal cut is to buy a roast and have your butcher grind it or do it yourself. This isn't anything new.

[dilby]

190. But it was done for years and never an issue happened.

Just because one guy thinks it's a problem does not make it so, there is that doctor who thinks vaccines cause autism yet the scientific evidence says otherwise.

[Pakid]

43. What I am tired of is that we elect people to Congress

who job is to protect the publics best interest and what do they do? Take the first pay off that come along and to hell with our right to know just what is in our food or our dog food etc. It is to hell with us and do what ever big money wants no matter what happens to us. That is what happens when big money get to buy it's own government thanks to citizen united and the GOP!!!!

[ColesCountyDem]

46. I no longer eat burger that I don't prepare.

The only good thing about having developed Type 2 diabetes is that I can politely turn down eating ground beef dishes at friends' homes by simply stating that I've eaten my meat quota for the day and need to consume carbs.

I only by ground chuck at my local Sav-A-Lot, whose butcher shop has a glass window where you can watch them prepare the various meat, fish and poultry. Mine will also grind/slice/dice, etc. for you at no extra charge, so I most often buy a chuck roast and have them grind it for me.

[ChosenUnWisely]

52. Grind your own meat at home, problem solved

[bobclark86]

57. Love the anti-science vibe here...

1) is it cow?

Yes

2) is it the same cow bits that get used to make hamburger now?

Yes

3) Is it proven more unsafe than normal ground beef?

No. In fact, they gas it quickly so it DOESN'T kill you.


Don't like it? Don't eat it. Not every one is middle class and has a Whole Foods nearby.

[woo me with science]

65. See post 60.

No, it's not the same "cow bits" used to make burgers in most developed countries.

It wasn't even legal to feed it to humans here until 2001.

Your attempt here is absurd.

[840high]

66. Not everyone can

afford their prices.

[byronius]

58. I knew there were a couple of good reasons I went vegan.

Not that unwashed kale from Kazakhstan doesn't have a few risks associated with it.

Jagshemash! Is good!

According to Rand Paul, mass death from poisoned food is a good thing. Because the market.

[C Moon]

61. I consume my share of junk, but this article makes me glad to be vegetarian. Eeek!

The FDA should stop making excuses for these corporations, and make them quit putting that garbage into the consumers' foods. Period.

[bulloney]

64. With the crap these profit-by-any-means corporations try to pass off as food

is it any wonder we have so much cancer, diabetes, allergies and other diseases and disorders?

I remember talking to a friend of my niece who was a broker for a pet food manufacturer. She said her company rejects meat products that are purchased by Taco Bell. Haven't eaten there since.

There was another time when a colleague visited a stockyard in Australia. There was a pen full of sick cattle with abscesses all over their bodies being herded for shipment. My friend asked where these diseased cattle were going. The company rep hesitated, but eventually told her they were going to the U.S. for Burger King. Haven't eaten a burger there since.

[misterhighwasted]

73. The secret trade deals /Tpp etc, will only enhance this.

..and we won't have the right to challenge as consumers. Ever.

[woo me with science]

79. +10000000000000000000

[obnoxiousdrunk]

84. That was the point of this o/p...

[misterhighwasted]

91. Yes it was the point. And an urgent point at that.

We the Corporations are not the same as We the People.

[MisterP]

80. tustard!

[Liberal_Dog]

82. I Wish That I Was Surprised By This

Sadly, I am not.

Money trumps everything.

[Frustratedlady]

86. I wonder how many frozen convenience foods/pizzas contain this slime?

How are you going to know once it's cooked and doctored with tomato or cheese sauces? For instance, many pizza houses already use pellets of hamburger and sausage (supposedly), not to mention other ingredients that aren't that recognizable in bulk.

Chili, meatloaf, lasagna, spaghetti frozen dinners. Dang, I just bought some frozen entrees yesterday to have on hand for busy days. I'll have to wipe this out of my mind before I eat those.

[DebJ]

195. Also, try to forget that you have no idea if these products were kept frozen throughout shipment

delivery and stocking processes. I used to work in truck leasing, and those refrigerator units on the trucks would blow on a not-infrequent basis. I've worked in a number of business types, including restaurants, and there are a lot of careless, lazy, or simply uniformed people who regularly keep food products at unsafe temperatures. I am actually uncomfortable eating at restaurants; I feel like I'm taking a big gamble with my health.


I make my own frozen foods. I rarely ever cook for just one meal. I always make extras, and freeze them myself. No additives, no preservatives, no thawing getting too hot refreezing. And I have less pots and pans to clean, and can get many different types of meals
fast with just the microwave.

[Frustratedlady]

197. I also cook in batches and freeze. Great to grab and eat when you've had a long day.

Years ago, I saw a bunch of boxes sitting behind a famous chicken place and then saw they were full of frozen? chicken with some of the cardboard torn...enough to see from the car that the boxes were full of chicken. Gross. The employees would be there in a couple hours, but...

[Enthusiast]

93. Kicked and recommended a whole bunch! Ethics are a thing of the past.

[URL=.html][IMG][/IMG][/URL]

[Ramses]

101. School lunches is where this crap has always been

I doubt very much businesses and schools and supermarkets ever stopped using it to begin with. Chicken nuggets NEVER have gristle and the texture is evenly consistent with every nugget. It's tendons, eyeballs, shit filled intestines and asshole lining. Its not food and has little to no nutritional value.

[WillyT]

102. K & R !!!

[nationalize the fed]

104. There you go thinking about things again

You're a very dangerous person. Avoid small aircraft please.

Meat from animals isn't really necessary anymore anyway.

I haven't eaten "meat" for many years. And I'm healthier than most of my meat eating friends. This is an example of truly amazing vegetable food.



In my taste testing very few can tell the difference.

[workinclasszero]

112. Another good reason to be a vegetarian

Enjoy those pink slime sandwiches America!

[PatrynXX]

114. they wanna call it some absurd name

local waterloo ia company got shuttered by this Terry Brandstad called it all a hoax and yet it remains the same Beef scraps from the floor. not lean finely textured beef X_X

no hoax and it's still pink slime not matter what color they give it now.

[Liberal_in_LA]

115. that stuff looks disgusting

[AllyCat]

118. Gross

[quakerboy]

119. I had noticed that Grocery store beef prices had risen sharply

I understand the supply issues due to drought that have caused the rise. And it has effected the cost at the local ranch where I normally buy. Although my cost has gone up maybe 10%, where the grocery store meat seems to have jumped closer to 50%. I would even go so far as to say beef prices seem to have shot up pretty near the point where it could be considered economical to purchase from a local ranch or at least a decent butcher shop.

I wondered what the stores would do about that. I guess the return of finely textured beef slime is their answer.

If you buy grocery store meat.. and you have any means at all.. I suggest finding a local source and at least trying it. We found that we are far less likely to have stomach issues, particularly when dealing with ground meat. And the taste difference is worth the price difference, if you've got the money to make that choice.

[CoffeeCat]

127. The other day, I cooked a 5-pound package of hamburger...

…and I went to drain it in the sink. I drained it into a colander. Under the colander was a bowl to catch the
grease. I let the bowl sit on the counter to thicken, so I could throw away the grease in the garbage (and avoid putting it down the drain).

What I found was bizarre.

There was the usual layer of grease/fat on the top. However, underneath the fat was liquid. So much liquid. I dumped the liquid into a 32 oz cup to show my husband. Inside a 5-lb package of meat was 32 oz of liquid that was drained off.

We eat a lot of hamburger because we make walking tacos. I have NEVER, EVER experienced this with hamburger. Usually all of the grease just thickens and I throw it out.

I don't know if this was a fluke, or if this is practice now. But--in a 5 lb package of hamburger--32 ounces of it--is some kind of liquid solution! It looked like water.

I wonder if they aren't injecting beef with a salt solution--the way they do with chicken?

This would allow producers to make so much more money if they were puffing up the weight of the meat with some kind of watery solution.

Anyone else experience this?

[Demit]

160. Yes.

Especially in meat products that are on sale, or at a lower price per pound when you buy the bulk package. Like chicken that's on sale, then you get home & see they've left on more skin & fat than usual, or even thrown in extra.

I *have* had the experience of trying to pan fry a hamburger and it tastes more like I've stewed it. Not sure if it's always the case that it's sale meat, or bulk packages, but I don't react happily to a sale price anymore. I know they're gonna get me somehow.

[woo me with science]

165. Yup.

The "ice cream" won't melt anymore, but the "hamburgers" do.

[DeSwiss]

128. ORGANIC

- Eat it. It's cheaper than poison in the long run.....

K&R

[Major Nikon]

166. ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Germany_E._coli_O104:H4_outbreak

http://www.cdc.gov/ecoli/2012/O157H7-11-12/index.html

http://www.fda.gov/Safety/Recalls/ucm358740.htm

http://www.fda.gov/Safety/Recalls/ucm422431.htm

http://www.fda.gov/safety/recalls/ucm355933.htm

http://www.fda.gov/food/recallsoutbreaksemergencies/outbreaks/ucm399235.htm

http://www.fda.gov/food/recallsoutbreaksemergencies/recalls/ucm415790.htm

http://www.fda.gov/food/recallsoutbreaksemergencies/recalls/ucm386788.htm

http://www.fda.gov/safety/recalls/archiverecalls/2013/ucm378320.htm

http://manbir-online.com/diseases/Organic-food-linked-Ecoli-outbreak.html

...

[merrily]

132. It's discouraging that federal agencies that are supposed to protect consumers as well as business

do not emphasize the protecting consumers bit of their mission very much.

The demand is not coming from consumers … consumers have not changed their mind ,” adds Lovera. “It’s economics."

Probably not. Economics is not a synonym for deception, failure to disclose or greed. You are offering consumers a choice based on economics if you make full disclosure and offer ground beef with pink slime at a cheaper price and also offer ground beef without pink slime at a higher price. Vendors who sell pink slime without disclosure are trying to get away with duping the consumer. That's called fraud not economics.

As a relatively practical solution for consumers, choose a chuck steak or round steak or whatever cut of beef you prefer and ask your butcher or supermarket meat department to grind it. Since you already know what it costs, there is no incentive for the butcher or supermarket to add anything, though some residual bits of things you don't want may be in the grinder itself. You can also see in ways you understand exactly much fat is on the specific piece of meat you've chosen. And, they don't charge you for the extra labor (probably costlier than keeping pink slime out of ground beef would be).

You will have to wait a few extra minutes, but, to me, it's worth it.

[malaise]

134. Give thanks we don't eat any of that shite

Rec

[brewens]

161. I bought the cheap burger one time about a year ago. I was going to use it for taco meat and

thought, why not? How bad could it be? This was the three pound tube wrapped in opaque plastic that most stores sell.

What was in there was pretty much inedible. Just the color and texture was nothing like what I was used to. I don't know if it was because of pink slime or other fillers but even in taco meat, you could tell it was crap.

I should have known better. I'm used to getting my burger at Costco, six lbs at a time. That's the good shit!

[GP6971]

180. I use Costco's burgers

For my chile. Much better than even the premium ground beef you find at Safeway, Albertsons, etc

[brewens]

183. If you make patties and nail it just right on the grill, that burger cooks up real juicy!

The had signs posted saying no pink slime or something like that for awhile. A buddy of mine is a butcher there. I've rode in his boat floating Hells Canyon in Idaho a couple of times. I always give him crap when I see him there and ask for extra pink slime! That gets me a adament disclaimer in front of all the other customers.

[GP6971]

184. Boy, your post has given me an idea

Grill and cook the patties on the grill, chop them up and then put in the sauce. I make two kinds of chile.......I think today will be the traditional without beans.

[merrily]

173. Looks as though woome struck a nerve.

[Oilwellian]

187. But Woo, ammonium hydroxide is safe

Our government tells us it's perfectly fine for our families to ingest the ammonium hydroxide that comes with pink slime. In fact, because pink slime is considered to be a "processing aid," ammonium hydroxide doesn't even have to be included on food labels.

The U.S. Food and Drug Administration granted ammonium hydroxide status as a GRAS, or Generally Recognized as Safe, substance in 1974.

Ammonium hydroxide is also an acceptable ingredient under the conditions of "good manufacturing practices" in dozens of foods, from soft drinks to soups to canned vegetables, according to the General Standards for Food Additives set forth by the Codex Alimentarius Commission, a group funded by the World Health Organization and the United Nations' Food and Agricultural Organization.

A trip to the grocery store revealed ammonium chloride - a salt - present in Wonder Bread and Chef Boyardee Mini Ravioli, made by ConAgra Foods. Ammonium phosphate, another type of salt, is listed on Chips Ahoy cookies.

But ammonium hydroxide, the chemical often used to sanitize the "pink slime," was harder to find.

That is because it is often considered a "processing aid," which is not required by U.S. regulators to be included on food labels.

"If it helps facilitate a process, it's not required and (if) it's used at a percent less than 1 percent, it doesn't have to be declared on the label," said Roger Clemens, president of the Institute of Food Technologists and chief scientific officer of E.T. Horn Co, a private chemical and ingredient company.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/04/04/us-food-ammonia-idUSBRE8331B420120404

But even though our government deemed it safe for ingestion, we may want to study and learn what our government's poison control centers advise should we be exposed to this chemical.

Ammonium hydroxide is a colorless liquid chemical solution that forms when ammonia dissolves in water. This article discusses poisoning due to ammonium hydroxide.

This is for information only and not for use in the treatment or management of an actual poison exposure. If you have an exposure, you should call your local emergency number (such as 911) or a local poison control center at 1-800-222-1222.
Reference from A.D.A.M.

Alternative Names

Aqueous - ammonia

Poisonous Ingredient

Ammonium hydroxide

Where Found

Ammonium hydroxide is found in many industrial products and cleaners such as flooring strippers, brick cleaners, and cements.

Ammonium hydroxide can also release ammonia gas into the air.

Ammonia alone (not ammonium hydroxide) can be found in many household items such as detergents, stain removers, bleaches, and dyes. The symptoms and treatment for ammonia exposure are similar to those for ammonium hydroxide.

Note: This list may not be all inclusive.

Symptoms

Airways and lungs:

Breathing difficulty (from inhalation)
Coughing
Throat swelling (which may also cause breathing difficulty)
Wheezing

Eyes, ears, nose, and throat:

Severe pain in the throat
Severe pain or burning in the nose, eyes, ears, lips, or tongue
Vision loss

Esophagus, stomach, and intestines:

Blood in the stool
Burns of the esophagus (food pipe) and stomach
Severe abdominal pain
Vomiting, possibly with blood

Heart and blood:

Collapse
Low blood pressure (develops rapidly)
Severe change in pH (too much or too little acid in the blood, which leads to damage in all of the body organs)

Skin:

Burns
Holes in skin tissue (necrosis)
Irritation

Home Care

Do NOT make the person throw up.

If ammonium hydroxide is on the skin or in the eyes, flush with lots of water for at least 15 minutes.

If the person swallowed ammonium hydroxide, immediately give milk or water. Fruit juices may also be given. DO NOT give water, juice, or milk if the person is having symptoms (such as vomiting, convulsions, or a decreased level of alertness) that make it hard to swallow.

If the person breathed in fumes, immediately move the patient to fresh air.

Before Calling Emergency

Determine the following information:

The person's age, weight, and condition
The name of the product (ingredients and strengths, if known)
The time it was swallowed
The amount swallowed
http://www.nytimes.com/health/guides/poison/ammonium-hydroxide-poisoning/overview.html

Isn't it weird how this toxic chemical was approved for our consumption? Thank goodness the human instinct is to shy away from it.

[Major Nikon]

189. Ammonium hydroxide is already naturally present in most foods

http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/26/5/487.full.pdf

Comparing NH₃ levels in beef, measured in parts per million, to 5% household ammonia poisoning is ridiculous.

[benz380]

188. Knr nt