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madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
Tue Feb 3, 2015, 10:17 PM Feb 2015

The saddest part of Claire Conner's Wrapped in the Flag book about John Birch society.

I was just reading one of the saddest parts of Claire Conner's book about the new rise of the John Birch Society. It is called Wrapped in the Flag.

Her parents were avid John Birchers. They had no tolerance for disagreement on issues. In the 60s "The Birchers scared a whole lot of citizens with the revelation that the Communists had formulated a plan to form a Negro Soviet Republic right in the heart of the South."

Claire had defied her parents and become what they snidely called a "bleeding heart liberal". When I read the last words her mother ever said to her, I realized how strong she had to be to break from their devotion as Birchers.

Claire's daughter, Sarah, had driven to see her grandmother when she was very ill. Sarah put her on the phone with Claire. She said her grandmother was having a good day and wanted to talk to her. I transcribed this from the book.

"This is Claire," I said. "I'm so glad you called. I love you, Mom."

Silence.

"Don't you want to say something to your daughter?" Sarah suggested.

"What should I say?" Mother said.

"Tell her you love her," Sarah suggested.


There was a long pause before Claire's mother finally responded.

Finally Mother answered. "I can't say that," she blurted out. "I'm not sure I do."


That was the last time she had a chance to talk to her mother.

I can't imagine the heartbreak that would bring.

In her personal blog, Claire tells some more of the ways they intimidated and tried to make her feel unworthy.

Part Five: Storming Dixie

She was impressed with MLK and took the opposite side from her parents during the Civil Rights movement.

You better be careful,” my mother told me. “You’re turning into a bleeding heart liberal.”

“You are a disgrace,” my father said. “I can’t stand to look at you.”

Many years later, after my father was gone, I talked to my mother about her beliefs. “What happens to the poor, the elderly, the unemployed, the disabled if the Birch society achieves success?”

“It doesn’t matter, not at all,” she told me. “It’s all about the Constitution.”

“The Constitution doesn’t feed a hungry child or help an unemployed man,” I argued.

“That’s not my concern.”


And these words from her mother unfortunately were correct. She told Claire that the Birchers were waiting and would be back.

“Our day will come.” All you socialist-liberals will fail and we’ll be ready.”


I do not think liberals failed, I think they were failed by a party that did not stand up to such extremists. A party that followed the policy of trying to win by being more like the other side, in other words taking their issues before they could get around to it.

SO yes, in that way liberals were failed. There was no real opposition when it was needed most. So many in the GOP congress now go around spouting Birch philosophy when in actuality is right wing libertarianism.

I am seeing just lately some Democrats moving away, or seemingly so, from the corporate policies of the DLC/Third Way.

I hope it continues.
109 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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The saddest part of Claire Conner's Wrapped in the Flag book about John Birch society. (Original Post) madfloridian Feb 2015 OP
I have that book shenmue Feb 2015 #1
Here's more about the book for those who don't have it. madfloridian Feb 2015 #2
her blog is an absolute eye opener rurallib Feb 2015 #50
I grew up in similar circumstances, I'll have to read this. Thanks! haikugal Feb 2015 #3
It's a fascinating read. madfloridian Feb 2015 #6
I just put it on my reading list kimbutgar Feb 2015 #4
They are cold and heartless. Some are proud of it. madfloridian Feb 2015 #5
Right wing, xian, bigots - same breed erronis Feb 2015 #56
Paraphrasing Yoda n2doc Feb 2015 #7
and hated makes you stupid vlyons Feb 2015 #30
Heard Claire Connor speak... hay rick Feb 2015 #8
Hi back. madfloridian Feb 2015 #15
That's a great book! I will never, ever,ever understand octoberlib Feb 2015 #9
It's right wing radio, Fox News watching, and rigid religious belief that does it. madfloridian Feb 2015 #47
Indeed! Duppers Feb 2015 #72
Now it's like the JBS runs talk radio and FOX nt uhnope Feb 2015 #10
yes, i remember when they were like the crazy uncle who lived down the street in the basement. ND-Dem Feb 2015 #35
Glory be to KOCH. Downwinder Feb 2015 #11
I'm amazed that over 50% of Americans still know nothing of the Kochs ClaireConner Feb 2015 #100
I have always thought of the John Birch Society as a cult. Downwinder Feb 2015 #107
We had that material around our house rosesaylavee Feb 2015 #12
I worry that we may all have to experience such tough times. F4lconF16 Feb 2015 #71
Maybe there are enough of us already rosesaylavee Feb 2015 #75
At least we have that...haha F4lconF16 Feb 2015 #79
Read it last year and rec to all lunasun Feb 2015 #13
A powerful story. earthside Feb 2015 #18
I see little difference between yesterday's Birchers and today's GOP base. nt SunSeeker Feb 2015 #14
Nor do I. It has moved so far from Eisenhower lovemydog Feb 2015 #16
Interesting. JBS website blames Ferguson protests on Communists. madfloridian Feb 2015 #17
didn't they blame littering on Reds? MisterP Feb 2015 #23
Who remembers this classic hit? hedda_foil Feb 2015 #29
I do. madfloridian Feb 2015 #31
Try and play that on todays radio mrdmk Feb 2015 #37
Kick FloriTexan Feb 2015 #19
.... madfloridian Feb 2015 #22
My mother has the same attitude.... VanillaRhapsody Feb 2015 #20
...... madfloridian Feb 2015 #21
I sooo grok that!!! daredtowork Feb 2015 #70
I have seen that attitude more than once SheilaT Feb 2015 #24
Nope....and for some reason....SHE "worked" for them.....but her children....don't deserve VanillaRhapsody Feb 2015 #27
Typical Repug cant. lark Feb 2015 #55
and my poor parents are stupid enough to fall for their bullshit! It angers me VanillaRhapsody Feb 2015 #65
Yeah, my dad and mom were members of Jerry Falwell's foundation, forget the name. lark Feb 2015 #89
Moral Majority was Jerry Falwell's foundation. ClaireConner Feb 2015 #96
She's the audience for claims Obama stole from Medicare to pay for "Obamacare". Spitfire of ATJ Feb 2015 #45
Oh yeah....she totally believes that! VanillaRhapsody Feb 2015 #66
Birchers / teabaggers The Wizard Feb 2015 #25
Wonderful post, thank you n/t emulatorloo Feb 2015 #26
It's a powerful book. It's her story, simple and often heartbreaking. madfloridian Feb 2015 #34
Well, between election-rigging, and the judicious use of assassination... villager Feb 2015 #28
So true... haikugal Feb 2015 #32
I suspect this kind of thing is common among right-wing extremists. Exhibit A Feb 2015 #33
You are right. Among the right wing extreme elements there is no tolerance for views of others. madfloridian Feb 2015 #36
Now that's interesting! FiveGoodMen Feb 2015 #52
I lost my best friend from high school 25 years ago because I like Renaissance Faires. ieoeja Feb 2015 #57
Well . . . Exhibit A Feb 2015 #61
Thanks, that makes it clearer FiveGoodMen Feb 2015 #62
K&R ReRe Feb 2015 #38
It's a powerful book. Easy to read but hard to take so much radical stuff she grew up with. madfloridian Feb 2015 #39
I'm sure I will breeze right through it. ReRe Feb 2015 #40
The Birchers have come into their own. herding cats Feb 2015 #41
This group has the money to buy politicians and control policies. madfloridian Feb 2015 #42
K&R! This post should have hundreds of recommendations! Enthusiast Feb 2015 #43
Liberals are patient,.........and we win. Spitfire of ATJ Feb 2015 #44
an incredible book - as a side issue of sleaze - wasn't it something to learn that it was Douglas Carpenter Feb 2015 #46
And her brother is a co hort/was of JustAnotherGen Feb 2015 #76
I have read it twice and highly recommend that book! Triana Feb 2015 #48
Yes, "cold-hearted and mean". That is what we are dealing with today. madfloridian Feb 2015 #51
I read it shortly after it came out LibertyLover Feb 2015 #49
The SPLC had YAF on their radar for years. Don't know about now. madfloridian Feb 2015 #53
very interesting articles LibertyLover Feb 2015 #54
I have a personal tale to relate concerning the John Birch Society. radicalliberal Feb 2015 #58
Thank you so much for that personal story. I share your outrage toward this group. madfloridian Feb 2015 #59
Thank you very much for your kind words and your kind suggestion. radicalliberal Feb 2015 #67
PM me a link when you do. madfloridian Feb 2015 #68
The Koch bros dad was a founder of the John Birch Soc. Kablooie Feb 2015 #60
thank you so much for posting this! nt steve2470 Feb 2015 #63
Makes me glad I have the family I do. Aristus Feb 2015 #64
Huge K & R !!! - Thank You !!! WillyT Feb 2015 #69
Sounds exactly like my parents Duppers Feb 2015 #73
I guess the JBS omits the "general welfare" part of the Constitution. muntrv Feb 2015 #74
They don't believe in general welfare or anything about common good. ClaireConner Feb 2015 #81
please allow me the opportunity to thank you for your book which I had pre-ordered and was able to Douglas Carpenter Feb 2015 #88
glad you are here, Claire steve2470 Feb 2015 #97
Whoa gotta read that book abelenkpe Feb 2015 #77
I am so sorry for the behavior of your family. It is so sad. greatlaurel Feb 2015 #78
Liberals have a big problem ClaireConner Feb 2015 #80
So true and thanks for posting! Kingofalldems Feb 2015 #82
Good to see you here. Glad you don't mind my sharing. madfloridian Feb 2015 #83
Please share ClaireConner Feb 2015 #84
I have read some of your Daily Kos posts. madfloridian Feb 2015 #85
I've posted on Daily Kos ClaireConner Feb 2015 #86
I know what you mean. madfloridian Feb 2015 #87
We used to think Birchers were "the fringe." Arugula Latte Feb 2015 #99
please don't confuse or conflate the democratic party with 'the left' KG Feb 2015 #103
I just posted my first general discussion post. It's about the Kochs and the John Birch Society ClaireConner Feb 2015 #104
I read your book on the recommendation of madfloridian. Starry Messenger Feb 2015 #106
Thanks so much. It means the world to a writer when people appreciate the work. ClaireConner Feb 2015 #108
Do you thnk it would help if DU had a forum about radical right wing extremism ClaireConner Feb 2015 #90
My opinion would be to keep it a General Discussion topic. madfloridian Feb 2015 #91
okay ClaireConner Feb 2015 #93
My thoughts... madfloridian Feb 2015 #94
once you get to 10 posts or so, you can post your own threads steve2470 Feb 2015 #98
I agree. madfloridian Feb 2015 #101
hey "neighbor"! steve2470 Feb 2015 #102
Remember the Republican crowd that cheered the "Let him die" response tblue37 Feb 2015 #92
Benson, a relatively recent Mormon Prophet was a staunch Republican Sheepshank Feb 2015 #95
Reed Benson was a close personal friend to my parents, a member of the John Birch counsel ClaireConner Feb 2015 #105
Read the book treestar Feb 2015 #109

rurallib

(62,451 posts)
50. her blog is an absolute eye opener
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 01:25 PM
Feb 2015

looks like it may be a bit old, but her observations about the link between the Birch Society and today's Republican party is amazing.
Thanks for posting this.

kimbutgar

(21,211 posts)
4. I just put it on my reading list
Tue Feb 3, 2015, 10:39 PM
Feb 2015

I never can understand have the right wing in this country can be so cold and heartless and then call themselves Christian.

The Jesus I know said, "love they neighbor as thyself, feed the poor and be my brother's keeper".I just don't get today's republican party who cut food stamps, heating assistance and protecting children. Today's Republican Party starting with Bush turned me off religion.

erronis

(15,355 posts)
56. Right wing, xian, bigots - same breed
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 03:55 PM
Feb 2015
I never can understand have the right wing in this country can be so cold and heartless and then call themselves Christian.


They wrap themselves in some fancy clothes(power suits, vestments, sheets) and symbols (flag, cross, kkk) and then feel secure that they can pass judgement on anybody else.

If you strip off these wrappings you'll find the same lowly maggots.

n2doc

(47,953 posts)
7. Paraphrasing Yoda
Tue Feb 3, 2015, 10:49 PM
Feb 2015

“Fear is the path to the Birch side. Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering.”

vlyons

(10,252 posts)
30. and hated makes you stupid
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 01:02 AM
Feb 2015

I had a hard-hearted mother. It took me many many years to stop hating her. Hatred is like drinking poison and expecting the other person to die. We can make a conscious choice to stop hating someone. And even when there's still some leftover resentment for the wrongs done to us, we can hold the aspiration to one day be completely released from the hatred in our hearts.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
47. It's right wing radio, Fox News watching, and rigid religious belief that does it.
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 09:42 AM
Feb 2015

It's like the old saying I grew up hearing in the Southern Baptist church, still popular today...:the Bible says it, I believe it, that settles it."

That leaves no room for thinking.

 

ND-Dem

(4,571 posts)
35. yes, i remember when they were like the crazy uncle who lived down the street in the basement.
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 02:16 AM
Feb 2015

now they're everywhere it seems.

ClaireConner

(24 posts)
100. I'm amazed that over 50% of Americans still know nothing of the Kochs
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 05:28 PM
Feb 2015

I'll be sharing information about Fred, the father of David and Charles, who was a founding member of the John Birch Society. David and Charles are made in their father's image. And their favorite causes happen to have been his, too.

Downwinder

(12,869 posts)
107. I have always thought of the John Birch Society as a cult.
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 06:36 PM
Feb 2015

At least as far as brainwashing and mind control.

Don't forget Harry's opinion pieces against trade unions, retirement pensions, and the regulation of banks

rosesaylavee

(12,126 posts)
12. We had that material around our house
Tue Feb 3, 2015, 11:11 PM
Feb 2015

while I was growing up. Schafley pamphlets and John Bircher books. They all seemed to disappear when my father died quite young and unexpectedly without his pension signed and not a lot of savings... and my mother tried to find work to support us, tried to keep us in the house we were living in. She was very smart but could only find a part time receptionist/bookkeeping job for little more than minimum wage.

All the remarks against feminists stopped too.

I loved my mom. Glad she finally figured it out. Sorry she had to experience tough times to get to that. Would love to ask her what she thought of these folks now.

F4lconF16

(3,747 posts)
71. I worry that we may all have to experience such tough times.
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 08:44 PM
Feb 2015

Will we only be able to turn the insanity around when we are all impoverished, homeless, cold, and hungry? I hope not. But I fear that it's coming. There's a tension in the air that we don't like to talk about--I think most people know that things aren't right. But we ignore it, and continue, and hope that it doesn't affect us.

It will, though. Eventually hatred and greed touches every one of us; some for better, some for worse. I hope that we manage to figure it out before then. If we have to have a collapse before we can create a socialist society where we support each other rather than take for ourselves, there will be a lot of pain.

rosesaylavee

(12,126 posts)
75. Maybe there are enough of us already
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 09:44 AM
Feb 2015

experiencing this for our society to finally 'get' it. I think we are at least close to 'critical mass' if not surpassing it at the moment.

The changing climate will bring this to a fore and either we work that out together or we won't survive. Not as a democracy anyway. So, in the words of Bill Murray "At least we have that". lol...

It's hard to be a thinking individual most days, ain't it?

F4lconF16

(3,747 posts)
79. At least we have that...haha
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 10:38 AM
Feb 2015

And yeah it is. I swear, state the most basic of things, that we have a corporate media that ignores all of reality, and people look at you like you're a conspiracy nut. Say much more and they stop listening altogether.

earthside

(6,960 posts)
18. A powerful story.
Tue Feb 3, 2015, 11:44 PM
Feb 2015

Not exactly great literature, but well told and an easy read.

I grew up in Wyoming, a liberal Democrat, and was surrounded by Birchers, YAFers, NRA fanatics, Christian hardliners ... so I can sympathize and empathize with others who are socially surrounded by right-wingers.

However, as bad as the Eagle Forum was, the Goldwater phenomena, the John Birch Society ... these Tea Party reactionaries, in my opinion, are far worse and scarier. I believe a right-wing coup or fascistic revolt is possible these days; despite movies like "Seven Days in May" I don't think that would have happened back then.



lovemydog

(11,833 posts)
16. Nor do I. It has moved so far from Eisenhower
Tue Feb 3, 2015, 11:41 PM
Feb 2015

espousing peace and prosperity. When the top marginal rate was over 80%. When a higher percentage of our country earned a living wage that could pay the bills, put a down payment on a home and even have some left for saving.

And I fully agree with the original poster, that democrats should fight back hard. Screw the going more conservative route. As Truman mentioned, for a democrat to act more republican means they will lose. Democrats should offer a very clear alternatives. Those policies may not be overwhelmingly popular now. But by sticking to the correct principles (starting with a total rejection of failed trickle down policies and strong bold steps on alternative energy and reducing the causes of climate change) they will attract more people to vote. The success of those policies will bring more people around. In my humble opinion.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
17. Interesting. JBS website blames Ferguson protests on Communists.
Tue Feb 3, 2015, 11:42 PM
Feb 2015
http://www.jbs.org/home/communist-groups-behind-the-ferguson-demonstrations

Here they go again.

http://www.bobdylan.com/us/songs/talkin-john-birch-paranoid-blues



Well, I was feelin’ sad and feelin’ blue
I didn’t know what in the world I wus gonna do
Them Communists they wus comin’ around
They wus in the air
They wus on the ground
They wouldn’t gimme no peace . . .

So I run down most hurriedly
And joined up with the John Birch Society
I got me a secret membership card
And started off a-walkin’ down the road
Yee-hoo, I’m a real John Bircher now!
Look out you Commies!

Now we all agree with Hitler’s views
Although he killed six million Jews
It don’t matter too much that he was a Fascist
At least you can’t say he was a Communist!
That’s to say like if you got a cold you take a shot of malaria

Well, I wus lookin’ everywhere for them gol-darned Reds
I got up in the mornin’ ’n’ looked under my bed
Looked in the sink, behind the door
Looked in the glove compartment of my car
Couldn’t find ’em . . .

I wus lookin’ high an’ low for them Reds everywhere
I wus lookin’ in the sink an’ underneath the chair
I looked way up my chimney hole
I even looked deep down inside my toilet bowl
They got away . . .

Well, I wus sittin’ home alone an’ started to sweat
Figured they wus in my T.V. set
Peeked behind the picture frame
Got a shock from my feet, hittin’ right up in the brain
Them Reds caused it!
I know they did . . . them hard-core ones

Well, I quit my job so I could work all alone
Then I changed my name to Sherlock Holmes
Followed some clues from my detective bag
And discovered they wus red stripes on the American flag!
That ol’ Betsy Ross . . .

Well, I investigated all the books in the library
Ninety percent of ’em gotta be burned away
I investigated all the people that I knowed
Ninety-eight percent of them gotta go
The other two percent are fellow Birchers . . . just like me

Now Eisenhower, he’s a Russian spy
Lincoln, Jefferson and that Roosevelt guy
To my knowledge there’s just one man
That’s really a true American: George Lincoln Rockwell
I know for a fact he hates Commies cus he picketed the movie Exodus

Well, I fin’ly started thinkin’ straight
When I run outa things to investigate
Couldn’t imagine doin’ anything else
So now I’m sittin’ home investigatin’ myself!
Hope I don’t find out anything . . . hmm, great God!
Copyright © 1970 by Special Rider Music; renewed 1998 by Special Rider Music

MisterP

(23,730 posts)
23. didn't they blame littering on Reds?
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 12:35 AM
Feb 2015

or was that some other tinpot banana republic they wanted the US to become?

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
20. My mother has the same attitude....
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 12:04 AM
Feb 2015

I informed her that the Military Medical Benefits she has received all her life is Socialism....she denied that of course.... So I asked her....wouldn't you want your kids and grandkids to have that quality of healthcare....She said no....because "SHE" and my father earned that (she never worked which is the ironic part)....what she meant was....if THEY got that.....then what "she" and my dad "worked" for....would be worth less....

This is how brainwashed she is.....

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
21. ......
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 12:08 AM
Feb 2015

I have neighbors who think like that. I think I am the only liberal for miles around here. I only talk about the weather.

Sorry about that, hurts when it's family.

daredtowork

(3,732 posts)
70. I sooo grok that!!!
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 08:41 PM
Feb 2015

I grew up in a rural area, but I escaped to New York early - I have nothing culturally in common with my origins. This became a problem in maintaining ties with my Mom, my only close relative, over the years. I doubt we would have maintained contact without the ease of email since we had nothing to talk about. Her emails were filled with news of church gossip - people I didn't know. We talked about the weather, lol.

Finally, recently, I found a common interest! What a relief! I'm enjoying the little shared enthusiasm while it lasts.

 

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)
24. I have seen that attitude more than once
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 12:38 AM
Feb 2015

in older women whose husbands were in the service. Somehow they deserve these benefits the rest of their lives, but the rest of us deserve, what? Certainly not any benefits of any kind.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
27. Nope....and for some reason....SHE "worked" for them.....but her children....don't deserve
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 12:39 AM
Feb 2015

the same....and the irony of that is lost on her!

lark

(23,158 posts)
55. Typical Repug cant.
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 03:33 PM
Feb 2015

It's OK for Rick Santorum's wife and for Anne Romney to have abortions because of their health conditions, but abortion can't be legal for health reasons for anyone else. Clarence Thomas and Carson and Joni Ernst are all the beneficiary's of government handouts, yet oppose government handouts for anyone else.

All those fuckers care about is getting theirs and getting more $$ for the rich so the rich give more $$ to them. Everyone else can go die a lingering death, because, they are unimportant and didn't earn healthcare the way the rich did (NOT).

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
65. and my poor parents are stupid enough to fall for their bullshit! It angers me
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 06:33 PM
Feb 2015
“The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.” John Kenneth Galbraith

Same as it ever was...

lark

(23,158 posts)
89. Yeah, my dad and mom were members of Jerry Falwell's foundation, forget the name.
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 02:08 PM
Feb 2015

They were lower middle class, yet bought into the Repug lies due to the support of their christian fundamentalist Southern Baptist church. They railed against those welfare cheaters, but had no gripe with big business getting all the $$. Dad and I fought like banshees about this when I was younger. When I returned back to FL, we made an agreement not to discuss politics because we couldn't talk about it without fighting. Sad.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
66. Oh yeah....she totally believes that!
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 06:34 PM
Feb 2015

Now I see....even though she is a big racist bigot too.....she is reading Ben Carson's book....she thinks that proves she is not one!

The Wizard

(12,549 posts)
25. Birchers / teabaggers
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 12:38 AM
Feb 2015

poisoned the political well and turned American against American for cheap political gain, very Machiavellian. Their propaganda operation would make Goebbels envious.

 

villager

(26,001 posts)
28. Well, between election-rigging, and the judicious use of assassination...
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 12:43 AM
Feb 2015

...those "socialist-liberals" have had a hard time keeping any real power-for-change here in the good ol' U.S. of A...

Exhibit A

(318 posts)
33. I suspect this kind of thing is common among right-wing extremists.
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 01:06 AM
Feb 2015

My father once told me that if I were not his daughter -- if I were just some person he met somewhere -- he would have nothing to do with me. It was entirely about my political views and my disinterest in guns. I'm not even hostile toward guns or gun owners, just not personally interested in them.

It kind of makes sense: I think that conservatism has become the new counter-culture, a way of rebelling against mainstream society, and that divides people into opposing camps. I don't think that much of it is genuinely based on sincerely-held beliefs; it's about identifying with a particular in-group. Just being my own person, with my own views and interests, is interpreted by my father as a betrayal of "our side," which I was apparently born into and owe something to, in his view.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
36. You are right. Among the right wing extreme elements there is no tolerance for views of others.
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 02:33 AM
Feb 2015

They are right, they don't have to prove it. The rest of us are wrong. They really damaged the word liberal forever.

FiveGoodMen

(20,018 posts)
52. Now that's interesting!
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 01:46 PM
Feb 2015

I can fathom (though not agree with) people who feel threatened and therefore want guns for protection.

I can see how people with those views could fear a government that might remove those guns from their possession.

But to reject someone just because they didn't love guns -- that's something else again.

Could you expand on that at all?

Do people like your father specifically worship the guns themselves?

 

ieoeja

(9,748 posts)
57. I lost my best friend from high school 25 years ago because I like Renaissance Faires.
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 04:21 PM
Feb 2015

That makes me a "pervert" in his eyes. He therefore does not want me around his family. Possibly Exhibit A’s father views an individual’s lack of interest in firearms as weird.

Or it might more simply be “if you’re not with us, you’re against us”. Paranoia is a huge stock in trade for the modern gun culture after all. So if you're not into guns you must be out to take his guns away.

Exhibit A

(318 posts)
61. Well . . .
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 05:41 PM
Feb 2015

I wouldn't call it worship. It's partly a cultural thing -- my parents are both from rural southern families. My father got his first gun when he was eight years old, and he's an extremely skilled shooter. He has dozens of trophies from competitions he's been in over the years. In that sense, it's a hobby and a part of his cultural heritage.

But there is definitely a political dimension, too. He's a life member of the NRA and a Faux News addict. I probably don't need to elaborate on that.

I think the real issue boils down to my father feeling like he did not have opportunity, and he wanted me to do the things he would have done if he had grown up differently. He started steering me toward law school and politics when I was in my early teens, and was disappointed in me for wanting to go into medicine instead. Seriously -- have you ever heard of a family who was disappointed in a child who wanted to be a doctor? It's kind of nuts. Anyway, this has been a consistent theme throughout my life -- he gets upset when I don't share his interests. Does this help explain my other post?

FiveGoodMen

(20,018 posts)
62. Thanks, that makes it clearer
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 05:53 PM
Feb 2015

Many of us who have 0 interest in guns and >0 interest in gun control will make remarks about gun-loving people.

From your post, it almost seemed like the gun-as-symbol-of-something was really and truly being adored, loved, worshiped.

I wanted to know if it was really that cut and dried.

If it's a shared-interest kind of thing, that's a little different.

ReRe

(10,597 posts)
38. K&R
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 03:13 AM
Feb 2015

Haven't read it, nor heard of it. But I have been informed now, thank you mf. Will try to pick up several copies, one for myself & others to share with family and friends.

ReRe

(10,597 posts)
40. I'm sure I will breeze right through it.
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 03:43 AM
Feb 2015

I hit the stacks around 1984 to try to figure out for myself WTF was going on in this country. Wondering what the rest of the world thought of us (the USA), got me a short-wave radio. That thing bit the dust many years ago, but I learned so much from listening to it all night long for years, in addition to my reading. Anyway, I can't wait to get my hands Claire Conner's book.

herding cats

(19,568 posts)
41. The Birchers have come into their own.
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 03:50 AM
Feb 2015

I had this conversation with a friend a few weeks ago, not long after the election. Their game was long, and they abandoned the name, but they're seeing their dreams realized. The Koch's played this country well.

Excellent book, also. I can't recommend it enough in today's political climate.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
42. This group has the money to buy politicians and control policies.
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 04:03 AM
Feb 2015

Unfortunately. Money talks very loudly.

Douglas Carpenter

(20,226 posts)
46. an incredible book - as a side issue of sleaze - wasn't it something to learn that it was
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 08:53 AM
Feb 2015

was Congressman's John G. Schmitz ( Republican member of the United States House of Representatives and California State Senate from Orange County, California. He was also a member of the John Birch Society. In 1972 he was the American Independent Party candidate for President of the United States,)

It was John G. Schmitz's daughter who became a national scandal in her own right - Until I read Claire's book I would have had no idea - Mary Kay Fualaau (daughter): famously arrested for having sex with (and impregnated by) her 12 year old six grade student while employed as his elementary school teacher. While on probation and forbidden to contact her former student, was again arrested after being found having sex with her former student in a car (and impregnated with her second child by her former student). Upon release from prison, she later married him.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_G._Schmitz

JustAnotherGen

(31,907 posts)
76. And her brother is a co hort/was of
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 09:51 AM
Feb 2015

Erik Prince - believe he worked at Blackwater at one point . . .

How 'small' those circles are eh?

 

Triana

(22,666 posts)
48. I have read it twice and highly recommend that book!
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 10:13 AM
Feb 2015

You can follow Claire on twitter at @wrappedinflag.

My aunt's mother-in-law (uncle's mother) was a Bircher and was just as cold-hearted and MEAN as Claire's mother was. It didn't surprise me to read about such cold-heartedness in Claire's book because I'd heard about it from my aunt about her MIL.

Claire's book is a MUST-READ, IMO if Dems are to be fully aware of what they're dealing with. I think EVERY DEMOCRAT in the country ought to be required to read it. EVERY. ONE.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
51. Yes, "cold-hearted and mean". That is what we are dealing with today.
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 01:39 PM
Feb 2015

There is as Howard Dean used to say...."no compromising with extremists". Like to hear him say that again loudly.

LibertyLover

(4,788 posts)
49. I read it shortly after it came out
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 10:50 AM
Feb 2015

and thought it was very good. My parents were, thank all the Gods, FDR Democrats, and would have nothing to do with the Birchers. When I was in high school, a number of the guys that I liked started a YAF (Young Americans for Freedom) chapter. I was pretty much apolitical at the time but joined because of, well, the guys. My mom hated the YAF stuff that would come to the house. It only lasted a year because we were all graduating and going to college and my mom was so darned happy. Actually, so was I because by then I realized that YAF was not what I was. Growing up, I knew one or two kids in school who had upbringings similar to Ms. Conner's and I remember how sorry we all felt for them. It seemed like they never had fun.

LibertyLover

(4,788 posts)
54. very interesting articles
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 03:25 PM
Feb 2015

I was in it in high school, 1970-1971. I don't recall it being so, well, nasty.

radicalliberal

(907 posts)
58. I have a personal tale to relate concerning the John Birch Society.
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 04:38 PM
Feb 2015

I have a sister seven years older than I who attended Colorado College from the fall of 1961 through the spring of 1965. As a high-school student living in Houston, Texas, she once came to the defense of a Jewish friend of hers who was being bullied at school. Despite the fact she was nominally a Methodist, my sister wore a Cross of David around her neck in defiance of the anti-Semitic bigots.

While she was attending C.C., she joined a sorority -- which, like so many other sororities (and fraternities as well), had racist bylaws. A friend of hers at the college was Jewish. (I don't remember if she was the same girl my sister had defended in high school.) She wanted her friend, as well as others, to be able to join her sorority; so, she and another friend of hers launched a petition to the national headquarters of the sorority urging them to drop their racist bylaws.

She also participated in a PEACEFUL demonstration against the largest employer in Colorado Springs for their "whites only" hiring practices. (Incidentally, why didn't any conservatives ever condemn employment discrimination against blacks?)

When the Houston, Texas, chapter of the John Birch Society heard about her activities, they held a press conference in which they publicly accused my sister of being a Communist. If this had happened in the 1950s during the height of McCarthyism, my sister's chances of getting a good job would have been ruined.

What's so funny about this is the fact that my sister, who had been blacklisted as a "Communist," was the person who in 1971 would introduce me to a very depressing but interesting book: The Confession by Artur London. This book was an autobiography written by a man who had served as an important government official in the Stalinist regime of Clement Gottwald, the former Czechoslovakia's first Communist dictator. To be brief, London survived a Stalinist purge that resulted in the infamous Slansky trial. He was one of the three defendants who was sentenced to life. The other eleven defendants were condemned to death. The remaining three were eventually pardoned, and London and his family were permitted to immigrate to France, where London wrote his book (and called Stalin "the grave digger of socialism&quot . London detailed what the secret police had done to him. In other words, the book was an expose of Stalinist totalitarianism. So much for my sister's "Communism"!

I'm one of the most moderate and independent members here, but I DESPISE the John Birth Society with every fiber of my being and have ABSOLUTELY NO RESPECT for anyone who defends this pathetic group of people, who once called Eisenhower a Communist. As far as I'm concerned, my sister was performing a public service. She deserved a medal for her contriubtion to civil rights in this country. Again, I DESPISE the John Birch Society!

Forgive me for submitting such a long post and getting so emotional.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
59. Thank you so much for that personal story. I share your outrage toward this group.
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 04:45 PM
Feb 2015

Really you need to make a stand alone post of that story. It's powerful.

radicalliberal

(907 posts)
67. Thank you very much for your kind words and your kind suggestion.
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 07:14 PM
Feb 2015

I might submit an OP with the same message.

Aristus

(66,467 posts)
64. Makes me glad I have the family I do.
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 06:05 PM
Feb 2015

My mother is a classic, old-school Kennedy liberal. (She even marched in his inaugural parade). My brother and sister are all pretty far to the left, just like me, with an emphasis on civil rights, especially for the gay community. (We are all straight.)

My brother offers an interesting perspective; he is a successful businessman, but socio-economically he is very far left, which would seem to be the opposite view for a business man.

I don't know what I'd do if my blood family were right-wingers. I married into a family of conservative Republican evangelical Christians, so I need the balance. (BTW, Mrs. Aristus, despite her self-ID as a conservative Republican, actually espouses views that peg her as a moderate Democrat.)

Duppers

(28,127 posts)
73. Sounds exactly like my parents
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 09:10 PM
Feb 2015

Growing up, I dared to protest only slightly but if I had told them exactly what I thought, the consequences would have been very severe - anything from a beating to being kicked out of the house! I can identify with Claire Conner so much.

When my father passed when I was 21, there were no tears from me. He was an angry tyrant who should have been treated for PTSD when he returned from WWII. My relationship with my mother has always been a tense, distant one. She's now almost 90, yet I see her but once a year. She often drives me to drink.


muntrv

(14,505 posts)
74. I guess the JBS omits the "general welfare" part of the Constitution.
Wed Feb 4, 2015, 09:37 PM
Feb 2015

"We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence,[note 1] promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."

ClaireConner

(24 posts)
81. They don't believe in general welfare or anything about common good.
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 12:32 PM
Feb 2015

The John Birch Society and a lot of libertarians and other radical right wingers believe that the federal gov't is constitutionally authorized to do 4 things:

1. Coin money
2. Manage foreign policy
3. Organize the army and run wars
4. Maintain the post office. (And they're not so sure about that one now)

Liberals have the hardest time grasping that these people are 100% serious.

The leaders of the John Birch Society, who regularly visited my home in Chicago to meet with my father and mother, were perfectly clear on this understanding of government. The founder of the Birch Society, Robert Welch believed and preached that "all the functions of a national government should be negative." He went on to write this: "The people should always support the necessary minimum of government while the government should never support the people."

"Our national government should protect its citizens from foreign trespasses on our right, and from invasions . . . but those are the limits at which the duties and responsibilities of governments, as an almost invariable rule, should sharply cease."

Robert Welch, "What is Americanism?" Speech given iMarch 12, 1977, Los Angeles CA.

What would the US look like if this vision became reality?

Douglas Carpenter

(20,226 posts)
88. please allow me the opportunity to thank you for your book which I had pre-ordered and was able to
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 02:03 PM
Feb 2015

read soon after it rolled off the press. I was never directly exposed to the John Birch society when I was young. But some of my relatives embraced an extreme form of Fundamentalist Protestant Christianity that had just about everybody labeled as Communist. I recall my Aunt seriously believing that the relatively liberal Methodist minister in our town and many of the school teachers were Communist. I'm quite certain she believe John F Kennedy was a Communist and in her nineties thinks President Obama is most likely a Communist.

You are quite right that the modern Republican Party has been hijacked by these extremist. It's frustrating that so few grasp this reality.

abelenkpe

(9,933 posts)
77. Whoa gotta read that book
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 10:09 AM
Feb 2015

Her parents sound just like mine. My family has completely rejected me because I don't share their right wing tea party libertarian views and FOX news tells them I am the enemy.

greatlaurel

(2,004 posts)
78. I am so sorry for the behavior of your family. It is so sad.
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 10:31 AM
Feb 2015

One of the big propaganda techniques used by the right wing in the fifties and sixties was telling parents the "communists" (liberals) would turn their children against them. In a new twist on their old propaganda techniques, the right wing now uses their propaganda machine to turn older adults against their children and grandchildren.

We progressives must realize that propaganda aka marketing works and we need to get our message out there.

My parents were conservative, but it would be a cold day in hell before they let politics come between them and their children. It is extremely painful to hear how many people have fallen for this propaganda so they reject their own children. My heart breaks for you and all the others on this thread who have described similar experiences. The Kochs, Rupert Murdoch and the JBS and the right wing in general need exposed as the real anti-family perverts.

Thank you for your story.

ClaireConner

(24 posts)
80. Liberals have a big problem
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 12:14 PM
Feb 2015

Thanks so much for sharing my story here on Democratic Underground. Since my book was published in hardcover (Beacon Press, 2013), in paperback (2014) and on ebook, I've worked non-stop to tell my story and warn Democrats (and anyone else who'd listen) that the radical right has taken control of the GOP. I recognized that the "NEW" GOP talking points, rolled out by the Tea Party and mainstream Republicans are old recycled 1960s extremism, the kind preached by the John Birch Society. Because I was a witness to the rise of the Birch society -- being only 14 when I became a member -- I was sure that my story would resonate with Democrats all over the country.

I've had a first-hand, personal experience with the "hands over ears" of the left. Those who call themselves Democrats or liberals can't grasp these realities

1. The right is never kidding, never retreating, and never constrained by facts.
2. The right will, absolutely, dismantle every bit of progressive legislation from 1913 to the present.
3. The right has sold the idea that government is our biggest problem. And they've done this with almost no pushback from the left.
4. The right are radical extremists and they have a big tent for a host of folks. They specifically target certain issues to grab a specific audience and keep them in the GOP. For example: anti-abortion, anti tax, anti-healthcare, anti-civil rights, anti-education, and on and on.


Today's radical right has re-packaged old John Birch Society conspiracy theories, paranoia, hate, and fear and wrapped the whole stinking mess in phony Christianity. Armed with this snake oil, they've taken over most of the GOP and 60% of the states. Extremism has gone mainstream and the left is still convinced that we can "work" with these people.

It's impossible to find common ground with people who want to slash the government without regard to the impact on real people.
The people running the GOP and the Koch network are not conservatives or compassionate. They are dangerous extremists.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
83. Good to see you here. Glad you don't mind my sharing.
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 12:58 PM
Feb 2015

This part of your book just broke my heart. People like this do not listen, will not listen, have closed their minds.

There should have been an organized opposition to this rebirth of the Birchers, and that should have been the Democratic party.

They played from the book of the so called "centrists", never opposing, going along to get along...for way too long.

Welcome to DU.

Keep being passionate.

AND you are so right:

The people running the GOP and the Koch network are not conservatives or compassionate. They are dangerous extremists.


And we can no longer compromise with them.

ClaireConner

(24 posts)
84. Please share
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 01:03 PM
Feb 2015

Don't hesitate to share! It is only by sharing our stories and our views that we'll make a difference. Thanks again for helping me tell my story --

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
85. I have read some of your Daily Kos posts.
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 01:08 PM
Feb 2015

I post there as Floridagal. Not very often though. Been a while.

Where I live it is safe only to talk about the weather if one is a liberal. My late hubby and I left our Southern Baptist church in 2003 when they called Iraq a holy war and called us unpatriotic when we disagreed.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
87. I know what you mean.
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 01:32 PM
Feb 2015

It's hard to get attention to a post at Dkos because it is only visible a little while. There is no way to get it moved up the line again, so all the recs and posts must come soon. When you post there link to your twitter feed. That helps a little, but not a lot sometimes. I have had some posts get lots of recs while other equally good ones simple disappear.

Here at DU at least a post can be kicked to be more visible for a while. It gives fighting odds.

 

Arugula Latte

(50,566 posts)
99. We used to think Birchers were "the fringe."
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 04:48 PM
Feb 2015

But now it seems most of the Republican party embraces their extremity. It's frightening, and disheartening.

Congrats on your book!

KG

(28,753 posts)
103. please don't confuse or conflate the democratic party with 'the left'
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 05:50 PM
Feb 2015

(3. The right has sold the idea that government is our biggest problem. And they've done this with almost no pushback from the left.) the dem party since 1994 has been happy to help to help push this meme.

ClaireConner

(24 posts)
90. Do you thnk it would help if DU had a forum about radical right wing extremism
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 02:21 PM
Feb 2015

and the John Birch Society. I've been talking and writing about the Koch Brothers, libertarians, and assorted other anti-gov't types on FB, Twitter, and my blog. If you all think a forum here on DU would be a good move -- let's start one. I haven't posted enough to do it -- but many of the rest of you could.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
91. My opinion would be to keep it a General Discussion topic.
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 02:44 PM
Feb 2015

That way it gets more views and a better likelihood of getting noticed.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
94. My thoughts...
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 04:13 PM
Feb 2015

I think you should post here just as you did on DKos. Just pick some thoughts from your book, or current events that seem like things you write about. Post it to twitter, copy it to my twitter so I will be sure to see it and retweet. There are several others here who have twitter accounts, so if I retweet it they are likely to see it.

Your posts at Daily Kos were just great. I think they just dropped too quickly, like most do there.

You have so much to contribute. Every time I reread parts of your book I see something I missed before.

Glad to see you here.

I may if you don't mind post some more thoughts from my re-reading. I think it is vital that people recognize the way this group is controlling the agenda of the right.

steve2470

(37,457 posts)
98. once you get to 10 posts or so, you can post your own threads
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 04:43 PM
Feb 2015

I do think radical right wing extremism needs to stay in General Discussion. Once a topic goes into a sub-forum, it gets much less visibility and it's an extremely important topic. Thanks for all you do!

tblue37

(65,490 posts)
92. Remember the Republican crowd that cheered the "Let him die" response
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 03:03 PM
Feb 2015

about a sick young man with no money and no health insurance? Same attitude exactly.

 

Sheepshank

(12,504 posts)
95. Benson, a relatively recent Mormon Prophet was a staunch Republican
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 04:18 PM
Feb 2015

He served as the Sec of Agriculture and was a firm Bircher.


Color me unsurprised.

ClaireConner

(24 posts)
105. Reed Benson was a close personal friend to my parents, a member of the John Birch counsel
Thu Feb 5, 2015, 06:05 PM
Feb 2015

Mormons have been very open to and accepting of Birch ideas.

treestar

(82,383 posts)
109. Read the book
Sat Feb 14, 2015, 03:56 PM
Feb 2015

I was intrigued by this thread.

It is amazing how much the right wingers sound like the early 60s JBS.

Eisenhower was a communist. And of course JFK was. Even Reagan wasn't right wing enough.

The fear of the UN has always interested me. They prefer war and conflict and military might to any type of diplomacy or international cooperation.

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