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sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
Wed Jan 14, 2015, 04:37 PM Jan 2015

Why the Left is Different from the Right and why they want to stay that way.

Not all on the Right are bigoted, and not all on the Left are NOT bigoted.

However, when Bush lied this country into war in Iraq it unleased all the bigots who up to then, had to be a bit more careful than in previous times, about being openly displaying their bigotry.

9/11 happened and they got permission to return to the old days, where it was okay to launch disgusting, bigoted verbal, and as everyone surely remembers, even physical attacks at the latest 'other' group, who had tried to 'take away our freedoms'.

You couldn't go anywhere online, or to the Right Wing Noise Machine without seeing such disgusting epithets as 'camel jockeys' and 'ragheads' and much, much worse.

Even our Military Generals got in on the act: 'Treat the Iraqis like dogs'!

MUSLIMS! We had a new word for the old bigotry and every 'Patriot' joined in the action, just like old times again for them.

If ever there was a time I felt grateful to be on the Left, it was during the beginning of this ugly period.

The Left otoh, refused to broad brush an entire group of people because of the actions of a few.

Which to the mindless haters translated to 'the Left are not Patriots!' They were Saddam Lovers, traitors, singing 'Kumbaya with Terrorists'!

The War Machine was fueled by this rabid Nationalism and Muslim Americans were often the target of violence and anger.

Mindless, dangerous bigotry.

Challenges were issued to Muslims: 'Why don't you come out and CONDEMN these terrorists'? I noticed some Muslim owned businesses in our area putting up American flags, trying to show 'we are not the enemy' but irrational hatred doesn't deal in facts.

And near where I lived an Indian family who had owned a Convenience store for decades, known and respected in the area, their children born and raised as Americans, were attacked one day by mindless, ignorant bigots who couldn't tell the difference between an Iraqi and a native of India. It doesn't matter to them, they were not white and they 'all look the same' anyhow'.

I was proud of the people in our area that day. They came to the defense of that family, they held the perps until the police came. The father had tears in his eyes, thanking everyone for standing up for him, for something no one should have had to do if the bigotry had not been fueled by, at that time, mostly the Right.

I am proud to be on the Left right now. I am seeing the same thing happening again. The same arguments against the Left, who apparently should not allow the Right to maintain their role of bigoted, blind blame of an entire group of people for the actions of a few.

We are supposed to jump on that far right wagon, so we can 'win', what exactly?

Murderous fanatics committed a terrible crime, another one, in France. THEY are to blame for that.

I have zero interest in competing with the Right for just about ANYTHING frankly.

I'm more than happy to allow them to 'win' this war game where in order to keep it going, we must have an enemy.

This is the kind of human being I identify with:



Rais Bhuiyan after he was shot in the face on Sept. 21, 2001.

http://www.npr.org/2011/06/19/137283467/9-11-hate-crime-victim-seeks-to-save-his-attacker

Just 10 days after the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, Rais Bhuiyan was working at a gas station in Dallas when he was shot in the face by a man named Mark Stroman.

Stroman was on a shooting spree, targeting people who appeared to be Muslim or of Middle Eastern descent. Stroman is due to be executed July 20; Bhuiyan, the only survivor of the attacks, is fighting to save his life.


He wen through years of surgeries and his family, who were in Bangladesh, suffered more tragedy when his dad had a stroke upon hearing the news of his son's shooting.

The perpetrator of the hate crime, (are we all responsible for his crimes btw?) ended up on death row for HIS crimes.

However, Rais Bhuiyan worked with the defense to try to stop the execution.

Despite the difficulties, Bhuiyan looked to his faith in order to find forgiveness.

"According to my faith in Islam, there is no hate, no killing. It doesn't allow anything like that," says Bhuiyan. "Yes, Mark Stroman did a horrible thing, and he brought a lot of pain and disaster, sufferings in my life. But in return I never hated him."

Bhuiyan has created a website called World Without Hate to educate others about hate crimes as a means of preventing them. He's also working with Amnesty International and Stroman's defense attorney, who has filed several appeals on Stroman's death sentence.

"I strongly believe executing him is not a solution. We will just simply lose a human life without dealing with the root cause, which is hate crime," Bhuiyan says. "In Islam it says that saving one human life is the same as saving the entire mankind. Since I forgave him, all those principles encouraged me to go even further, and stop his execution and save another human life."


Revenge and hatred simply continue the vicious cycle we are now in.

I have zero interest or intention of competing with bigots to show how 'patriotic' I am.

I would much rather compete with Rais, though I'm not sure about winning that contest either. However, people like this are who I look to for inspiration to become a better a human being.



29 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Why the Left is Different from the Right and why they want to stay that way. (Original Post) sabrina 1 Jan 2015 OP
"All is Forgiven". Where did I see that written lately? Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #1
Rupert Murdoch made such a demand of Muslims recently. Someone responded by sabrina 1 Jan 2015 #11
Like it or not we are "competing with bigots". The question is, are we going to win that competition Warren Stupidity Jan 2015 #2
Competing with them? I prefer 'opposing them'. I can't think of any reason why we should sabrina 1 Jan 2015 #6
One reason is to give the terrorists what they want and respond with hate, like Bush did. Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #14
I think we are being manipulated, again. Last time the fear mongering worked so well sabrina 1 Jan 2015 #20
here!! Here!! Douglas Carpenter Jan 2015 #3
I am kicking and rec'ing your thread, which you must realize doesn't happen very much. FSogol Jan 2015 #4
Thank you, I really appreciate that! sabrina 1 Jan 2015 #5
I have nothing to say other than "I agree completely." [n/t] Maedhros Jan 2015 #7
We've seen this sort of thing throughout history. Scapegoating is easy, thinking is hard. Tierra_y_Libertad Jan 2015 #8
I like 'Boogeyman' better. It is more descriptive of what it is all about in the end. Finding an sabrina 1 Jan 2015 #27
Erect Bogeyman, wave flag, declare we need protection, give more money to the MIC. Tierra_y_Libertad Jan 2015 #29
Sadly we have a long, long way to go and all can be quickly undone when the next 9/11 rhett o rick Jan 2015 #9
Rick, my comment below was meant to be directed to you. sabrina 1 Jan 2015 #28
They are sure wringing the most fear out of the tragedy in France. And I see that more money is sabrina 1 Jan 2015 #10
White folks are never terrorists, Sabrina, not in the agenda to mention the danger of white terror. Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #15
The Corporate Media sets the agenda. As I pointed out, we have heard nothing about the boming sabrina 1 Jan 2015 #17
Look at this unreported American terrorist. The media can not even dare to call him an extremist: Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #18
They would call him a terrorist if doing so could them support for one of their wars. sabrina 1 Jan 2015 #21
I disagree a bit stupidicus Jan 2015 #12
I'm not sure we do disagree. I completely agree with your first sentence, which I stated in the OP. sabrina 1 Jan 2015 #13
I wasn't "sure" either sabrina stupidicus Jan 2015 #16
Me too stupidicus. As I said it was after seeing appeals to do what they do, which is inconceivable sabrina 1 Jan 2015 #19
K&R for the original post and JEB Jan 2015 #22
Mark Stroman Executed: Texas Man Received Death Penalty For Killing Store Clerk oberliner Jan 2015 #23
Thank you for that. I didn't know whether or not he had been executed. I remember the attacks sabrina 1 Jan 2015 #24
Quite an interesting story oberliner Jan 2015 #25
Very interesting link. At first I thought he had not succeeded due to the date, 2011. But in the sabrina 1 Jan 2015 #26

Fred Sanders

(23,946 posts)
1. "All is Forgiven". Where did I see that written lately?
Wed Jan 14, 2015, 04:45 PM
Jan 2015

The message of the Hebdo cover is being manipulated by the media once again to cover for their own lack of coherent logic in wanting apologies from the Muslim religion for the actions of mad men and refusing to see their own double standard.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
11. Rupert Murdoch made such a demand of Muslims recently. Someone responded by
Wed Jan 14, 2015, 07:01 PM
Jan 2015

Last edited Thu Jan 15, 2015, 12:54 AM - Edit history (1)

agreeing with him 'as soon as the West apologizes for all the terror they have rained down on other nations'.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
6. Competing with them? I prefer 'opposing them'. I can't think of any reason why we should
Wed Jan 14, 2015, 04:59 PM
Jan 2015

compete with those who foment hatred, who work in every way they can to stomp on the poor, the disable and the elderly.

I want to defeat them by opposing them strongly and working to take away the power they grabbed after 9/11 by electing Democrats who are not afraid of them, do not want to be 'bi-partisan' with people who view that as weakness.

Fred Sanders

(23,946 posts)
14. One reason is to give the terrorists what they want and respond with hate, like Bush did.
Wed Jan 14, 2015, 07:25 PM
Jan 2015

The Hebdo cover set back that effort immensely.

And the cover is not of the Prophet, who has met him and say that is what he looks like....it is a racist caricature of an Arab Muslim.

"All is Forgiven" is the big title of the cover, barely mentioned.

The cover is of forgiveness in the end, indentical to the same authors cartoon after Hebdo was firebombed years ago...also never mentioned.

Has anyone asked the author, who also recently blasted the American media as hypocrits?

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
20. I think we are being manipulated, again. Last time the fear mongering worked so well
Wed Jan 14, 2015, 08:56 PM
Jan 2015

70% of Americans supported the invasion of a country that had nothing to do with 9/11. Blind fear, and when the Left tried to explain why Iraq could not possibly have supported Al Queda, the reaction was 'traitor' 'terrorist supporter'.

The propagandists couldn't do it alone, it requires many people to help them. Using fear of 'losing' to the Right appears to be one of weakest reasons I've seen so far.

 

Tierra_y_Libertad

(50,414 posts)
8. We've seen this sort of thing throughout history. Scapegoating is easy, thinking is hard.
Wed Jan 14, 2015, 05:36 PM
Jan 2015

"The Jews..", "The Catholics..", "The Protestants...", "The unbelievers..", "The Muslims...", "The Indians..", "The Blacks..", "The Communists..", "The Unions..", etc, etc, etc.

It would be easier to just call the lot "The Bogeymen" so the fear mongers and bigots don't have to strain their feeble brains.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
27. I like 'Boogeyman' better. It is more descriptive of what it is all about in the end. Finding an
Thu Jan 15, 2015, 02:10 AM
Jan 2015

enemy and then creating hatred for the enemy. Without that, they couldn't get support for their madness, because war is madness, especially when it isn't necessary, when it is for profit.

 

Tierra_y_Libertad

(50,414 posts)
29. Erect Bogeyman, wave flag, declare we need protection, give more money to the MIC.
Thu Jan 15, 2015, 02:51 AM
Jan 2015

Works every time. Especially when they toss in "God Bless America" and constipated looking "experts" and generals bedecked in tinware.

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
9. Sadly we have a long, long way to go and all can be quickly undone when the next 9/11
Wed Jan 14, 2015, 05:55 PM
Jan 2015

happens. It might not have been planned by the Deep State but it sure worked well for their agenda. It wouldn't surprise me if we have another.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
10. They are sure wringing the most fear out of the tragedy in France. And I see that more money is
Wed Jan 14, 2015, 05:59 PM
Jan 2015

being requested for our 'war against Isis' apparently with 'boots on the ground' AGAIN.

Terror is better by far, than the old Commie threat. For one thing it is never ending, there always will be 'terrorists'.

Have you noticed that not one word has been said about the OTHER terrorist attack far closer to home? The bombing of the NAACP?

Fred Sanders

(23,946 posts)
15. White folks are never terrorists, Sabrina, not in the agenda to mention the danger of white terror.
Wed Jan 14, 2015, 07:27 PM
Jan 2015

Home born terrorism is a greater threat than home grown terrorism and "sleeper cells" that seem tonever get the wake up call.

Give the people fear and then offer solutions to save them. The solution offered is always war.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
17. The Corporate Media sets the agenda. As I pointed out, we have heard nothing about the boming
Wed Jan 14, 2015, 08:04 PM
Jan 2015

of the NAACP eg. THAT is a much greater threat to citizens of this country than what happened in France, but they never miss an opportunity to use such tragedies to promote MORE war.

I can't even bear to watch the MSM anymore, it is like something you read about when you were a kid regarding how the Soviet Union, or Germany managed their media, constantly using fear to control their populations.

It's all fear mongering. Measles outbreaks, Ebola outbreaks, Flu outbreaks, Terror threats etc etc.

And their solution for Terror has been an abysmal failure. We are apparently in MORE danger than we were before Iraq, which they are essentially saying.

Yet, people still buy into doing MORE of what FAILED, which is why they keep doing it.

It's just amazing how they get away with it.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
21. They would call him a terrorist if doing so could them support for one of their wars.
Wed Jan 14, 2015, 11:37 PM
Jan 2015

That is why they reserve the word right now for people from the ME. If they called every terrorist a terrorist, we would all be confused about what terrorist justified all of our wars.

 

stupidicus

(2,570 posts)
12. I disagree a bit
Wed Jan 14, 2015, 07:06 PM
Jan 2015

I've long thought and argued that the rise of islamophobia in this country since 9/11 explains in no small part the inroads that the racists have made from the fringes they were previously all but confined to.

I've thought and argued equally as long, for something akin to this. http://crooksandliars.com/2015/01/former-conservatives-liberals-need-learn

All that "turning the other cheek" stuff is just an invitation to get them both slapped off, and using their rhetorical tactics (particularly when the truth is jn our side) hardly makes us "just like them".

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
13. I'm not sure we do disagree. I completely agree with your first sentence, which I stated in the OP.
Wed Jan 14, 2015, 07:24 PM
Jan 2015

I am also far from 'turning the other cheek' to right wing morons, quite the opposite. I am appalled at how our own Party Leaders eg, cater to them, talk about 'bi-partisanship and compromise' when what is needed is the exact opposite, imo. It's embarrassing to be led by people who appear to be afraid of these bullies on the right.

I clicked your link and completely agree with this:

I call on my fellow liberals to embrace the rough stuff. Engage in battle with people who hate you and feel free to throw crazy right back, even if you only half believe it. Let it out and taste it on the way by. See if it flies. If it doesn’t, screw it — just fix it up next time. Refer to your political opponent as “the honorable shithead from New Jersey.” Use the words, images and for god’s sake, the passion of the street. People who hate and fear you will always hate you unless they die out, change their minds or we can beat them in a heated contest of ideas. You’re not playing checkers — and they’re winning by giving zero shits about reality, so cut the crap and fight like you mean it.


The OP was in response to people here on DU bemoaning the fact that we on the Left are 'ceding the battle to the Right' because we refuse to engage in their black and white thinking. In this case, join them by 'admitting' that all Muslims are responsible for the actions of a few criminals.

I believe in calling them bigots, and have to their faces. Not joining them because they 'are winning' some kind of battle.

To see people even here, suggesting we join the Right on anything, let alone their despicable bigotry is exactly what is wrong with Dems, go along with the Right because if we don't, they will win'?? No thank you! I like the sentiment in the excerpt above, 'cut the crap and fight like you mean it'! Yes!
 

stupidicus

(2,570 posts)
16. I wasn't "sure" either sabrina
Wed Jan 14, 2015, 08:01 PM
Jan 2015

but am glad that we don't. I based that primarily on the part about "not becoming the hater/bigot" they are stuff. Like you I'm "sure", I find a big diff between intolerance for their intolerance, and their intolerance, and I don't need hate for an individual or a collection of them to express it. Defense and protection of those they hate is my motive.

good post by the way...

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
19. Me too stupidicus. As I said it was after seeing appeals to do what they do, which is inconceivable
Wed Jan 14, 2015, 08:45 PM
Jan 2015

to me. And the Left needs to get really tough on these people. I have no problem with that. That kind of bigotry needs a clear and unapologetic, extremely strong response from the Left. No matter what names they pull out of their bag of talking points. We have to get over the 'what will the Right say' nonsense. Of all the people in the world whose opinions should matter least to us, they are the ones that come to mind.

The Left operates on the defensive. Not everyone, but there seems to be fear of upsetting them. I could not care less about upsetting people who need to be upset.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
23. Mark Stroman Executed: Texas Man Received Death Penalty For Killing Store Clerk
Thu Jan 15, 2015, 12:45 AM
Jan 2015

HUNTSVILLE, Texas -- A Texas inmate was executed Wednesday for killing a Dallas-area convenience store clerk during a shooting spree that he claimed was retaliation for the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks.

Mark Stroman, 41, said hate in the world needed to end and asked for God's grace shortly before the fatal drugs began flowing into his arms at the Texas Department of Criminal Justice Huntsville Unit. He was pronounced dead at 8:53 p.m., less than an hour after his final court appeal was rejected.

Stroman claimed the shooting spree that killed two men and injured a third in late 2001 targeted people from the Middle East, though all three victims were from South Asia. It was the death of 49-year-old Vasudev Patel, from India, that put Stroman on death row.

The lone survivor, Rais (Raze) Bhuiyan (Boo-yon), unsuccessfully sued to stop the execution, saying his religious beliefs as a Muslim told him to forgive Stroman. The courts denied his requests.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/20/mark-stroman-executed_n_905292.html

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
24. Thank you for that. I didn't know whether or not he had been executed. I remember the attacks
Thu Jan 15, 2015, 12:52 AM
Jan 2015

after 9/11. I'm sorry he was executed. It seems he was learning that hate doesn't solve anything. He certainly got a powerful lesson from Rais Bhuiyan.

He might have been able to do some good in prison, teach others not to take the road he took.

We waste so much human life.

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
26. Very interesting link. At first I thought he had not succeeded due to the date, 2011. But in the
Thu Jan 15, 2015, 01:07 AM
Jan 2015

updates on the left at the top of the page, his most recent update was Nov of last year, he is still working on the documentary. Apparently someone else is making a movie about the story and has asked him to be an adviser due to all of his work on the story. They have also offered to help fund his documentary so he can finish it and release it at the same time as the movie.

It is worth donating to imo. Apparently there was a real transformation in the man.

Thanks again for the link. Forgiveness can be a powerful thing.

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