"Ali burned some people who retreated from islam"

[FrodosPet]

http://muflihun.com/abudawud/39/4337

Sunan Abu Dawud Book 39 Number 4337

‘Ikrimah said:

‘Ali burned some people who retreated from islam. When Ibn ‘Abbas was informed of it, he said: If it had been I, I would not have then burned , for the Messenger of Allah (PBUH) said: Do not inflict Allah’s punishment on anyone , but would have had killed them on account of the statement of the Messenger of Allah (PBUH). The Apostle said: Kill those who change their religion. When ‘All was informed about it he said: How truly Ibn ‘Abbas said!

[geek tragedy]

1. Thumbs down. nt

[Fred Sanders]

2. Playing the "whose holy book is more full of murder references" game? Ludicrous.

[oberliner]

3. Agreed

The Old Testament wins that game hands down.

[stevenleser]

7. The Koran has basically the whole old testament in it. nt

[oberliner]

8. Are you sure about that?

I thought the Koran was a later, separate book.

[JI7]

12. Islam came from Judaism and Christianity

[stevenleser]

13. Yep, I'm sure. I was given one as a gift a number of years back and read it.

I'm not going to say it has every book, and the word "Allah" is substituted for "God", and the names are "arabiscized" but yes, it's got most of the Old Testament books in it. IIRC it also discusses Jesus whose name in Arabic is Isa.

So, almost all of the Old Testament, discussion of Jesus and then lots of additional stuff added by Mohammed.

[oberliner]

14. Good to know

That for the information.

[stevenleser]

15. You're welcome. I worked for a company contracted by Motorola to put up cell towers 20 odd years ago

and many of the engineers on site were Iranian or Arabs from the M.E.

I had some great chats with them. When I left, they gave me as a gift what was obviously a very expensive copy of the Koran that had some of the nicest leather binding I ever saw. I was very curious about this religion that is so controversial so I dove in and read it. And I recognized all of the old testament stories from Hebrew School.

I think one of the issues with Islam is that it is so young and has not had time to mature. Most of the same crazy stuff that Islamic fundamentalists believe should be done to people with stoning and such comes from direct old testament Levitican passages copied to the Koran. Jews 3000 years ago used to do that stuff, stoning, etc. But Judaism has had 5000+ years to mature and has had top Rabbis get together and say we're not doing those kinds of things anymore because we aren't perfect enough to really know if someone is guilty and thus deserving of the harshest punishments (that was basically the ruling, 2000 years or so ago).

Islam has had only 1500 years and has not gone through the refinements where top folks have said we're not doing the crazy stuff anymore.

[oberliner]

16. Maybe they should talk to some rabbis?

Perhaps they can encourage moving things along a little more quickly.

[stevenleser]

17. 100 years ago that might have been possible. The great antipathy between the religions is a recent

development and a sad one.

IMAMs are not going to take suggestions from Rabbis at this point, particularly the fundamentalists ones.

[Fumesucker]

4. I kind of think of it as "Who takes their holy book most seriously?"

As a lefty atheist living among almost entirely right wing Christians I can tell you it's a bit culturally isolating, I can't imagine how bad it would be living somewhere like Saudi Arabia and not be part of the Islamic faith.

[oberliner]

9. Exactly - and how familiar are they with what the books say

For instance, a lot of American Christians say they take the Bible literally but don't really know what is in it exactly.

[seveneyes]

5. And the Darwin award goes to...

those who can discover how to survive in a world of chaos. Survival is a the very first step.

The meaning of life means nothing if life means nothing.

[MohRokTah]

6. "Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones."

Psalms of David, 137 : 9

[FSogol]

10. Unrec.

[NewDeal_Dem]

11. Who is this "ali"?