Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 01:14 PM Dec 2014

Alfie Kohn's very angry rant about ed reform. Says Obama has intensified what Bush began.

I think I will sit back, have some coffee, and watch this very real truth disappear down the rabbit hole or wherever.

Hat tip to educator Steven Singer on Twitter

A: What is the purpose of education?

B: To raise test scores.

A: Why?

B: To raise corporate profits.



Listen closely to his words about STEM and why it is crowding out subjects like literature and history.

Who in the world is Alfie Kohn?

Kohn has been described in Time magazine as "perhaps the country's most outspoken critic of education's fixation on grades [and] test scores." His criticisms of competition and rewards have helped to shape the thinking of educators -- as well as parents and managers -- across the country and abroad. Kohn has been featured on hundreds of TV and radio programs, including the "Today" show and two appearances on "Oprah"; he has been profiled in the Washington Post and the Los Angeles Times, while his work has been described and debated in many other leading publications.

Kohn lectures widely at universities and to school faculties, parent groups, and corporations. In addition to speaking at staff development seminars and keynoting national education conferences on a regular basis, he conducts workshops for teachers and administrators on various topics. Among them: "Motivation from the Inside Out: Rethinking Rewards, Assessment, and Learning" and "Beyond Bribes and Threats: Realistic Alternatives to Controlling Students' Behavior." The latter corresponds to his book BEYOND DISCIPLINE: From Compliance to Community (ASCD, 1996), which he describes as "a modest attempt to overthrow the entire field of classroom management."

Kohn's various books have been translated into Chinese, Japanese, Korean, Spanish, German, Italian, Swedish, Dutch, Polish, Romanian, Bulgarian, Portuguese, Arabic, Hebrew, Thai, and Malaysian. He has also contributed to publications ranging from the Journal of Education to Ladies Home Journal, and from the Nation to the Harvard Business Review ("Why Incentive Plans Cannot Work&quot . His efforts to make research in human behavior accessible to a general audience have also been published in the Atlantic Monthly, Parents, and Psychology Today.

His many articles on education include a dozen widely reprinted essays in Phi Delta Kappan from 1991 to 2008. Among them: "Choices for Children: Why and How to Let Students Decide," "How Not to Teach Values: A Critical Look at Character Education," "Test Today, Privatize Tomorrow," and "Why Self-Discipline is Overrated."


Crossposted at my Twitter link

38 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Alfie Kohn's very angry rant about ed reform. Says Obama has intensified what Bush began. (Original Post) madfloridian Dec 2014 OP
knr roody Dec 2014 #1
Notice also that improving your test scores rock Dec 2014 #2
You are so right. madfloridian Dec 2014 #8
I had a bad dream the other night. In the dream I was back in school taking a test. I'm 62. Enthusiast Dec 2014 #14
..... madfloridian Dec 2014 #17
Thank you for pointing this out. nt LWolf Dec 2014 #9
His prescient article from 2004. Test today, Privatize tomorrow. madfloridian Dec 2014 #3
The object of education should be for every child to get a doctorate. hay rick Dec 2014 #4
the cries have been "STEM shortage! STEM shortage!" for a decade now (or has it been three?) MisterP Dec 2014 #11
Well said. madfloridian Dec 2014 #20
for Sputnik's decennial World Book called the increased student workload "a crime against MisterP Dec 2014 #22
Ironically, we produce 2x the engineers that China or India do Nevernose Dec 2014 #12
Yes. And for some kid whose talent destines him to be a great jazz musician or a classical JDPriestly Dec 2014 #27
We need an ''A'' to transform STEM into STEAM. Octafish Dec 2014 #37
Thanks, had not seen that. madfloridian Dec 2014 #38
this is the person to read about education "reform", ellenrr Dec 2014 #5
"education deform by predatory vultures" Well said ellenrr madfloridian Dec 2014 #6
thank you. the 'deform' part is after Clinton's deform of the welfare system, ellenrr Dec 2014 #7
Thanks for posting this, MadFloridian kiva Dec 2014 #10
Kick FloriTexan Dec 2014 #13
.... madfloridian Dec 2014 #19
Kicked and recommended! Enthusiast Dec 2014 #15
k&r for exposure. theaocp Dec 2014 #16
bookmarked daleanime Dec 2014 #18
K&R The society based on production is only productive, not creative. Albert Camus Tierra_y_Libertad Dec 2014 #21
..... madfloridian Dec 2014 #23
... Tierra_y_Libertad Dec 2014 #25
I am a big fan of Alfie Kohn, but his ideas on education are so different from current practice gollygee Dec 2014 #24
Agree with you on many of his issues. madfloridian Dec 2014 #26
I wish I taught in his world. It would be awesome. Goblinmonger Dec 2014 #32
Kics nt kiva Dec 2014 #28
K&R Starry Messenger Dec 2014 #29
..... madfloridian Dec 2014 #30
Happy New Year! :D Starry Messenger Dec 2014 #31
..... madfloridian Dec 2014 #33
KnR. nt tblue37 Dec 2014 #34
Can you say "Arne Duncan"? Scuba Dec 2014 #35
K&R for the original post and subsequent informative posts and links. JEB Dec 2014 #36

rock

(13,218 posts)
2. Notice also that improving your test scores
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 01:31 PM
Dec 2014

Does NOT raise your intelligence significantly nor make you less ignorant. Both are exactly what the politicians want. I should point out while I'm on the subject that managers will be pleased too as they want 'potatoes' (i.e. non-distinguishable commodities) for workers. Why would a minimum wage worker offer anything more than that?

Enthusiast

(50,983 posts)
14. I had a bad dream the other night. In the dream I was back in school taking a test. I'm 62.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 03:32 PM
Dec 2014

Test taking can be traumatic.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
3. His prescient article from 2004. Test today, Privatize tomorrow.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 01:38 PM
Dec 2014
Alfie Kohn's 2004 article.."Test today, Privatize tomorrow"..coming to fruition with Arne Duncan.

Test Today, Privatize Tomorrow

“FREEDOM” FROM PUBLIC EDUCATION

I try to imagine myself as a privatizer. How would I proceed? If my objective were to dismantle public schools, I would begin by trying to discredit them. I would probably refer to them as “government” schools, hoping to tap into a vein of libertarian resentment. I would never miss an opportunity to sneer at researchers and teacher educators as out-of-touch “educationists.” Recognizing that it’s politically unwise to attack teachers, I would do so obliquely, bashing the unions to which most of them belong. Most important, if I had the power, I would ratchet up the number and difficulty of standardized tests that students had to take, in order that I could then point to the predictably pitiful results. I would then defy my opponents to defend the schools that had produced students who did so poorly.


Do you see that?
1. Discredit public schools.
2. Call them "government" schools.
3. Sneer at teachers and call them out of touch.
4. Ratchet up number of tests and keep making them harder.
5. Point to the ones who do poorly.
6. Ignore the ones who did well.

hay rick

(7,626 posts)
4. The object of education should be for every child to get a doctorate.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 01:42 PM
Dec 2014

Then nobody would have to flip burgers or collect the trash.

The emphasis on STEM education is a substitute for discussing the declining availability of decent-paying middle class jobs in our economy. A "good" education (vocational preparation for a high-paying job) changes individual outcomes but does nothing to change the continuing decline of median wages in our society as a whole.

MisterP

(23,730 posts)
11. the cries have been "STEM shortage! STEM shortage!" for a decade now (or has it been three?)
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 03:16 PM
Dec 2014

to the point where it's the new English degree (with a minor in Movement): the notion is being pushed by the same people demanding more visas and even bringing white slaving back to SF

"STEM education" is also a great cover for slashing art, music, and humanities programs (and there's some ideologues saying we shouldn't teach history until we get to the biochem (and that they be in charge of the history to boot))

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
20. Well said.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 04:31 PM
Dec 2014

Just like the cries about failing schools....started strongly when Reagan's Nation at Risk was published. We teachers looked at each other and wondered what they meant by failing schools. Heck our schools were doing great. But propaganda repeated over and over with no one defending it.....works quite well.

MisterP

(23,730 posts)
22. for Sputnik's decennial World Book called the increased student workload "a crime against
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 04:54 PM
Dec 2014

a generation" sparked by the '57 panic and Loren Eiseley called it the "Invisible Pyramid", saying space/STEM was absolutely important but not the *only* thing and not go all deMille building it: now this was when the US was still in a boom and Fordist (if you were white enough, though LBJ was expanding that)

but even after Rachel Carson and the failure of industry and science to win Vietnam and even the financialization of every damn thing under the sun and the reinforcement of school districts (Compton pays for its own schools, Bel Air for its), art and music were still permitted in schools and programs--but they're always the first to go, and each "STEM panic" twists the tourniquet a little. bit. tighter. each. time. (some have even said "we have science: who needs history or philosophy?&quot

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
27. Yes. And for some kid whose talent destines him to be a great jazz musician or a classical
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 05:55 PM
Dec 2014

violinist, STEM is really just a way to LOWER his or her self-esteem.

It's ridiculous. We should encourage children who are talented and capable of becoming engineers and mathematicians to go that route. But measuring children with standardized tests throughout their schoolyears is a waste. It is in many cases counterproductive. Just minimizes the value of other talents.

And a lot of the intellectual skills that STEM education focuses on are likely to become less important as computers and electronic gadgets do more and more of the tasks those skills are required to do.

My father was great with a slide rule. People don't need them that much any more. Computers have replaced the slide rule. Computers do the work the slide rules used to do -- but much better and much faster.

And spell-check? We all use that (although I still make a ton of mistakes when I write).

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
38. Thanks, had not seen that.
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 01:47 PM
Dec 2014

Interesting. I can't imagine schools without language arts and art and music.

ellenrr

(3,864 posts)
7. thank you. the 'deform' part is after Clinton's deform of the welfare system,
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 02:44 PM
Dec 2014

but you probably figured that out.

kiva

(4,373 posts)
10. Thanks for posting this, MadFloridian
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 03:13 PM
Dec 2014

The emphasis on STEM is maddening - if students can't read the damn books, articles, and blogs, what good are they? If students have no idea of the context of these facts, how useful are they? And if students have no sense of morality - defined by me as public good - then what use are they to society?

gollygee

(22,336 posts)
24. I am a big fan of Alfie Kohn, but his ideas on education are so different from current practice
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 05:04 PM
Dec 2014

that it's unlikely they will ever be put in practice. Such as, he does not believe schools should give homework, issue grades, or have any kind of competition including sports.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
26. Agree with you on many of his issues.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 05:20 PM
Dec 2014

I think many of his stances could be more moderated.

Trouble is people who are having more impact today are to other extreme....way way to the other direction.

His stances at least are not dangerous to true learning. The ones imposing their beliefs now truly are harmful.

 

Goblinmonger

(22,340 posts)
32. I wish I taught in his world. It would be awesome.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 10:08 PM
Dec 2014

But I think what Kohn does do is at least push things a little closer to his side even though I think he fully realizes his vision will never be seen. He makes people think and question their practices.

 

JEB

(4,748 posts)
36. K&R for the original post and subsequent informative posts and links.
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 12:38 PM
Dec 2014

Thanks for keeping us informed on this vital subject.

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Alfie Kohn's very angry r...