How can there be justice in Ferguson if there is no trial?

[randys1]

How often does a DA defer to a GJ on murder or manslaughter indictments?

Pretty rare, isnt it?

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

1. An indictment is basically a finding that there is probable cause

to believe that the person indicted committed a particular crime. It is the equivalent of a criminal complaint and is required by the 5th Amendment to the Constitution before a person can be tried for a serious crime: "No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury..." In other words, an indictment is a prerequisite for a trial. If the grand jury doesn't indict the person the Constitution does not allow him to be tried for the crime. Whether that result is "justice" in the Ferguson case is another question - but if there's no indictment there can be no trial.

I don't know what the law is in Missouri, but in my state only first-degree murder requires a grand jury indictment; lesser offenses like second-degree murder and manslaughter can be charged by complaint.

[randys1]

3. Exactly my point, it never would have been first degree so he could EASILY have been

indicted for 2nd degree and manslaughter without a GJ

The racist prick DA went to the GJ so he could blame someone else

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

5. Wouldn't surprise me in the least if that's what happened.

The DA might indeed have been too much of a coward to charge murder 2 and the included manslaughter charge (which could also be proved more easily than murder 1). I don't expect anything good to come out of this.

[mathematic]

6. 1st degree murder is one of the charges they're considering

And its strange, to say the least, to say that a grand jury harms the cause of justice.

[randys1]

7. It was clearly not first degree murder, he should have been indicted for 2nd degree

and if they can include lesser charges of manslaughter for safety

1st degree i thought requires some premeditation and this was not that

[mathematic]

8. MO they use the word "deliberation"

I don't know what that means in a technical legal sense but I could see how the scenario where wilson shoots brown after he's run away that there's some deliberation involved.

http://www.moga.mo.gov/statutes/C500-599/5650000020.HTM

[avebury]

10. Not only that by the DA's office is making the GJ try

to figure out what level of crime that Wilson might have committed with no assistance from them. The DA's office has totally walked away from their responsibility. Why one earth even have anybody from the DA's office be at the GJ hearing. They should have just let the GJ jurors have free rein to question the witnesses.

[TheKentuckian]

2. Who said there would be? This is the USA, here we have "Just Us" and cops are part of the "Us" as

they are the security forces for the rich and powerful.

[randys1]

4. Dave Marsh says the police exist to protect the rich from everybody else

[TheKentuckian]

15. That is correct.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

9. Ina grand jury the DA pretty much has free rein.

There is no defense counsel, discovery of evidence, cross examination or other such instruments. If a DA cannot prove the case -- all but unchallenged -- then there is no hope of a trial conviction with all the defenses the accused is entitled to muster.

[Dreamer Tatum]

11. The title is District Attoney, not "God" or "Judge, Jury, and Executioner"

if a GJ is not impressed by the DA's evidence, it will not indict. This is subject to law in MO, but that
is the gist of it.

You already have your mind made up, however, so "justice" has a different meaning for you.

[loyalsister]

12. If it happens at all, it's rare

This DA should not have anything to do with this case. It should have been immediately transferred to the state AG's office.
I talked with an attorney about the route his clients take. Arrest> indictment> trial>verdict (with a possibility of a plea bargain to change the course after an indictment.
o take this case to a grand jury was a radical shift, and I have not gotten clear answer as to why the DA did it.

[ctaylors6]

13. most high-level felonies in St. Louis County go thru grand jury

according to person quoted in this article: http://news.stlpublicradio.org/post/whats-grand-jury-how-will-it-work-ferguson-case

"Marcia McCormick, who teaches criminal law at Saint Louis University Law School, says most of the high-level felonies in St. Louis County go through the grand jury. In addition, grand juries are almost always used in cases of alleged police brutality because they allow the prosecutor to gauge the credibility of witnesses."

The article probably answers a lot of your questions about the grand jury procedure, particularly in this case.

This case was presented to an already-sitting grand jury, by the way.

Generally two different procedures are used pre-trial to assess sufficiency of evidence - preliminary trial and grand jury. I think the article explains the difference.

FYI, grand jury indictment is required for all federal felony charges

[Ykcutnek]

14. They're trading the peace and security of an entire city to protect one murderer.

Unreal.

[TheKentuckian]

16. Incorrect, they are protecting many murderers particularly a whole slew of future ones

They are protecting a corrupt power structure and the absolute right to subjugation of the people.