Father invites daughters rapist to dinner then tortures and kills him.

[ForgoTheConsequence]

Furious over the alleged rape of his 14-year-old daughter by a 45-year-old married man, the father called the man to his house on Friday night, treated him to dinner and then tortured him to death, police said. He then went to the police station, surrendered himself and gave police a detailed account on how he tortured and murdered the man.
The 36-year-old reportedly burned the man’s genitals using heated tongs and then strangled him to death. The incident was reported from Northeast Delhi’s Khajuri Khas area on Saturday.
Based on the man’s statement, police said the deceased, a medicine supplier, had allegedly raped the man’s minor daughter two months ago. The father did not approach police fearing “a bad name for his daughter”.



http://indianexpress.com/article/cities/delhi/man-calls-daughters-rapist-home-tortures-and-kills-him-say-police/#sthash.kSssGKAm.dpuf

[mythology]

1. How very Titus Andronicus of him

But while I can understand the sentiment, that isn't the way to get justice and now his daughter may grow up without her dad being able to be an active presence in her life.

But we as a species need to find a way to get past the idea that the victim is at fault for rape, or any other crime. Especially in a case where the victim is a 14 year old kid.

[Xipe Totec]

3. I will grind your bones to dust And with your blood and it I'll make a paste,

And of the paste a coffin I will rear
And make two pasties of your shameful heads,
And bid that strumpet, your unhallow'd dam,
Like to the earth swallow her own increase.
This is the feast that I have bid her to,
And this the banquet she shall surfeit on;

[Recursion]

34. Romans, friends, followers, favorers of my right:

Great, great, great play...

[KingCharlemagne]

84. But revenge is a dish best served cold. - nt

[Drunken Irishman]

11. In India there isn't much justice for rapists, sadly.

[Recursion]

35. Is it much better outside of India?

[Crunchy Frog]

51. Yes.

[Recursion]

52. Having lived in the US and India I have no idea how to compare sexual violence rates.

If you have a workable rubric I'm all ears (seriously).

[Tuesday Afternoon]

68. not really, although I don't see many(any) Fathers in the US taking this route. Not saying I approve

just saying.

[JI7]

2. fearing "a bad name for his daughter"

so what ignorant types think was more important to him than getting justice for her at the time.

does he think what he did is somehow better ?

now she has to deal with what happened to her and her own father being a piece of shit and the "bad name for her father".

[RandySF]

4. I want to say it's a terrible thing.

But if something like that happened to my child, I'd probably daydream about about torturing the per.

[Logical]

6. I think quite a few fathers would want to do the same thing! But resist. nt

[wyldwolf]

13. I'd daydream about it but I'd definitely confront the guy

[stevenleser]

46. To paraphrase Chris Rock, "I'm not saying I would have done it, but I understand" nt

[lpbk2713]

5. Come in to my parlor said the spider to the fly.

I wouldn't give the late perp much credit for a lot of wisdom in accepting that dinner invitation.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

69. IKR !! Not only mean but, a dumbass to boot. wow.

[tonedevil]

7. I'm assuming Dad told the perpetrator he had a...

CASK OF AMONTILLADO the best he'd ever had. I would hope I would restrain myself, but I can see how that could drive me to wrong deeds.

[LeftInTX]

8. Worth reading the article for the comments

[Crunchy Frog]

9. Understandable given the context.

This is India, where rape is normally consequence free. This might at least give pause to other would be rapists in the area.

[flvegan]

10. I find it almost astonishing how the DU treats the word "alleged" with such whimsy.

I don't blame the father in light of any facts, none of which seem to be presented here. Not that it seems to matter here.

[JonLP24]

22. You could say that for any article on a freshly charged individual

I was a huge "Best Defense" Jami Floyd fan several years ago so I basically used her advice on the first few "so-and-so charged with this" threads but after the derailments I choose more to topic on the issue the discussion topic is at-hand. While the facts or lack therof presented her may not be true or a little off or missing key info, it certainly is possible -- a set-up followed by torture session by father on daughter's rapist and a discussion could be interesting. I can't count how many times someone said "if someone did this to one of my kids I'd..." (post #4! is another that I just saw after I originally posted this) and the range such as laws, morals, torture, etc.

[Bluenorthwest]

32. Deleted

I was confused and my comment does not apply...

[Dorian Gray]

12. Geez

It sucks that in India you can't depend on the police to do their job, and this man tortured and killed another man. Holy hell this is sad and insane and horrible.

I'm glad he turned himself in. There isn't much more I can say about this. The whole thing is terrible.

[FLPanhandle]

14. As a father of daughters, I applaud the man

If the police did nothing, I would be mightily tempted to do the same.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

17. If you don't report a crime to the police, of course they will do nothing.

[TexasProgresive]

23. How about when the police have a history

of doing nothing or worse making life miserable for the victim?

[Donald Ian Rankin]

24. Not reporting a crime is a legitimate choice. Murder is not.

And using "the police didn't do anything about it" as an excuse for murder a) doesn't work, ever, and b) especially doesn't work if you didn't tell the police.

Private citizens cannot be allowed to substitute their personal judgement for jury trials; "he was a bad person" can never be allowed to be an excuse for murder.

[TexasProgresive]

31. I never suggested it was (murder) a legitimate choice.

But desperate people will resort to desperate measures.

A man who sexually assaulted my grandaughter over several years is in prison. Had the CJ system not worked I may have put this guy down- It would've been a clean death, no torture, that's not my style.

[BubbaFett]

87. Murder is a choice

not the best choice, but still a choice.

[Maedhros]

86. As a father of daughters, I can't in good conscience "applaud" the torture and murder

of another human being. That would call into question my own humanity.

[bemildred]

15. See? That's how you do it. nt

[Donald Ian Rankin]

19. Nonsense. At every step, this was completely wrong.

1) He didn't report the rape the police.

2) Vigilanteism is wrong - insert all the obvious arguments about presumption of innocence, jury trials etc here.

3) Even if you are certain that they victim was guilty, and deserved what he got, and are fine with vigilanteism, this crime will still have cost his daughter her father's support for many years to come, and probably made the whole episode even more traumatic and hard to recover from for her.

This was about as bad and stupid a course of action as was available to him, and applauding it is appalling.

[bemildred]

20. Yeah, take it to the police. That will work. nt

[Donald Ian Rankin]

21. At least it's not worse than nothing, which this was.

Reporting it to the police would have been a little better than nothing - rapes of minors by strangers are among the categories more likely to result in a conviction, but even so India's record in this respect is not stellar.

This, though, was massively *worse* than not doing anything - it will have exacerbated the harm done by the rape.

If one were writing a textbook of "what not to do if your daughter is raped" then entry #1 would be "blame her for it", but this would almost certainly be #2.

[bemildred]

28. Actually it is nothing, going to the police is just like doing nothing. nt

[Donald Ian Rankin]

33. There are two obvious responses.

1) In the West, this is clearly not true. I can't comment informedly for India, but I rather doubt it's true there either (although I'm quite prepared to believe that the difference is not large). And trying to convince people that it is true is going to result in fewer rapists going to prison, and more rapes.

2) Even if it is true in India, nothing would still be a lot better than this.

[seabeyond]

44. "In the West, this is clearly not true." about 3% of rapists spend any time in prison.

https://www.rainn.org/get-information/statistics/reporting-rates

2) Even if it is true in India, nothing would still be a lot better than this.

easy for the man who is not being raped, to say

[Donald Ian Rankin]

48. Do you worry that you're a caricature?

> easy for the man who is not being raped, to say

Yes, it's very easy for me, or anyone else, to say that depriving a child who has probably been raped of her father, and potentially making her worry that it's her fault that he has gone, is a bad thing.

"You are a man, how dare you comment on this" is not a feminist opinion, it's a silly right-wing caricature of a feminist opinion. Thankfully, most feminists have more sense, but it's sad that the stereotype is not completely unfounded.

[seabeyond]

50. yes. you put out a rw cariacture of feminists, or me, and then blamed me, lol. you made two points

i countered the two points.

then you go one about a whole lot of garbage.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

53. Pointing out that I am a man is *not* "countering a point". N.T.

[seabeyond]

54. a man that does not have the same experience with rape and the threat of? i think it is.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

56. Go and look up "Bulverism". N.T.

[seabeyond]

58. and i disagree. as a matter of fact, for me merely pointing out the two flaws in your argument,

that i saw, you used the bulverism in your first reply to me. creating your caricature of me, and then trying to arrive at an argument to what i said, thru that.

bulverism that.

lol

have a good day. i am out of this game.

[bemildred]

55. People who abuse women and girls need to be dealt with.

Women are the future of our species, without them we got nothing. I'm not a violent man, but people who abuse children, who are not respectful of women and children and their feelings, to this extent, I'd be happy to turn myself in afterwards. They are not property, they are not placed here for you to use just because you want to.

The West, despite its illusions of grandeur, is no better than most, and worse than some, when it comes to how it treats women and children. Our economic systems are exploitive to the core, they conflate sex and money all day long, we conflate EVERYTHING with money, Fuck the West. Don't tell me about "The West". We need to get off our fucking high horse and stop all this dishonest political shit while we still have something left worth saving here.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

59. I'm afraid I think that is a faith-based, not an evidence-based, position.

If you look at objective measures of the wellbeing of women and children, you'll see the West massively outperforming the rest of the world on many of them and at least holding its own across the board.

Rather than "getting off our high horse", we should actively promote the superiority of Western to most non-Western cultures in most (by no means all) ways and looking for ways to encourage and help the rest of the world to be more like the West in most (by no means all) respects.

[bemildred]

60. RIght, the West says the West is better than anybody else.

You aready mentioned that.

[seabeyond]

63. i provided that only 3% prosecuted here in the u.s. instead of addressing that he called me a ...

feminist.

how dare i think that is what we feminists should be discussing.

this is really a good subthread. take the battle out of it, and just sit in the thinking of it.

the nation wide rapes, the president addressing in colleges, the lack to no sentencing, gang rapes, videod and distributed on line to humiliate, towns turning on the victims. lol

rape as our "wests" entertainment.

ya. lets teach india.

[bemildred]

65. Hi there.

We've talked before I believe.

[seabeyond]

70. ya ya ya

of course we have. and some have been good, i know. not that i remember shit. we agree and disagree if i remember correctly. but, i will be damn if i can remember a single thing. lol.

that is what happens as we get old.

[bemildred]

71. We agree, but I don't get in flame wars over it.

Being a large, older, white man, it's less personal for me. But remembering when I was a small, young, white boy, I know quite well what it's like not to be treated with respect.

[Arugula Latte]

80. Going to the police there is probably worse than nothing because the woman would have

probably been blamed and shamed.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

29. If by 'it', you mean

demonstrate that you're just as barbaric and evil as the other guy, sure.

It's 'I/P'ism, with people feeling that just because a barbaric act of violence was committed against you or yours that you're justified in committing barbaric acts of violence in return. It does not end violence, it merely expands upon it.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

36. I wouldn't say "evil", just "stupid" and "criminal".

I wouldn't condemn him on abstract moral grounds without having been in his shoes.

Yes, what he did was illegal, and will have made things massively worse for his daughter, and for all I know the guy he murdered may have been innocent, and he needs to be punished. But I don't know that I'd call it "evil" if he - rightly or wrongly - believed that his daughter had been raped; certainly not as evil as raping a 14-year-old.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

61. Yeah, I'm going there. Torture is evil.

There's no 'shoes'. Torture is an evil act, period. You torture some guy to get the code to stop him from blowing up a million people, the torture part was still evil, no matter the outcome.

[Live and Learn]

73. +1 nt

[Donald Ian Rankin]

16. Which will, of cause, make the whole episode less likely to traumatise his daughter.

Even leaving aside all the obvious arguments about jury trials, vigilanteism, the presumption of innocence and so on, the fact that this is probably going to cost his daughter her father's presence and support for many years, and make the whole episode even more traumatic and harder to recover from for her, makes this spectacularly stupid and irresponsible parenting.

[JonLP24]

18. This isn't something I'd condone

especially torture but I certainly am aware how probable something like this would happen in right situation, right time, and you figure law prevents this (but I imagine some cops looking the other way or even providing assistance as they do use discretion in all sorts of different situations -- someone may get a ticket while someone else will get off with a warning.

[gollygee]

25. The daughter needs her father

she's going through hard stuff and now, instead of having his support, has to deal with his trial and jail time instead.

[IdaBriggs]

81. On a good note, she doesn't have to live in terror of answering the door

when the rapist comes to call again.

And bonus - he can't rape anymore children, can he?

Not a perfect solution, but definitely a win there.

[JustAnotherGen]

26. This was in India?

The framework of the justice system as it regards to sexual violence astounds me. May these high profile incidents continue to shed light on the very real issue there.

[treestar]

27. We'll never know if the guy was actually guilty or not

Since the father appointed himself judge and jury.

[Blue_Tires]

72. +1

[IdaBriggs]

83. You may not know. The victim does.

Any reason you can come up with why a 14 year old girl who lives in a society where her life is pretty much over if she is publicly branded a rape victim who was threatened, but still found the courage to tell the truth the day of the attack, would lie about something like this?

[treestar]

91. What?

Number one, rape does not carry the death penalty, even in India. Secondly, we do not punish people here merely on accusation. I'm sure there is some justice system of some kind even in India.

[Mike Nelson]

30. The father's anger...

...is easy to understand. His sadism is not.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

37. No, the sadism is very easy to understand too, just not to justify.

[Phentex]

66. I agree...

I can respect his feelings but I cannot endorse his response.

[liberal N proud]

38. As a father of two girls, I can understand his rage

You want to protect your girls no matter what. I can see how this man was raged into this act.

However, no matter what one would like to do to the scum who hurt your little girl, you have to let the law handle it.

[n2doc]

39. Indian "justice" is very misogynic

People seem to think that he would have received justice by going to the police.
Read this:

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/india-twice-raped-teenage-girl-was-burnt-alive-by-attackers-west-bengal-1430747

Maybe the Father feared this sort of outcome.

[IdaBriggs]

40. What a great dad - no sarcasm. Truly brings tears to my eyes.

It is India, and the belief that a rapist will get away with it due to the cultural shaming of the victim is pretty much commonly acknowledged. This man did something, when "suck it up, buttercup - get thee to therapy!" is the prevailing view.

Best therapy is a dead perpetrator.

The first thing I love is that the father BELIEVED his daughter when she shared a traumatic event. That is not always the case.

Next, he decided on what was important to him - keeping her safe. Since the rapist had gotten away with it once, the 14-year old girl was in constant danger / stress because she knew it could happen again, and the man would be able to over power her.

So dad decided that he would not get a chance to do it again.



The odds are good this wasn't the first time this entitled rapist got away with raping a young girl.

The world is better off with this rapist gone.

In a perfect world, the rapist would have been prosecuted and punished by society, but since that world does not exist, I can only applaud this loving, protective father who has surrendered his own freedom to protect his teenage daughter, as well as his future victims.

Unfortunately, more parents don't take such steps to protect their children, and we end up with multiple generations of victims of sexual violence (even here in the United States).

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025519661
Rape Culture in the Alaskan Wilderness
One night a few years ago, when Geneva was 13, a man she’d grown up with stumbled into the room she shared with her two sisters in Tanana, Alaska, a tiny village northwest of Fairbanks, and climbed on top of her. He was stumbling drunk and aggressive.

“He tried getting into my clothes,” she recalls. “He tried putting his hands under my shorts and inside my shirt.” She struggled and pushed, but he was years her senior and made of muscle; he pulled her on top of him. She kept pushing and yanking until she suddenly shot backwards and tumbled off the bed. “He was so blacked out, he was like still asleep; his eyes were closed,” she says. “I was watching his face, but his face didn’t move at all. His breathing was normal, but his hands…” She pauses, and the word hangs thickly in the air. “His hands felt like he was awake.”

Afterward, she ran into the living room and burst into tears, stuffing her face into a pillow so her parents wouldn’t hear. She didn’t tell them, then; she was scared and ashamed. “I guess I just felt like I was dirty. I guess that’s what victims feel like. They feel dirty and just want to clean everything off.”

The following summer, Geneva was fast asleep at her family’s fish camp downriver, while a group of adults drank and caroused in the next room. She awoke to someone tugging down her pants, reaching between her legs; she struggled and kicked, and he lumbered out of the room.

http://www.theatlantic.com/features/archive/2014/09/rape-culture-in-the-alaskan-wilderness/379976/

I have never heard of a rapist who only did it "once".

My opinion. Your mileage may vary, and I won't reply to the inevitable "shame on you, you big meanie!" posts.

[KitSileya]

45. On May 17th, 1954, in Little Rock, Arkansas, a father told his daughter,

who had just narrowly escaped being raped on her way home from school: "We ain't going to no police. They're liable to do something worse to her than what already happened."

That was the US 60 years ago. That little girl is still alive, and her name is Melba Pattillo Beals, one of the brave Little Rock Nine.

That liberal Americans can't understand that sometimes, going to the police is NOT an option shows an astounding lack of awareness of their own past and present that is disgraceful. We can discuss whether taking justice into one's own hands is right or not, whether torturing a rapist is right or not, but this naive belief that going to the police is always a solution is very typical white and male privilege. Anyone frequenting DU should definitely know it, just by seeing the headlines on Ferguson, Trayvon Martin, Michael Brown, Eric Garner, John Crawford, and the recent reports of cops raping women, making rape jokes, and so on.

We never stop working for a society in which taking matters into your own hand is unnecessary, but we acknowledge that for minority groups especially, that day is not yet come, and that society not yet achieved.

[ecstatic]

47. +1000. No disagreement here. nt

[ileus]

41. the torture was probably unnecessary.

[dembotoz]

42. do hope he got the right guy.....

[Tatiana]

43. It's India. The man would likely have never seen justice for his daughter.

She would have been shamed or made to feel as if she had "enticed" this married man.

While I can't excuse murder, I do understand why the father did what he did.

Maybe this will give other potential rapists in India something to think twice about.

Moreover, the man turned himself in to authorities and recounted what he had done. This tells me that justice for his daughter was his sole motivation. He didn't try to cover up or hide the crime.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

49. Your statement that you can't excuse murder is out of place in a post doing so. N.T.

[CBGLuthier]

57. The people applauding this make me sick.

vigilante justice is wrong. He did not even try to get regular justice so he was wrong.

If instead of raping her he had molested her would people applaud this too? Perhaps just a catcall in the street and cut off only one of his testicles.

No moral high road for any of you.
Sickening.

[Douglas Carpenter]

62. +1000

[Live and Learn]

74. +1 nt

[closeupready]

64. Let's play devil's advocate and take the father's side:

Wouldn't you want to hold off on vengeance until AFTER the outcome of a trial? Or even if it happened that the courts were not going to charge him?

From the standpoint of going Dirty Harry, this was stupid timing. At the same time, I don't think anyone would be able to argue this was first degree murder - a crime of passion, yes, absolutely.

[dilby]

67. As a father I understand.

This father killed a man and justly so. This man raped a minor who was home alone and used threats of violence against her, hopefully the police will look into any other women who may have been victims of him. I don't condone murder however the father took responsibilities for his actions and turned himself into police, hopefully he will get a lenient sentence.

[MineralMan]

75. Where justice is not officially served, people will

serve themselves. Such is the case throughout the world, really. Many men have died at the hands of an angry father in similar circumstances, even in the United States. It happens here less often than it once did, but it still happens.

In India, apparently, rape charges do not often end in justice being officially served. In this particular case, an outraged father went to an extreme to serve that justice, as far as he knew. He then turned himself in to authorities, and will no doubt be punished for his actions. How many times does a similar thing happen but isn't self-reported? Many, I suspect, where there is no official justice.

I cannot condone this sort of justice. I can understand it, though.

[eissa]

76. What a great story to start off my Monday

Especially after viewing this over the weekend:

https://www.linktv.org/programs/india-a-dangerous-place-to-be-a-woman

[LittleBlue]

77. Assuming the guy actually raped the daugther

Nothing of value was lost. Hopefully the father gets off the hook somehow.

[Dreamer Tatum]

78. Confirms my eye rolls when people say they're against the death penalty nt

[Sheldon Cooper]

89. Are there specific people in this thread, who have publicly stated

that they are against the death penalty, yet are applauding the rapist's death? Can you prove your statement?

[riqster]

79. I hope the girl was not further traumatized by her father's actions.

My sympathies are entirely with her; not with a rapist, not with a murderer. Hope she gets the support she needs and deserves.

[bluestateguy]

82. I do not condone what the father did

I do not condone it.

That's about as far as I am willing to go.

[WillowTree]

85. If he voluntarily showed up for dinner with the father of his victim.......

.......then he was too stupid to live in the first place.

[RedstDem]

88. that father treated him better than i would have

but I'm a bit devious...

[True Blue Door]

90. Yikes. Definitely not a solution to India's rape problem.

Vigilantism invariably sweeps up the innocent as well as the guilty.

And even in the case of the guilty, that's obviously not justice - not even from a thoroughly brutal, eye-for-an-eye perspective.