SMART move by a local bike shop -- others should pay attention

[LuckyTheDog]

OK, so I wanted a new bike for the first time in 20 years. I went to a local shop and found one that I liked (I had test-ridden it about a week earlier). It was on sale for about 20% off (which was very good) but not in stock. They said I could buy it at that price and they'd call me when it came in. That was alright by me, but I decided to check out another, nearby shop.

Shop #2 had fewer items on sale, but was aware of the sale being held by Shop #1.

I told Shop #2 about the Trek I looked was interested in. They didn't have it because they don't carry Treks. But they did have a Specialized in stock that was just a bit nicer (better rear derailer, nicer hand grips, better tires and rims) than the Trek and priced $120 more. I test-rode the Specialized and liked it, but was reluctant to shell out an extra $120 because it was hard enough to fit a new bike into my budget.

Then Shop #2 did something smart. They told me that, if the Specialized were to go on sale, they's probably lower the price my as much as $80 and wanted to know if I'd buy it that day if they lowered the price by that much.

That sounded OK, but it turned out that they didn't have the black one in the frame size I wanted. All they had was the grey one that I test-rode. And I really liked the black. THEN, the sales person said "take the grey one and we'll throw in the kickstand for free."

Shop #1 lost a sale and Shop #2 gained one -- simply because they wanted my business more.

This was Shop #2: http://www.bikesbladesandboards.com/

[HopeHoops]

1. Confused: You can get a kick stand for $4 at K-Mart.

And why the fuck don't all bikes come with them now?

More bike gripes:

1) Quick release tires are worthless on mountain bikes since you can't get the fucking tire through the brake pads without deflating it.

2) The kickstand thing.

3) Non-round frame parts look cool, but accessories don't fit well on them.

4) Why the hell don't they make mirrors that let you see behind you?

5) No fucking fenders. What the HELL is up with that?

6) Fuck clip-shoe pedals. If I want to be locked into a bike I'll use duct tape like in "Breaking Away".

7) Skinny little ball splitter seats are useless. I want to sit on my ass, not my gonads.

I've got more, but I'll leave it at that for now.

[LuckyTheDog]

2. It was not the kickstand itself, it was the willingness to throw it in

It saved me either the $15 it would have cost me to buy it there or the trouble of buying one at Kmart and installing it myself.

The bike I purchased was a hybrid -- nice, wide seat, upright seating position, normal pedals. Based on your set of gripes, you really should look at hybrids.

On edit: You are right, though, every bikes should come with a kickstand. The bike store people claim that the purists don't like them. But most people aren't purists.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

3. Not only that...

You can always buy a difference seat. They're not that expensive. I did...then my bike got stolen.

[LuckyTheDog]

4. I made numerous modifications to my old Schwinn over the past 20 years...

I added a better seat, put on a rack, added an extender to raise the handlebars.

But after a while, I just had to accept that the bike that worked for me at 29 was not the bike I needed at 49. So I reluctantly broke down and replaced my beloved Schwinn Sidewinder.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

7. They have this cute little bubble gum pink Schwinn

at Target I really want. It is just a simple hybrid, there are no gears to deal with, and it's just awesome. I dream of getting it and putting a basket on it. LOL

[HopeHoops]

8. I learned on a Schwinn Sting-Ray (banana seat), then a Typhoon, and then a Sprint.

They were all damn good bikes. My kids all have Schwinn's, but unfortunately they are made in China now. The welds are pretty pathetic but they hold together. The shifters are all Shimano and they work well.

[adigal]

24. I loved my StingRays with banana seat

and foot brakes, and tassles hanging down from those big handles - monkey handles?? I don't remember. I am 50 now, and I don't remember when they stopped making those very cool bikes!!

[HopeHoops]

27. They have a new one out now - not as cool. Ours had squared off rear tires.

They were a bitch to find back then. I'm about your age. Same bike. DAMN good wheelies!

[uncle ray]

37. ape hangars.

i believe that's the phrase you were looking for.

[HopeHoops]

6. My wife and I have our own bikes, but we also ride a tandem.

The tandem weighs about 8 lbs, has five speeds, (fenders), lights all over the place, mirrors everywhere, a double rear basket, and snowmobile saddlebags tied to the baskets. When we open it all up it looks like a dressed Harley. We've had it for 25 years and still ride it. When the kids were young we threw a trailer on the back so we were trucking about 17' of bikeage down the road. We would take her shopping and come home with about 100 lbs of food (we had a front basket at the time also).

My wife's bike is a racer - 1 1/4" 80lb tires. She rides it to work. Mine's a mountain bike a friend gave me. It works. I still prefer the tandem, but those 25 year old tires need to be replaced. The sidewalls are cracking and I don't want to deal with that in the field.

[Javaman]

9. Had you riden a Trek in the past?

And how is the feel of the Specialized as compared?

I currently have a Trek Hybrid. It's my second one. My first one was stolen.

I'm just curious.

[LuckyTheDog]

16. I test-rode both and found the Specialized to be pretty comparable to ride

The Specialized seemed to be built a little better. But really, you can't go wrong with either brand.

[lame54]

12. it's the purists who are their steady business...

not the one time shopper

although all patronage is important

[appal_jack]

10. The QR tires thing has a solution

1) Quick release tires are worthless on mountain bikes since you can't get the fucking tire through the brake pads without deflating it.

Every mtn bike that I 've seen lately, whether the lower end models with V-brakes, or the higher end models with disc brakes, all have quick release brakes as well. I didn't realize this on my mtn bike (with V-brakes) until my awesome bicycle ninja girlfriend showed me. It would be tough to explain, but it involves pushing back the little rubber boot, then pinchng a spring/wire underneath. Once the brake is released, removing the rim without deflating the tire is a cinch.

My bike shop also sold me some fenders that are tough enough for trail riding, and I still use the old style pedals, so just about everything you want can be done, albeit at some cost...



-app

[HopeHoops]

11. The main use for the quick release is taking the front tire of when locking it.

I solved that problem 2 decades ago - I got a huge length of cable and two lead cable clamps and made my OWN fucking cable. It's long enough to secure the tandem (both wheels and frame) to something five feet away and can easily do the same with any smaller bike. MasterLock rules.

[frylock]

18. quick release is mainly so you don't have to carry wrenches with you..

makes it a lot easier to switch out a flat.

[HopeHoops]

21. I keep wrenches in the flat kit along with the patch and spare tube.

Getting the fuckers off the rim is the bitch.

[frylock]

29. oh yeah, i carry some rather long, metal tire levers..

try unseating some of those downhill tires if you're really looking for a fun time! reseating those beads is no picnic either.

[Brother Buzz]

47. The main use for the quick release is to remove the tire to fit the cycle in an automobile.

Every kid know that!

[HopeHoops]

55. I've never driven anything small enough that it wouldn't accept a bike.

Even the tandem (10' tip-to-tip) will fit in the back of the minivan.

[frylock]

17. sheldon explains it here:

http://sheldonbrown.com/canti-direct.html

[Romulox]

23. Sheldon was/is a treasure. RIP. nt

[frylock]

31. indeed

[DotGone]

14. Sounds like you want a custom commuter bike

Companies know that kickstands, seats, and pedals are the first things removed by the owner and replaced by what the owner likes. For bike shops, the enthusiasts are their clientele and the above applies to them. I know shops who will customize the bike for their customers but that's extra $$$.

2) Kickstands are evil, blood drawing devices. If you're just putzing around town, they may come in handy if you don't like laying the bike up against something or the ground. For mountain biking or road cycling, those things are waiting to impale themselves into your leg when you crash. There's also nothing like crashing when the kickstand comes down on a turn. It is also extra, useless weight for the gram watchers.

4) They do make mirrors that clip to eyeglasses, helmets, or can be attached to the handlebars. They don't include them since most people don't want them and if they do, they would have a preference of what type they want. Simple turn of the head does the same thing and let's drivers know (along with hand signals that drivers no longer understand) that you're about to make a turn.

5) Pretty much only people who commute in the rain want fenders. Roadies don't since they're extra weight and slows them down. Mountain bikers are gonna get dirty anyways.

6) I hate clip pedals but as I mentioned, pedals are the first things replaced so companies put cheap clip pedals on their bikes. Pedals are a personal thing and riders put their own on.

7) See 6. Seats also get replaced with one of the rider's preference.

[HopeHoops]

19. Whoa, whoa, whoa. I use a bike to get from point A to point B. That's it.

[frylock]

22. weight weenies is the preferred nomenclature

[frylock]

15. simply unhook the noodle from the arm link..

that will allow you to remove the tire without issue. kickstands?! that's what a wall is for.

[HopeHoops]

20. Do you think FSM would approve of unhooking the noodle?

[adigal]

26. Only if his noodly appendage gets out of line! LOL!! n/t

[HopeHoops]

28. You'll have to talk to MFM about that. Speaking of which, where the fuck is he?

[Fumesucker]

30. If you really want to be comfortable on a bike get a recumbent or semi recumbent..

This is my setup, it's a semi recumbent and it's like riding a barcalounger compared to a regular bike, even a cruiser.

Much, much easier on the back, neck and butt..

[Romulox]

33. Dude, I've wanted to "get bent!" for some time! Nice rig. nt

[Lizzie Poppet]

38. Point-by-point:

Hmmm...

1) Quick release tires are worthless on mountain bikes since you can't get the fucking tire through the brake pads without deflating it. - Pull the "noodle" (the little bent tube the cable goes through right at the brake caliper) outward while pulling the caliper inward...that caliper "half" can then detach from the cable and the two halves move farther apart. Takes about half a second...

2) The kickstand thing. Most riders seldom leave their bikes unlocked (to a rack or suchlike). A kickstand is extraneous.

3) Non-round frame parts look cool, but accessories don't fit well on them. Agreed. If you're going to accessorize, it's not a bad idea to look for a bike with round frame tubes. You'll have more accessory options

4) Why the hell don't they make mirrors that let you see behind you? There are a bunch of mirror options on the market.

5) No fucking fenders. What the HELL is up with that? Very few bikes won't take fenders. Even full-on racebiles can use Raceblades. They don't come stock on a lot of bikes because so many riders are "fair weather" riders. I live in Portland, so my day-to-day bike has 'em, for sure!

6) Fuck clip-shoe pedals. If I want to be locked into a bike I'll use duct tape like in "Breaking Away". Flat pedals have their place (BMX, casual riding, etc.), but once you learn to pedal in a full circle rather than in alternating downward motions, you never go back. Clip shoes/pedals are way, way more comfortable than toe straps.

7) Skinny little ball splitter seats are useless. I want to sit on my ass, not my gonads. Those wide "comfort" seats are only comfortable for pretty short rides. Beyond that, well...chafing. In the inner thigh. Need I say more? A seat really only needs to be as wide as your "sit bones" to be comfortable.

[Canuckistanian]

53. I totally agree on points 6 & 7

Especially for long, extended rides.

Having toe clips/straps is MUCH more efficient and easier to accelerate with.

And those big wide seats that look SO comfortable in the store? You'll be ditching them after ONE ten-mile ride.

[Whisp]

49. heh, that was pretty good :)

I used to ride a bike to work a few years ago and really enjoyed that - but it was an old timey bike, no fancy stuff. I don't think I'd like a brand new bike at all.

[qb]

5. That's one benefit of buying from local shops. I got a great deal at a local fitness store

because the manager matched what it would have cost me (price + shipping) to get the same equipment online.

[Romulox]

13. Normally, people don't put kick stands on nice bikes. For several reasons.

#1: where, precisely, will you be standing your $500 - $3,000 bike? In front of the 7-11?

[frylock]

25. i had to do a triple-take the other day..

some maroon left his $5000 Specialized Roubaix unlocked in front of the sushi place. i keep my bikes locked with a cable even in the garage!

[Romulox]

32. I'm the same way--I'm riding my bike, or it's put up in my house.

Kickstand? I don't think so!

This thread/your user name reminds of one of my favorite ATHF. I think it's "The the", where Frylock moves out and joins the biking club...good times...

[frylock]

35. the ep where they all get conjunctivitis..

that's such a good season. was watching the frat alien episode from season 2 just the other day!

[MagickMuffin]

34. DH and I have our own little bike business: vintage Schwinns Crusiers, Road bikes, Mountain

I suppose we would have never expected to be in the bike biz but here we are a year later and as of right now selling a lot of bikes. I have a thread in the DU bike forum that explains how we came about our good fortune.

Hubby will spend up to 3 hours sometimes talking with people. He knows how to sell the best bike for the right person. One gentleman in his 70's wanted a bike, he spoke with hubby several times. His step son talked him into a new bike, he bought one rode it a few weeks and ended up contacting us and buying a vintage Schwinn. He it.

Hubby will also customize the bike, anywhere from custom paint job, to new chains, awesome tires from several colors. You name it he will please our customers.


I ride a vintage 3 speed Sears and Roebuck made in Austria awesome black with colored accents, black fenders, gold chain, black front basket that holds my doggy purse I made, rear chrome rack, and new tires black with reflective stripe.








These pics don't have my new tires on them. They have the original until I had a rear blow out while out riding.

I also have a vintage Raleigh Sports 3 speed that is very similar to my S&R, but is a little larger than my S&R and was in very sad shape when we bought her. However, she is still a great bike.


I MY BICYCLES

[LuckyTheDog]

42. NICE!

Those bikes are things of beauty.

[Romulox]

46. 2nd that emotion: sweet bikes! nt

[Honeycombe8]

51. I love your bike! nt

[Proud Public Servant]

36. I'm confused by this anecdote

Shop #1 lost a sale and Shop #2 gained one -- simply because they wanted my business more.

Shop #1 had exactly what you wanted at the price you wanted, but not in stock; they were nevertheless willing to guarantee the price while you waited for the bike to come in. What more could they have done for you? Any why does Shop #2's willingness to hard-sell you a product you didn't want as much (wrong color, cost more even after the discount) make them the better choice?

[LuckyTheDog]

41. Let me explain

At Shop #1, I test-rode a small-frame version of a Trek hybrid bike (Bike #1) but decided I needed a medium-sized frame. They told me the bike was not in stock in that size, but talked me into testing a similar Trek -- same frame, slightly better components. The size felt good, but I decided I could not afford (and didn't need) the upgrades. The salesperson told me to come back in a couple weeks when the Bike #1 would be in stock in the size I wanted -- and on sale as well. So, I marked my calendar.

When I came back, they told me that the bike I wanted was, indeed "on sale," but still not in stock in the medium size. So, the choices they offered were: 1) pay more for the slightly better bike I test-rode on my first visit or 2) wait for some undetermined amount of time. I didn't exactly smell a bait and switch attempt. I just got the idea that they were disorganized.

Because of that, I went back to Shop #2 (which I had visited earlier in the shopping process) just to check them out again because -- why not? They could not have been nicer. There was no hard sell.

Shop #2 told me they could not come down low enough to match the price of the Trek I wanted. But, they could sell the Specialized to me to less than I would have paid for the more-expensive Trek. After thinking it over most of the day, I decided that the better components on the Specialized were well worth the extra $40, so I went back to Shop #2 and told them I'd take it.

The color thing was a bit of a snag, but was never going to be a deal-breaker. I was happy that they offered me anything on account of that.

[Proud Public Servant]

43. This little detail was missing from your first post

When I came back, they told me that the bike I wanted was, indeed "on sale," but still not in stock in the medium size. So, the choices they offered were: 1) pay more for the slightly better bike I test-rode on my first visit or 2) wait for some undetermined amount of time. I didn't exactly smell a bait and switch attempt. I just got the idea that they were disorganized.

Now I get it; I probably would have done the same thing you did. Thanks for the clarification.

[LuckyTheDog]

44. I should have been more clear (nt)

[Honeycombe8]

52. I was wondering that, too. nt

[taught_me_patience]

39. Don't buy Specialized

They are happy to use bullshit tactics to stifle competition.

Here's a slap suit they tried in order to squash a legit startup:
http://velonews.competitor.com/2012/01/news/an-expensive-dollar-volagi-owes-specialized-1_203443

Aggressive tactics to prevent dealers from carrying competitor's products (suit was dismissed):
http://www.bicycleretailer.com/news/newsDetail/5940.html

According to the court documents, Specialized issued an addendum to its dealer agreement asking dealers to agree to no longer purchase or sell Giro cycling shoes, and that Bell “suffered and continues to suffer an increasing decline in market share as a result."

[frylock]

40. my LBC (Big Ring Cyclery in La Mesa, CA) was once a Specialized shop..

but they dropped Specialized for the very reasons you've outlined.

[Noodleboy13]

45. Nothing like that new bike smell either.

Hope you have fun with your new purchase. Here in Mpls we have a lot of bike shops, both new and used, and I always found that some of the smaller shops will bend over backwards if it means a sale, or do simple adjustments and repairs on the super cheap. That's why I will return to them.

And in the words of the late great Freddy Mercury: "Get on you're bikes and ride!"

peace
Noodleboy

[Whisp]

48. I really detest bartering

I wish the price was just the price and leave it at that and not to some bartering skills some have and others don't want to bother with.

Automobile sales are the worst for this. It's like a kids game with adults money.

lol. edited for typo

[LuckyTheDog]

50. BTW... in case anybody is curious... a photo

[rucky]

54. Would you bargain like that at a department store?

just curious.

[LuckyTheDog]

56. If I thought it would work, sure

But $7.40-per-hour clerks at Sears usually don't have the same authority to bargain as the owner of a bike shop. I have gotten big stores to sell me something better at the same price when an advertised item was not in stock. I have gotten discounts on slightly damaged merchandise. But that's as far as department store personnel usually can go.

The better comparison is: Would I bargain like that at a car dealership? And the answer is: Of course I would.