There’s a Kind of Workplace Discrimination No One’s Talking About

[RandySF]

As the executive director of Philadelphia’s non-profit Center for Advocacy for the Rights and Interests of the Elderly (CARIE), Diane Menio’s job is to improve the quality of life for older people. Through advocacy, education, training and counseling, her organization helps older people in an increasingly challenging landscape, providing “direct assistance to the elderly, their families, and professionals in the aging field.”

How much of an issue is ageism today?

Ageism has always been out there and we don't talk about it much. I think there's more of an effort lately to get older people in the media and so on, but I think most of us aren't feeling positive about aging, period. When I was young I looked at older people and never thought I'd be there. But guess what? It happens. Even people who are getting older often don't think kindly toward other older people. A lot of volunteer programs are bringing younger people together with older people and hopefully that's helping a little bit. But who knows?

How about workplace discrimination against older people?

You only have to look at the unemployment numbers to see that the numbers of people over 50 who are unable to find another job are greater than those who are under 50. I work at a non-profit and I'm happy to hire older people and there are other non-profits that are as well, but in the private sector it's much more challenging to get a job.



http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/prudential_living_longer_project/2014/08/there_s_a_kind_of_workplace_discrimination_no_one_s_talking_about.html#!/

[Laelth]

1. k&r for labor. n/t

-Laelth

[cilla4progress]

2. People ARE talking about

The law firm where I work (who focuses on workplace discrimination representation) has a case where 7 employees of a nursing home were terminated - all over age 40 (which I believe is the cutoff under federal age discrimination laws) and all with lots of tenure and benefits (accrued leave).

The other form of discrimination that I see that isn't addressed is - believe it or not - looks or attractiveness discrimination! Looking forward to for the time when this makes it into the law...

[ChazII]

15. Facially different people

have a more difficult time finding jobs because many in the public do not want to look at them. This happens often in the restaurant industry.

[cstanleytech]

16. It happened to my brother recently. After 18 years with the grocery chain he was with they fired him

and many other older full timers claiming there was a lack of work and immediately hired younger part timers at half the pay.

[tazkcmo]

26. Mine too.

Won't mention the name but he's also a member here. He's doing well now having landed another job that actually pays more and with a much better outfit.

As for me, I'm over 50 and am mostly a food service worker. It's very difficult to get hired now despite my decades of experience.

[cstanleytech]

27. Mine is still looking and has been turned down multiple times. Even tried for the new whole foods

that is opening here on the 23rd but rejected him and from the looks of it they seem to be bringing in most of their full timers from out of the area rather than hiring them locally

[TheMastersNemesis]

3. Ageism Is Pandemic And Was Put On Steroid Since Reagan. And No One Will Intervene.

Age discrimination is viewed by business as a right of doing business. Workers are now like aging athletes, once you are too old to compete you are DONE. The GOP believes that discrimination practices of all kinds are part of a business man's right to do business any way he or she or they want.

If you do not believe that go back to 1900 where such a belief was the dominant theme. Nothing has changed in 114 years. Business still believes it has that right and that is part of the code meme "getting government off of people's back. The problem is that most Americans to not understand that idea is in place today. It is the same idea as "work at will". That is they can fury you any time the please and let you go even after many years of service. You can be cut off and abandoned without warning and without means.

The entire GOP and business agenda is that YOU ARE ON YOUR OWN PERIOD.

[elehhhhna]

6. Ditching older (45+) workers is all about supressing health insurance premium increases

Risk Management says you need to scram, oldies! BTW, insurance companies offer consulting to their corporate clients in - guess what? Risk Management!

The biggest driver of this tactic? it's the insurers, guys. Best guess - it's well over half the reason mature workers are routinely cut. This antitrust pricefixing health insurance cartel has also sucked up most of ya'll's wage increases FOR THE PAST 15 YEARS.

[MH1]

8. Sure would be nice if we could break the link between employment and health insurance. nt

[Dont call me Shirley]

33. And stealing those pesky pensions

[lunatica]

4. My bosses are so inclusive

That they hire their family members and the family members of friends all the time. The vast majority of which have no experience at all and are promoted within months of being hired.

I'm telling the literal truth.

I work in UC Berkeley.

edited to add my place of employment

[Demobrat]

11. I thought you were going to say

you work for the city of Oakland.

[tularetom]

5. Employees are merely replaceable parts in the machine

The experience you have gained in your years of employment, the investment they have made in training you, how you fit in with your peers, you institutional knowledge of the workplace and its history, all of these mean nothing to management if you can be replaced by a pliable kid who will work for half of what they paid you and more importantly, won't ask any embarrassing questions.

It's why capitalism as it's practiced in the US is ultimately doomed to failure.

[madville]

7. My employer discriminates by

Requiring that employees be able to climb a 120 foot tower and be able to fit through small openings even though we rarely do those tasks. This pretty much eliminates older and overweight people.

Many federal positions won't hire individuals over the age of 36 due to mandatory retirement ages later down the road, those are mainly law enforcement and firefighting positions.

[marym625]

9. It's amazing what people get away with

If you look at commercials today, it is obvious getting old is BAD! And shame on anyone that let's it happen! Try finding a job when you are a female over 50 who can't afford all the crap that makes you look a couple years younger.

I have had problems in my extended family with elder abuse. No one gives a shit. The police say it isn't their problem. Call the elder abuse agency. The Elder abuse agency actually outright lied about going to investigate. The hospitals and nursing homes involved didn't want to get involved. To the point they allowed files to be stolen and didn't press charges.

Get old in the US and you might as well crawl in a hole

[Dustlawyer]

32. My girlfriend's 93 year old "Auntie" is being abused by her much younger sister and her family.

They cancel her doctor's appointments repeatedly and will not let anyone speak to her alone. She is fed Raviolios while the family eats a home cooked meal. We called Adult Protective Services who sent an investigator (investigator my ass) who asked her in front of the whole family if she thought she was being abused, she of course said "No." She has to stay there after he leaves. That was it, case closed, no abuse!

[marym625]

37. I'm so sorry

I understand exactly what you are going through. It's horrible.

My cousin abused her mother. Played the game with social security. Moved her around from home to hospital to nursing home to hospital, etc always just before they would cut off social security. In the meantime she got her mother to sign power of attorney, and a trust while she stole every dime from my aunt. She actually hid my aunt from her sister, my mother. Couldn't find her for 3 days. My mom went absolutely ballistic. When elder abuse wouldn't do anything and the police wouldn't do anything, my mother threatened to kill my cousin. I don't know if she really would have done anything but my cousin took her seriously. She finally told my mom where my aunt was.

When my aunt died, she made sure that her grandkids, whose mother had passed away a few years before, got nothing. Not even a trinket to remember her by.

The problem with elder abuse in this country is completely out of hand. When family members become fed up enough to finally do something, nothing happens and it makes the problem worse.

luckily when my own grandmother was being abused, I had 2 rich uncles who put a stop to ot. Unfortunately, it went on for years before we really recognized what was going on.

There are a few groups out there that help. Some are free some are expensive. The fact your girlfriend can't speak to her aunt alone is a HUGE red flag. Each state has different groups that help but because laws are so different, there might not be a free one in your state.

Here's a link to a national place that might help. But check out different places in your state. Unfortunately, we found these after it was too late.

http://www.ncea.aoa.gov/

[noiretextatique]

10. lowering the age for SS is one answer

of course, the political class wants to raise it. i am 55, soon to be 56. my chances of landing a decent job are just about nil. so, i am trying to get SS disability for my shoulder and neck problems. the idiot doctors don't seem to grasp that working on a computer 8 hours a day, every day (i am an Accountant) greatly contributes to my pain and discomfort. and there is no cure for my problem.
i took time off when i broke a bone in my foot and had to get UI because the doctors would not give me disability...for a damn broken foot. i was in a boot, so i could not drive and had to take public transportation. i didn't have to walk much while at work, but i had to walk to get there miraculously, my foot healed in about a month after i stopped walking on it...after 5 months of wearing the boot and walking and of course, my shoulder and neck are much better too, since i stopped working in march.

[Veilex]

13. Hah! You and I are in agreement.

Looks like we posted within minutes of each other too!

[daleanime]

30. Amen....

with the lack of available work lowering the age limit to 50/55 should be a given.

[Veilex]

12. My view on this is that Social Security ought to be lowered to age 50 to match age discimination

This would give folks the option of retiring at 50, or if they have a job, to keep working.

This would also have the effect of allowing those who want out of the workforce, but still need money, to get it... and allow for more jobs to available to younger folk.

As I see it, either there needs to be a dramatic crackdown on ageism, or social security age needs to be dropped by about 15 years...one or the other.

[NBachers]

17. I'm 65, and I'll have to work at least 'til 70 to max out my SS and 401K

I've got a huge backlog of vacation days. I've taken a rare day off over the last few weeks. It made me wish I could have every day off. I'd sure like to open up a slot for someone else to move into. But I've gotta keep pushing.

At least I'm blessed to work at a company that doesn't age-discriminate. My work partner finally left last year at 83; another guy I work with a couple days a week is 79.

[Veilex]

19. "I'll have to work at least 'til 70" - this is terrible

It angers me that anyone should have to work past 55 let alone to 70!!

I sincerely hope it goes smooth for you.

[NBachers]

20. Yeah, the actuaries are hoping I'll croak before 70, and they can keep all my money.

But at least I'll have a lot of vacation time and sick leave accrued if I do.

[Veilex]

24. "the actuaries are hoping I'll croak" - Yeah... well, fuck them...

Seriously. I hope you live at least another 20 years and enjoy every moment of it!

[airplaneman]

25. I'm 60 and retiring before 70 is out of the question

unless I am willing to live without any money. I fear being laid off between now and when I feel its finally time. Health insurance costs and co-pays are a big part of the problem coupled with having enough money to be able to do anything. My sister retired at 62 and spent 20% of her life savings in two years on medical costs. This did not include anything significantly major. She is now deciding she will have to re-enter the workforce at age 64. I'm not going to voluntarily be destitute financially so I will remain in the workforce as long as possible - wanting to retire or not feeling well is irrelevant - this is the new reality today and I imagine I am not alone on this matter.
-Airplane

[LibDemAlways]

23. Social Security advice columnists always tout postponing the

benefit until age 70. If you are healthy and want to continue working, more power to you. I'll be 62 in November and have already signed up. The past few years I've been working as a substitute teacher -one of the lowest paid jobs imaginable. For me SS represents a raise. I hope to live well beyond 70, but who knows?

My husband was laid off at age 59 and had a hell of a time finding a job. Finally took a job at a 40% cut in pay and was lucky to get it. It's brutal out there.

[Curmudgeoness]

34. It isn't just the SS age,

but more importantly, it is health insurance costs. I realize that they are supposed to be less than in the past, but it is still a big chunk of money out of your pocket (premiums and co-pays and deductibles) if you do not have Medicare as well as SS. I could retire today if I didn't have to be concerned about that gap between my age and the Medicare eligibility. The additional money spent for insurance would bust my budget.

[noiretextatique]

46. it is a common sense solution that will help everyone

the older folks can get out of the workforce so there will be more jobs for the younger folks. it makes way too much sense, so don't expect the do-nothings in dc to do anything about it. GMTA

[Veilex]

49. Of course, the reason corporate America hates this idea...

is that it'd decrease the number of folks working... driving down the demand for jobs and driving up the demand for employees... which in turn drives up wages and benefits.

[femmocrat]

14. K & R

And going to the EEOC or state anti-discrimination agencies is a huge waste of time. Employers know all the tricks to avoid these complaints from coming to a trial or settlement.

[graywarrior]

18. Thanks for posting this

Market Basket is famous for employing people over 50 and have people up to age 94 working for them. They also hire kids aged 14 and provide college scholarships for students that work for them.

The Market Baskets I shop at have a majority of older people working and they love their jobs because they get paid well and are treated with the utmost respect. If I lose my present job, the first place I will apply is at a Market Basket.

[antigop]

21. precisely why unions and worker co-ops are needed. nt

[Sherman A1]

42. Precisely

Yet, even in union environments ageism continues. It is certainly more subtle, but it continues. I had a talk with my immediate superior last year who saw many younger and less qualified people promoted past him despite his immense knowledge, skills, dedication and quality of work. I simply told him what the bosses wouldn't say... "Bob, you have gray hair, you are not going to move up". Something he knew down deep, but never wanted to admit to himself.

Work speed ups and targeting older workers for more subtle forms of abusive behavior are simply part of the game. It still very much exists, they are just much more careful.

[marble falls]

22. I am retired at sixty-three. I was forced into semi-retirement at 50. I ended up with a ....

new career in the service industry. The surprise isn't that there are socialists, but that there aren't thousands more than there are.

I feel like one of the lucky ones. Thank G*d I had a few good years.

[LiberalElite]

28. The ageist

comments on DU threads are very disheartening to me. You don't have to be RW to be a prejudiced jerk.

[Louisiana1976]

29. I know two women at the place where I used to work who were fired because they were in their

50s. One was replaced with a 24-year-old girl.

[Dr. Xavier]

31. Although

I don't work in tech, I do live in the Silicon Valley. These charmers have taken ageism to unprecedented levels, its like the entertainment industry (I am originally from L.A.) only its worse because these guys don't take showers and they drink Pabst Blue Ribbon beer.

[Wolf Frankula]

35. GREAT FIRST CAREER!

It means nobody under thirty need apply.

Wolf

[OnlinePoker]

36. Age Rage is alive and well

People are blaming the elderly for having the audacity to grow old and cost "them" money in pensions, higher health care costs, and higher taxes. I've started to see benefits that used to be given to elderly be reduced (lower movie tickets and bus fares, for instance). As soon as the baby boom generation started hitting retirement age, this is when it seemed to start. I'm at the tail end of that wave and don't expect there will be much benefit to growing old except for dying. I'm fiscally better than many, but there won't be any free-wheeling when I retire, that's for sure. I'm expecting I'll have to sell my house because the property taxes keep going up by 5-7% a year whereas my income has stagnated at maybe 1% a year if I'm lucky. My government pension will be tied to the inflation rate so all these extra fees on everything will soon outpace the pension increases.

[flvegan]

38. In my industry, I'll take an "over 50" with chops any day.

That's the kind of expertise I'd want and currently gravitate towards.

Y'all should try it.

[JustAnotherGen]

40. Me too!

My last two at time of hire - 58 and 24.

I'm Gen X - I'm a cynical asshole. I need people to surround me who aren't "yes men/women". I get "no don't do that" from people who have btdt and people with a fresh perspective. Put those two people on a project - and they are killing it.

[coldbeer]

39. Today is "Watticism Day" (Trivia related to Workplace discrimination)

Talk about Discrimination!

I found my best discription of "Watticism" on posts
on DU from 2005!

[Sherman A1]

41. K&R

[littlewolf]

43. I am 58 and have a job and glad to have it.

I shudder to think if I have to get a different job at this point.
and my employers know it and tells everyone every day
that if they do not like the new rules they can leave and be replaced.

they just have just told us that they are putting in a PT program
they haven't said when or what standards they are going to use
(suspect they are using the Navy PT standard.) so I will have to run
a 1.5 mile in 17 minutes. that is cuz I have 58 .. lots of folks who
are younger have lots less time.
If I get fired because I can not do the PT I maybe able to get back in
with the state .. I worked 10 years there .. I can go back to DOC or
maybe as a teachers aid.

they are also cutting our hours from 12 hours to 8 hours ... 12 hours of built
in OT per month. *sigh* well it was good while it lasted.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

44. The attitude is "Why hire a guy that's gonna retire in ten years"?

Doesn't matter if the turnover is such in your business that nobody has ever stuck it out for more than six months.

[VA_Jill]

45. Damn right there is!

And it's why I ended up retiring before I'd planned to. I'd had no problems as a travel nurse, and I had no problems getting a job in a larger city, but when I moved to where I live now to be with the gentleman with whom I share my life, all of a sudden I could not get a job. Never mind my years of experience in nursing, somehow they just were not "enough" for employers here. Of course, there are 3 schools locally with nursing programs to draw from, so they can just hire new grads and pay them half what they have to pay me....and then have to put all kinds of time and money into training them, just so they can leave and go elsewhere, or quit the profession entirely (which about 25% of them do these days). So I quit looking and retired, which a year later turned into a blessing as I got very sick and spent a year having and recovering from 4 major surgeries.....and now I barely think about nursing at all, except in the abstract.

[uppityperson]

47. Yup, k&r for us over 50 who can't get work even though we've lots of great experience.

And kudos to employers who realize our experience is a huge benefit in hiring us.

[undeterred]

48. "I'm looking for someone who fits in with my team."

My team is all young white males who work for an entry level wage and don't like to hang out with anyone different than themselves.