General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumstheHandpuppet
(19,964 posts)Seems the only place where the "No" vote is strong is in England (no surprise there). Scots elsewhere, including Wales and Ireland, are definitely trending YES.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)That seems pretty screwed up.
geardaddy
(24,931 posts)So, if you're Scottish, but live in another part of the UK other than Scotland, you can't vote. If you're English and are a resident of Scotland you can vote.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)The map was very unclear. I hope the Scots stick their collective thumb in the eye of Cameron and his refried - or should that be re-boiled? - Thatcherism.
geardaddy
(24,931 posts)snooper2
(30,151 posts)GummyBearz
(2,931 posts)... can someone tell me the major reasons for Scotland wanting to leave? Is it just national pride? England isnt the same invaders they were hundreds of years ago. What will Scotland gain in actual rights, or monetarily? Do they dislike certain English laws? What is it?
Laelth
(32,017 posts)The want many things that American liberals want, and they don't think they can get those things from the conservative Parliament in the U.K. Now, they want to try governing for themselves.
An independent Scotland will be quite liberal, like its neighbors--Norway, Iceland, Denmark, and Sweden. The U.K. Parliament will become more conservative if Scotland leaves (as Parliament will lose 58 leftish Scottish seats and only 1 Tory seat).
-Laelth
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)and they are sick to death of Thatcherism and Cameron's revival thereof.
marions ghost
(19,841 posts)many issues.
Rachel Maddow said hatred of the current Tory government in the UK is huge. Margaret Thatcher government was also rough on Scotland. Scotland is in a good position financially to separate in terms of self-control of their future energy resources (oil and also renewables like wind and tidal power). Also their other financial resources are extensive. They hate the American Trident nuclear arsenal within their territory and want it gone.
Scotland is fairly far left and identifies with Scandanavia socially/politically as to what the people, especially the young, want. They are poised to lead in this direction, rather than be chained by the conservatism of present day England. The winds of change are blowing, much as they did here with Obama's election. But the Scots probably have a better chance of achieving real change than we ever did.
I wouldn't underestimate the historic brutality towards the Scottish clans and all that old bad blood tho......
---These are just some of the factors
Denzil_DC
(7,244 posts)In addition, the Labour Party lost a great deal of support in Scotland over the Blair/Brown years, especially over the Iraq invasion, but not insignificantly because it continued too much of the Thatcherite agenda. The Liberal Democrats (don't be fooled by the name) have historically had a lot of support in certain parts of Scotland, but that's crumbled since they went into coalition with the Conservatives. So none of the major Westminster parties have fared well in the last decade or so, which has left something of a vacuum. Meanwhile, in the last Scottish elections the SNP won an unthinkable overall majority in the Scottish Assembly (it was deliberately set up in such a way as supposedly to make it impossible for one party to gain an outright majority, forcing the formation of coalitions), having already been in power as part of a coalition, and its record has been pretty good on most things.
The SNP's manifesto at that last election included the holding of a referendum. This had to be negotiated with David Cameron, who obstructed the whole idea as much as he could until some of the courses of action he proposed were found to be illegal.
Scottish First Minister Alex Salmond wanted the referendum to have three propositions on independence: Yes, No, and "Devo Max" (enhanced devolution with more tax raising powers and greater overall control--polls showed this would have had something like 70% support if offered). Cameron vetoed the inclusion of Devo Max as an option, so it ended up being a straight Yes/No referendum, which forced the whole argument into the shape it's currently in.
Ironically, in the final stages of the campaign, panicked by a surge in support for the Yes campaign, the No campaign have promised that if Scotland votes No, then it will get Devo Max anyway. Whether it's wise to believe that Cameron or the successor government will actually deliver on that (the whole campaign and the way it's been covered in most of the media has provoked resentment among some of the population in the rest of the UK at what some see as too much special treatment for Scotland, so it's questionable whether it's a vote-winner for non-Scottish politicians) is anybody's guess, but it's been a clear, recorded promise.
seaglass
(8,173 posts)this Tweet:
Scrapper Duncan ?@scrapperduncan 16s
Show me what democracy looks like! Falkirk #indyref polling station has closed early because it had 100% turnout. Everyone registered voted.
That is democracy in action.