My ward's polling place just got changed from an elementary school to a church

[Silent3]

Last edited Fri Aug 22, 2014, 06:10 AM - Edit history (1)

I can't say I'm very happy about that at all.

I know this isn't that uncommon, but I don't approve of this blurring of the line between church and state, and I've before never had to do vote at a church myself.

Of the three wards listed for having their polling locations changed, one is simply being moved from one school to another due to road construction issues. The other two, however, mine included, are both being moved from schools to churches, apparently "to improve security in our schools for children who were present on election day".

I guess we need to "think of the children!", and not worry about giving religious voters an edge and religious institutions an opportunity to influence the vote, because scary voters dropping in once or twice a year is such a threat.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

1. My question would be

"Has there ever been an incident in which a child has been in any way injured or even threatened on polling days by an adult?"

Or is this simply another solution in search of a problem?

[YarnAddict]

14. It's a security issue

Who is going to be checking ID's to make sure people entering the building are coming in for legitimate purposes vs. potential abductors, or FSM-help-us, another Adam Lanza? Would it be better to wait until there has been an incident to take those things into consideration?

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

16. Would it be better to wait?

Yes. Just like most people wait until they get hit by a meteorite to look into meteorite insurance.

Reality should be based on statistical likelihood, not simply somebody's fear.

That's why my question was 'Has this actually ever happened?' If the answer is no, then chances are that there is an ulterior motive for the change that has nothing to do with the stated reasoning.

[YarnAddict]

20. Well--

most schools are tightening security. And a whole lot of parents' of kids going to that school may have expressed concern about opening the school building to lots of strangers. If the community is being responsive to parents' concerns, then that's a good thing.

[davidpdx]

36. ....

Just like most people wait until they get hit by a meteorite to look into meteorite insurance.

I'm going to look into meteorite insurance.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

19. Oh, and, btw

I vote in an elementary. Nobody coming to vote is allowed in except through one door, with a dozen or so poll workers right there to make sure anyone coming in to vote isn't leaving the single room in which voting takes place. I suspect they lock the interior doors while voting is open as well. If somebody wanted to go Adam Lanza, they'd have just as much luck simply shooting their way in through any other door on the school. There wouldn't be any need to wait until voting day.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

2. It's no big deal

My polling place was at a church for years, and it was no different than voting anywhere else. The same rules regarding politicking inside the polling place apply, so it's just another place to vote.

Not sure how it's an advantage to religious voters?

[gratuitous]

24. Also . . .

This is part of what congregations should be doing with their buildings, making them available for civic exercises, in exchange for that tax exemption for their property. We have made our building available free of charge for citizenship classes, census worker training, and other civic meetings. Nobody's been struck by lightning yet and nobody's been drowned in the baptistry.

[Bohunk68]

110. Exactly. My local churches do much

the same public services, like Blood Drives, Food Pantries, we served as an Emergency location during the floods from Hurricane Irene and Hurricane Lee. No one joined the congregation during any of those events. My new church feeds the kids during the summer vacation, and will during December vacation. Our voting location has just been changed from the High School to the Emergency/Rescue Squad building. The school didn't want us because of "perceived" security problems, although in all the years we have been there, nothing has happened.

[femmocrat]

3. We will probably see more schools opting out for "security reasons".

Trying to enter a school building is like trying to crack a bank vault anymore.

[frazzled]

4. I used to vote in a church

when we lived in Minnesota. It was in the basement of a church. I didn't see anything wrong with it. It was a gym space. Then when we moved to Massachusetts our polling place was at an elementary school. Also a gym. (It did feel a bit disruptive to the school in the hallways.) Then, when we moved to Illinois ten years ago, we voted at the local IBEW union hall, until this spring's primary that is. It just got changed to the lobby of an apartment building a block away from me. I miss the union hall, but whatever.

I don't see that the location of voting gives any preference to anyone. Why would religious voters be any more inclined to vote because the polling place is at a church and not a school? I went to the church to vote, and I'm nominally Jewish (though not really religious): I wouldn't dream of not voting, no matter where it is.

It's hard to find spaces for polling places; I think you maybe need to give your municipality a break on this one.

[SoCalDem]

97. We used to vote in a guy's garage

I never understood that one

Churches often have large multi-purpose spaces, and probably charge little (if anything)..

We have also voted at the library (my favorite choice)

The best way would be for mail-in ballots

[dsc]

5. as a school employee I can attest to the fact that it likely is for security

schools, especially elementary schools, often have only one door people can enter through and it often is buzzer only. That obviously can't work if the school is a polling place.

[Anansi1171]

6. "They'll never believe election fraud is commited in a church"

Wink wink

[ProdigalJunkMail]

7. Election days are a pain in the ass for schools...

makes much more sense to put them in a facility large enough and mostly unused on the day of voting...

hardly blurring the line between church and state...

sP

[davidpdx]

35. Makes sense because most election days are on a weekday

With the exception of some of the state primaries. Schools are in session most of the time.

[RKP5637]

8. I've lived some places where they have done this because some churches have areas that can easily

accommodate voting. I don't think they were pushing religion, but some of the religious might feel that way. I never went, we also had absentee voting for all, easy to obtain and was preferred.

[HooptieWagon]

9. Mine have mostly been churches.

And I haven't found it objectionable. Religious material is removed from the room, and is not visible. There has been no prostelizing. And its only a few blocks away, making it very convienient.

[Blue_Tires]

11. +1

Been voting in a church most of my life with no incident...The church has this big multipurpose hall/rec room and all religious stuff is absent (and I live in a pretty conservative precinct)..

[ChazII]

34. My voting experience

mirrors yours. Voted at a church in my neighborhood for years and the voting took place in the reception hall.

[dsc]

12. It did cause a problem here when Issue 1, anti marriage equality issue, was on the ballot

many voters here had to vote in churches whose marquees had anti gay slogans.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

13. Repugnant

But why would it cause a problem for the voters? Ignore the sign and go vote; it's not like you have to broadcast how your'e going to vote.

[dsc]

22. It is campaigning for the issue in a zone in which there is supposed to be no such campaigning.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

26. I don't agree

When I go to vote, there are activists representing political parties, issues, etc., all handing out sample ballots and literature 20 or 30 feet from the door of the building. I see no difference between that and a church sign, so long as the sign is outside the proscribed distance for such things.

[Bohunk68]

111. In NYS, activists

must remain 100' from the door and we post signs where that becomes effective. This would include any signage by the owner of the building that could be conceived as politicking.

[YarnAddict]

85. Most classrooms

have pictures of the President on the walls. Would that be considered campaigning, in a Presidential election year?

[dsc]

89. voting takes place in gyms or cafeterias

neither of which have pictures.

[LeftyMom]

31. What's the rule in your state about electioneering?

Here we don't allow anything of that sort within 100 feet of the polling place, and we even measure the distance install signs prior to opening the polls just to make sure everybody's clear on the rules.

If I saw a sign like that at a poling site I'd call a supervisor at the elections department immediately and let them handle it. However, the only electioneering issues I've had to deal with were asking voters to cover their campaign t shirts or buttons while they were voting.

[xmas74]

39. It's the same here in Missouri.

I didn't think the marquee sign mentioned above would be legal at a polling place.

[LeftyMom]

41. If it was more than 100 feet away it might be legal, but the county rents the site,

and I'd be amazed if they don't cover things like that in the rental agreement.

I know posters and such are supposed to be down in the room that we use and we're allowed to cover anything left up that might be of concern. I expect that if there were an objectionable marquee we'd cover it up while we were renting the site, but since I've never run into the issue I can't say for certain. I can say we'd call a supervisor for advice and they'd be on the site checking out the problem before the first voter arrived.

[xmas74]

92. That makes sense.

I know at our church (not the one I vote at but the one I attend) volunteers are asked to go through the day before and remove anything and everything. This even includes pamphlets that are usually kept in the family center about the mission of the church. They change the marquee to "Hello voters! Second district votes here from 7am-7pm. Be sure to vote!" (or maybe it's 6-I always vote after work, since I go in at 5am.)

The church I vote at does something similar. They clean up the area with nothing that might appear to sway voters and if there is something on their marquee it's a psa for voting, with 3rd district and the hours open. There is absolutely nothing that might influence on the lot of the church and our judges take it seriously.

[etherealtruth]

10. I really don't see the problem

I can't imagine how this would give religious voters an edge ... all of the polling place laws remain in effect

[YarnAddict]

15. There are many, many more important issues

concerning our elections. go, vote, and don't worry about it.

[procon]

17. Unless the church is violating election laws

by publicly advocating for a certain faction, I don't see how anyone would have an advantage simply because of the purpose of the building where you went to vote.

It makes about as much sense as being against voting at a school if you opposed public education or were a homeschooler.

[bigwillq]

18. Be lucky you have the right to vote.

Get over it. It's no big deal.

[pintobean]

21. It's just a building.

I once voted in a neighbor's garage. I'd rather go to a church.

May God bless you and relieve you of your fear.

[FSogol]

80. My feelings too. Just a building.

Some people seem to think that atheists will shrivel up like vampires exposed to sunlight upon entering a church, but it isn't true. Election officials will insure that everything remains kosher (heh).

[pintobean]

98. Yeah, but who wants God looking over their shoulder?

[GobBluth]

23. Until recently I've always had to vote at a church

at a Lutheran one when I live in Minnesota and then a Methodist one here in Florida. Never had a problem doing so. Here in Florida I did notice some "churchy" things, bulletins mainly. I moved to a different precinct, now it's located in a condominium's general use building. No difference.

My kids use to go to a school that was also a polling place (a Lutheran church). It was a mad house. One I was willing to deal with, but quite honestly pretty unsafe. As I drive by public schools and see the line for drop off and pick up, well I can't imagine adding even more crowds to the madness. Not to mention how people trying to vote must feel. It is a HUGE inconvenience I would think! But I vote absentee now, so I don't have to deal with any longer.

[whistler162]

25. Will you burst into flames by entering

a church<HORRORS>? It is just a building.

[madamesilverspurs]

27. Done both.

I've voted in churches and schools, and worked as election judge in both settings. In a couple of cases, the church setting were preferable simply because the schools' lavatories were set up for tiny people. Other than that, never gave it much thought. Don't know if it still happens or not, but Mom remembers when the family's living room was the neighborhood polling place. As long as there's a ballot box...

[LeftyMom]

42. Our neighborhood polling place used to be the neighbors' garage.

You can get away with that in California in November.

[Niceguy1]

28. I have always voted in a church

It isnt a big deal. It is always nice and calm without anyone trying to infuence you. I prefer a chrich over a busy school or any other high profile place with a bunch of knuckle heads hanging around.

[Retrograde]

29. A church proper or a church-owned building?

The latter- essentially large halls - are frequently used as polling places where I live because they have space, restrooms, are accessible, and not normally used on Tuesdays. No proselytizing occurs: they even move all their religious-related stuff to a corner for the duration.

Now the actual place of worship is another thing altogether.

[LeftyMom]

30. As a poll worker, I always find churches to make great polling sites.

There's usually a kitchenette so we can refrigerate our lunches and make coffee, which is a big deal when you're working from 6 am to 10 pm or later.

And there's plenty of parking space available on Tuesdays, which isn't true of schools.

[kwassa]

32. I've voted in a nail salon that was open for business.

and a car dealership. The line was run through the showroom.

Welcome to Los Angeles.

[Phentex]

33. I vote at a church but not in the church...

Years ago we voted in a school cafeteria and the parking was terrible. I find the church hall easy to get in and out. I don't know if there are other facilities that can accommodate so many people while keeping them close to home.

[davidpdx]

37. I don't see a big deal with it if both inside and out nothing is left out that could be considered

electioneering. Security probably is an issue along with the fact that classes are taking place during the time which voting is.

Someone up thread mentioned the fact that churches (and other places of worship) should be used as polling places as they are contributing to the community. I think that's a fair point. Not every precinct is going to have a community center (or something like it) to use as a polling place.

[xmas74]

38. Mine is in a church

and it's actually in a great spot-far better than the schools. Most of the churches in my town are older and near the city center while the schools are mostly on the outskirts of town. While the schools have to worry about the logistics of where to set up that wouldn't interfere with the school day my polling place sets up in its Family Life Center-a huge room used for dinners, for basketball games, for shelters and for other activities.

The church is already used regularly for various meetings such as AA, NA, OA, etc. It's also one of the many local shelters open to the public in case of severe weather. Right now they are open as a heat shelter for the homeless, the elderly and those without air conditioning. They stay open all the time with volunteers on site and offer water, snacks, activities (mostly games such as cards or board games but also television and some crafts) and offer places for people to crash. In the winter they open up if a storm is coming our way and during tornado warnings they automatically open their doors for all to enter and take cover in the basement.

They've never once even tried to influence a vote. Besides, isn't that one of the things that the election officials are there for? Aren't they supposed to put a stop to any kind of influence or interference?

[BainsBane]

40. It doesn't give religious voters an edge

I've voted in a church for ages and it never influenced my voting in the least. It's not like you're voting during Sunday services. They open the churches up to benefit the public, something businesses do not.
A building does not influence how you vote. This has got to the most ridiculous complaint I've ever heard.

Maybe some predator preyed on children during the last election cycle? Did it occur to you that might matter? Sexual predators do vote you know. Or maybe they are concerned about some pscyho with a gun shooting up the place. Yes, we should think of children. I think it irresponsible that you are more worried about catching cooties from a building than the well being of children in your community.

[LeftyMom]

44. Now that I think about it, many schools these days require background checks for adults on site.

There might also be an insurance requirement for background checks that can't be easily worked around.

[BainsBane]

46. We have voting in both churches and schools

but there is a separate entrance at the schools. The point is to have as many places available as possible to make it easier to vote, and the fact is there are usually a lot more churches than schools. We also vote in libraries.

It could be an insurance reason, an actual incident, or a combination of the two. They might be worried about a nutter shooting up the place too.

[Silent3]

47. Did I say I was filing a complaing, calling the ACLU or the FFRF?

No. Philosophically this use of a church bothers me, however. Whether there's a clear, direct impact is hard to say, but I feel that it helps lend the imprimatur of the state to these churches. As a small, temporary advantage, members of this church might well have a minor advantage in finding the place, or not feeling put out by trying to find a new place, in the first couple of elections held there.

From some stories I've read, not all churches are as good about hiding religious messaging as they should be either.

I'll bet that if the polling place had been moved to a mosque, the right wingers would have gone nuts. Not merely been bothered by it, but up in arms (literally perhaps, some of them) and frothing at the mouth.

If a mosque would get such a negative reaction, and a Christian church is treated as neutral ground, how doesn't that say something about promoting and sustaining Christian privilege?

As for "Maybe some predator preyed on children during the last election cycle?"... are we talking once? Twice? An established pattern of risk, or just totally indulging and catering to helicopter parents' overblown fears that a predator is lurking around every corner waiting to snatch their precious snowflakes?

[BainsBane]

49. Once is too many

I don't know where you live so how can I possibly know what the local news is? How many children need to have their lives destroyed before you decide your own personal inconvenience at having to vote in a church is not more important? 25% of children are sexually abused, most by someone they know but sometimes strangers. People who care about the community and world they live in take that seriously.

In my community we actually encourage people to vote, which is why MN has the highest voter participation rate in the country. We don't run around thinking of reasons why polling places shouldn't be open. We vote in schools, community centers, churches, retirement homes--anywhere they will allow a polling place to be set up.

We also vote in synagogues, and I would imagine there are mosques and Islamic community centers that are voting places too since we have a sizable Muslim population. If someone is going to freak out about that sort of thing, they don't live in diverse neighborhoods. I suppose RWers might freak out --if they lived here. Very few do. So you decided to do the exact same thing and throw in some references showing disregard for children's safety in the process. I can't think of a single reason why I or anyone else should care even a little bit about what you find inconvenient.

[Silent3]

51. Does it make sense that over ten years after a *failed* shoe bomber...

...that we're all still taking our shoes off at the airport?

I didn't state my complaint as anything at all to do with "convenience" anyway. In fact, the new polling place is easier for me to get to than the old one. But even if I did bring up convenience, which I didn't, your attempt to frame this as "convenience vs. safety" is still a false framing, because jumping at every perceived risk doesn't necessarily improve actual safety.

Further, people are totally inconsistent about safety and children. Taking your kids out in the car for an ice cream cone or a trip to the movies puts them at far greater risk that any having voting happen in the same school that they attend ever will.

Are ice cream and movies ever worth more than the safety of the children? Apparently many parents think so, when the risk is small and comfortably familiar, deciding not cocoon their children in protective bubbles from every conceivable risk -- mainly worrying only about the risks they have media-fueled, irrationally distorted fears about.

[BainsBane]

53. at least 20% of girls and 5% of boys are molested or raped

Not a single shoe bomber. You don't get to decide what is safe for other people's children. Schools decide if they want to serve as a polling place, and election officials decide which places to choose. Parents make private decisions about their own children, not you. You entire post is irrational and aside from the point.

It's not just about safety vs. convenience. It's about you vs. the interests of the community and clearly the latter doesn't concern you. Therefore the former doesn't concern me. From the looks of this thread, no one else cares much either, probably because they know what you don't--voting in churches is common in every state in the nation.

As for unnecessarily worrying about risks, pedophilia and child rape are very real and common risks. Catching cooties from a church exists only in your mind, as does the supposed edge to religious voters.

I'm done. I shouldn't have given this self-indulgent OP any attention in the first place.

[Silent3]

74. No, I don't "get to decide what is safe", but I'm perfectly free to decide...

...what I think is an emotion-driven overreaction on the part of other parents. One can accept a parent's right to decide what's necessary for their children's safety without accepting that they have some magical expertise on that subject simply by virtue of being a parent.

Your stats on incidence of molestation don't say one thing about what are truly useful ways to solve those problems, and what's overreaction and fearmongering. The parents themselves are often the biggest risk to their own kids, followed by family and friends and other people trusted with supervision of the children, not "stranger danger!", especially from something as infrequent as the use of public schools for voting.

[Arugula Latte]

114. How is it any safer in a religious institution? I'd feel much less safe there.

We've all heard about sexual predators who are priests and ministers and youth group leader. They hide behind the cover story of gawd 'n' jesus and commit their crimes.

[cbayer]

59. So, if you think the right wingers would be up in arms about it being moved

to a mosque, how is that any different than you being up in arms because it is being moved to a church?

Precious snowflakes? You bet they are precious snowflakes.

[Silent3]

65. So me writing this OP on DU...

...with such fierce wording as "but I don't approve of this blurring of the line between church and state" constitutes "up in arms" in the same way you'd imagine a bunch of teabaggers reacting to having to vote in a mosque?

[cbayer]

66. I think they are different sides of the same coin, yes.

And I would make the same argument with them.

It's a building. If you give it more importance than that, that's your problem.

There is no blurring of lines. Voting laws are clear. If you see a violation of the law when you go to vote, you should report it.

[Silent3]

68. So you'd be fine going to a KKK meeting hall to vote, because it's "just a building"...

...and any more reaction than "ho hum" on your part would be "your problem"?

No, I'm not equating (all) churches to the KKK, just using the exaggerated case to demonstrate that your "just a building" principle probably isn't something you really believe either.

[cbayer]

69. Sure, as long as they aren't having a meeting and it is not

in the room where they perform whatever ceremonies they might perform.

And you are making the comparison between the KKK and a church, despite your disclaimer.

Have you ever voted in a church? I have lots of times. It is generally in a room that has not one iota of evidence that it is part of a religious building.

I also voted in courtrooms, something I find much more intimidating.

[Silent3]

73. Frankly, I don't buy it that you'd be that blasé about voting being moved to a Klan hall...

...no matter what they'd done hide the usual activities there. And if you really were so blithely unconcerned, I'd be shocked at your insensitivity to the other people who would be greatly offended by such a venue being used.

[cbayer]

75. A building is a building. It is important to me to vote.

As long as there is not evidence of things that are political, I honestly don't care.

I will be there for all of 5 minutes or so.

Shocked by my insensitivity? That's probably right about on the level as my shock at your outrage.

A building only takes on the significance you give it.

Just go vote and get over it.

[Silent3]

93. Your reactions are all about you?

You'd have a "Suck it up! Get over it! It's just a building!" attitude toward black voters if they said to you that having their polling place moved to a KKK building bothered them?

[cbayer]

96. Er, you asked me for my personal reaction.

Geez, you are making me out to be some kind of monster.

If there was some part of the community that objected to a certain polling place, I think it would be important to hear their concerns and consider alternatives.

If you feel that way about a church, then perhaps you should organize a group who would object. Perhaps there is a community center or other neutral place you could suggest.

My feeling is that it is just a building and that it only takes on significance if you give it that. You obviously feel differently. Are you going to do something about it or just rant and rave here?

[Silent3]

100. The only "ranting" and "raving" is at dull, thoughtless responses from...

...people who can't seem to grasp that I could possibly have any even slightly worthy of consideration reasons for so much as a tepid "I can't say that I like it" reaction to voting being moved into churches.

Any "ranting" and "raving" seen in my OP itself, not in my subsequent annoyance at stupid responses, is a projection of people reacting defensively to any distaste being expressed toward their beloved churches.

[cbayer]

101. I see that you have cross posted this, and I feel certain that you will soon be

getting the kind of response that you were hoping for. Probably should have put it there to begin with.

If you think people that disagree with you are all dull, stupid and thoughtless, you are in a sad spot indeed. Please note that many of the people not giving you the responses you were looking for identify as non-believers, so your idea about "projection" and beloved churches is really off the mark.

Like I said, you will soon be getting some brilliant, sharp and very thoughtful responses on this horrible dilemma you are in. And you can talk about all the stupid responses that you got here to boot!

Now, you didn't answer my question. What are you going to do to address this in your community?

[Silent3]

102. It's not that there's disagreement, it's the total dismissiveness that I have any reason...

...for the slightest distaste for this at all.

Now, you didn't answer my question. What are you going to do to address this in your community?

That's a question based on a faulty premise that I'm so incensed that I'm ready to storm the castle to "address this in (my) community".

[cbayer]

106. If you wanted an echo chamber, then you should have posted elsewhere to begin with.

People disagree with you. So what? That doesn't make you or them wrong, it's just a different perspective.

I just thought if it were important enough for you to bring up here, you might consider bringing it up in your community.

But if that is not the case, then I guess this has played itself out.

[Silent3]

107. Is it possible for this much "not getting it" to be anything but deliberate evasiveness?

There's a big difference between expecting people to agree with me (which I don't, and have clearly said so) and thinking that other people might at least show the slightest hint of understanding or empathizing in the slightest degree with my distaste for churches being used for voting and the church/state issue there.

[cbayer]

108. Do you not see that people may just not agree with you and get it just fine.

What an odd position to take. You are getting a lot of responses from people who don't see it as a big deal, and your assumption is that they don't get it.

As one person after another has told you, they don't think there is any reason for concern here and don't think that it in any way infringes on the 1st amendment.

Church buildings are used for all kinds of things - food kitchens, shelters, day care, AA meetings, after school programs, political gathering points, educational events.

Maybe you are the one that just doesn't get it. Is that possible?

[betsuni]

67. I dislike the way you're being attacked here.

It's just a comment about how voting in a church might be blurring the line between church and state. I don't get why this is so terrible. What are people reading into this? I haven't lived in the States for almost a quarter of a century and I've never heard of voting in a church. I think it's weird, so there.

[Silent3]

71. Thank you for getting it.

From some of these reactions, you'd think these others imagine I'm fuming and raging and picketing and refusing to vote.

As a side issue, since it was related to the motivation for the change of venue, I called out what struck me as an excessive "think of the children!" move, a sentiment that plenty of people seem to understand in this other thread I posted:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025426811

People get the point about over-protectiveness in that thread, when they aren't being overwhelmed by a need express their "Don't worry! It's just a church!" sentiments.

[Arugula Latte]

115. I agree.

[Drunken Irishman]

79. They probably would - would you, tho?

I wouldn't. I would have no problem voting in a mosque.

[cbayer]

83. Would I have a problem voting in a mosque? Absolutely not.

Why do you ask?

[LanternWaste]

81. No more and no less than balloting held in schools gives that same small, temporary advantage to the

"As a small, temporary advantage, members of this church might well have a minor advantage in finding the place..."

No more and no less than balloting held in schools gives that same small, temporary advantage to the school staff who works there...




"I'll bet that if the polling place had been moved to a mosque, the right wingers would have gone nuts..."

I'd be compelled to pat them on their heads also and say, "bless your little heart", as they too would be looking for, and then decrying imaginary obstacles to their rights.

[Silent3]

86. The staff who works at a particular public school isn't likely to have a net bias...

...in political leanings, unlike those who attend a particular church -- which in this case is a Republican bias.

Further, please point to the place in this thread where I was "decrying" any "obstacle", real or imagined, to my rights.

[Arugula Latte]

113. I wouldn't feel safer from sexual predators in a church, that's for sure.

Especially in an RCC church...They don't exactly have a stellar record on preventing and reporting child rape.

[BainsBane]

116. The point is schools are full of children

Obviously. Children don't vote. Adults do. You aren't attending a mass. It's voting. There is no reason you'd even see a priest.

[Jenoch]

43. It doesn't seem like a big deal to me.

There is an elementary school nearby and they don't want the hassle of people coming to their achool to vote. Meanwhile, there is anither location nearby who invites voters to their location and will allow a polling location to be created in their building, free of charge. What's the downside?

[hrmjustin]

45. How does this give religious voters an edge?

[Silent3]

48. See post #40, I'd say roughly the same thing. n/t

[Warpy]

52. Funny, they used the gym where I went a thousand years ago

I absolutely loathed PE, so if voting day gave us a study hall hour instead, it was win-win for me.

[kas125]

54. It may not be only about security -

it might also be about disrupting the school routine. I worked at an elementary school where there was voting and everyone in the building complained about them taking up the gym for a day and a half when there was an empty church directly across the street.

After school care, which usually happened in the gym had to find somewhere else to go the night before when the voting machines were set up. Then on election day no gym classes, no indoor recess, no after school daycare in the gym. It was a real pain. It could just be about that.

[jwirr]

55. Many churches, including mine, have a public room that is used by many community organizations

that have nothing to do with the church. Our church has two Alcoholics groups, the Boy Scouts, Naps (a sr. food program), the food shelf and any others who want someplace they can meet. We in no way interfere with what they are doing. I can see that happening with voting also. We would not be preaching to the voters which really would be a blurring of the lines.

However, my church is very liberal and if the church in your area is a rw church I would be very worried.

[cherokeeprogressive]

56. Refuse to vote. That'll teach 'em.

[cbayer]

57. How exactly does a building give religious voters an edge and religious

institutions an opportunity to influence the vote?

Electioneering laws still apply.

I would love to see some data that showed that voting in a church building had any influence over outcome whatsoever.

Or is this just a belief based on faith?

I suggest you get over it. It's a building.

[cbayer]

57. Dreaded dupe -- bad connection.

[Behind the Aegis]

60. When I was in New Olreans ours did the opposite.

I was glad when it was moved to the school...much closer.

[raven mad]

61. I voted in a church for years.

Then I voted in a school for years.

The setups were identical; ID at the doors, security folks, and designated rooms.

Give me the school any day, the kids were so much fun!

Now I vote in a commercial sporting goods store that holds a sale on election day........... sigh. What's worse?

I understand security concerns; how about someone coming in to bomb a church?

[betsuni]

62. Schools and churches both give me the willies ...

but there's something else. I've seen TV shows and movies wherein demons disguised in human form, vampires, and others with supernatural handicaps cannot enter churches because it makes them uncomfortable or burst into flames. Who will think of the vampires and demons? Although, come to think of it, they probably vote Republican. Never mind.

[eShirl]

63. We used to get that day off from school. n/t

[treestar]

64. Isn't there a law about not campaigning within a certain number of feet?

This is nothing at all to worry about.

[onenote]

70. We vote in a public elementary school and frankly, I'd prefer it if they moved it to a church

The public elementary school has a very limited amount of parking, most of which is taken by teachers and other school employees. There is no street parking available. It makes it difficult for people to vote. One of the advantages of using churches or synagogues is that they tend to have more parking and its generally not being used on a weekday.

[B Calm]

95. Now with all the school shootings and new security measures,

I look for more polling places being moved.

[justiceischeap]

72. When I lived in PA, I always voted in churches

I prefer it because it seems to go faster.

[MineralMan]

76. I can vote anywhere, and don't care where.

I'm an atheist, so I'm not in churches often, usually for a wedding or funeral. But, when I go to the polls to cast my vote, it doesn't matter to me what the normal use of the place I vote might be. For the election, it is just the place where I vote.

I don't see a church vs. state issue here, as long as the laws are followed. I don't even care if the religious symbols are visible. I needn't pay them any mind.

[Drunken Irishman]

77. My polling place was an elementary and then a Lutheran church and now the elementary again.

I remember as a kid, my elementary was also a polling place. Election day was fun to people watch.

I never had an issue going to vote in a church, tho.

[ProfessorGAC]

78. Mine Is The ESDA Building

Emergency and disaster response center. Seems right that a government sponsored entity is used since there are not that many times the building is hopping.

BTW: We have a river running through town so they've got rescue rafts and other stuff like emergency generators and flood pumps, etc. That's why the building is there.

[madokie]

82. I've been voting for 50 years

and almost all of them has been in a church. I don't do religion so I never darken a church door otherwise
Well voting and funerals is all

[Lydia Leftcoast]

84. Until Oregon went to vote-by-mail, my polling places

were churches--and that's in very secularized Oregon.

They chose churches that had social/meeting halls with direct entrances to the outside and no religious materials visible. At other times, the halls might be used for meals for the homeless, AA, Scouts, community improvement groups, or others.

Just last summer, the group that supported the locked-out Minnesota Orchestra musicians held a meeting in the big Presbyterian church in downtown Minneapolis. The meeting was even in the sanctuary, with stained glass windows, a pulpit, and hymnals in the pews. They chose it because it's right across the street from Orchestra Hall and can accommodate a huge crowd. After the plenary meeting, we broke into small discussion groups that were held all over the church.

I was there, and people of all religions and no religion attended. The church made no effort to convert anyone, although so many parts of it were used that they couldn't take down all the religious materials. However, no one melted or burst into flame at the sight of pictures of Jesus.

[gollygee]

87. Mine too but there was a reason given

The school increased security, as so many have. You can't have tons of people walking into the school like you once had. There's no way to have a polling place at a school without having a bunch of people having entry to the school. The church doesn't have tons of schoolkids in it at the same time and there haven't been bunches of non-Sunday church shooting sprees to create alarm.

[Silent3]

88. "You can't have tons of people walking into the school like you once had."

Why not?

An actual threat of real statistical significance, or merely a perceived "These days you can't be too careful!" kind of thing?

[gollygee]

91. Well if it's perceived by the parents and the voters

then the perception becomes the reality as far as voting moving out.

[FiveGoodMen]

90. Same here

and then the lines were re-drawn and it was moved to another church.

[B Calm]

94. Mine just got changed too, from one church to another church. The

only problem I have is the new church is 7 miles away and the old one was 1.5 miles.

[TreasonousBastard]

99. I've voted in schools that were fine, but...

others that were cramped and screwed up both the voting and the school day. Been an election judge at schools and firehouses, too. We have enough public buildings in this county that we don't much need churches, but we have used a few here and there. Part of it is that every ED need a polling place, and you can combine several, but not all.

I personally cannot see the problem with using a church. As many others have said-- it's convenient, lotsa parking, a good kitchen, and no religious propaganda spoiling your day. Anyone who has had the privilege of voting at a small school during a Presidential election when school is in session should be screaming for any alternative.

[liberal N proud]

103. Happening many places, and it is security

Schools are becoming increasingly locked down and voting provides too much exposure.

[Silent3]

105. Are becoming more locked down, yes.

Need to be more locked down? That's highly doubtful. The exaggerated concerns of helicopter parents are now being enacted in public policy and law enforcement, like arresting parents for negligence for daring to leave their children play to by themselves in a public park.

[WinkyDink]

104. Churches have been used as polling places at least for my 65 years. And for other secular events.

[WCIL]

109. I used to vote right across the street

At the parochial school my children attended. Our polling place was moved because traffic was a nightmare. Voters were weaving around school buses with the STOP arm out and disrupting the regular flow of traffic. One child was hit when an older driver drove through a taped off walkway. Most schools have very precise drop-off and pick-up procedures and adding extra drivers unfamiliar with the routine adds even more danger to the chaos.

Now my polling place is at the Knights of Columbus hall. Most of the polling places in my town are at churches and church halls. The exceptions I can think of are the Senior Center and a few nursing homes.

[Arugula Latte]

112. I wouldn't want to vote in a church. I'm glad we've got 100 percent vote-by-mail here.