A Former Marine Explains All the Weapons of War Being Used by Police in Ferguson

[Fantastic Anarchist]

There is a growing chorus of military veterans who have chimed in on the absurdity of photographs like this one. Let me join the parade. What we’re seeing here is a gaggle of cops wearing more elite killing gear than your average squad leader leading a foot patrol through the most hostile sands or hills of Afghanistan. They are equipped with Kevlar helmets, assault-friendly gas masks, combat gloves and knee pads (all four of them), woodland Marine Pattern utility trousers, tactical body armor vests, about 120 to 180 rounds for each shooter, semiautomatic pistols attached to their thighs, disposable handcuff restraints hanging from their vests, close-quarter-battle receivers for their M4 carbine rifles and Advanced Combat Optical Gunsights. In other words, they’re itching for a fight. A big one. It’s a well-known horror that the US military greets foreign peoples in this fashion as our politicians preach freedom, democracy and peace. It’s an abomination that the police greet black communities in the States with the same trigger-happy posture. Especially on the occasion of an unarmed teen’s death by cop.

The Nation

[Autumn]

1. A big fucking kick and recommend on this one.

Great article. Why in gods name do we allow this?

[Fantastic Anarchist]

22. Because we don't have control. nt

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

2. All I got as a marine, was an M1, ammo belt, helmet, and blisters.

Times have changed since '61.

[MannyGoldstein]

5. obviously, the enemy you fought

wasn't as dangerous.

[happyslug]

7. Yes, they only had the ability to fight back, as oppose to protesting.

n/t

[christx30]

19. "In war, they can only kill you once.

In politics, they can kill you over and over again."
---- Paraphrased from Adm. Adama, Battlestar Galactica.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

8. The only fighting I got was with other marines and sailors.

And a bar brawl with some Australians. The Australians were pretty tough.

[gollygee]

3. K&R

"They're itching for a fight." True words!

[Puzzledtraveller]

4. "Former Marine"?

[Fantastic Anarchist]

6. That's the title in the article.

I didn't editorialize the title.

[msanthrope]

21. I know. nt

[Rex]

25. Good catch there is no such thing as a 'former Marine.'

nt

[littlemissmartypants]

32. This.^ nt

[mrdmk]

49. Here is the authors bio

Lyle Jeremy Rubin

Lyle Jeremy Rubin is a PhD candidate in American history at the University of Rochester. He served in the United States Marine Corps for five years, and nearly a year of that service in the Helmand Province, Afghanistan.

link: http://www.thenation.com/authors/lyle-jeremy-rubin

[WillyT]

9. K & R !!!

[xocet]

10. How can the police possibly think that running around pointing weapons at people is a good idea?

A Former Marine Explains All the Weapons of War Being Used by Police in Ferguson
There’s at least one line every Marine knows: “Never point a weapon at anything you do not intend to shoot.” The St. Louis County Police Department apparently never received that memo.

by Lyle Jeremy Rubin, August 20, 2014

...

There’s at least one line every Marine knows. It’s ingrained at boot camp or Officer Candidate School and follows us to the front lines and back home again. It’s a simple command and it’s the second of the four weapons-safety rules. It says, “Never point a weapon at anything you do not intend to shoot.” The St. Louis County Police Department apparently never received the memo. Either that or they intend to shoot.

...

http://www.thenation.com/article/181315/catalog-ferguson-police-weaponry

[yardwork]

11. Powerful. I'm interested in what other military think.

Is this a common reaction among military and former military?

This also reminds me if people driving Humvees in the states while our military had much less protection in Iraq and Afghanistan. Were IEDs a bigger problem in Sacramento?

[F4lconF16]

16. There's a bit of a difference.

Except for the relatively rare military-derived H1 you'll occasionally see, the vast majority of the hummers out there are civilian oriented H2s and H3s, which are just excessively large SUVs with little off-road capability and certainly no use as a military vehicle.

Unless of course you meant police departments had Hummers, in which case I have no idea of the numbers involved or the rationale.

[Blue Idaho]

12. Time to put an end to

The toxic lethal culture of the "warrior cops."

[littlemissmartypants]

33. Agreed. nt

[L0oniX]

55. More Rambo ...less Terminator?

[hifiguy]

62. This.

They wanna play soldier? Then join the Army or the Marines, shitheads.

[Uncle Joe]

13. Semper Fi to Lyle Jeremy Rubin.

I remember tasting tear gas at boot camp in in Parris Island, that's some bad stuff.

Thanks for the thread, Fantastic Anarchist.

[Fantastic Anarchist]

23. You're more than welcome, Uncle Joe!

You're staying to become my real uncle!

[Uncle Joe]

24. That's my intention, Fantastic Anarchist.

[jwirr]

14. Thank you for this description. Many of us do not know what all that stuff is for. But many of us

know that it was never meant for use against US citizens on the streets of America.

[ReRe]

18. ^^^^^^^

Thanks for voicing my exact opinion!

[damnedifIknow]

15. Immature cops

I think this is a major part of the problem as they haven't matured enough yet to stop playing war.

[Uben]

17. If they wanna use that stuff, join the fucking military!

That's what it's made for....to kill people. Cops aren't here "to kill people". Their job is to serve and protect. From what I have seen, the FPD serves and protects themselves, with little regard to its citizens, other than to use them as a cash cow for the city! I'd fire the chief immediately, the onus is on him for this behavior.

[Blue_Tires]

20. The problem is state governments and DHS

have been awarding all these "toys" and increasing budgets for local police departments...

It's been like Christmas Day ever since 9-11...

[A HERETIC I AM]

26. This morning at about 5:00 AM I came across a Sheriff dressed as if he was about to go into combat.

I had a trip this morning that took me down I 95 in Northern FL. I stopped at a Pilot Truck Stop for a coffee and when I walked out, here was a local Sheriff Deputy talking to another truck driver about something. The guy was dressed in body armor, fatigues, combat boots and all the accoutrements.

I walked by him and in a properly loud voice asked him "Are you in the Army? Or are you a PEACE Officer?" (Purposely emphasizing the word "Peace&quot

He looked at me as if I was speaking French.

Who is your enemy, dude?

Jesus H. Christ on a unicycle juggling chainsaws.

[truedelphi]

59. Those of us who know what is going on are the enemy.

Special Ops forces are being deployed to Ferguson Missouri.

Why do we need special ops people involved? Can anyone in an official position really count on people of color in the National Guard to fire on their own?

Here is a link to a discussion abut this:
http://failuretolisten.com/2014/08/21/breaking-special-ops-military-contractors-now-being-deployed-to-ferguson/

Breaking: Special Ops Military Contractors Now Being Deployed to Ferguson


The Blackwater-esque military contracting company ‘Asymmetrical Solutions’ announced on Twitter yesterday that they are deploying special ops to Ferguson.

They refused to give the public necessary details about why they are capitalizing off of this civil unrest, saying“we cannot professionally hand out that information, regardless of client or location. We put a security team of former SOF personnel into the STL area at the request of a client.”

[A HERETIC I AM]

61. Sickening. n/t

[Feral Child]

27. K&R n/t

[Number23]

28. "My guess is that they’ve got a surplus of toys to play with,

and a powerless demographic to experiment on."

This should be required reading. K&R

[Flyboy_451]

29. Actually, no, he didn't.

Aside from the fact that that he didn't reveal anything that couldn't be discovered with about fifteen minutes of internet research, he is flat out wrong or misinformed on much of what he wrote.

For the record, I firmly believe that there is more than enough evidence to swear out an indictment on officer Wilson and that I personally believe him to be guilty of aggravated manslaughter, AT THE VERY LEAST. Evidence may prove otherwise, but I would be very skeptical.

My full support is with the PEACEFUL PROTESTORS!

Returning to this particular individuals "explanations"...

Notice that when referring to any of the chemical agents or projectile weapons deployed in ferguson, he always calls them "less THAN lethal". In 6 years of military service and 18 years in law enforcement, not one time have I seen packaging of these products that describes them as "Less Than Lethal". In fact every package that I have ever seen describes them as "LESS LETHAL", they are still lethal, but less so than traditional copper and lead projectiles. Additionally, every factory package that I have ever seen included labels that strongly warned that improper use was likely to cause death, and even when used according to manufacturers intentions, medical conditions could cause unexpected results including serious injury and death.

During training with any of these weapons, it's is stressed that this is the case. There is a strict list of "DO NOTs". Violations of these lists greatly increases the chance of more than minor injuries.

Let's look at a few other items he specifically calls out.

Kevlar helmets- really? A piece of equipment designed to protect the wearer from head injury is somehow offensive and hostile? We require kids to wear a helmet when riding a skateboard or bicycle, standing at the plate hoping to hit a home run, and while playing various other sports. Why do we require this? Because of a potential for head injury associated with all of these activities. Would you really expect a police officer going into a situation where there is a significant likelihood of objects being thrown to not wear something to protect his head? Not to mention the various other situations that law enforcement encounter that would indicate to any thinking individual that this might me a good piece of gear to have on hand.

assault-friendly gas masks- I'm not really sure what he means by this. I can only assume that he means that it is a low profile mask, that allows a wide field of view, so as not to impede the use of weapons.

Once again, I would think this to be a very reasonable piece of equipment for law enforcement to have. Protests, peaceful or otherwise, are not the singular incident that law enforcement responds to. How many different types of gas masks or other respiratory protection devices would you like your local government to shell out big bucks for?

combat gloves and knee pads- once again, I have to ask...really? Items intended to protect the wearer from injury that we find in many other fields of endeavor.

tactical body armor vests- so, LEOs should approach possibly dangerous situations without adequate protection from everything from impact injuries to edged weapons and rifle fire? Or are we supposed to be omniscient and simply know when such equipment will be called for? How often would you be willing to bet your life on that guess?

semiautomatic pistols attached to their thighs- breaking news! Semiautomatic pistols are standard issue for nearly every law enforcement agency in the country, if not the world. Does the location that it is worn really matter? If so, I'll explain why they are worn lower than belt level. It's really quite simple, the body armor covers the belt line. You have to put it somewhere. Why not the upper thigh?


disposable handcuff restraints hanging from their vests- is it not reasonable to carry multiple restraints when moving into an area in which it is very possible that you may have to restrain multiple people? The zip cuffs cost less than $2 per unit. Smith and Wesson handcuffs, on the other hand sell for about ten times that.

close-quarter-battle receivers for their M4 carbine rifles- in all my years involved in forearms, both professionally and for recreational use, I have never heard this term. I assume he is referring to the flat top, or A3 style receivers that are common on these rifles. They are there to allow a more flexible and suitable sighting system to be installed by the user, depending on what their specific needs are.

Advanced Combat Optical Gunsights- now that sounds truly terrifying. At least it does until you understand what this sight is and what it does. While the A.C.O.G. is a specific sight made by Trijicon, I assume he is using it in a more general sense, meaning any of the optical style sights commonly used for similar roles. With typical rifle iron sights, shooting in low light conditions is difficult to the nature of the sights. The rear sight is generally a peep that must be looked through and aligned with the front sight. This requires the shooter to shift his eyesight between three different focal planes, the rear sight, the front sight and the target.

The advantage of this type of sight is that when you look through it, it superimposes a bright dot onto your target and places everything in a single focal plane. They typically have no magnification and are intended for close range shooting, making it more reliable to place rounds on target in sub-ideal conditions. Perhaps you would prefer to have a system that increases risk to bystanders by making the gun more difficult to aim accurately?

I think that's enough for now. Ask yourself if you are reacting to such things on an emotional of practical level. Regardless of what is going on in Ferguson, law enforcement work encompassing a multitude of roles that require a variety of equipment.

[blackspade]

31. Apologist fail.

So by your definition of the issue we should just put the Army and Marines on the street.
Let's just skip the poorly trained racist cops and go straight for people actually trained in urban combat to keep the white utopia safe.

[Flyboy_451]

34. Not at all what I said, but

Thanks for putting words in my mouth.

I apologize for nothing that is not my own action or decision. As far as I'm concerned, nearly every officer involved with the events in Ferguson, including Captain Johnson, should be put on review by a non police panel, and held accountable for their actions/inaction. Wilson needs to be brought up on charges and let the court determine what did or did not happen.

As for LE equipment, if you choose to remove defensive equipment that truly serves a need in the varied role of LE, as well as less lethal offensive measures, the only two options left will be bare hands and lethal force. Care to make a guess how that will turn out?

Tensions and emotions with regard to this travesty of our legal system are running high. If people continue to fuel those fires rather than use their heads to find solutions, the problem is not going to get better. It's going to get far worse. This is a powder keg waiting for the right spark to ignite it. Nothing good comes from that. But carry on if that's where you think a solution is to be found.

[blackspade]

36. The issue is that this is not defensive equipment.

It is offensive military gear that should only be used by the military or specially trained swat units, not as standard issue.
And what about the tanks and armored cars? Is this a fucking war zone? No, it's not.

The militarization of the cops has to stop not only for the sake of 'civilians' but for the cops as well.
It is not an us verses them situation. It is just another civilian job like any other, admittedly slightly more dangerous.

[Flyboy_451]

37. How is a vehicle that is

Last edited Fri Aug 22, 2014, 10:08 AM - Edit history (1)

ARMORED, but does not have mounted weapons an offensive weapon? It's primary role is to serve as a safe means of moving into and out of a potentially dangerous environment, and as a safe haven should the need arise. I have yet to see a "tank" in use any local law enforcement. Not saying that there isn't some department out there that has one, just that I haven't seen it. Nor would I condone it.

Of the items listed in the OP, what do you believe I have failed to provide an accurate description of, and what reason are they not suitable for civilian law enforcement use?


Edited for spelling.

[blackspade]

38. Never mind.

If you can't see the problem with a militarized police force, nothing I can say will change that.

Enjoy your stay at DU.

[green917]

40. mrap

The vehicle in question is called an mrap or mine-resistant armored personnel carrier. When you can tell me the last time an ied or land mine killed a police officer in the United States then I will accede that a local police force like that of Ferguson, mo (or Dakota county, mn in my Kneck of the woods who also have a couple of them) needs this type of vehicle. I was I in the military for 6 years and served several times in a forward area and I can assure you that there is no need for a local police force to have such a vehicle!

[Flyboy_451]

41. Yes, I am very familiar with the MRAP.

Notice that I did not specify the need for a mine resistant vehicle. However, just because a vehicle is mine resistant, does not make it unsuitable. Because it is mine resistant, is it also safe from any level of weapon that is likely to be brought to bear against LEOs in some situations.

The ability to safely deliver and retrieve officers from situations that require resistance to rifle fire is a very real concern. Most of this type equipment is acquired from the DOD at a fraction of the cost of retrofitting something like a Chevy Suburban to similar bullet resistant capabilities. If memory serves, the price of doing so is somewhere north of $200,000. I would think that it would be preferable to spend less on the vehicle and use the remainder for training in everything from community relations to municipal law and civil rights. As I stated earlier, if you remove defensive and less lethal measures, what's left is not something that we want to explore.

To be clear, yes, the MRAP exceeds the needs of police departments for armored protection. However, it is a cost effective means of addressing a real problem and is defensive in nature, not offensive.

[A Little Weird]

50. Cost effective??

I know the military is just giving them away, but how much does it cost to operate and maintain one of these? I think the taxpayer is getting screwed. First we pay for equipment the military obviously doesn't need and then we pay at the local level for the cops to have a cool toy to play with.

[truedelphi]

63. Thank you for info on the MRAP and otehr weapons. However,

My feeling on the matter is that as a society, we would have a lot less cause to need these things if our money was spent on regular old fashioned programs for kids and other people, rather than on weaponry.

Sixty seven counties in Calif. have either purchased these MRAP's or else been "gifted" them.

Meanwhile communities are struggling. The local city's swimming pool
needed $ 40,000 of repairs before it could be opened. Man oh man did we have to struggle to come up with the money.

And music and arts programs are cut to the bone in Calif. schools.

I think if we spent our money on the kids, they would grow up to be happier more productive, and then less need to worry about this type of vehicle being needed. (IN affluent Marin County, I have no idea how the MRAP would get to a hostage site. The county is in grid lock almost 18 hours of the day. You'd have to have the hostage taking happen at 2 Am. And why we can't simply rely on helicopters to get officers into a calamity zone, I don't know.)

[toby jo]

65. Wealth maldistribution in a nutshell, true.

Same thing in the middle east. The Peace Corps had Afghans growing saffron. When the program stopped, they went right back to their beloved poppies.

Far too much money being spent on the great war machine.

[duhbyas pet goat]

42. Imagine waking up to find

a fleet of armored vehicles surrounding your house. That wouldn't be offensive at all.

[Flyboy_451]

43. Offensive to someone's personal preferences, absolutely.

Offensive in the sense that they cause physical injury? Pretty unlikely. Particularly when you consider that it is very unlikely that any police department has a fleet of them.

And not nearly as offensive as being struck by a thirty caliber bullet that just penetrated the thin sheet metal door of a conventional patrol vehicle.

[duhbyas pet goat]

44. They are assault vehicles

used to deliver troops to attack.

[Flyboy_451]

45. And to safely retreat when the need arises.

[green917]

39. as this marine said

I wasn't as up-armored as the "peace officer" in the photo in question is the last time I deployed to Afghanistan. What's your explanation for the camouflage? The simple reality is that these "peace officers" are excessively armed and, what is worse, are not exercising proper fire arms etiquette in an already tense situation...it's almost as if they want to project an intimidating stance!

[A HERETIC I AM]

64. " making it more reliable to place rounds on target in sub-ideal conditions."......

Because, at the end of the day, that's all that matters to a cop, isn't it?

That the public is a target and one wants to make sure he has nice grouping.

18 years, eh?

I suppose if we were sitting across a table from one another at a pub sharing a pitcher, I might find you a personable, reasonable individual.

But my impression of you after reading the above is that you are a cop who bloody well loved his job, and I can imagine why.

I'll bet you just didn't put up with any shit at all, did you?

[Flyboy_451]

66. Ignoring the very thinly veiled attacks on my character

As well as the obvious contempt without justification...

" making it more reliable to place rounds on target in sub-ideal conditions."

Because every round fired from my weapon is a round that I take full and absolute responsibility for. The ugly truth is that there are occasions when firing in the line of duty is necessary. If that moment comes, putting rounds onto the intended target is in every way, shape and form, preferable to having them impact an unintended target. And, at the end of the day, that is ALL that matters.

I suppose if we were sitting across a table from one another at a pub sharing a pitcher, I might find you a personable, reasonable individual.

Well, I like to think that I am both personable and reasonable. The citizens in the area that I routinely patrol seem to think so. During my years on duty, I have built an excellent relationship with my community. It makes my job both easier and more enjoyable.

But my impression of you after reading the above is that you are a cop who bloody well loved his job, and I can imagine why.

While I do indeed love my job, your imagination is about as far from reality as the latest greatest low budget, B grade sci-fi movie. I have seen enough violence to last two lifetimes. I have seen people at their absolute worst and their absolute best, and can tell you from personal experience that some of the acts of courage and compassion that I have been witness to, are likely far beyond what the average person will ever have the opportunity to observe. THIS is why I love my job. Because the best of mankind is truly amazing, and it is often displayed alongside some of the worst of man.

I'll bet you just didn't put up with any shit at all, did you?

Actually, I am tickled to tears of laughter to take all the shit anyone wants to shovel, short of you initiating physical force, and do so with a smile on my face. Funny thing about having a solid reputation both within the community as a whole, and within our legal system, even if everything that you and I are doing and saying were not being recorded, (we have been wearing body cameras for almost two years now, and I love it!) that type of community standing is hard to overcome with the judge and jury. I've spent my entire career building a reputation of being friendly, fair and honest. Integrity is a gift that only you can give yourself.

Have a nice day!

[A HERETIC I AM]

67. Fine. You're Sheriff Andy Taylor.

Bully for you.

"Thinly veiled attacks on my character"

Damn...I thought I was being crystal clear!

I have been thinking for several hours how I would respond to you, as I am a truck driver and I had a short - 5 hour trip to make tonight.

It wouldn't have been out of the ordinary for me to spend 2 hours crafting a reply with all sorts of links and videos and whatnot, picking your post apart word for word.....but you know what?


I just don't give enough of a fuck to bother. Not to mention I have to drive to Atlanta tomorrow and then team drive up to Detroit, so it will be a very long day and it is late now.

But I will say this; I'm not attacking your character, but I sure as hell do question it. I question the character of ANYONE who voluntarily chooses to join a line of work that, by virtue of saying some special magic words, is given permission by the state to fuck with people. To lie intentionally. To carry weapons and use them at will with virtual impunity. To be able to order complete strangers around and if they don't act fast enough to satisfy some unknown and unknowable mental stopwatch, detain, arrest and incarcerate for extended periods even when the slightest crime was not committed. Permission that allows thousands of people who take an oath to defend the Constitution, to ignore it completely when it suits them. Permission to act as an agent of the state tax collection division, which is essentially what all traffic cops are.

I will start believing the majority of cops are good and decent (like I did when I was 5 or 6) when I start seeing video after video and story after story showing how the 25 "Good Cops" show up and stop the 1 or 2 bad ones from beating the shit out of someone laying on the ground with his hands extended. All I want to see is all these allegedly good cops - the supposed vast majority I keep hearing about, kicking the crap out of the endless numbers of assholes making you all look bad. When, oh when am I going to start seeing that?

When, oh when am I going to see a video where a guy holding a steak knife (a FUCKING STEAK KNIFE!) gets 9 bullets shot into him by two cops too fucking lazy or stupid or shitstained cowardly to talk to him and calm him down, who are then ARRESTED by the next 2 cops on the scene?

You want to defend yourself and your profession. Fine. Like I said, you're fucking Andy God Damned Taylor. Bloody well good for you. But you are becoming a minority my good man and your ranks are being filled with people who took the god damned job because it was the only way they were ever going to get ANYONE to call them "Sir" and/or they took the job because they relish the idea of being able to tell others what to do because they took 3 colors of shit growing up. The kind of guy who was picked last for kickball.

One last thing - this;

I have I have seen people at their absolute worst and their absolute best, and can tell you from personal experience that some of the acts of courage and compassion that I have been witness to, are likely far beyond what the average person will ever have the opportunity to observe.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, blah blah fucking blah. Who gives a fuck? YOU chose the line of work. Please don't think I am impressed because you "have seen enough violence to last two lifetimes." That's the damned job you chose, bub. As far as acts of courage and compassion are concerned, again, blah blah blah. You are no more privileged to see that sort of thing in your lifetime than I am or anyone else, the thing is, you are most likely so incredibly impressed when those things are done by your fellow badge and gun toting chuckleheads that you might not see the simple acts going on around you constantly.


Sorry pal, I am just not impressed. You're a cop. Big fucking deal.

The business I am in brought you your entire life.


But so what?

Have a great day! And stay safe out there.

[Flyboy_451]

68. Thanks for the morning laugh!

Funny thing about people, we ALL have prejudices, but we all have the choice of either acting on them or not. If your conduct here is reflective of how you deal with people in person, I would not be surprised at all that you have had unpleasant experiences with cops, or anyone else for that matter.

Andy Taylor? Nah...but I do make the choice to be friendly and polite, both in person or here on an anonymous forum.

Enjoy your weekend

[A HERETIC I AM]

69. Glad to be of service.

I've been arrested exactly twice in my entire life; a DUI and for possession, both over 35 years ago.

If your conduct here is reflective of how you deal with people in person, I would not be surprised at all that you have had unpleasant experiences with cops, or anyone else for that matter.

Yeah...I suppose I deserved that. Just ask anyone that knows me or is familiar with my posting history on DU. I don't get along with anyone and am always surly and disagreeable.

I deal with people in the same way you would have me believe you do - with humor, kindness, compassion and politeness.

I just don't do it with a firearm strapped to me and I don't have a state sanction to fuck with people.

As long as we are telling each other what to do, enjoy your weekend too! Don't ticket anyone for making a simple mistake.

[blackspade]

30. Super kick from me!

[father founding]

35. Patriot Act

Dismantle the shadow government and send it back to the sleazy hole it crawled out of.

[blkmusclmachine]

48. But 9/11. And "freedom." And 9/11. And 9/11. And 9/11. And 9/11. And 9/11.

And 9/11.

[world wide wally]

46. PATHETIC

[blkmusclmachine]

47. +1 on a War against the 99%.

[Squinch]

51. And though it certainly isn't the most important point of all this, let's not forget that we paid

for all that nonsense in our taxes. And that shit is expensive. And we bought it at the expense of education and infrastructure and services.

[harun]

53. The scream "budget neutral" until it's time to buy the weapons, then not a peep

[Fantastic Anarchist]

56. ^^^This^^^

Health care? Nope.

Weapons? Hell yeah!

[sendero]

52. I reject 90% of the narrative surrounding this phenomena...

... first bullshit lie, the equipment is "surplus". Do you really believe that? The pentagon screams that the budget cuts are too much but year after year they give equipment, CURRENT USABLE EQUIPMENT, away? Bullshit.

When the Federal government gives ANYTHING to cities/states, there is an agenda.

What do you think the agenda is? You think podunk police departments need this kind of equipment to do their current jobs? NO FREAKING WAY.

There is a job that is anticipated, something in the future, a possible or likely eventuality, that is why they have this equipment, IMHO.

[L0oniX]

54. They know they've been maliciously wrong and pissed off the community for years...

so the pigs expect revenge ...and are ready for it. IMO those Ferguson pigs deserve the revenge they should be getting.

[Fantastic Anarchist]

57. Yep, and now they've internalized themselves as the victims.

Fuck them.

[Enthusiast]

58. Kicked and recommended a whole bunch!

[johnlucas]

60. They're prepping for a fight alright. A war even. A Civil War.

Eventually every Progressive/Liberal/Fairness/Justice minded person will recognize that the ROOT of all the Regression & all the Obstacles to making this place a better place to live for all is the CONFEDERATE SOUTH.

Everything from the abortion clinic bombers to those who attack women's rights to the spectacle about "illegal immigration" to the Military-Industrial Complex to the War on Drugs to the Christian Taliban to the Resistance to Science to the blockage of Universal Health Care to the ever-increasing gap between the poor & the rich...EVERYTHING...

It all stems from this spiteful faction in the country called the CONFEDERATE SOUTH.
They never let go of the ORIGINAL Confederacy of the 1770s & 1780s.
It was then that they enjoyed their fiefdoms as they lived like kings on the backs of the African slaves.
White Dominion was a National Religion, it's true, but nobody practiced it better than the slaveowning South.

"States' Rights" "Small Government" all different code words that mean "LEAVE MY FIEFDOM ALONE while I oppress these inferiors!"
State Governments are smaller than National Governments, aren't they?
When this place had to make that first compromise in 1787 (the 3/5 One) who were the ones blocking the unity of the supposed United States?
The SOUTH.

They hated this idea of this central league, this 'foeder', these federals putting the National Government over their State Governments.
It was the Federalists vs. the Anti-Federalists.
Wait I got a better name than that. Who really wants to name themselves after their opposition?
Let's call us Anti-Federalists the Democratic-Republicans.
Break it down to its Greek & Latin roots.

Demos = People (in Greek). Crat = Rule (in Greek). Res = Matters (in Latin). Public = People (in Latin).

Democratic-Republican = People Rule the Matters of the People = States over Federal = States' Rights = Small Government = Fiefdom.

To get them on board the Federals had to give the South an advantage in representation.
Not JUST 1/2 but 3/5 of every slave counted in census to make the pot sweeter.
That way the South effectively still has their fiefdom as they can have more sway in the direction of the government.
And the South pushed for their way over all others ever since.

When they're finally put in check, no one ever finishes the job & they are allowed to fester & grow back.
They will continue to retard the country until they are ABSOLUTELY DEFEATED.

If you are serious about changing this country, you will recognize this nerve center & seek to destroy it.
Texas is the nuclear power plant fueling the Confederate South & has been ever since the 1800s.
Break Texas & the rest of the Confederate South starts to crumble.
Chip away at Georgia, the Carolinas, Florida, the Virginias, & all the rest as much as you can.
Until this South is defeated absolutely you can forget ANY real lasting progress for this country.

These guys are still fighting this war. A quieter version than the 1860s one but the same Civil War nevertheless.
And know that this war didn't begin in 1861 & didn't end in 1865.
This war has been fought from the very beginnings of the country called the United States of America.
The 1860s one was just the one with the fireworks.
They don't wanna give up their fiefdom & they will fight you to keep it.

That's what happened to Michael Brown, that's what happened to those Sikhs who got killed by that wacko from that hate group.
That's what happened to Trayvon Martin, that's why Cliven Bundy has those militias aiming guns at officials.
It's all connected.

Read my old post A long story about the Southern Strategy to see the history in detail.
There are no coincidences here.
They must be defeated if you REALLY want progress.
John Lucas