Questions About Tactics and Targets as Civilian Toll Climbs in Israeli Strikes

[bravenak]

By ANNE BARNARD JULY 21, 2014



KHAN YOUNIS, Gaza — The blast from the Israeli strike was so powerful that it threw an iron door clear over several neighboring houses. It came to rest along with a twisted laundry rack still laden on Monday with singed clothes and a child’s slipper.

When the strike leveled a four-story house in the southern Gaza Strip the night before, it also killed 25 members of four family households — including 19 children — gathered to break the daily Ramadan fast together. Relatives said it also killed a guest of the family, identified by an Israeli human rights group as a member of the Hamas military wing, ostensibly Israel’s target.

The attack was the latest in a series of Israeli strikes that have killed families in their homes, during an offensive that Israel says is meant to stop militant rocket fire that targets its civilians and destroy Hamas’s tunnel network.


http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/22/world/middleeast/questions-about-tactics-and-targets-as-civilian-toll-climbs-in-israeli-strikes.html?_r=0

[Violet_Crumble]

1. More from the article...

'Speaking in general, a senior Israeli military official said in a recent interview that not all civilian casualties come from strikes going astray; some take place when civilians are in places the military aims to hit.

“Not all the casualties are due to mistakes,” he said. “If Hamas are holding people inside the apartments while shooting from there, that’s one of the tragedies they are making.”

That did not appear to be the situation at the Abu Jameh home, where, survivors said, the family was gathered to break its daily Ramadan fast, a ceremonial meal, a time when Israeli military officials would have known that people were likely to be home.'

[bravenak]

2. A little bit more from the piece.

Of those who lived in the house, only four people survived, three men who had gone to pray, and Tawfik Abu Jameh’s toddler, shielded by the body of his mother. The children killed ranged in age from 4 months to 14 years, and included an adopted orphan whose father had been killed in an Israeli strike.

One of the survivors, Bassam Abu Jameh, lay on a mat with a broken leg, his eyes rimmed with red. His wife, Yasmeen; two brothers; and three children, Batool, 5, Sohaila, 3, and Bassam, 1, had all been killed. “There is nothing left,” he said, pressing his hand to his eyes. “It is the end for us.”

He closed his eyes, lying still and letting his neighbors continue the account. After a while, he opened them again and announced, in a shaky voice: “I will marry again four times, and I will have 10 sons with each wife, and they will all be in the resistance.”

[LuvNewcastle]

3. These murders have happened so many times during incursions

into Palestinian territory. But it really feels like the world is watching this time; I'm surprised and I don't know why this time is different. I hope the next attack will be prevented. Maybe there's something the rest of the world can do. I'd like to see Netanyahu captured and brought to the Hague for trial along with his military commanders. I know that's hoping for a lot, but this must be punished.

We've got to force some kind of peace between the Israelis and Palestinians. It's time for the U.S. to do something about it since we have the most influence, although I think it's something in which the rest of the world should also be involved.

[4now]

4. Something seems to be changing

People are speaking out and the world is not believing Netanyahu's lies this time.

[bravenak]

5. Good.

He went off the deep end with the 'Telegenically Dead' thing he said. The man is a big time liar and bad for Israel.

[BlueMTexpat]

6. Such a human being is bad

for humanity itself.

[bravenak]

7. I'm glad he wont shut up.

It helps us see who this guy really is.

[azurnoir]

8. another bit from the article

On Monday night, a strike hit an eight-story apartment building in downtown Gaza City — an area where Israeli officials had urged Gazans to take shelter. The building collapsed as rescue crews were inside, killing more people. The death toll, at least 13, was still being tallied.

this has happened more than once in past in past operations people are told to go to a specific place and then it is bombed-the explanation when one is given is usually something along the lines of -"failya to communicate" or some such

[bravenak]

9. It really does sound like it was on purpose.

I do not believe anything Netanyahu says now.

[azurnoir]

10. There's so many attempts at absolution fron responsibility

coming from Israel and it's 'supporters' that it's actually starting to have a negative impact

[bravenak]

11. It's the way they talk about it and blame the dead for dying.

It trips me out that i actually read someone say that the kids should have gotten out of the way of the missiles. Their cries of 'Human shields' sound so nasty and unsympathetic to the dead civilians that it make them seem bloodthirsty and unfeeling. I keep saying never become the bad guy you are fighting against. But nobody listens.

[azurnoir]

12. check this out : Israel-Gaza conflict: The myth of Hamas’s human shields

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/israelgaza-conflict-the-myth-of-hamass-human-shield-9619810.html

http://www.democraticunderground.com/113471537

[bravenak]

13. The people have nowhere to go.

This right here makes perfect sense.

Members of families who owned six of the buildings had moved in with relations and neighbours in the area. Their reason for staying behind was primarily because there was, they said, nowhere else to go. There were also declarations about not giving up one’s land, not giving in to invaders.

There was denial of coercion by Hamas. “I am not going to go because I can do something Hamas cannot do”, maintained Nabil al-Masri. “I know from times before that if Israeli soldiers get into an empty house they will ruin it on purpose. Hamas cannot stop them going into my house if we leave, but, by staying here we can try to make sure that doesn’t happen.”

[azurnoir]

14. I remember in the after math of Operation Cast Lead

stories about how troops totally trashed houses destroyed stuff, sprayed graffiti, and in some cases actually urinating and defecating on furniture carpets walls ect

[bravenak]

15. They did that?

I never knew about it. I only started noticing how majorly fucked up my perception of the IP situation was about five years ago. I really believe everything Israel said. Truly. Someone had to sit me down and tell me to shut up and look or myself. I am glad i did.

[azurnoir]

16. heres a link

http://www.commondreams.org/headline/2009/03/06-6

for me it happened a bit earlier and started with a friend of one of my daughters who'd grown up in Southern Lebanon during Israel's occupation there and recounted his experiences as kid and young teenager

[bravenak]

17. What a horrible story.

The most moral army. I can't believe we send them billions of dollars a year to do this. This operation will not go as well as that one and they won't come out of it looking like the good guys.