A time when people weren't stupid and annoying.

[hobbit709]

[uriel1972]

1. Truly... nt

[certainot]

2. if they were going back in steps: when the left failed to notice the right's media

managers buying up a talk radio monopoly after reagan killed the Fairness Doctrine in 1987, and subsequently continued to ignore the alternate reality-creating machine that dominates messaging in the US today, would rank as a major recent turning point.

[2banon]

3. annoying and stupid people existed before Murdock came along

we just didn't have to hear any of their insane and stupid ideas on our radios or tvs before the obliteration of the Fairness Doctrine, which yes Reagan half way killed and then Clinton finished off in the 90's.

[certainot]

5. exactly my point. they'll always be there but before 1987 and the monopoly

they didn't have the loudest soapboxes on the planet. and the left still walks by with their iPods in their ears going na na na na na.

BTW, excusing the bush reagan criminals and later hamstringing clinton, stopping health reform and making single payer politically impossible (later stopping public option), getting thomas on the supremes by letting limbaugh do to anita hill what he did to fluke, and generally creating the political atmosphere in which a pro corporate dem like clinton would take the easy way out and deregulate media (while all those radio stations were screaming 'free speech!' to 50 mil a week), were all big successes for the right that wouldn't have happened without the left's complete ignorance of talk radio. which continues today, with few exceptions.

shifting blame for letting rw radio dominate messaging onto the clinton media deregulation is useless and distracts from the fact that the left still allows talk radio to kick our internet ass.

and practically irrelevant also, because the republicans would merely have had to spread ownership among more fascist corporatist owners.

[2banon]

6. Shared blame. not shifting. I was intensely involved in media activism for about 10 + years

I agree with your points, except I'm not shifting blame. Just reminding that Corporate Dems share the blame, Clinton was in position to "undo" Reagan's repeal of the Fairness Doctrine. Instead he hammered the last nail in the coffin. Having said that, I agree with your assessment of the left ignoring the issue, failing to grasp how important it was/is to take back the media.

[certainot]

7. and it's a catch 22 cause until we challenge rw radio that massive propaganda

machine will ensure we'll never get legislation past the republicans and corporate dems to get any real reform. i believe taking down rw radio is the necessary first step, but there will continue to be a lot of futile effort and discussion on the left about the lack of reform first.

the fcc was recently going to do a simple study of decision making for content of those radio shows, but the hundreds of rw radio blowhards all screamed censorship, and it was squashed like a bug.

all recent efforts by dems to fix the media have been squashed similarly.

while i think at this point it would be futile to try for a new fairness doctrine for radio, it's amazing how many on the left oppose some new fairness doctrine merely out of the belief of much of the BS about it by the right as they defend their talk radio monopoly as an expression of free speech by individual political entertainers, and market forces.

[2banon]

8. very true.. and speaking of RW dominance of media, Murdock seems to be closer to

achieving his goal wrt to Time Warner. a true coup d'etat wrt total dominance. In this morning's news.

pick and choose which report(s) you want to read about the matter, I am aware that the reports suggest rebuff by Time Warner, but ya know how the story will eventually go.

[2banon]

4. good one.. n/t