If You Were Here For The Clinton/Obama Fights In 2007/2008... A Question:

[WillyT]

If you were here, you know how heated/bad it got.

I realize nobody has declared as of yet...

But what are your tea leaves telling you ?

2015/2016...

Better, or worse?

21 votes, 0 passes | Time left: Unlimited
	Better
	3 (14%)
	Worse
	18 (86%)
	Their IS no "other"
	0 (0%)
	0 DU members did not wish to select any of the options provided.
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[leftstreet]

1. 1000x worse. If you misspell Hillary you'll be SEXIST !!111

Oh Gawdz

Let's just move on to the coronation, then grit our teeth through 4 yrs

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

12. 4? If she gets 4, she'll get 8.

If people are willing to elect her once, I don't think they'll change their minds after one term.

[leftstreet]

16. I really doubt it. The economy's going in the shitter

Hillary doesn't really have the Hope and Change Candidate-Out-of-Nowhere thing going for her. Buyer's remorse is more likely to set in

Plus that's 4 years to groom a populist sounding GOPer

Not that I"m an expert

[StevieM]

23. There is no way of predicting exactly what will happen

For all we know, she wins the White House in 2016 and then decides that she doesn't want to run for a second term.

And the economy could slowly keep gaining ground through 2020 before a recession hits in 2021. There are so many variables that determine that, many of which are not apparent in advance.

And even if a Republican does win...it might not be a new face. Their great revolutionary, Ronald Reagan, was neither a new face, nor a new idea, in 1980. He just finally won.

[L0oniX]

18. ...and the jury clowns will hide it.

[Historic NY]

2. Who can forget the PUMA battles....

raging in the trenches.

[NightWatcher]

3. During Hillary v Obama there were two sides. Who are the combatants this time?

Sure there are some that don't like Hillary even if she were running against Satan-Hitler spawn, but I'm just hoping for a win to crush the repukes, then we can work on our problems.

[leftstreet]

5. Democrats vs Centrists

The supreme irony - the battle between Obama and Hillary was Centrist vs Centrist

[NightWatcher]

11. it's been said before but Obama was the rorschach candidate

People who wanted a Progressive saw him as a Progressive, those wanting a Centrist a Centrist, and those fearing a Kenyan, Socilist, Muslin....

[brooklynite]

31. So, which side will Elizabeth Warren be on?

[H2O Man]

4. Worse.

(Recommended, by the way.)

The level of discourse on DU has been steadily lowered in quality since 2008. This includes discussions about issues we should be debating. It's a safe bet that the 2016 primary season and general election will be uglier than ever.

[Demeter]

6. Glad you mentioned that it wasn't just the elections that will be worse

I cannot believe some of the goings on on this site.

Perfect strangers being perfectly rude. The conform--or else! attitude. Who are these people, and why do they think they are gods?

[H2O Man]

9. Right.

I grew up in a poor, Irish family. We lived on a small farm. For entertainment, my brothers and I had two options: boxing and arguing (often about boxing).

I enjoy a good-spirited debate, and even a heated argument. But that can be best accomplished by showing a degree of respect for one's opposition, if not their opinion.

[StevieM]

14. I remember you educating me about boxing about three years ago.

You had said that Muhammad Ali was the greatest of all time. I told you that I didn't know much about boxing, but I had thought that Joe Louis was considered the greatest. You explained to me why you considered Ali to be superior, but acknowledged that many (especially from the older generation) considered Joe to be number one, and that you respected their point of view.

I haven't learned too much more about boxing since then, but I do have one more question for you: Is it true that many consider Larry Holmes to be vastly underrated, and arguably in the top 3, along with Ali and Louis?

The reason I ask is because I recently heard that many boxing observers considered Holmes to be the most underrated of all time, and Rocky Marciano to be the most overrated. Is this true?

[H2O Man]

39. I'll pm my answer.

[NanceGreggs]

27. ...

"I grew up in a poor, Irish family. We lived on a small farm. For entertainment, my brothers and I had two options: boxing and arguing (often about boxing)."

Honest-to-God, that sounds like a great slug line for an upcoming movie - one I would definitely want to see. Not because I am interested in small farms or boxing, but because it so totally captures the essence of a bygone era, a way of life, and a time when siblings created their own reality and lived it with gusto.

Well said, H20 Man - downright poetic.

[H2O Man]

44. Well, thank you!

The first time I read "Angela's Ashes," I remember feeling a bit jealous that the author had more food and clothes in his childhood than I ever dared to dream of.

[AuntPatsy]

7. I rarely if ever participate in these polls but had to... I am not looking forward to it all

[etherealtruth]

8. Much worse ... and iit has nothing to do with the candidates

[ecstatic]

10. Better. That was a ground-breaking, exciting primary season

We'll probably never see anything like it again in our lifetimes.

[NaturalHigh]

13. I really have no idea.

It depends on who the candidates are.

[hughee99]

15. Better or worse in what respect?

How heated it got? If Hillary is able to "clear the field", as it were, it shouldn't be all that contentious, you'd just have a lot of unhappy people holding their nose while they vote for her in the GE.

I haven't seen anything yet that convinces me she's going to get a serious challenger, but there's still plenty of time for that.

[quinnox]

17. Hillary vs Obama was epic

It seemed like it was a battle to the death some of the time! Picture a Rome arena with two gladiators fighting, and bloodied.

I am thinking the next one will be a more mild affair.

[UTUSN]

19. Uh, and the question *is*?!1 n/t

[OffWithTheirHeads]

20. If we don't get out the vote in 2014, 2016 will be irrelevant.

[Warren DeMontague]

21. Bolt your teeth to your face

Its gonna get ugly in here

[Algernon Moncrieff]

22. My tea leaves tell me there is a large segment here who only want Warren or Sanders

If Hillary gets nominated, I suspect this segment of DU will be perturbed.

[WillyT]

24. Kick !!!

[krawhitham]

25. The Hillraisers were out of control in 2007/2008

They could not believe she was losing and would not accept it. They wanted here to stage a coup at the convention.

[bluestateguy]

26. Hillary and Obama were heavyweights

In 2016 it's going to be Hillary the heavyweight vs. a bunch of lightweights.

And no, Elizabeth Warren ain't running.

There will be some tension, but not like last time.

[hfojvt]

29. the 2004 primary was over pretty quickly

but DU still got very heated in the pre-primary battles. Iowa caucus will be in January 2016, and barring a miracle, Hillary will be declared the winner by late February at the latest.

But there will still be time for rending of garments and gnashing of teeth between February 2015 and February 2016.

[Dawgs]

30. EW is running. No doubt about it.

And she's definitely no lightweight.

[Beacool]

34. In your imagination.

And no, she will not run if Hillary runs.

[Dawgs]

37. In mine, but not yours?

We'll see.

[gordianot]

28. If there is not a Democrat in 2016 America is done.

Two words "Supreme Court". A rabidly insane congress will remain, the only legacy the next President will possibly influence is a slightly less rabidly insane Supreme Court.

My voting philosophy is not a Republican.

[Beacool]

35. I agree, but around here they don't see further than their nose.

2016 will not be like 2008 when people were yearning for a change after Bush. Democrats are now in power and traditionally it's hard for a party to have a third term in the WH. The only thing I see on this site is infighting and a 24/7 campaign against the most viable potential candidate.

As I said before, I will vote for a block of cheese in 2016 if it has a "D" after its name, to prevent Republicans from winning the WH and stacking the Supreme Court. THAT is far more important to me than whatever possible flaws any of our candidates may be perceived to have.

[StevieM]

40. I think the party will coalesce around Hillary if she is the nominee.

And I think she will win, perhaps handily. My bet is on Mike Huckabee to win the Rpublican nomination. Hillary can trounce him, possibly even winning Arkansas.

I don't think the campaign here against Hillary is too bad. And people do tend to change their minds once the primary voting is over. I didn't like Obama in 2008, but I voted for him in the GE. Now I like him a lot and think he has been a great president. I'm glad he has been in the White House for the past 6 1/2 years--can you imagine if it had been McCain or Romney?

[CrispyQ]

32. I didn't want either one, so I stayed out of the fray.

'16 will be worse, though, count on it. We, meaning our society in general, haven't gotten any nicer.

[DanTex]

33. Depends on how the primaries turn out.

If they're over pretty quickly, then it won't be as bad. If it goes to the bitter end again, then it could get nasty.

[Xyzse]

36. Probably a little bit better.

Hillary and Obama was an extremely bitter fight since it was a very historic primary. It was the first time that a Black Man and a Woman had a very real chance in becoming President.

So the supporters wishing for a first of one or the other as President understandably gets very strong feelings about it.

Now that it has happened, it just isn't the same.

It would probably be a little less bitter than the Republican Primary in 2012, where there were also candidates who had a decent shot in winning the candidacy. It would also be a whole lot less of a clown show.

[Johonny]

38. I remember when Obama lost in 2008 because of it

oh wait... for all the crap flung it made no difference to the general election. All the "talk" will be best ignored as it was in 2008.

[truebrit71]

41. Worse. If you're anti-Hillary you're a sexist...

...apparently...

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

42. "Differences of opinion are what make horseraces." Mark Twain

It might spark some interest.

[LexVegas]

43. Sexism is 10x more prevalent than racism.

I believe that Yoko Ono had it right in her famous quote.