Imagine if even the poorest Americans earned a legitimate, sustainable living wage

[Hugabear]

It's no secret that if you make close to minimum wage, that you can't really go out and buy a lot of stuff. Hell, you're lucky if you can even scrape enough just to get buy.

Now imagine if the "poorest" of Americans all earned a decent, sustainable living wage - to the point where there was no more poverty in this country. Imagine that being the starting point, with the country having a vibrant and expanding middle class.

What happens when people have more money? They spend it. They buy stuff. They travel.

"Trickle down" has failed miserably. It only benefits the rich, and creates a wider and wider gap between the haves and have-nots.

How about trying "trickle up" instead - pay everyone a sustainable living wage. Watch how quickly the economy recovers! Hell, buy paying people enough money, they could afford to actually buy products made in the US - which in turn would create even MORE jobs.

[Cleita]

1. I remember when minimum wage sustained me.

We once had an economy where minimum wage, at the bottom, still got you a place to live, food to eat and a beer and a movie at the end of the week. Also, you knew you would move up from there and you did. It is no more.

[onestepforward]

5. Me too.

In the early 80s, I could afford a small, one-bedroom apartment and make car payments on a modest used car. I was able to take a class or two at the community college and have a little money to party.

You're right. It is no more.

[eridani]

8. Yes, I remember that well

My MIL was abandoned by her husband in 1966. She immediately went out and got a minimum wage job, and shortly thereafter entered into a rent-to-buy arrangement for the house we now live in.

[jeff47]

2. How do I earn an illegitimate wage?

/snark

[TheMastersNemesis]

3. Trickle (tinkle) Down Economics Has Succeeded

Tinkle down economics has suceeded. It worked exactly as the GOP and big business designed it. They had RR sell it to the masses then injected racism to keep every one distracted. I remember when RR said we would have a service economy early in his first four years in office. When he canned most of PATCO and allowed cronies to sell junk bonds and start selling of MFG companies the writing was on the wall.

I was at DOL and it was obvious to anyone in my department who was paying attention. The fact that the media was already infiltrated and corrupted help them disguise their activities. The MSM did not report what was happening. And they are much worse to day. Clinton sealed the deal by signing Telecom 1996 which allowed the RW to consolidate even more than they were.

Even progressive talkers constantly say they do not understand how the MSM misses things and does not report important events. The brutal truth is the MSM is an arm of the corporations now and the GOP. And Fox is the flagship of propaganda. So remember what the MSM is doing is deliberate. They know. They are willingly participating in the economic murder of millions. They agree with GOP politicians. They only have Democrats on so they can skunk them.

Tinkle down economics has succeeded wildly for the billionaires. And they will continue it for generations to come. They will never give up supply side because they can see trillionaire in the future. I predict that they will even kill Americans to keep it in place. Romney is their henchman and he will make Bush look like FDR because he will compete with worst president.

Romney is a racist and hateful sociopath and his family is no better. They are all a bunch of scum. Remember Seamus. No one objected to abusing that dog. And you can bet the Bushes are behind a lot too.

[freshwest]

6. I don't buy the bemusement of those claiming the MSM is doing a poor job. It's doing what it's told.

The mocking of what the GOP is a diversion and and ego boost, not putting the blunt truth out.

They won't state the terrible facts of what our existance is or may become.

So many said Bush was stupid, a failure, etc. No, he was not:

[freshwest]

4. AND!!! They are also able to pay taxes for schools, health care, roads, social services, etc.

The stifling of wages has been not just to make a few richer.

Its purpose is to dis-empower the lower groups in society from elevating their conditions.

At that point, they are less willing to go to wars and kill each other at home or abroad.

Thus low wags are part of the MIC's strategy, note all the times they have interfered with unions, etc.

IMHO.

[Egalitarian Thug]

7. Every time it's tried, it works.

But we won't even consider it?

Unless you believe that virtually all the leaders of this nation are drooling idiots, there is a different agenda at work here.

Then the question becomes, "what are we going to do about it?"

[byronius]

9. Great post. Absolutely true.

Robert Anton Wilson called money 'biosurvival tickets', and suggested that an advanced society would ban the hoarding of it.

After all, what are we doing here? What is this all about? Anything at all? Biosurvival ticket hoarders are the ultimate nihilists. Teeth-baring throwback primate tribalists from thirty million years ago. They need to be strongly encouraged to evolve.

Not to mention -- we're all connected. Pain leaks into the quantum foam, stains it. The smart society strives to nurture and develop every single citizen, as if they are all worthy, because it makes everyone healthier, hoarders included.

[freshwest]

25. +1,000. Signed in just for that. Thanks.

[limpyhobbler]

10. makes sense to me

I would like to hear these words "living wage" cross the lips of President Obama some day.

[Zalatix]

13. It's nice to see that we're staying on-message about this

instead of cowering away from the concept in the face of anticipated Republican scorn.

[Major Nikon]

11. Here's why Republicans will never let that happen

If you're trying to support a family on minimum wage, most likely you are eligible and taking advantage of a full range of social services. Your retirement (Social Security), health care insurance (Medicaid), housing (Section 8 or housing assistance), and income (food stamps) are all being supplemented by the government. If these same businesses tried to pay minimum wages without the social safety net, there would be rioting in the streets (which is generally not good for most businesses).

Effectively the government is subsidizing businesses who pay minimum wage. That is what people who vote against their own best interests (Republicans) fail to realize. They are making up the difference in the form of tax dollars.

[hunter]

26. The current system also locks wage slaves into crappy jobs.

Human beings ought to be able to walk away from intolerable working conditions with no risk of hunger or homelessness.

With a generous welfare system and a guaranteed minimum income, low wage employers would be competing to make their work attractive. Shitty abusive low wage employers wouldn't find anyone to work for them. An employer who treated their employees like crap might have to pay twice the wages of a competitor who didn't, and would thus have to change their ways or go out of business.

Businesses that paid minimum wage would have to be pleasant and satisfying places to work.

When I was a young person I remember a few jobs that didn't pay much more than minimum wage, but were interesting and pleasant and didn't make me dread going to work. I also had a few jobs so awful I quit. It was never about the work being difficult, it was always about the bosses treating people like shit, treating them like disposable cogs in their machine.

[Sherman A1]

12. When they started talking trickle down in the 1980's

I knew it was BS then. Trickle up as you say or A Rising Tide Lifts All Boats, would in make use all better off, but I guess it is and was much easier for the 1% types to just steal everything through tax and regulatory reform.

[mopinko]

14. a living wage would fix it all.

including the gap between rich and poor.

[cbrer]

15. The legacy of Ronald Reagan

Has brought us to these economic realities. It will require a struggle to get that power back from wealthy capiltalists and corporate entities. It might be violent, it might be long, but it will be a struggle. Power never conceded anything without a fight. Never will.

[Javaman]

16. First you have to imagine those jobs being here...

instead of being outsourced.

[gateley]

17. K&R. Simple and true. nt

[HooptieWagon]

18. It would eliminate the need for much of the safety net.

You would think conservatives would be all over it.

[mathematic]

19. The poorest Americans will never earn a living wage

Simply because the poorest Americans will never earn ANY wage. The poorest are not employable and will never be employable. This includes people that are mentally ill, have extreme personality disorders, are physically disabled, are too old or too young.

This constant focus on earning a living wage does nothing for people that can't maintain full time employment. The real question our society is facing is how do we address poverty among the lowest productivity workers (including people that don't work)? The answer is not jobs. The answer is minimum income.

[freshwest]

27. I thought #9 was great, but here you come. That is what a nation that truly...

Believes in equality, and the value of life, does. Thanks.

[glowing]

20. At the end of the day, "buying things", is unsustainable for our environment...

We need to create a new way to be "wealthy". Wealth should be measured in happiness, healthiness, time to spend one's time in a manner they wish to spend it in, the ability to be able to do what one is naturally inclined to do (like painting, singing, acting, studying sciences, mathematics, etc...), and the wealth of our natural environment used wisely for 7 billion people.

We need a better model of living than pure Capitalism or Socialism can provide. We need to live amongst one another without fear of one another or jealousy of other's having more stuff or just the ability to have a life that includes having a "job" that one enjoys along with time to live life and have food, health, clean air and water, a roof of quality over one's head (living in a trailer park in the path of tornados and hurricanes because of one's bank account or lack of funds in one, really sucks).... these are items that the wealthy among us have at the touch of their finger tips and often they were only "lucky" enough to be born into a family with monied wealth.

Capitalism (or the capitalistic model we now have of insulating the already wealthy and powerful to keep their lifestyle exclusive for themselves) is a model that only works if we have infinite resources (which we do not) and that items, in general, are supposed to work on a supply/ demand type of model. However, the current flavor doesn't quite work as a supply/ demand only. There are investors that siphon off wealth from those who work to create the supply. There are the big banks, investment firms, and hedge funds that essentially gamble (speculate) on everything from oil and corn to airlines or lightbulbs becoming more or less profitable.

On the other side of the spectrum there is pure socialism (which I don't think we have ever actually seen other than written down as a theory/ model of what things could be like under that structures). Communist countries never let go of the centralized single govt rule to allow people to live as free people. And there is the whole human nature instinct to be competitive and to survive. Having competitive strives and urges to do better or create more can be positive when we are looking to cure cancer or write a best selling novel... And having too much power in the hands off a few is dangerous.

In both systems, centralized power structures make it worse for the rest of humanity. Creating a system that allows every human being, no matter where they are born or who they are born of, to live a life of possibility with a sense of justice and fairness in laws that make sense. I have no idea how its possible to re-structure 7 billion people and to also have people look at one another as people because hatred and fear have been tools long utilized by the wealthy, powerful, religions, and government to keep people divided and warring with one another, rather than to look towards the top of the power structure to see who is really harming their lives.

[Puzzledtraveller]

23. I get what youre saying but..

We are talking about humans, homo sapien-sapien. The species that wiped out , crowded out, or assimilated all the others. Our human nature wants things, wants to collect things, wants to control things and collect more, and control more than the other homo sapien-sapiens, and she, he, will beat your head in with some giant cats femur if you don't comply. There will be no utopia for humankind, EVER!

[raouldukelives]

28. So true. I see so many people these days running

around like crazed drones. Driving to and fro to places of work or places to shop. Never once stopping to wonder what they are really contributing to society as a whole other than increased carbon emissions and a more terrifying world for their offspring.
We need to stop working against nature and start working for it. That is, if we want to truly create a better world for the future.

[KamaAina]

21. Excellent point!

I have long advocated for a full employment economy, that is, changing the rules of the game so that we win when the most people are gainfully employed as you describe, not when the overall pile of money is the biggest.

To illustrate, let us suppose that there are only three people in the country: you, me, and Bill Gates. You and I each have $10,000. Bill Gates has $1 billion. The next year, Bill Gates has $2 billion, while you and I have $5,000. The headlines (in the paper he owns) read "GDP Nearly Doubles". For the majority (us two), however, income has been cut in half. Far better for us to have $20,000 each while you-know-who stays stuck on a billion, even if the headlines read "GDP Nearly Stagnant".

[Zalatix]

22. If that happened, the Plutocracy would create resource shortages to weed out the people.

In fact, a huge manufactured crisis is already being whipped up by this bunch.

I kid you not, this is already in the works.

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/sideshow/next-great-depression-mit-researchers-predict-global-economic-190352944.html

A trickle-up economy is a great solution - it's just not the whole solution. We've got to deal with the Plutocracy directly.

Why? Because.......
http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2010/10/08/the-race-to-buy-up-the-world-s-water.html

[librechik]

24. you are so right and it seems crazy to me that corporate entities & others

are dedicated to keeping wages as low as possible (frozen for 30 years!) and to fight against all the social safety net programs which save lives.

Don't they want to have continuing profits? Giive your workers a National Health Service and become competitive with other nations. Don't they want continuing profits? Pay your workers well and sustain them when they are out of work. That will sustain your profits.

What is their motive? They are shooting themselves in the foot with this agenda of greed and hoarding money.