Elizabeth Warren says the U.S. economy is rigged. Many americans agree.

[n2doc]

BY JAIME FULLER June 27 at 6:30 AM
Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.) has built a sizable political profile — including the requisite presidential speculation — by espousing a simple idea: that the system is "rigged" against average Americans.

And you might be surprised who agrees with her: A whole bunch of conservatives.


According to a new Pew survey, 62 percent of Americans think that the economic system unfairly favors the powerful, and 78 percent think that too much power is concentrated in too few companies. The discontent isn't limited to those who share Warren's liberal ideology; 69 percent of young conservative-leaning voters and 48 percent of the most conservative voters agree that the system favors the powerful, according to Pew.

Although Warren seems an outlier in the legislative branch for her fiery discontent with inequality — and the role she says Wall Street plays in exacerbating it — the Pew survey suggests that the vast majority of Americans are at least open to her underlying premise.

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http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-fix/wp/2014/06/27/elizabeth-warren-says-the-american-economy-is-rigged-many-conservatives-agree/?tid=rssfeed

title changed to better reflect the poll results

[RDANGELO]

1. This is the issue that should destroy the Republicans.

[treestar]

2. How so? Saying that just sounds paranoid and CTish

What laws are to be proposed to help? Capitalism is not "rigged" to be that way, it just is.

[RDANGELO]

4. It doesn't have to be.

If you have the right laws and regulations in place, you can have an economy that is growing the middle class instead of depleting it.

[treestar]

22. Which is why we don't have pure capitalism

I agree. Liberals are for regulated capitalism. (Right wingers refuse to recognize that and insist we are "socialists.). But we have made many strides and have a lot of regulation and the system is not "rigged" against us - we have passed many laws to regulate capitalism and moderate its effects.

[Romulox]

12. LOL> "Capitalism is not "rigged" to be that way, it just is."

Both insipid and reminiscent of the Jessica Rabbit defense:

I'm not bad, I'm just drawn that way!

Thanks for the laugh!

[fasttense]

15. Capitalism has built into it an ever increase gulf between the uber rich and the

abject poor. The gulf will continue to grow until there are only 2 kinds of people remaining. Those who were born wealthy and have a pampered decadent life and those who were born into abject poverty and suffer miserable lives.

Because the rich can make money off their money and the poor can barely get decent wages for their labor, capitalism always causes instability and destruction of a society.

Read Marx he explains how this always happens.

You can NOT put rules or laws into the system to prevent it because with wealth comes power. The rich lucky few keep attacking any restriction, or rescinding laws, to their growing power and wealth. Look how easily Glass–Steagall was overturned. Look how the rich are trying to do away with almost every benefit FDR put into place. Look how they propagandize their greedy ideals - Ayn Rand, "free-markets" Trickle down, Globalization, Trade agreements that by-pass the sovereignty of a country. The laws that were put into place after the 1st RepubliCON Great Depression only slowed down the psychotic wealthy. We are right back to the unprecedented levels of inequality that no society can long stand without revolution.

If you have to keep making laws and restrictions on the richest capitalist to prevent them from abusing all of us, then there is something wrong with the system. We should have an economic and political system that doesn't need to be restricted in order to keep it from imploding.

[daleanime]

19. Amen....

Marx has been made a boogie man not because he was wrong, but because so much of what he said was right.

[treestar]

23. We have a lot of laws in our favor

Wage and hour laws, discrimination laws. We have modified capitalism greatly. Maybe we need more. Environmental regulations, health care. But saying it is "rigged" against us it just wrong - it has been greatly modified already, which is a good thing, but it sounds insane to claim all of those laws are some secret conspiracy to help the rich.

We need to vote out republicans who want to de-regulate everything and make more tax cuts. But let's not sound insane and as if we have nothing on the books.

[socialist_n_TN]

34. Those laws were put into place to SAVE capitalsm from itself....

and any law on the books can be erased and repealed when the capitalists think that the danger of a systemic change has passed. They just buy enough legislators to repeal those laws. That's exactly what's been happening for the last 3+ decades. It's what capitalism IS. You can't change the beast or cage it, you have to destroy it.

[SomethingFishy]

35. Sorry but I have to disagree...

Wage laws? A guarantee that you make at least $280 a week before taxes. Yeah, that's impressive... for 1987.

Hours laws. LMAO, are you in the work force? They want more hours out of you without paying extra, they put you on salary. 60 hours a week before they are forced to pay overtime.

I work between 60 and 100 hours a week, and I can barely make ends meet. I haven't seen a raise since 2005, and I'm over 50 so my prospects for starting over or moving to another job are slim.

Being a white male I have no idea if discrimination laws are working or not but I'll give the benefit of the doubt on that one...

Warren is right, the system is rigged. It's not a "secret conspiracy" it's right out in the open. And it's not just Republicans.

[fasttense]

37. There is no Secret conspiracy

and I never claimed there was.

It is just how the system works. With huge wealth comes huge power in a capitalist society. Because everything is up for sale including politicians and justice. It's in the nature of capitalism to put a price tag on everything. But the price tag is only based upon what one individual, usually a capitalist, can sell it for. The price tag never includes the external cost to society as a whole. It never includes the suffering of people who get the low, low wages that allow the rich to accumulate so much. It never includes the damage to cities when entire industries move like in Detroit.

Sure there are a few laws restricting capitalism that have NOT been overturned YET. Have you not heard RepubliCONS claiming there should be no minimum wage? Have you not heard RepubliCONS pushing for child labor? Have you not heard RepubliCONS explaining how the disparity between women and men's wages is find and dandy? Have you not heard RepubliCONS claiming there is No Global Warming and urging to do away with all environmental laws? They are doing this on behalf of the rich capitalist who have bought the RepubliCON party. It's no conspiracy. There have always been powerful rich people pushing for fewer and fewer restrictions on the use of their wealth. With the help of the Supreme Court, they have now even given their businesses the rights of people.

FDR was able to put restrictions on capitalism but RepubliCONS are proud that they are overturning those laws. Those restrictions created a middle class in the US. But as happened in the 1st RepubliCON Great Depression, those laws are being overturned and our middle class is rapidly shrinking. FDR merely slowed down the inevitable results of capitalism by allowing for a short time, the growth of a middle class. But the uber rich will NOT be stopped. Their huge wealth gives them huge power and they will turn a stable society into a feudal type environment, where there is only a few very rich and a vast majority suffering in poverty.

But it is No secret. It is done right out in the open. It just sitting there waiting for the people to notice. In the mean time the uber rich are obtaining unprecedented levels of wealth and power by taking all opportunity away from the rest of us.

To me you sound insane because you refuse to see what is just so obvious. I never said there is no alternative to capitalism.

There is a solution and it requires creating a different economic and political system. A system where the people who do the labor control the profit and wealth of the corporation or business. A system that puts democracy into the work place.

Check this site out, it is filled with information http://www.democracyatwork.info/

[socialist_n_TN]

32. Regulating capitalism is like riding a hungry tiger.......

It's impossible to do over the long term and you're always in danger of being eaten.

[rhett o rick]

17. At least she is saying something. What's H. Clinton saying, "It's not the bankers fault."??

At least Sen Warren is speaking out while most are keeping a low profile as the 0.01% continue to rob from the lower classes.

Sounds like you support the status quo.

[davidpdx]

30. +10,000

[laundry_queen]

36. Yes and no.

all capitalism trends toward monopoly. That's how it IS, as you said. No matter what you do, unless you have extremely heavy handed regulation with a good dose of socialism, you will have monopolies in the end with capitalism.

However, in some ways it's rigged in that as you have a concentration of wealth in a select few companies, they scratch each other's backs by handing out BOD seats to others at the top. So you have a bunch of people at the top, who give each other top positions, and it's a tight knit little group where no one else is allowed in. One person is a CEO, and sits on several other boards, and all his CEO buddies sit on his board...and they are all buddies with people at the top of government because of donations. No one else has a say but a very small, select group of people. That's how it's rigged. To 'break in' you have to come up with a revolutionary idea, start a business, make billions with your business and stay in business for many years before any in the 'select' group will let you in. How many times has that happened over the last decade? Twice?

Also, because many corporations are large conglomerates, they bolster their own game by creating a need between the companies. I haven't studied who owns what in the US, but an example would be if a large conglomerate that owned a pharmaceutical company that produced the leading diabetes drug also sold candy bars, snack cakes and colas. It's a conflict of interest, ethics-wise, but ethics seems to be an old-fashioned, antiquated idea with these conglomerates - they are fine with producing sugar-laden treats and fighting against 'healthy alternatives' because it makes for more diabetics overall so they can sell more of their drug. In that way, the game is rigged.

[Orsino]

38. Capitalism IS rigging. n/t

[Octafish]

3. Don't Democrats get it?

Hard work. Put your nose to the grindstone. American Dream stuff. Positive thinking.



Seeing how since Reaganomics all that doesn't work much anymore, we need to make friends with those with money.

Yeah. I mean, "Yes, Sir!" That's the ticket.

[rhett o rick]

18. The new American Dream.....Win the lottery. nm

[WillyT]

5. Huge K & R !!!

[Rex]

6. But but but...Snowden and Russia! Benghazi! Occupy Wall Street!

Anything BUT let's not talk about reality in America...lalalalalalalalallalala...

[polichick]

8. Keep on keepin' it real, EW!

[Baitball Blogger]

9. Hallelujah!

Jaysus. We need her leadership, badly.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

10. Understatement if there ever was one - love Elizabeth's callin out these cretins on Wall Street. What a delightful breath of fresh air!

[salib]

11. So tis the political system

So, let's change it. We have waited long enough that it is likely to be especially painful.

Let's not wait any longer.

Time to have the courage to make it our personal responsibility to protect the human race, our world, our and our children's future.

[hedgehog]

13. I went to look up what was meant by "Faith and Family Left"

and discovered that apparently people can take away whatever they want from the survey results:

"If you don't like social welfare programs, take heart: Democrats may hesitate to expand the safety net anytime soon. And the reason isn't Republican opposition, but centrist indifference."

http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2014-06-26/the-new-left-like-the-old-left-just-more-selfish

I tend to think the Washington Post story is accurate, and the Bloomberg story is cherry picking facts as it whistles in the dark.

(Do I get extra points for using 2 metaphors?)

[supercats]

14. Good!.....

Now run for President on this platform, PLEASE!!!

[EEO]

16. Counter-argument of the rich: Nah-uh.

[Uncle Joe]

20. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, n2doc.

[colsohlibgal]

21. Too Much Seems Rigged These Days

I've been invited to a Move on.org gathering, at a friends house, for a screening of a film about the evils of the Kochs. I will pass. I get it, it's preaching to the choir.

I just don't see an easy way to get to a political system that works for the common people as well as it does for the elites anytime soon - unless enough people suddenly learn how to critical think. So I think so much of this is almost pointless and doomed to fall way short of any significant change for the better.

Short of people deciding not to be gullible anymore the only way for real change for the better is getting big money and special interests out of politics. And I don't see anything like that on the horizon. Right now I find it almost laughable that we call ourselves a democracy.

[DeSwiss]

24. It's always been rigged. Duh.

- Shit! Capitalism is another word for RIGGED.

It's also another word for SOFT FASCISM. By the time you figure it out, it's already too late. The system cannot be fixed.

Torn down, yes. Destroyed, yes.

And then rebuild anew.

Resource-based Economy

K&R

[center][/center]

You cannot fix this shit!!!!!

[Alex P Notkeaton]

25. Everybody knows the system's fixed/The poor stay poor and the rich stay rich/

That's how it goes/
And everybody knows

[madokie]

26. Its time we had a Woman President

and my first pick would be Elizabeth Warren

[LuvNewcastle]

27. Yep, she looks better every day.

Everything she says seems to strike just the right chord. She has a couple of things going against her, like her lack of political experience, but I think that could be turned around into a plus. If she gets a little more media exposure, people are going to love her. God, I hope she runs!

[madokie]

28. If there is such a thing as a God send

She is it.

[davidpdx]

29. I am becoming more convinced then ever that she is the person

I finished her book last night.

[riseabove]

31. Sorry but it's not big business that's the problem, it's congress.

While big business is a problem, it's not what's "rigging" the economy if you ask me. It's congress who allows lobbyist to influence how they vote. Which is usually to give big business tax breaks, subsidies and to write loopholes into laws that allow big business to avoid paying taxes.

Big business is only doing what it's CEO's are supposed to do. No you can speak about morality and big business all day long, but in reality they are only getting away with what our laws and the people that write them, allow them to get away with.

If you want this catering to big business to stop, well that's when you have to know who your voting for.

May not be a popular opinion here, but I think there's a lot of truth to it.

And FWIW I like Elizabeth Warren.

[socialist_n_TN]

33. Getting mad at the "government" for this system is like........

getting mad at the ventriloquist's dummy for what the ventriloquist is saying. Under the dictatorship of capital, it's capital that owns the government and always has. IOW, it's the wealthy capitalists who buy the government that creates the laws that benefit the wealthy capitalists.

I will agree that you have to change the government along WITH changing the economic system though. They're too intertwined to try and change one without the other.