Marijuana abuse linked to child abuse

[fried eggs]

A 24-year-old Winter Haven man "lost it" and threw a baby across the room when he couldn't stop the child from crying, officials said.

The baby suffered a skull fracture, two broken wrists and five fractured ribs, Polk County Sheriff Grady Judd said. Detectives arrested Christopher Finlayson on Friday and charged him with aggravated child abuse.

Finlayson told detectives that he smoked "a blunt and a half of marijuana" Wednesday and had been up all night. So he "lost it" when he couldn't stop the baby from crying, deputies said. He told the baby "I'll give you something to cry about," deputies said. Then, he tossed the baby toward the end of a bed. The baby landed face first on the floor.

"This is just another example of marijuana abuse linked to child abuse," Judd said.

Read More: http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/os-winter-haven-man-threw-baby-20140607,0,2697268.story

Interesting. I didn't know about this link.

[ret5hd]

1. Sounds exactly like every pot head i've ever known.

not.

[RainDog]

17. this title of this OP is yet more propaganda

pitiful to see it here.

[fried eggs]

20. The key word here is "abuse." Marijuana abuse.

[RainDog]

24. NO. The story does not add up to known facts about mj

So, either the story is wrong or the cop's remark is wrong.

Your title is propaganda because it's based upon the remark of a cop, not on any accurate information about the effects of smoked marijuana - which were other parts of the "facts" presented here.

You are engaging in propaganda to have a post with this title on this forum - at least that's what anyone should assume until more facts are known.

How much do you know about marijuana, btw?

[2pooped2pop]

44. the guy probaby admitted to the pot

but left out the bath salts and meth , and they won't show up in testing like the pot will. Many do admit to the pot coz they know when they drug test them that it will show up. Almost every other drug clears your system in a very short amount of time. Those marijuana metabolites just hand around for as long as two months. (Not active pot, just what it breaks down to, in your system)

[jwirr]

71. Or he has a temper that is not in any way connected to pot. He is a typical abuser.

[defacto7]

30. It's Child abuse.

MJ abuse my ass. People do wicked things with or without chemical use and the worst offenses are from alcohol overuse.

If he had not been on Marijuana I'd hate to think how much worse it would have been.

[CountAllVotes]

64. Some parents can't handle being parents

People like this have no business BEING parents, marijuana or no marijuana!

I cry B.S. on this article as well -- consider the source!

[Politicalboi]

53. How does one abuse Marijuana?

Even too much water can kill you. But you can NEVER OD on weed.

[GreenPartyVoter]

2. More likely to have been caused by lack of sleep than too much MJ, IMHO.

[Live and Learn]

3. Yep, it couldn't have anything to do with the guy

being up all night or having anger control issues. It must be the marijuana then.


btw

[laundry_queen]

4. correlation does not equal causation.

could be that abusers who don't care about breaking the law are more likely to smoke pot. ETA btw your article does not match your title. If one posts an assertion, one usually posts a link supporting that assertion, not a link to an anecdote. FTR.

[fried eggs]

19. In the article, marijuana abuse is linked to child abuse:

"This is just another example of marijuana abuse linked to child abuse," Judd said.

Note the word "abuse," which might make a difference in outcomes.

[laundry_queen]

21. That's an opinion, no link to anything that shows a link btwn the 2. nt

[intaglio]

23. And Grady Judd has the evidence to back up his statement?

No.

All the Sheriff has is a vague folk memory of "Reefer Madness" and the assertions of the DEA

[RainDog]

26. There are NO STUDIES THAT INDICATE A LINK

That's the point. There is no evidence other than a cop, who benefits from marijuana prohibition by funding for his dept..

There are no studies out there that indicate any relationship between domestic violence and marijuana either. There are no studies that indicate marijuana abuse, for that matter, beyond the sorts of reefer madness reports from people who also benefit by calling marijuana use "abuse."

No doubt the guy was an abusive fuck. But there is nothing to indicate marijuana was the reason for his behavior.

If he had consumed alcohol, then, yes, there are studies that indicate a relationship between alcohol USE - it doesn't have to be "abuse" and violence in interpersonal relationships.

But don't believe my word for this. Go try to find any peer reviewed study that indicates a link between marijuana and violence against children.

[Eleanors38]

29. SCIENCE! from Sheriff Judd. nt.

[CBGLuthier]

43. The "article" is bullshit.

Pure bullshit. Some stupid fucking knowitall cop spouts cop bullshit and some people think it adds up to some kind of "facts."

Bullshit.

[morningfog]

57. By one stupid ass sheriff. Not a study, for fuck's sake.

And you know this. Hmmm....

[redqueen]

67. Hmmm, indeed. nt

[snooper2]

69. You ever try a little weed in scrambled eggs? The trick is to not get it too hot..

I usually mix it in with some cheese at one minute until they are done-


YUMMY!

[napi21]

5. I doubt MJ was the cause or a contributor.

Some people have severe anger issues. I also would think MJ would have enabled him to relax and sleep. Strange...

[Warpy]

6. Well, it might have been a contributor

especially if it was mixed with booze or pills. Having a screeching baby that just won't stop can really harsh your mellow.

Then again, it would have had the same effect if he was cold sober.

A lot of the massive child abuse that hits the paper here has a similar story: young and immature father being left in charge of his kid. Kid won't stop screaming, father loses it.

Mom goes to jail too, since she left the kid in the care of a ticking time bomb, whether or not she knew it.

[Live and Learn]

32. +1 And brains aren't fully developed until 25

and hormones are flowing rampantly. Adding any chemicals or lack of sleep to that powder keg can ruin havoc.

[msongs]

7. all child abusers breathe. breathing causes child abuse. ok nt

[2pooped2pop]

45. I think you got it.

Nevermind that most all heroin users drank milk as a baby and many still do.

Stay away from milk.

[eridani]

8. How in bleeding hell do you stay up all night smoking that much MJ?

It would put me to sleep in 20 minutes. He pretty much had to be doing some other substance(s) to overcome the soporific effects.

[Inkfreak]

39. I never get why some smoke so much at once.

I burn every day. Love it. But I just take 2-3 bong hits, which maybe holds a lil under a gram of weed. It's perfect for me. I smoke a blunt and I'm in a coma. Or the fridge.

[valerief]

9. Yes, I'm sure FloridaMan wasn't an asshole otherwise.

[WinkyDink]

10. Sounds like real science to me!

[MADem]

11. I thought if you smoked too much pot, you fell asleep.

What kind of pot turns people into the Incredible Hulk?

That shit's gotta have PCP in it, or something.

Pot would be more likely to cause a parent to regard fritos and oreos as a balanced dinner than make them get up and start expending energy harming their children.

IMO, anyway.

I just don't see this as a plausible scenario.

[Cha]

34. Crack. I don't see it credible, either. And, this is from previous years

of experience.

[Skittles]

12. I hope they took a blood sample

because his story sounds like complete bullshit

[cali]

13. what contemptible dog shit. Let's see the fucking studies.

It's purely empirical, but I've known a lot of potheads and a lot of people who smoked a lot who were parents. And pretty good parents at that. Marijuana ingestion linked to violence? Let's see the studies. Anti-legalization people are pulling out everything- and pulling it straight out of their dim assholes.

I'm not saying smoking a lot of pot is a good thing. I think it does lead to deficits- again empirical. I think it can lead to loss of motivation and structured thinking, but violence? Never seen any evidence of that. The violence around marijuana is linked to it being illegal.

[frylock]

14. nothing keeps me up all night like 20-30 hits of tree

[Inkfreak]

41. LOL!! (nt)

[RainDog]

15. Propaganda bullshit served up to Florida voters

Alcohol, not marijuana, is connected with increased domestic violence.

If someone stayed up all night - it wasn't because of marijuana. He "smoked a blunt and a half on Wednesday" was up all night, then he abused the child?

Smoking marijuana will not make you high for that long. Edible mj may have a longer impact, but this story smells like bullshit because marijuana would not be psychoactive for two days for anyone.

I hope they tested the guy for alcohol - because that's the recreational drug associated with increased violence and lack of impulse control.

[hobbit709]

36. It's the new version of Reefer Madness.

[Iggo]

16. Oooooooooooooooooh, bullshit.

[wildbilln864]

18. nonsense!

they are trying harder and harder to demonize cannabis! It won't work. People know better.

[TeamPooka]

22. So, you've got the reefer maddness. Thanks for outing yourself. nt

[RainDog]

25. exactly.

it's good to know who is willing to do the work of the DEA here with this sort of OP title, then the defense of the same.

[JesterCS]

27. Complete and Utter BS. n/t

[giftedgirl77]

28. A truckload of bullshit...

[defacto7]

31. BS

n/t

[magical thyme]

33. a single claim attributed to a single sheriff does not make a link.

maybe that's why you didn't know about this link.

[sendero]

35. Any honest person..

.. and ESPECIALLY any honest law enforcement official knows that whatever nasty things people do on pot you can multiply it by 10 for people drinking alcohol.

What a bullshit article with a bullshit opinion. Basically, a functional lie.

[KG]

37. did MoDo write this article?

[moriah]

38. Linked by one cop, and a very tenuous link at that.....

Sounds like the LACK of marijuana was more to blame than anything else. If he'd been smoking that blunt while taking care of the baby instead of over 20 hours before, perhaps he wouldn't have lost his temper.

I'm looking forward to blood tests. I know kids keep you up all night, but I wonder what else he'd been on Wednesday night.

[WhiteTara]

40. This is the new Twinkie excuse

I ate so many Twinkies I lost my mind and killed someone.

[Inkfreak]

42. Well...that's one skewed way of looking at it. (nt)

[Vattel]

46. Badminton linked to child abuse.

A 24-year-old Texan badminton player threw his baby across the room . . .

[msanthrope]

47. I like how this article is all nice and sciencey. Truthy!!! nt

[davidthegnome]

48. Hmm.

So, this asshole threw a frigging BABY across a room because he was high on marijuana? Yeah. I don't think so. This asshole threw a baby across a room because he's an asshole. I've seen sober people, drunk people, people high on meth, bath salts, heroin, whatever... I've seen them become violent. I have never seen someone become violent just from smoking marijuana. There aren't really (to my knowledge) any studies that indicate that marijuana alone makes one more likely to be violent.

Marijuana abuse linked to child abuse? Uhm. No. Present some factual evidence that this is the case if you're trying to make that argument. Otherwise, it's just another bull shit attack coming from holier than thou nitwits and drug war fanatics.

[Enthusiast]

49. Wait until Nancy Grace gets hold of this.

Ever listen to Nancy about marijuana? On one recent past episode she blamed pot for violence even though it had been laced with PCP. Way to do nuance Nancy. Not!

[Tikki]

50. Most here probably agree being drunk and parenting is not a good idea...So

Tikki

[RainDog]

54. So the reefer madness crowd is out on this thread

I never said anything about parenting while high as a good idea - some here, of course, did state mj would be more likely to modify things like anxiety, etc. in relation to dealing with a child - but I, personally, would never suggest anyone should get high while taking care of an infant.

I didn't say this. The majority of people here didn't say this.

But like the OP, you are saying this when it's not the point that people were making - which is there is no evidence of a correlation between marijuana use and physical abuse - whether partner or child.

Except.. most people would say that, sometimes, a glass of wine will help when someone is tense - Doctors, last time I checked, were back to saying this was okay for mothers when nursing even.

I think the issue here is someone who is an abusive person. Ultimately any other substance ingested has nothing to do with this - tho maybe the guy has a history of substance abuse.

I don't know. I'm just going on what was said in the article, and calling that bullshit. Because it is a bullshit statement.

Your inference about people here is also bullshit, but it's good to see who is willing to insult others here for the sake of reefer madness.

Duly noted in your case.

[Tikki]

60. Ask a kid..or an adult raised by loadies...

You will probably get a variety of descriptions of their life...just like those raised by alcoholics.

No matter how pot becomes legal there are still going to be those parents who won't allow
their children to interact with families where the parents use pot.
And an adult's arrest for public UI or for driving UI will financially hurt the family.

It is going to be regulated, always, and there will be arrests for the various outcomes of pot usage.

That is all...

Tikki

[RainDog]

63. LOL

sure. but whether marijuana is legal or not, most people aren't throwing kids against a wall.

I do know people whose parents smoked pot while they were growing up. None of them have bad things to say about those parents and have good relationships with them. Maybe that's because the parents acted responsibly and didn't abuse them.

Neither alcohol nor any other substance is necessary for someone to be a dysfunctional parent.

When my kids were growing up, I didn't want them to spend time at the houses of kids whose parents had firearms. Instead, I would always have a kid over to my house to play because I didn't want my child around firearms...that was the one kid my son was friends with whose parents, imo, were irresponsible fucks and they also owned firearms. That kid would come over and stay for a week at a time...

I'm just disgusted to see someone here on DU engage in the sort of bullshit statements you are engaging in here - twice. But I know your history here in relation to this topic, so I'm not surprised.

If someone needs to use marijuana to control epileptic seizures, and thus uses daily - is that person the equivalent of an alcoholic to you? What about MS - because I also know someone with MS who illegally uses MJ to control spasticity.

It's the person, not the substance, that is the problem in case after case regarding these issues - that's reality.

If this nation would put money into mental health care treatment and support for people who need it to become better parents - including a mother and her choice of a partner - we'd all be much better off than regurgitating stories of reefer madness because cops are paranoid because attitudes are changing.

[Tikki]

68. My post was about whether a parent could be held legally accountable for..

actions that occur while they are caring for a child and while they are under the influence of marijuana.

Also, what would be the penalties for driving under the influence and Public under the influence and how
the outcome would affect a family.

If your strong beliefs can't stand up to these questions....

PS...I bet the doctor who prescribes marijuana for patients reminds them not to drive under the influence.

Tikki




.

[RainDog]

70. Your question makes assumptions not in evidence

as far as the influence of marijuana since the article stated the guy smoked on Wednesday but abused the child on Thurs. Smoked mj does not stay in someone's system for this long with any psychotropic influence.

I noted, already, this is something problematic about the article - which is what people were responding to.

To claim you were responding to the wider issue of marijuana and parenting seems more than a bit disingenuous if someone were to read responses in this thread.

The penalties for driving under the influence should be directly related to someone's ability to function. This varies. If someone has cannabis metabolites in his/her system - that's no indication of an altered state of consciousness because one hour after use, THC has already broken down to a metabolite (one that is, still psychoactive) and, after four hours or so, that metabolite has further broken down to ones that are not psychotropic but remain in the body and are excreted over days, rather than hours, as with alcohol, heroin, cocaine, etc.

I HAVE NO PROBLEM ADDRESSING THESE QUESTIONS.

The issue is the action of a parent - whether or not that parent was under the influence of alcohol, marijuana, coffee, etc. That's what needs to be addressed - the abuse of a child.

Your response to me is a joke, honestly - because, again, you are trying to imply that I don't have answers to your ridiculous assumptions phrased as questions.

Irvin Rosenfeld has smoked ten marijuana cigarettes a day for decades to deal with tumors that grow on his bones. Without the marijuana, he would not be able to function. With it, he teaches sailing, is a stockbroker (in FLORIDA), testifies before committees, when asked, about the impact of medical marijuana for particular medical problems - and he drives, every day.

With marijuana, the metabolite that is slowly excreted modifies the experience of being high - which may be one reason those with a lot of experience smoking marijuana demonstrate they are better drivers than sober ones - at least in one study.

So, since people who regularly use marijuana have demonstrated in studies they may be better drivers than sober ones, should we insist that all drivers smoke copious amounts of marijuana to improve their driving skills? LOL.

What? Don't you have an answer to this question? Isn't this correlation, if someone high on marijuana has better driving skills than someone sober. Should we put people in prison for driving while sober?

ermergerd!!!!

[Tikki]

72. Ya...see, I have my description of what "under the influence" of marijuana is...

No, I don't want my grandchildren to be at someone's house where the parents are 'under the influence' of pot and I don't
want to be driving with my grandchildren on the road with another driver 'under the influence' of marijuana.

I do have a background as to why I believe as I do. I bet you have reasons to believe as you do.
I am not going to be the only person you run into that is against certain aspects of marijuana legalization.



Tikki

[RainDog]

73. True. You are not going to be the only person with your pov

But you are, increasingly, outside of the mainstream of thinking about this issue.

Your questions, really, are about basic responsible parenting, to me. Again, as I have said, again and again and again and again and again and ad nauseum...

the issue is about PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY.

The reality is that it's very likely you would never know someone is under the influence many times. People who use cannabis are not like people who use alcohol - the two experiences are very different.

Some people will use mj to get very high. Some will use a little bit of mj to get a little bit high. The two experiences are not the same - in the same way that someone might drink a glass of wine while someone else might drink a pint of Jack Daniels - both experiences are alcohol use but the way it is used is very different.

The "all or nothing" view of marijuana use makes the assumption that all who use marijuana are couch locked cheech and chong wannabes rather than people who view marijuana as something like drinking a glass of wine - and done in that way.

But you failed to address the reality that some people under the influence of marijuana have demonstrated they are better drivers than those who are sober. This was in a research capacity, so, in truth, I'm not extrapolating that moment - I just mentioned it to make a point about reefer madness in general.

I would never encourage anyone to drive while high, especially an inexperienced user, because the same reports that indicated long-term users have better reaction times, etc. also demonstrated those with little experience demonstrate the most impairment - more than sober drivers.

I would also never encourage anyone to text and drive, but I don't think texting is a moral or social harm in and of itself.

It's these sorts of reports from this cop that sound like they're straight from a Dragnet episode that are ridiculous. I don't know anything about the guy who abused that child, but I would bet you marijuana use is one of the least problematic issues in his life. I would look at other substances of abuse first - such as alcohol, a legal one. I would look at his work situation and his interpersonal relationships. Maybe he was raised by a straight, abusive parent and he's mirroring that behavior. Who knows. I don't. But these are all questions I have when I read this propaganda.

Poverty, rather than substance use, is tied to more problems than any substance, any other life situation.

What happened to the war on poverty?

If we care about children, why are we not addressing the greatest stressor for children, their parents, the communities in which they live... this is really the greatest problem in our society, not drugs.

Crime, substance abuse, bad parenting - all these could be mitigated by addressing the overarching issue for many who end up dealing with the criminal justice system because of these other issues - the most dangerous problem is poverty.

[Tikki]

75. I agree with a change in penalties for simple marijuana possession. I agree with doctors

prescribing marijuana for what they deem necessary.

I believe there is a point when a person using marijuana is 'under the influence' to
a degree where their judgment is not clear enough to parent children and where
their motor skills are impaired enough they should not be behind the wheel of a
car, also, feel they should not be working around equipment, using a gun or making important decisions.

Do I need to add that this includes all substances that negatively affect all of the above?

Ultimately as marijuana usage is legalized the law will sort this out. Arrests will be challenged and tests
will be developed and challenged and laws will stand and laws will fall.

The legal aspects of marijuana usage will not go away with the legalization and those with a negative
past history will continue to tell their reality in hopes of informing others and those with
another reality will fight on with their story.


Tikki

[RainDog]

84. But the cop isn't entitled to his beliefs

in a professional capacity as a statement to the public about issues related to marijuana.

His statement is no different than a racist remark - i.e. grounded in his personal worldview about a certain segment of the population that is, actually, tho not based upon his experience, as varied in experiences, attitudes, actions, etc. etc. as people who have no relationship between them based upon either their ethnicity or the use of a substance. I'm not linking these two, to clarify. I'm talking about two different issues that cops often respond to in the same biased ways.

that's the problem here - and that's what, again, people are responding to.

In the context of this thread - yes, you do need to specify about what you think about others' actions because the OP is engaging in propaganda.

Those with a negative attitude toward cannabis are free to say whatever they'd like. At this point, I will challenge what I see as misinformation.

After this issue is settled vis a vis its status as a legal plant material - I don't care what anyone has to say about this subject.

I do care at this time because I am tired of states using marijuana prohibition to target minority communities, tired of friends who can't legally use a substance that's best for them, tired of my government lying to the American people for 80 years and contributing to the dumbing down of America by throwing any shit against the wall to see who will lap it up as suitable food for thought.

I don't think it's any accident that, since Reagan, this nation has been fed a steady diet of lies about a multitude of issues.

And I don't think it's any accident that this was successful because Republicans were playing to the religious right (most white) population to get votes.

That whole edifice of lies needs to come down, like the Berlin Wall came down.

We need to be able to talk about subjects rationally - not just this one - also rights for people, climate issues, poverty issues, health issues - it's all a web of lies by the right wing in this nation that has hurt us all and it is imperative that we disrupt that narrative.

[samsingh]

51. study just in: inhaling air leads to child abuse

it turns out that anyone ever charged with child abuse took a break of air at least 1 minutes before committing the alleged abuse.

[redqueen]

52. Yeah, it's "interesting" all right. Interesting the way you served this idiotic propaganda up.

Interesting indeed.

[shanti]

55. Florida Man

again?

[morningfog]

56. You should change your bullshit headline. You are flame baiting.

You made up this "link: based on an ignorant ass sheriff's comment. You are embracing and promoting ignorant ass comments.

[G_j]

58. FAIL nt

[Phlem]

59. Judd is an imbecile!

this whole incident is based on nothing more than child abuse. I've smoked marijuana, most my life and have never even spanked my child. I make it a point to make her happy every day. And I have PTSD from child abuse starting at a very early age to begin with.

This is utter bullshit.

[Trajan]

61. A completely fallacious assertion

ANY DUer who would post this nonsense is not my kind of DUer ....

[panader0]

62. You are correct.

[Iggo]

66. You got that right.

[In_The_Wind]

65. Pure BS! A child abuser is a sick individual with or without drugs.

Smoking marijuana was not the cause of this problem.

[blogslut]

74. Grady Judd?

Grady Judd? Oh, darling. Bless your heart.

[JNelson6563]

76. This would've happened w/out the pot.

Sounds like sleep deprivation and frustration were pretty important factors.

Julie

[otohara]

79. And W/O The Baby

some people shouldn't be parents in the first place.

[JNelson6563]

80. Yes, there's that.

Well said.

Julie

[arcane1]

77. "had been up all night" is more responsible than the weed.

Bullshit propaganda. "Linked" my ass.

[stillwaiting]

78. You can't say that it's linked without scientific studies demonstrating that there is a link.

I mean, you COULD say it's linked, but then you will hopefully get the responses that you received in this thread.

This OP is nothing but propaganda, and it's horrible to see it here.

[SomethingFishy]

81. You actually bought this pile of shit?

"I didn't know about this link"... Because there is no fucking link. Just the opinion of one person. There is no study, there are no numbers, and the facts state that Cannibis does not make people violent, it does the exact opposite.

You Reefer Madness folks already embarrassed yourselves, for half a century... you need to give it a rest.

[Ellipsis]

82. ... this your brain on drugs fried eggs

&feature=kp

[jmowreader]

85. Yeah, I have a question...

Where do you get one of those pans that heats up to ten thousand degrees without glowing white? That fuckin' egg cooked top and bottom in two seconds.

[bunnies]

87. cast iron pans are a gift from teh gods...

especially when youre high and need an egg sammich... pronto!

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

83. That's because it's not real.

Here's the deal. There are assholes out there. And some of them even also smoke pot.

That doesn't actually mean that when they do horrible things, they did it 'because of the pot'. It means that horrible people do horrible things, whether or not they smoke pot. If causality worked the way that article suggests, we'd all be blaming the Holocaust on Hitler's 'not smoking pot', and saying, 'oh, if only he'd smoked pot, maybe 11 million people wouldn't have died!'

[retread]

86. Damn. If only he had seen this first!

[Earth_First]

89. This sh*t may fly over at Discussionist...

...however don't for one minute think it is going to fly here at DemocraticUnderground.

#swingandamiss

[Kali]

90. jeebus!

you are either extremely gullible, some kind of anti-weed propagandist, or a bad satirist. because what bullshit some cop claims has no bearing in science or reality.

[LanternWaste]

91. I seem to have missed any direct causal link to the abuse being predicated on smoking.

I seem to have missed any direct causal link (beyond 'after this, therefore because of this', a logical fallacy) to the abuse being predicated on smoking.

On edit: a great excuse to add the opening scene from one of the funniest movies ever (Reefer Madness: The Musical)