Jimmy Carter: Democratic Party Should Be More Pro-Life

[Humanist_Activist]

Jimmy Carter appeared on the Laura Ingraham recently, and spouted some opinions on signing on to a letter to ask the Democratic Party to change its platform on pro-choice issues. While he made it clear that Roe v. Wade shouldn't be overturned outright, he believes that abortion should be, well, I'll just use his own words:

"I’ve signed a public letter calling for the Democratic Party at the next convention to espouse my position on abortion which is to minimize the need, requirement for abortion and limit it only to women whose life are in danger or who are pregnant as a result of rape or incest. I think if the Democratic Party would adopt that policy that would be acceptable to a lot of people who are now estranged from our party because of the abortion issue," he added.

Video here:

Now, my first question is, what about the health of the mother? Apparently that doesn't matter to him. I mean, seriously, if he's worried about estrangement of people from our party, I think this would cause it, not solve it. Not to mention it adopts the language of the anti-choicers and plays into their hands.

To be honest, on one level I oppose Roe, it didn't go far enough, the court should have ruled that the government had no vested interest in interfering with a medical procedure for non-medical reasons, period.

[Zalatix]

1. Jimmy Carter said this? What planet did I wake up on?

I don't have a telescope on me, can someone tell me what the 2nd and 4th planet in this particular system is? I think I woke up in the wrong universe this morning.

[bigdarryl]

2. It's old age he's

[customerserviceguy]

15. Not necessarily

While he was goverrnor of Georgia, he declared "American Fighting Man's Day" in response to the sentence of life imprisonment for Lt. William Calley for the My Lai massacres. It would have been interesting if the interviewer had asked him about Staff Sergeant Bales.

[Proud Liberal Dem]

3. Helpful

NOT!


Being "pro-life" has come to be exclusively associated with being anti-choice when it comes to abortion but if we're going to talk about being "pro-life", we should IMHO be also talking about other issues such as ensuring that people have health care, food, and shelter so that they can survive, the death penalty (which sometimes is WRONGLY imposed on some people) and war, particularly the morality of starting "elective wars" based on lies.

The discussion about what it means to be "pro-life" IMHO needs to be broadened beyond abortion.

[daleanime]

22. +10,000

[SammyWinstonJack]

35. ...

[cali]

4. ugh

why are women's rights so expendable?

[Proud Liberal Dem]

6. The one-word answer is in your question.

I share your frustration

[Humanist_Activist]

8. I simply view it as a lack of respect for women as individuals, as humans...

people like these anti-choicers, and Carter is one of them, simply don't trust women to make choices with their own bodies.

[ithinkmyliverhurts]

89. One small question.

If gender is at least the marker of personhood, and personhood demands choice or freedom over one's body, then what if we compromised and waited until the fetus's gender could be determined. If the fetus is a female, we'll assume she chooses life, as this would no doubt be her future choice (as everybody here seems to indicate); or at the very least, we'll let her live long enough so that she can decide whether or not to live or commit suicide; whether she chooses to live or commit sucuicide is really irrelevant since we've granted her that existential right to choose. For this she will be grateful. This seems to be the safest choice given that a female's right to choose is no doubt a premium human factor.

[eShirl]

5. I suppose nobody's perfect. n/t

[cali]

10. this is a bit more than not being perfect. It's a profound flaw.

Would you say the same thing if he expressed support for slavery?

[Humanist_Activist]

11. Actually, he is espousing slavery, he's saying women don't have a right to own their bodies...

that's enslavement to government control and coercion, and its unacceptable.

[queenjane]

24. Thank you, Humanist_Activist, for putting it as bluntly as it should be!

To take away one's right to control one's own body is, indeed, slavery. I feel about the right to abortion the way I feel about the right to assisted suicide: it is the individual's most basic right to control one's self, one's body, one's life and destiny. THAT is what progressives should be shouting from the rooftops!

[eShirl]

21. It's called understatement.

[sakabatou]

7. *facepalm*

[Yavin4]

9. Even If The Dems Took This Position, The Right Would Not Accept It

They would still call abortions because of rape and incest murder, and they think that contraceptives are evil as well.

There's no pleasing whacko fundies.

[ibegurpard]

12. no

[HereSince1628]

13. Which only goes to show that talking about day-dreams on winning over estranged voters

can lead a person to say things that are discordant to a majority of the loyal base.

[Quantess]

14. He's an old man and he is light years away from the realities of young women's daily lives.

You really cannot fully understand what it is like to be a fertile young woman (or teenager) until you have actually been one. I know that sounds unfair to all those exceptionally supportive males, but it's true. I don't want to exclude males from the conversation, but they really need to shut up and listen more to women.

In general, men tend to want to take control over everything. Well, this is one thing that they are not sufficiently qualified to take control over. Men are just going to be more "out of the loop", which cannot be helped, simply because they aren't women and they cannot get pregnant.

[cali]

16. oh please

there are lots of men- including old men- who get it.

[sarge43]

18. Yup

My 70 year old husband gets it just fine. "Your body, your life."

[Quantess]

19. Okay, but Jimmy Carter apparently doesn't.

As much as I like Jimmy Carter, he wasn't being all that supportive of choice in that interview.

[redqueen]

48. "fully underatand what it's like to be a ..."

Those were the words. And they don't. They may get that we deserve to control our own bodies, but they will never know what it is like to be in that position.

[marybourg]

17. Second strike against him

as far as I'm concerned. First he threw Israel to the wolves, and now, women.

[PCIntern]

43. +10000

from this confirmed Zionist

[fascisthunter]

45. boohoohoo for Israel...

the victimized bully

[kestrel91316]

20. No, Jimmy. I love ya, but SORRY. Forced pregnancy is for RW fascists.

[bowens43]

23. I never thought I would say this

fuck you Jimmy

[Arugula Latte]

75. I feel the same.

Hey, Jimmy -- Men who don't support a woman's right to choose can go fuck themselves.

[LuvNewcastle]

25. Why was he on Laura Ingraham's show?

Did he think he was with Rachel Maddow? I'm going to give Jimmy an excuse here and suggest that he's going senile.

[thesquanderer]

29. To promote his book.

The same reason some on the far right have gone on Jon Stewart.

[thesquanderer]

26. The least defensible position. More anti-woman than a total ban.

I am firmly pro-choice, but if you honestly believe that abortion is the taking of an innocent life, what makes it okay if it is the result of rape or incest?

It is the most "anti-woman" position there is. It says that women should be "excused" for involuntary sex, which means, in effect, that they are being "blamed" for voluntary sex.

So it is not about protecting an innocent life, it is about telling women that, if they make "poor decisions," they must live with the consequences, whereas if they live "virtuously," they get a pass, innocent life be damned, so to speak.

Simply, they are demonizing "wanton" women. "You made your bed..."

Either the life in the womb is protectable or it is not. You know, sometimes a baby from rape or incest is actually born. They even become adults. The logical extension of this "compromise" policy is that it would be okay to kill these people. "You were the result of a rape? Sorry, no health care for you."

There is a logical exemption from the pro-life position for "life of the mother," where one life will be lost no matter what. Arguably, perhaps, even "health of the mother," though the exact line to be drawn gets fuzzier. But rape and incest in and of themselves as specified acceptable exceptions? That's nothing but a repulsive value judgment.

[Gidney N Cloyd]

27. I've never understood that 'rape or incest' exception either.

[sarge43]

40. Agree

If the anti-abortion types believe that personhood begins at conception, then that person is the only truly innocent involved. Didn't even exist at the time of the crime.

They make the exception because they know there would be one hellva uproar if they didn't.

What's the word I'm looking for? Oh yeah -- hypocrites.

[PassingFair]

28. It's the only way it could happen to their "good girls".

Really, it's RELIGION.

[redqueen]

50. Yep, religion.

Good, old time, patriarchal religion... sanctioning misogyny since time immemorial.

[Bok_Tukalo]

38. I agree

The carve out of rape and incest no longer makes it about protecting the individual in the womb. It cannot be squared with a pro-life position.

[TruthBeTold65]

30. I have a lot of respect for Jimmy Carter...

with his humanitarian efforts and stance on environmental issues...and he seems like a genuine nice guy...but this stance on abortion is a completely religious position.

If you were to pull the religious implications out of the debate there is absolutely no reason why a woman cannot get an abortion. Granted late term abortions are more risky but these procedures do not stop a woman from having a baby in the future or 20 babies.

If "god" had a big problem with it...I am sure he will either strike the woman down with his magic bolt of lightning or handle it on "judgement day"...but for some reason his "people" seem to want to do all the judgement and punishing on their own.

[Marrah_G]

31. I disagee with him on this

I still think he is an amazing person.

[bigtree]

32. he's off his rocker

never had to personally face that choice but he's all fired, determined to make that choice for others. What a crock, Mr. Carter. He can stuff that.

(I shouldn't have to say this, but I think Carter is a fine man. He's profoundly wrong on this, though.)

[izquierdista]

33. minimize the need

Notice those are the first words about the subject, and are a guiding principle for what follows. The history of the Soviet Union offers a lesson on why abortion should be minimized. Women were using it as a regular birth control method, and they were finding out that having multiple abortions had long term detrimental health effects. So as a public health matter, the total number of abortions should be a small number and getting smaller.

Now "minimize the need" also means better access to contraception, effective contraceptive methods, and 'morning after' pills that prevent implantation and the need for a surgical type procedure later. "Minimize the need" could also mean earlier surgical interventions, rather than waiting for the complications in a pregnancy get to the life-threatening stage. But that would mean better genetic screening and better and earlier imaging, which is going to cost more money.

Perhaps "minimize the need" goes by unheard because the anti-abortionists completely deny the need in the first place. But Jimmy has in his comments allowed for the need of a woman to terminate a pregnancy. That's the area to build some common ground around. I don't think we want any woman terminating her pregnancy because of economic reasons (she or her husband lost a job and the health insurance that goes with it), and terminating it because of a failure of birth control really means that the birth control has to be more reliable.

[bigtree]

37. but he leaves such a narrow window for abortions

. . . that he completely precludes free choice for women. It's particularly galling for a man to express this.

We don't want a woman terminating her abortion for 'economic reasons?' Really? 'We?'

All that you outline as mitigating those reasons a woman might use to justify an abortion isn't in existence or reality. There isn't an infrastructure that will effectively support and care for all of these children folks want to insist be born and there won't be. It's just sophistry to suggest that there will be. Thankfully, the majority in this nation still agree that these choices (within 'Roe') are not the purview of folks who are in no way in any reasonable or responsible position to make that choice for others.

[izquierdista]

39. We?

You're right, I can't speak for Republicans. They are already on record as thinking that poor people shouldn't be having more children.

[bigtree]

42. most Americans probably don't want folks to have to face that choice

. . . although, I do see many republicans just oblivious or outright hostile to the economic challenges families and individuals face.

I don't think Carter is saying the same thing you are though. I get the impression from his remarks that he's prepared to accept restrictions without first ensuring that women won't have to make these choices based on affordability and the like. I don't think there can ever be an assumption that the government or society is in any position to mitigate all of the reasons a woman might have to terminate her pregnancy (under current law, at least) in a way that would reasonably substitute for her free will. There are so many wrongheaded assumptions made when considering taking that choice away from women that can't be simply and fairly administered from the lofty heights of government or the courts.

[SammyWinstonJack]

34. So IOW become even more like the repuke party, then? No Thanks!

And men should keep their damn opinions to themselves on this!

[truebrit71]

41. Mr. President I respectfully disagree...

Nothing could be more 'Pro-Life' than getting the government OUT of that decision entirely. Men do not tolerate any intrusion into their reproductive rights, women shouldn't have to either.

[goclark]

82. I'm on your side

Proud to be a woman.

I am a Christian but he needs to back out of his one IMO.
goclark

[Solly Mack]

44. Uh...No.

No.No.No.No.No.

And a few Fuck No's.

No.

N.O.

No.

Did I mention No?

And, no.

[Rex]

53. I get the feeling you are saying something here

could it be NO?

[Solly Mack]

59. Yes

[smirkymonkey]

74. Thank You!

God it pisses me off when senile, old men think they have a right to an opinion on this subject.

[fascisthunter]

46. Oh well... I disagree with him on this issue

[LynneSin]

47. Here's my 2 cents, for what it's worth

* If we provide smart and effective sex education to our children that includes both abstinence education (which lets face it - it's the best way to prevent a pregancy) and use of condoms and other birth control.

* If we provide free or at least low cost (like $5 a month) birth control pills for whomever needs them. We make condoms readily available along with Plan B for when an 'oops' happens.

* If we provide strong healthcare for all people, especially those no longer in the fetus stage of life.

* If we provide good public education, jobs and safety nets for those who need them..

If these things (and a few others) were done - you'd probably find that most abortions would occur because of rape/incest/threat to mother's life.

Abortions should not ever be considered a form of birth control. But because many people in our government want to restrict all access to reproductive health AND hamper opportunities to make this country a better place for all who live here, sometimes Abortion is the only option.

Abortion should always be a legal option with only a few exceptions. I better trust doctors with helping women decide what is best for them than politicians. But that's just me.

[Myrina]

81. Exactly.

Thanks for such a concise explanation.

[Johonny]

49. This was pretty much Clintons safe, legal, rare idea

the Republicans didn't accept it then, they sure never voted for Clinton, and they won't now. I do believe Carter is pro-life. He's always fought for people that need medical help mental and physical, housing, prison reform... I think safe, legal, rare is acceptable stance for a liberal to take. I just don't think a person in the Republican party who won't even back sex education is going to move towards a candidate that backs this language. It's 2012 no need to not call the other party anti-women and fight hard for full women's rights, including parts of Clinton's safe, legal, rare idea like birth control and sex education.

[cali]

63. no it was not. not ever. not even fucking close.

[Johonny]

66. it sounds close to me

he states he wants to make it less common. Limit to need times, medical and rape. Blah, blah. Don't really hear his mechanism to do this. I imagine it would sound a lot like safe legal rare. Remember he is on a conservative show trying to attract conservative voters. I like carter, but safe, legal and rare never worked as political strategy. And worse it pisses off liberal voters. As evidence by this thread. I want democrats working for sex education and contraceptives. Hey in magic land it would be great if women only had to have abortions rarely and early in pregnancy and complications were rare and they had means to support... but we are any closer to magic land now than the 1990s. I think in 2012 trying to sound or move to a more conservative language on abortion is horrible political strategy, and frankly a step in the wrong direction for women's rights. I'd rather see john kerry defend his vote on late term abortion than pretend conservatives will vote for obama if he uses more prolife framings.

[BlueIris]

51. ...Why must you do this to me, President Carter?

[ParkieDem]

52. The real question is ...

what the hell was he doing on Laura Ingraham?

[Xyzse]

54. Mr. Carter I believe you have it wrong

That though I am an Independent, my views on such a topic is more in line towards the Democrat's views.

It is not that we are not Pro-Life, because WE ARE. It is because we are for Choice as well.

I don't think that any one in this country is actually for Abortion, WE are just being realistic that such a thing will happen no matter what laws are imposed.

There will always be those who have complications during pregnancy that will threaten the life of the mother.
There will always be those who are abused and so forth.

To those that have to do to health reasons, to those who comes to a point due to circumstance. NO ONE, wants to have to make that choice. However it is a choice that some do face.

Abortion is not the issue, it is the symptom of a bigger problem. The problem of Health Care, Poverty, Lack of Choices and Abuse.

Address those four and you'll find the rates drop.

[NoMoreWarNow]

60. exactly!!!

[Johonny]

65. i dont think carter would disagree

He seems to be trying to restate the safe, legal, rare strategy. Personally I never thought this worked in 90s. In the current political climate it seems less likely to work.

[Xyzse]

67. I don't think so either

However, I don't think he needed the controversy and should have just kept his mouth shut.

I can agree that the Democrats may need to refocus their message, however he is falling for the same fault that many Democrats do (and was discussed here at some point) in using the "Right's" language he merely empowers an erroneous belief system or a method that he himself does not truly endorse.

[Johonny]

72. i agree

I believe it has been said over and over in a choice between a conservative and a guy trying to sound conservative, conservatives vote for the conservative.

[Rex]

55. Why is pro-life only about the fetus?

What are his views on the death penalty and how does he feel about sending troops into harms way? This is so stupid that I am embarrassed for the former POTUS.

People that are pro-life should be for ALL life and not just what their holy book tells them to think.

[Union Scribe]

57. Um

How do you not know that Jimmy Carter is pro-peace and anti-DP? Say what you will, but he isn't a GOP hypocrite. His pro life is just that.

[JonLP24]

71. He is against the DP

and in the vast majority of cases he is against sending troops in harm way. I'm not sure how he feels about ever or type but certainly was against the US recent engagements.

[Rex]

77. Just curious, don't keep up with the former POTUS.

Or what he is up to. As long as when he says PRO_LIFE, he is talking about ALL life and not some very strick and narrow view based on faith.

[JonLP24]

78. I have mixed feelings

I don't agree with him here but there are plenty of things I find admirable. Also his wife is a big mental health advocate which doesn't get enough attention with the inadequacies in identifying and receiving help & care. I still want to & look forward to reading her book Within Our Reach: Ending the Mental Health Crisis

[Safetykitten]

56. Well here he is again, The Failure President opening his big fat mouth. Gee, wonder why he lost...

to Reagan.

[Hawkowl]

70. +1000

Politically inept in the dictionary has a picture of Jimmy next to his beer swilling brother Billie.

[JonLP24]

73. He lost because of the inflation and oil crisis

that I believe Nixon was more to blame for that. He didn't always make good decisions but I don't believe he was a failure. Reagan was more of a spectacle and people are attracted to that like Las Vegas.

[NoMoreWarNow]

61. The question I have is-- do conservatives REALLY care that much about embryonic human life?

Why are so many people in this country obsessed about this issue? There are so many other problems that we face. Why are they so obsessed with this undeveloped, completely dependent bundle of cells? I understand they think it is a human life but WHY are they so focused on this to the exclusion of almost everything else, and not even want to look at root causes for abortions?

[alp227]

85. it just makes conservatives feel more smug about themselves.

while dismissing the plight of poor CHILDREN.

[Arkana]

62. No offense, Jimmy, but no.

Safe, legal, and rare.

[DefenseLawyer]

64. Yeah, well, you know, that's just like, your opinion, man. n/t

[frogmarch]

68. This makes me

think of Martin Sheen when he was asked if he was an atheist. He replied by saying something to the effect that for all rights and purposes, yes he was, but added that because he was raised Catholic, he would keep the Virgin Mary. “You can take away God, but don’t take away my Virgin Mary,” he said with a chuckle. (Probably not his exact words, but close.)

Jimmy Carter is a great Democrat and humanitarian. Even though he had a falling out with his church, he may still oppose abortion on religious grounds.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

69. Dear Jimmy, "pro-life" isn't about life. It's about punishing naughty women.

I've grown to like Jimmy but he's waaaay off base in thinking that women's rights are bargaining chips in elections.

[sudopod]

76. No one's perfect. :p nt

[Dawson Leery]

79. Laura Ingram? Really Jimmy?

This piece of filth has made a fortune from vilifying people such as yourself.

A few more matters:

Your bible(as well as every other religious document) is inferior to the rights of the individual.

Social conservatives are never going to vote for a Democrat. They oppose gay rights and contraception.
They believe the government must control our personal lives.

The time to tax religious institutions has arrived!

[Myrina]

80. "Minimize the need" = access to birth control, education and life options for young women.

THAT MUCH of Mr. Carter's statement, I do agree with.

[alp227]

83. Carter has now sunken as low as Palin and Santorum.

And what happened to Carter's humanitarian worldview? His heart goes out to the unborn Americans and children in third world countries but not poor American children?

[great white snark]

86. That low?

Does this one deed negate all the good he's done as a statesman?

My feelings are mixed at the moment..this has to sink in.

[Tom Ripley]

84. Along with dragging religion into the political sphere, we can also now thank Carter for this

bullshit.
Ted Kennedy was right to challenge that mealy-mouthed blue dog.

[Dawson Leery]

90. At least Ted did not allow his personal views on the matter become law.

[TBF]

87. That is insane. I thought we didn't give in to terrorists.

And I'm not going to give in to terrorists in the republican party (or this party) who think they should control what women do with their bodies. I don't know that I would be able to have an abortion - so I won't have one. And the more they try to force this down our throats the more militantly pro-choice I'm getting. WTF is going on with this war against women in the US?

[demmiblue]

88. I can't tell you how much this saddens me.