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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsOBAMA Admin: "The Pipeline Would In Fact Be Rejected - Only Question NOW Is Timing Of Announcement"
Obama's Last ShotThe president came into office promising to make fighting climate change a priority. Now, he finally seems to be getting serious about it
Read more: http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/obamas-last-shot-20140423#ixzz2zkbMKb35
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…Although no final decision has been made, two high-level sources in the Obama administration told me recently that the president has all but decided to deny the permit for the pipeline – a dramatic move that would light up Democratic voters and donors while further provoking the wrath of Big Oil. Finally, Obama is positioning the U.S. to play a key role in negotiations on a new global-climate treaty that will begin next year, establishing American leadership on climate issues and giving him one last chance to lead the world to a cooler future before he leaves the Oval Office
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Exactly how the president has weighed the decision on Keystone is a closely guarded secret in the White House, known only to a few senior advisors like Valerie Jarrett and Dan Pfeiffer. But it's no surprise that I was told recently by members of the administration that the pipeline would, in fact, be rejected. "If the president is really serious about his legacy on climate change, he can't have that and approve Keystone," an Obama insider told me. "The only question now is the timing of the announcement."
Read more: http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/obamas-last-shot-20140423?page=2
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octoberlib
(14,971 posts)
FiveGoodMen
(20,018 posts)We'll see...
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)
MindMover
(5,016 posts)SIGHS AND STARTS REPAIRING THE DAMAGE ...
mike_c
(36,281 posts)The oil companies' business model requires bringing every drop of petroleum reserves to market, no matter how dirty they are and regardless of the damage this will cause to the Earth's climate. As long as a market exists for fossil fuels, they will eventually pump and burn it all, in the name of maximal profit.
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)And if what I hear about TPP (which Obama is pushing for) is correct, then its provisions would probably reverse a Keystone XL denial.
Louisiana1976
(3,962 posts)
gratuitous
(82,849 posts)What I would greatly prefer to see is immediate action denying the permits, with a concomitant announcement that the United States environment and the health of its citizens is more important than running this death funnel down through the middle of the country for the greater profit of Big Oil, which has a piss-poor record of cleaning up its messes.
Make this an environmental and public health issue, as well as an attack on the bad citizenship practiced by our extractive industries. Set the discussion on those terms, let the Republicans whine and yammer, and stand by your decision. Aren't the talking chuckleheads always telling us that they love themselves a bold, decisive leader?
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)that would reverse any XL denial?
Do you really believe that President Obama (and his team) haven't gamed that out, too? 
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)But what has been leaked out, if accurate, says that provisions of the treaty over-rule any local or national laws and regulations in regards to environmental and worker protections. Thus, if Canada and China want to build a pipeline through the US, the treaty allows it. So yes, its entirely possible that Obama could deny permits for Keystone, all the while knowing that if TPP is authorized that denial will be negated. Do I know that for fact? No. But I also can't discount the real possibility of that occuring.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)Zero prosecutions of Wall St criminals. He lets BP, Duke, and other extraction corps off lightly. So he will decide based on National interests, as long as we're willing to accept that National interests = Wall St interests. Wall St wants TPP, Obama is doing all he can to deliver.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)The American People. Period.
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)I will not engage such foolishness.
sheshe2
(83,870 posts)And in the end, when it is denied, it still will not be enough for many. They will move onto the next game of bash this President!
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)when TPP is railroaded...errr, "fast-tracked" through the Senate and lo! and behold! it permits KXL. Some of us are paying attention, rather than being blind cheerleaders for Wall St puppets with a (D) after their name.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)I trust it because you're what 0-Every prediction.
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)2/2/12 David Higgs and Salmaan Siddiqui, Credit Suisse, plead guilty to conspiracy involving valuation of MBS
3/6/12 Allen Stanford, former Caribbean billionaire and general schmuck, convicted on 13 of 14 counts in $2.2B Ponzi scheme, faces 20+ years in prison
6/4/12 Matthew Kluger, lawyer, sentenced to 12 years in prison, along with co-conspirator stock trader Garrett Bauer (9 years) and co-conspirator Kenneth Robinson (not yet sentenced) for 17 year insider trading scheme.
6/14/12 Allen Stanford sentenced to 110 years without parole.
6/15/12 Rajat Gupta, former Goldman Sachs director, found guilty of insider trading. Could face a decade in prison when sentenced later this year.
6/22/12 Timothy S. Durham, 49, former CEO of Fair Financial Company, convicted of one count conspiracy to commit wire and securities fraud, 10 counts of wire fraud, and one count of securities fraud.
6/22/12 James F. Cochran, 56, former chairman of the board of Fair, convicted of one count of conspiracy to commit wire and securities fraud, one count of securities fraud, and six counts of wire fraud.
6/22/12 Rick D. Snow, 48, former CFO of Fair, convicted of one count of conspiracy to commit wire and securities fraud, one count of securities fraud, and three counts of wire fraud.
7/13/12 Russell Wassendorf Sr., CEO of collapsed brokerage firm Peregrine Financial Group Inc. arrested and charged with lying to regulators after admitting to authorities he embezzled "millions of dollars" and forged bank statements for "nearly twenty years."
8/22/12 Doug Whitman, Whitman Capital LLC hedge fund founder, convicted of insider trading following a trial in which he spent more than two days on the stand telling jurors he was innocent
10/26/12 UPDATE: Former Goldman Sachs director Rajat Gupta sentenced to two years in federal prison. He will, of course, appeal. . .
11/20/12 Hedge fund manager Matthew Martoma charged with insider trading at SAC Capital Advisors, and prosecutors are looking at Martoma's boss, Steven Cohen, for possible involvement.
02/14/13 Gilbert Lopez, former chief accounting officer of Stanford Financial Group, and former controller Mark Kuhrt sentenced to 20 yrs in prison for their roles in Allen Sanford's $7.2 billion Ponzi scheme.
03/29/13 Michael Sternberg, portfolio mgr at SAC Capital, arrested in NYC, charged with conspiracy and securities fraud. Pled not guilty and freed on $3m bail.
04/04/13 Matthew Marshall Taylor,fmr Goldman Sachs trader arrested, charged by CFTC w/defrauding his employer on $8BN futures bet "by intentionally concealing the true huge size, as well as the risk and potential profits or losses associated."
04/04/13 Matthew Taylor admits guilt, makes plea bargain. Sentencing set for 26 June; faces up to 20 years in prison but will likely only see 3-4 years. Says, "I am truly sorry."
04/11/13 Ex-KPMG LLP partner Scott London charged by federal prosecutors w/passing inside tips to a friend in exchange for cash, jewelry, and concert tickets; expected to plead guilty in May.
08/01/13 Fabrice Tourré convicted on six counts of security fraud, including "aiding and abetting" his former employer, Goldman Sachs
08/14/13 Javier Martin-Artajo and Julien Grout charged with wire fraud, falsifying records, and conspiracy in connection with JP Morgan's "London Whale" trade.
08/19/13 Phillip A. Falcone, manager of hedge fund Harbinger Capital Partners, agrees to admit to "wrongdoing" in market manipulation. Will banned from securities industry for 5 years and pay $18MM in disgorgement and fines.
09/16/13 Javier Martin-Artajo and Julien Grout officially indicted on charges associated with "London Whale" trade.
02/06/14 Matthew Martoma convicted of insider trading while at hedge fund SAC (Stephen A. Cohen) Capital Advisors. Expected sentence 7-10 years.
03/24/14 Annette Bongiorno, Bernard Madoff's secretary; Daniel Bonventre, director of operations for investments; JoAnn Crupi, an account manager; and Jerome O'Hara and George Perez, both computer programmers convicted of conspiracy to defraud clients, securities fraud, and falsifying the books and records.
But I suppose none of that happened ... We're only supposed to THINK it happened.
sheshe2
(83,870 posts)No cure in sight, I don't think even Obamacare will cover that one. The disease is to new it only became a problem in 2008~
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)the sickness will run it's course in January 2016. But then, again, it might metastasize into the equally debilitating, "OHIRLO Syndrome ... (Oh How I Really Love (President) Obama Syndrome)!
sheshe2
(83,870 posts)and give this President a sane Senate and Congress. We are at risk.
However, I think you are the one that will be surprised at the outcome. You underestimate this President as so many always have. It seems to me that many here never seem to hold the GOP accountable. All the hair on fire posts on DEMOCRATIC UNDERGROUND" only ever blame the President. Never ever the GOP. Wow, why is that?
Raksha
(7,167 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)lumberjack_jeff
(33,224 posts)So, no. No one in this government works "for the american people".
Would Obama sell the public out via globalization? Yes, just like Clinton did through NAFTA.
phleshdef
(11,936 posts)Including just about anyone posting here.
http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/12/12/tpp/?_php=true&_type=blogs&_r=0
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)Other Senators who are privy to the negotiations aren't allowed to disclose details, but have expressed a similar sentiment. If Senators are worried about the content, we should all be frightened as hell. The negotiations aren't secret because of trade secrets, they're secret because the agreement is really bad for us and they don't want us to know until its too late to stop it.
phleshdef
(11,936 posts)She is arguing against the nature of the negotiations. I agree with her points on that.
But as much as I like and deeply respect Elizabeth Warren, I give Krugman more credibility on these matters. It seems to me like it really won't make much of a difference.
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)He has no more facts than the rest of us. I'll heed the warnings of elected officials who KNOW whats in the negotiations because they've seen the documents.
phleshdef
(11,936 posts)She isn't part of the negotiations and the way your article reads, the only documents that have been seen by people outside of the negotiations, which include these same elected officials, are the ones that have been leaked.
Honestly I don't think any of our free trade agreements would be a big deal if we were doing the right thing in other areas of our politics. The impact of NAFTA for example would be a drop in the bucket if states weren't cutting public sector jobs right and left and we were passing strong infrastructure spending bills and making other real job creation strides.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)and what folks don't seem to understand/want to acknowledge ... President Obama has intimated that these trade agreements will include worker wage and workplace and environmental protections.
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)is how TPP is described. I doubt the business interests pushing it, and pulling Obama's strings, are including environmental and worker protections. In fact, leaks indicate the exact opposite. As small consolation though, at least Obama is the second best republican President in my life-time.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)that have only seen segments of leaked drafts of the agreement.
But you just keep on allowing others to blind-foldedly describe the elephant through touching the tail or its trunk.
It amazes me how people are so quick to jump on woefully incomplete information (that supports their political perspective) while not giving a thought to the idea that there is a reason only segments of the drafts agreements are being leaked ... if one can leak segments, one can leak the entire draft agreement. No?
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)And its a huge document... probably no single person has read or possesses the entire thing. What we do know, is from elected officials who have oversight, and have some knowledge of the contents. While prohibited from directly mentioning the contents, their vague warnings (all they're allowed to say) should be a red-flag to all of us. As if the fact that the entire agreement is being written by lobbyists and business interests isn't enough of a red-flag.
You must be in the 1%... there's plenty for them to cheerlead in the TPP. For everone else, prepare to get shit upon.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)go back and read your own up-thread posts ... count the number of times you wrote the word, "Leaked." Now, you claim to NOT know that the document was leaked? A swing and miss!
Really now ... is that what you are going to go with? Okay.
I guess that depends on how one defines "in the 1%." I can honestly say I am not in the Top 1%, I am, however, in the top 5%.
BTS, please note: arguing that we do not have sufficient information to form an (strong) opinion on TPP (as I consistently have), is not cheer-leading the TPP ... it's doing what liberals are (in)famous for ... waiting for FACTS, before forming an opinion AND being skeptical of the veracity of partial information and those that would form their opinion on partial information.
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)What part of that don't you get? All we have are warnings from those who've seen parts that what's in there isn't promising. And since it's being negotiated in secret, we won't know the facts. Even the Senate is unlikely to know the facts, that's why its being fast-tracked.... so no-one knows whats in it nor has time to raise objections before its approved and implemented. Good for you you're 5%, you won't bear the brunt of TPP burden.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)Just a couple of the non direct quote leaks.
So your basing your opposition to TPP on information from legislators that you acknowledge are short on facts?
Come on, mannn ... you're not trying very hard!
KoKo
(84,711 posts)"modified TPP agreement" they would go for...then onto the others in the Pacific to "modify" agreement to be acceptable. Bloomberg Business seemed very "Upbeat" in their reports about this.
So...according to the Business Groups (that we know he caters to) he is moving along "under stealth" to "modify" so he might make it seem that TPP is dead while he is already making agreements to make it more amenable to interests who are involved in it who won't complain. The Devil is in the Details, though.
How this will all be spun (before Mid-Term Elections) remains to be seen. But, he is a cautious, pragmatic person who knows how to deal in the shadows and make things seem good as he pushes Neo-Lib Global Agreements forward whether it is Military, Trade or Financial. He knows the Business Community will be thrilled and spin it foward and the (People/1%) will be on board and the rest of us will remain ignorant or cheer it on if we support him.
So this is probably more "Spin." Will end up where this all usually ends up.
WillyT
(72,631 posts)
frylock
(34,825 posts)
winter is coming
(11,785 posts)
babylonsister
(171,079 posts)if this admin didn't want it to be.
Happy camper here!! 
Calista241
(5,586 posts)So now we're going to have to depend on the Chinese to refine this crap properly.
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)If Canada wants to sell their crap to China, they can build their pipeline across Canadian soil. There is no reason to assume the enviromental risk, when there is zero benefit for us.
Autumn
(45,120 posts)recommended
99Forever
(14,524 posts)Wouldn't be the first time we were li....
... err ... misled by this cast of characters.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)is that you?
JoePhilly
(27,787 posts)NightWatcher
(39,343 posts)Don't chicken out and try to act like a moderate. Be proud to be a Dem and you'll be rewarded in 2014 and 2016.
madville
(7,412 posts)Since more crude will make the journey by rail car if the pipeline capacity isn't expanded, I wonder which way the railroads are lobbying j/k. I've seen conflicting reports over which method, rail or pipeline, has the larger carbon footprint so not sure on that.
I didn't know until recently that there are already existing pipelines that cover the same journey from end-to-end, they cover a longer distance though. Also that a large part of Keystone has already been built and is in use, the section under debate is the Northern leg that crosses the border.
Hekate
(90,779 posts)>fingers crossed<
Dragonfli
(10,622 posts)
joshcryer
(62,276 posts)
Jefferson23
(30,099 posts)Strelnikov_
(7,772 posts)For the American people, approval of this pipeline offers negative environmental impacts along with negative economic impacts (higher fuel prices) . . . lose lose.
bigwillq
(72,790 posts)And if so 
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)
hughee99
(16,113 posts)
Orsino
(37,428 posts)...but what is the fucking hold-up?
A president who could unequivocally reject this would have some serious liberal cred.
Tierra_y_Libertad
(50,414 posts)Thomas Jefferson
