General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsMinds of their Own - Animals are smarter than you think.
http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2008/03/animal-minds/virginia-morell-textIn 1977 Irene Pepperberg, a recent graduate of Harvard University, did something very bold. At a time when animals still were considered automatons, she set out to find what was on another creature's mind by talking to it. She brought a one-year-old African gray parrot she named Alex into her lab to teach him to reproduce the sounds of the English language. "I thought if he learned to communicate, I could ask him questions about how he sees the world."
When Pepperberg began her dialogue with Alex, who died last September at the age of 31, many scientists believed animals were incapable of any thought. They were simply machines, robots programmed to react to stimuli but lacking the ability to think or feel. Any pet owner would disagree. We see the love in our dogs' eyes and know that, of course, Spot has thoughts and emotions. But such claims remain highly controversial. Gut instinct is not science, and it is all too easy to project human thoughts and feelings onto another creature. How, then, does a scientist prove that an animal is capable of thinkingthat it is able to acquire information about the world and act on it?
"That's why I started my studies with Alex," Pepperberg said. They were seatedshe at her desk, he on top of his cagein her lab, a windowless room about the size of a boxcar, at Brandeis University. Newspapers lined the floor; baskets of bright toys were stacked on the shelves. They were clearly a teamand because of their work, the notion that animals can think is no longer so fanciful.
Certain skills are considered key signs of higher mental abilities: good memory, a grasp of grammar and symbols, self-awareness, understanding others' motives, imitating others, and being creative. Bit by bit, in ingenious experiments, researchers have documented these talents in other species, gradually chipping away at what we thought made human beings distinctive while offering a glimpse of where our own abilities came from. Scrub jays know that other jays are thieves and that stashed food can spoil; sheep can recognize faces; chimpanzees use a variety of tools to probe termite mounds and even use weapons to hunt small mammals; dolphins can imitate human postures; the archerfish, which stuns insects with a sudden blast of water, can learn how to aim its squirt simply by watching an experienced fish perform the task. And Alex the parrot turned out to be a surprisingly good talker.
arcane1
(38,613 posts)I saw him on a Nova special once, and my mind was blown!
Godot51
(239 posts)It's things like this that convince me that the earth and the life thereon has dominion over us and not the other way around.
CAPHAVOC
(1,138 posts)lob1
(3,820 posts)Luminous Animal
(27,310 posts)pokerfan
(27,677 posts)get the red out
(13,468 posts)Dogs can be very amazing in their own right.
Lucky Luciano
(11,258 posts)varelse
(4,062 posts)Moostache
(9,897 posts)The idea that humanity is somehow "special" is the most arrogant and self-limiting belief of the species.
We share the same DNA and biochemistry of all life on this planet. There is no greater evidence of common decent than our common basic functions - amino acids, protein transcription, metabolic pathways - all testify clearly that humanity is part and parcel of the tree of life and NOT its own branch, NOT apart from life on Earth, NOT specially created.
Dominion over the Earth.
Eternal Life.
Special Creation.
All evils of the highest order and one day, if the species survives long enough to free itself of the viruses of religion and credulity, that will become clear to all. If I were to ever "pray" for anything...it would be for Homo Sapiens to make it to that epiphany!
UnrepentantLiberal
(11,700 posts)Do skeptical scientists move the goal posts because of science, or because of their Judeo Christian upbringing?
varelse
(4,062 posts)or at least, some of them.
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)We have seen them do things that blow our minds regularly.
I used a lot of what she learned with Alex, in how we communicate with the conures. And when Tuky died, we saw honest to goodness grief from cookie.
Mojorabbit
(16,020 posts)They all are very intelligent. The Grey amazes me daily.
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)He died t the young age of 23' the sun and the Nanday are enough.
onethatcares
(16,178 posts)from what i've read, and it's not a whole lot, they teach each other hunting techniques and work together for the good of the pod.
Dolphins do the same, but those orcas really do some fancy things.
Skittles
(153,183 posts)when I start THINKING about taking him to the vet or putting flea medicine on him, he hides
hamsterjill
(15,223 posts)I put their vet visits on the calendar so that *I* won't forget. And so help me, they can read! They know when to hide!
Skittles
(153,183 posts)especially if it features Miss November!!!
hamsterjill
(15,223 posts)Last edited Tue Mar 27, 2012, 10:23 AM - Edit history (1)
n/t
That is awesome!
Skittles
(153,183 posts)I flipped that calendar for ten months - it wasn't until I got to November that Riff Raff became OBSESSED - he just would not stop staring - heck, he is standing on his litterbox trying to get closer - when I tried holding him up to it so he would see it was a paper cat, he tried beating the crap out of it - eventually I nixed using November on that calendar
Vattel
(9,289 posts)and he can do what they describe in the article: learn a word after hearing it only a couple times. It's scary how good he is with language. I have often wondered whether border collies are smarter than other dogs or they just listen more carefully. If you've ever had a border collie you know they really do hang on your every word.
tblue37
(65,483 posts)truedelphi
(32,324 posts)Blue bodied, yellow headed parakeet named Ricky. Whenever my baby sister was too fussy, and wanted to be left alone, we would play with the bird.
Soon, Ricky knew over three hundred words. And the amazing thing is, he used them in context. He never said, "Good morning" in the evening. And usually, when my mom let him out of the cage so he could wake me up for school, he'd fly to my forehead and pick at my eyelashes, while I slept. As I woke up he'd say, "Get up." Or else, "Get out of bed."
And as it got dark, he'd land on our heads, and when you had him hop on your finger, he'd say, "Dirty bird, go to bed."
We both found him amazing, and he lived to be thirteen years old.
I've had the experience of knowing a cat that snuck out of its real home to be with the elderly man that he had adopted. He would come and get this older man out to the kitchen, if the tea kettle was getting dangerously hot. The elderly man was hard of hearing, and he'd forget about how it was steaming away.
xtraxritical
(3,576 posts)He always speaks in context. "Good morning, how are you" every morning, "Good night" every night. "Hello" on entry. "Goodbye" on exit. Much, much more, always in context. Scientists are just stupids, looking for easy grant money, especially from that monster DARPA. Everybody knows animals have keen intelligence and feelings. Scientists and engineers are the devils tools. Yes, I'm a Ludite, skip the comments, I wish Native American's were in charge again.
truedelphi
(32,324 posts)Twelve favorite grandmothers rule the tribe. I don't know how we will bring it about. Those who have been attempting to take minor steps in that direction keep getting shot down.
But if enough people dream the dream and walk the talk, it can happen.
joeybee12
(56,177 posts)hootinholler
(26,449 posts)Or that it is smart not to vote at all.
harmonicon
(12,008 posts)crunch60
(1,412 posts)He has a special bond with his owner who said Skidboot changed his life.
AnotherDreamWeaver
(2,852 posts)ceile
(8,692 posts)Wonderful story...
snagglepuss
(12,704 posts)bloomington-lib
(946 posts)using human language?
aint_no_life_nowhere
(21,925 posts)go on to teach it to their offspring and use a number of signs to communicate, without researchers engaging in teaching the offspring themselves.
bluedigger
(17,087 posts)UnrepentantLiberal
(11,700 posts)If you have time, this is a great PBS documentary on crows. You can watch the full video here:
http://www.pbs.org/wnet/nature/episodes/a-murder-of-crows/full-episode/5977/
Although cultures around the world may regard the crow as a scavenger, bad omen, or simply a nuisance, this bad reputation might overshadow what could be regarded as the crows most striking characteristic its intelligence. New research indicates that crows are among the brightest animals in the world. NATUREs A Murder of Crows brings you these so-called feathered apes, as you have never seen them before.
magical thyme
(14,881 posts)Because I live with birds, dogs, a cat and a horse, and have had animals in my life most all my life, I KNOW how smart they are. Very, very smart. Smarter than most of the people I know, for sure.
How many people speak or understand *any* animal languages in their own language? Not many.
truedelphi
(32,324 posts)There was a knock at our front door. The weird thing was the knock came from about where on a door a small child would be knocking.
It was night time? How could any of the neighbor's kids be out?
I opened the door, and standing on his or her hind legs, was a beautiful adolescent raccoon. They looked at me with a deep intention. i knew they wanted food.
We didn't normally feed the racoons - but I couldn't let this guy or gal go away hungry. I took the twenty pound bag of kibble out to the middle of the yard and poured out about three pounds of the food.
In the morning, every crumb of kibble was gone. I had never seen that particular raccoon before, and i never saw it again.
An acquaintance of mine, who was a doctor had a similar thing happen. A big ol' buck came and knocked on her door, so she would heal his ear that had been ripped open?
We both lived in fairly populated areas. How did both animals know that our doors were good ones to be knocking on.
crunch60
(1,412 posts)Went out to my car one evening to get some paper work out of the glove compartment. Wind was blowing hard and it was raining. I sat reading the papers with the drivers side door open. My neighbor's cat (who I nursed back to health) appeared and looked at me. Then he jumped and ran a few feet to my front door and looked back at me. I closed the car door, and ran to pick him up. I took him to the back patio and gave him some food and milk, and came back into the house.
My phone was ringing, it was my neighbor asking me if I was alright. I said yes, why? He said, "look out the front door". A large dead tree fell onto my car, and a large branch went through the drivers side window, just where I had been sitting only minutes before.
I think the cat, whom I now call Angle, heard/felt the tree falling and warned me.
I took care of him, and he took care of me, for sure. That he came over that late in the evening while it was raining, is beyond me.
Kaleko
(4,986 posts)Keep chipping away at the insanely arrogant notions that animals are soul-less and inferior when, in many different ways, they have superior abilities in the sensing/feeling department.
truedelphi
(32,324 posts)Indeed, how did the cat know? And thank goodness the kitty braved the rain and the wind to let you know!
I assume that my kitties would do the same for me - if it was their dinner time!
jtuck004
(15,882 posts)Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)Because she was playful but stubborn, erratic, disobedient, so our family just kind of dismissed her as "dumb"...
I was always curious on what made her bark, what got certain reactions from her, why she went certain routes or why she sat and slept in certain spots, did she ever feel happy or sad??...It was all a mystery to me then, but as an adult and reading about animal behavior makes me so sad sometimes because it strikes me like lightning -- "OH! That's why she did x,y,z!! THAT'S what she was trying to tell us all those times! This is what I should have done!", etc.
Trillo
(9,154 posts)Trying to get other animals who are part of your pack--such as a pet dog likely considers their humans--to understand.
BeHereNow
(17,162 posts)I love Fur People; I have several of them and yes, they
certainly have "speech" and reasoning and they seem to know
that I know this about them.
It's funny, my family makes fun of me and calls me "Snow White"
because every where I go, they follow me like a parade
of baby ducks. Five cats and a Jindo Dog who is smarter
than most people I know. Jindos actually THINK about it
before they respond... it's funny as hell! And talk about vocabulary?
She knows so many words I've lost count.
I also have squirrel, Blue Jays and Crows who recognize me and
signal to others when I am in the front of the house.
I can hand feed them all!
It's a hoot!
And yes, the Blue jays are EXTREMELY sneaky characters~
BHN