Sometimes one is reading a discussion board and sees what looks like a female screen name

[CreekDog]

and that name, which at first glance seems to represent a woman, is actually posting some Men's Rights stuff.

and that name and that account actually belongs to a male. but most don't really realize this. the thing is if Men's Rights Activists want to get people to believe Men's Rights arguments, which seem largely to make you side against women and children (usually on child support), the arguments are more convincing if they sound like they are being made by a woman.

however, even though they are more convincing if they sound like they are coming from a woman, they often or usually aren't coming from a woman AND they aren't true either.

[DURHAM D]

1. Yes. They are commonly referred to as "internet women".

[temporary311]

4. Or GIRLs

Guys In Real Life.

[NYC_SKP]

2. I gotta hand it to you CreekDog, you make the old meta forum look like the DU Lounge.

It's like you're discussing the discussions about the discussions ABOUT the discussions!

BTW, I'll be in your city in the next month, I think, staying at the Harbor Court which is right next to where the SF YMCA was 35 years ago, which I discovered quite by chance but totally recognized the entry when I was there last, 35 years ago. Anyway, the Harbor Court is pet-friendly and there are tons of great restaurants nearby, I don't have to tell you.

So, send a PM if you want to grab a coffee and scone one morning or lunch. My dinners are always tied up, sorry.

[CreekDog]

7. and there's also the folks that coordinate efforts to shut down discussions of guns

what's most interesting about that is that these are often the posters who seem to post almost exclusively about guns.

[NYC_SKP]

12. They shut down gun discussions with facts, mostly. Which has nothing to do with this thread, yes?

Or.... Who the hell are you talking about???

[pintobean]

17. Hosts?

[Warren DeMontague]

3. Yeah, people play all sorts of disingenuous games on the internet.

The creation of large numbers of sock puppet accounts to create the illusion of a groundswell of opinion, is another favorite.

[pacalo]

9. I remember one of Skinner's most memorable PPRs of a sock.

The one created to subvert DU's 24-hour time-out policy for 0-6 alert results ...

[pintobean]

18. That's hilarious.

[TDale313]

5. "And they aren't true, either"

More important even than whether they're posted by a woman or not (although it's true enough that anyone can claim anything on an anonymous message board.)

Shocking truth is, not all women think the same. Most believe that women should be treated with respect, support equality even if they don't self identify as a feminist. But there are certainly some who do buy into mra talking points. There are some who feel that they manage very well under the status quo, thank you very much. There are even women who don't particularly like other women much. There are some who, even if they don't believe it, will say something outrageous in order to stir the shit.

Yes, most anti-women stuff comes from men. But not all.

[rrneck]

6. ...

[quinnox]

8. I think you are probably right, but I don't bother with it

I just take it all at face value. If I start worrying about who is playing a fake woman, or for that matter a fake man, or a fake liberal, or a fake Obama loyalist, etc etc, it would be time for me to stop posting. lol. That thinking would drive me nuts.

[Gravitycollapse]

10. It's called "internalized misogyny" and it very much exists.

[Bonobo]

13. The argument I have seen made

That the woman who posted it is merely trying to ingratiate herself with men is the precise inverse of the White Knight argument.

[Gravitycollapse]

14. Well, no, because the power relations are much different.

In the same way that Martiniquais who had a psychological desire to become part of their French, white colonial overlords would not be the same as a French colonizer wishing to shed his oppressive position and participate in African liberation (although the latter was an extremely rare occurrence). Even then, the enlightened French colonizer is not the same as the "white knight." But I very seriously suspect that so few "white knights" exist that it barely warrants a specific name.

Internalized racism is turning one's personal identity into abjectness. And like being near all abject things, this causes the individual to wish for an escape and to establish a new identity that isn't abject. In the case of colonized black Africans, internalized racism caused many to wish they were white.

[CreekDog]

16. It exists, but that isn't even what I'm talking about

I'm talking about men who create accounts with feminine sounding names (not necessarily concealing that they're males, but having a name which gives that impression).

And then they post the Men's Right's position on subject after subject - complaining about child support, that the gender based wage disparities aren't real, etc.

And seeking to gain credibility for their statements partly through people thinking that this is the opinion of a woman.

Go to the gungeon, you'll see female name after female sounding name --many of the posters are actually men, some will say they are, some won't, but they are.

[1000words]

11. It's all noise ... static.

So what.

[Warren DeMontague]

15. Where's my umbrella?