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DeSwiss

(27,137 posts)
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 02:24 AM Jan 2014

ANSWER: 210,000 to 440,000 - 3rd leading cause of death in America

[font size=3]QUESTION: How Many Die From Medical Mistakes in U.S. Hospitals?[/font]

ProPublica, Sep. 19, 2013, 9:03 a.m.
by Marshall Allen



An updated estimate says at least 210,000 patients die from medical mistakes in U.S. hospitals a year. (File, Scott Olson/Getty Images)

It seems that every time researchers estimate how often a medical mistake contributes to a hospital patient’s death, the numbers come out worse. In 1999, the Institute of Medicine published the famous “To Err Is Human” report, which dropped a bombshell on the medical community by reporting that up to 98,000 people a year die because of mistakes in hospitals. The number was initially disputed, but is now widely accepted by doctors and hospital officials — and quoted ubiquitously in the media.

In 2010, the Office of Inspector General for Health and Human Services said that bad hospital care contributed to the deaths of 180,000 patients in Medicare alone in a given year.

Now comes a study in the current issue of the Journal of Patient Safety that says the numbers may be much higher — between 210,000 and 440,000 patients each year who go to the hospital for care suffer some type of preventable harm that contributes to their death, the study says.

That would make medical errors the third-leading cause of death in America, behind heart disease, which is the first, and cancer, which is second.

The new estimates were developed by John T. James, a toxicologist at NASA’s space center in Houston who runs an advocacy organization called Patient Safety America. James has also written a book about the death of his 19-year-old son after what James maintains was negligent hospital care.

MORE


- If you do the things you need to in order to avoid dying from #1 or #2, then you're less likely of dying from #3......

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ANSWER: 210,000 to 440,000 - 3rd leading cause of death in America (Original Post) DeSwiss Jan 2014 OP
I have a close relative in the hospital now MannyGoldstein Jan 2014 #1
''________ is a disaster.'' DeSwiss Jan 2014 #2
All that counts is power and connections. MannyGoldstein Jan 2014 #3
You're right. ''The fish stinks from the head.'' :-| n/t DeSwiss Jan 2014 #4
Yep. bemildred Jan 2014 #14
I remember years ago, (mid '70s) the doctors in Los Angeles madokie Jan 2014 #5
Doctors strike in Israel. postulater Jan 2014 #10
Same thing..... DeSwiss Jan 2014 #12
, blkmusclmachine Jan 2014 #6
@ DeSwiss Jan 2014 #13
Health care is an industry and thus... LisaLynne Jan 2014 #7
The selling of ''life units'' on a for-profit basis.... DeSwiss Jan 2014 #11
Having worked in hospitals several years ago, I am not surprised. AdHocSolver Jan 2014 #8
All sound advice. DeSwiss Jan 2014 #15
It is alternatives that have helped me when the medical doctors couldn't. truedelphi Jan 2014 #19
Good for you. DeSwiss Jan 2014 #25
Very wise decision newfie11 Jan 2014 #27
They killed my 3 1/2 year old son 20 years ago on 12/21! Dustlawyer Jan 2014 #9
Sorry for your loss. DeSwiss Jan 2014 #18
Some of the "foods" we are sold are nothing but truedelphi Jan 2014 #23
That was the first thing I changed. DeSwiss Jan 2014 #33
Yet I bet many many doctors out there truedelphi Jan 2014 #35
Doctors receive virtually no training...... DeSwiss Jan 2014 #36
I can't imagine the nightmare you experienced. truedelphi Jan 2014 #21
We are commodities to be exploited for profit. Alkene Jan 2014 #16
We are ''treated as'' commodities to be exploited for profit. /fixed DeSwiss Jan 2014 #20
I stand corrected. Thank you. n/t Alkene Jan 2014 #24
Avoiding #1 and #2 isn't the answer Victor_c3 Jan 2014 #17
I think you've stumbled onto something here! DeSwiss Jan 2014 #22
I've worked 42 years in hospitals coast to coast newfie11 Jan 2014 #26
I wish I had done this for my Mom. PADemD Jan 2014 #29
Agreed. DeSwiss Jan 2014 #34
They killed my mom. A slow painful agonizing death. One dumbass mistake after another. we can do it Jan 2014 #28
I can relate to your experience. DeSwiss Jan 2014 #31
My mother was in the hospital in mid December and had four procedures to remove clogs in her hrmjustin Jan 2014 #30
What I've found is that most people continue consuming what they did....... DeSwiss Jan 2014 #32
 

MannyGoldstein

(34,589 posts)
1. I have a close relative in the hospital now
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 02:35 AM
Jan 2014

One of the country's better teaching hospital's (not in Boston).

Care is a disaster. We need to stay on top of them to prevent fuck ups, ranging from their inability to communicate between departments (all the nice info in the Emergency Department apparently doesn't travel with patients when they get admitted), to plain stupid stuff like withholding a critical medication because said relative normally takes it as a pill, and she wasn't eating for a few days. Of course she had an IV and the drug is readily available for IV use. She got quite sick before we realized what was happening.

Incredible.

 

DeSwiss

(27,137 posts)
2. ''________ is a disaster.''
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 02:42 AM
Jan 2014
- Is the way we seem to end up describing much, these days. In a society based upon money, what happens to it when the money becomes more worthless with each passing day?

 

MannyGoldstein

(34,589 posts)
3. All that counts is power and connections.
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 02:50 AM
Jan 2014

I work in the medical industry and have some pretty good connections. We started dropping some names two days ago, and our status was suddenly catapulted from lumpenproletariat to peer. Suddenly our questions get answers. Suddenly we're given options instead of being told what will be done.

This has happened to us before.

While we're pleased to be able to pull this stuff to help our family, we're disgusted that it's the only way to get even halfway-decent care. And this is in an enlightened state, and a well-above-average hospital.

Feh.

bemildred

(90,061 posts)
14. Yep.
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 06:43 AM
Jan 2014

My family, we show up in a herd to keep an eye on them. Knowing the social cues and the jargon is a big help. Be polite and stay in their face until you are satisfied they are doing what you want.

madokie

(51,076 posts)
5. I remember years ago, (mid '70s) the doctors in Los Angeles
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 03:21 AM
Jan 2014

went on strike, the strike lasted for a tad more than a month and during that month the death rate in LA went down substantially. The doctors answer to that was because no one was getting the care they really needed due to the doctors strike so less were dying, some shit like that. I've looked on google for this information but haven't been successful. I remember it plain as day just can't find any links to back what I'm saying up.
I'm trying my best to stay out of the hospital even though I spent a week in the VA hospital here in Muskogee OK about 12 years ago due to a DVT in my left leg.

I hope someone else remembers what I'm referring too and fills us in with the particulars.

LisaLynne

(14,554 posts)
7. Health care is an industry and thus...
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 03:36 AM
Jan 2014

when something is run for-profit, to keep costs down, they try to limit the number of people they have to pay. For some reason, that is where they all start. Nurses and doctors are often over-worked, I think, and that just leads to mistakes. Also, some of it is hubris. My grandfather died because the surgeon doing the operation on him wanted to get out early to go to dinner and so had someone else close him up. The sutures weren't done properly and he bled to death. More recently, my dad's doctor didn't get to him in the hospital for three days and by then, the infection he had had gotten to his heart and he died. Was he just too busy? Who knows.

 

DeSwiss

(27,137 posts)
11. The selling of ''life units'' on a for-profit basis....
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 06:30 AM
Jan 2014

...would be an accurate description of the US health ''care'' system. None of which come with a guarantee nor any assurance as to the efficacy of the products or services being rendered.

- Void where prohibited by law.

AdHocSolver

(2,561 posts)
8. Having worked in hospitals several years ago, I am not surprised.
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 04:29 AM
Jan 2014

My advice is to research any medical problem that comes up.

Use the Internet, "health" magazines, talk to people who may have had a similar health issue.

Formulate questions and ask any and all medical personnel that you deal with to explain the issues and how they plan to deal with them.

If they are not clear or forthcoming, insist on clarity. If you are still not satisfied, ask for a second opinion.

If someone needs to go to hospital, they should take an advocate with them. The advocate should have read up on the medical issues and ask the questions if the patient is not fully capable to do so.

The patient and the advocate should be proactive without being obnoxious, but should not passively accept everything they are told.

 

DeSwiss

(27,137 posts)
15. All sound advice.
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 06:44 AM
Jan 2014

I've developed a simpler method: I just stay away from them. They almost did me in, twice, in 2009. And that was after several years of failed treatments. My dresser became a virtual cornucopia of brightly-colored pills. Mine competing for ''best-in-show'' with my wife's collection of western medicine's finest offerings.

So I got out. I live alternatively now and haven't felt better in this past year since I began. I'm not looking back.

- So they missed their chance......

truedelphi

(32,324 posts)
19. It is alternatives that have helped me when the medical doctors couldn't.
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 07:07 AM
Jan 2014

Starting with the repercussions from a back injury in 1978, which only a chiropractor helped with.

Then in the late 1990's, and according to my doctor, I had the "worst case of diverticulitis" that his clinic had seen. Due to the terrible shape I was in, the surgery to scrape out the diverticuli had to be postponed until I was better. During that time, i happened upon a book that said that probiotics, that is, acidiphilus, would clear up diverticulitis. I went that route (cost was between
$ 14 an $ 28 a month.) By the time the surgery was an option, I had no diverticulitis.

After the above experience, I found out that some patients who have the operation end up needing a colostomy bag for the rest of their lives. I am really glad I avoided that expense, and the inconvenience of that side effect.

You would think my doctor would be interested in exactly how I went about curing my diverticulitis, but he didn't seem interested in the least.

For the most part, a healthy diet, exercise and some common sense seem to do the work of a dozen doctors.



 

DeSwiss

(27,137 posts)
25. Good for you.
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 07:28 AM
Jan 2014

Probiotics helped me when I was doing a tox-cleanse last year. I'd been trying to find a way to treat recurring idiopathic urticaria I'd been going to doctors for the previous 7 years. Prednisone was the drug of choice that I ended up on, when nothing else would work. Where upon it began taking me apart internally. It induced a diabetic condition that had to be treated with drugs that caused other very serious problems.

Ultimately it all caused a condition which resulted in a Triple-Aortic Aneurysm that turned into a quadruple a month later and they had to open me up again. So now I'm all patched up with Dupont's finest Gortex plastic aorta-sleeves and arterial sutures. While putting all that in, that's when they found the cancer.

In the end they had me going to the bathroom literally every hour on the hour and sometimes as frequently as every twenty minutes! I got no sleep at all. I'd just pass-out every few days. All from those damned pills. When they said they heard something wrong with my heart on an EKG, that's when I decided changes were in order.

- So no matter what happens from here on out, I'd rather be the author of my fate as opposed to being an income-producing unit for Big Pharma.

Dustlawyer

(10,497 posts)
9. They killed my 3 1/2 year old son 20 years ago on 12/21!
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 04:39 AM
Jan 2014

He always needed more enzyme pills to digest his food, more than normal. Every time he went into the hospital for something (approx 4-6 times per year) they would run tests to see why. Each time they would tell us they could not figure it out, but to keep giving him the extra as it didn't hurt anything. I even asked once would the enzymes digest his intestines in such high doses, they laughed and said no. Turns out they were wrong and it ate a hole through causing Sepsis and he died. My nephew with the same condition and enzyme problem was immediately switched to night feedings through a hook up placed in his belly button. He just got married 3 months ago and is a great guy who was a state wrestling champion.
They are far from Gods, but many (certainly not all) only care about the $$$. The worst thing is, and the reason for such a gross under-count, is because they cover it up and lie to the family.

 

DeSwiss

(27,137 posts)
18. Sorry for your loss.
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 07:06 AM
Jan 2014

I too battled serious illness and staved-off death, was riddled with aneurysms and cancer four years ago. I got this way with medical science helping all the way. I didn't get better until I took control back of my health decisions. It seems that many of our problems stem from the fact that we've allowed ourselves to be poisoned by our progress.

By accepting the pollution, the manufacture of processed food products with chemicals no one knows the impacts upon human health, and further allow the degradation of the air we breathe, the water we drink and our bodies to be overwhelmed by, bathed-in, and smeared upon with lotions and creams (many known carcinogens as well) and full of endocrine-disrupting chemicals -- and with no stopping them in-sight -- then these are the kinds of health problem we must accept as the price.

- Or, we can change it. Those are the only choices. It's either that we conclude it's our planet, and our lives. Or, we let others make those decisions for us.




The other thing people need to be aware of, is health benefits of consuming Cannabis. And in particular, CBD.

truedelphi

(32,324 posts)
23. Some of the "foods" we are sold are nothing but
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 07:13 AM
Jan 2014

A little bit of formaldehyde-contaminated wheat, with a chaser of high fructose sugar, lots of salt, food coloring additives, and MSG. I feel quite upset when I am in the grocery line behind a family, and all that is in the grocery cart is chips of various sorts, soda by the caseful, frozen pizza, lunch meats and booze.

And thank you for the OBD link.

 

DeSwiss

(27,137 posts)
33. That was the first thing I changed.
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 03:41 PM
Jan 2014

The food I ate. I now eat about 80% vegetable matter everyday. What little meat I eat is primarily to obtain essential nutrients needed since my musculature has been ravaged by my condition. And then it's organic fowl and/or fish.

One of the strange ''benefits'' of my surgery was that I couldn't stand the smell of food for months. Meats especially so. They didn't want to release me from the hospital because I wouldn't eat. It took about 6 months before I could eat any meat. I still hadn't learned the lesson at that time.

But as I began coming off the pills, I had to make sure my body was getting the vitamins and nutrients it needed, so I went to a nutritionist and found me an osteopathic physician (now since retired after just 1 year! - So I'm looking again).

- Anyone attempting to live alternatively must have patience. There is no quick fix I know of to repair this damage because it was done to us incrementally as well. And that's how you fix it, one bite at a time.......

truedelphi

(32,324 posts)
35. Yet I bet many many doctors out there
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 04:31 PM
Jan 2014

Would tell you that there is no scientific basis that eating the way you do now is healthier. (Even though such scientific proof exists.) But they are trained in med school to think that if it is on an American shelf for purchase, then it must be A-okay.

Anyway congratulations for your getting on the right path. And congrats to me too! Otherwise our only encounter might be in adjacent cemetary plots.

 

DeSwiss

(27,137 posts)
36. Doctors receive virtually no training......
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 05:22 PM
Jan 2014

...in nutrition in medical school. Because the AMA knows that good nutrition means bad business.

With all the doctors I saw previously, all the specialists and surgeons, not one ever discussed my nutritional intake, nor did any inquire as to what kind of environment I lived in, worked in, etc.

All they saw was that I exhibited certain symptoms within certain parameters and a pharmaceutical-chemical/surgical/cancer treatment response(s) were ordered up. And with each one came another set or series of problems and consequences. Few, if any of which are discussed or inquired into very fully with you by your doctor. Just the bare minimum, if that. We can thank the lawyers for much of this. You discuss it, you own it.

But the very things doctors were taught to consider impacting and negatively affecting the things growing in their petri dishes when they were in medical school, becomes oblivious to them and just so much background noise against the beatific sounds of their soaring medical practices, Big Pharma conferences (free golfing vacations), yachts and vacation homes, and bank investments. No one goes to the doctor to be healed anymore. Just treated. That's all they're allowed to do.

- What this is, is one more example of how all aspects of our society have been bankrupt for some time now. The medical industry is no different in this regard. The only difference here, is that we're ''the product'' being developed, nurtured, maintained and eventually composted.

[center]

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Alkene

(752 posts)
16. We are commodities to be exploited for profit.
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 06:46 AM
Jan 2014

Life, death, suffering- opportunities for someone's enhanced lifestyle.

How is that not immoral?

 

DeSwiss

(27,137 posts)
20. We are ''treated as'' commodities to be exploited for profit. /fixed
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 07:09 AM
Jan 2014
- I eschew all labels. Especially that one......

Victor_c3

(3,557 posts)
17. Avoiding #1 and #2 isn't the answer
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 06:53 AM
Jan 2014

[quote] - If you do the things you need to in order to avoid dying from #1 or #2, then you're less likely of dying from #3...... [/quote]

Nope, I don't think it'll work like that. If you avoid #1 and #2, you're could still be afflicted with #4, 5, 6, 7, 8,... all driving you to a hospital - where you once again have to face #3. I think instead of avoiding #1, and #2, you should embrace them and make sure that they do the trick before doctors get their hands on you.

I personally am building up a nest egg of money. When I feel it's time to go, I'm going to buy a whole crap load of cocaine and get a bunch of prostitutes and die mid-stroke of a drug overdose. Now I just need to worry about avoiding accidents until then...

I just thought of another plus of my plan. I don't have to worry about saving up for my retirement

newfie11

(8,159 posts)
26. I've worked 42 years in hospitals coast to coast
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 07:47 AM
Jan 2014

Some better, some really bad.
Never never let a family member stay in a hospital without supervision. Someone needs to stay with him/her. Question everything from meds to tests.
You can do this politely but if no answers don't stop.

PADemD

(4,482 posts)
29. I wish I had done this for my Mom.
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 12:47 PM
Jan 2014

She crashed and died on the day she was to come home. My Aunt talked me out of an autopsy.

 

DeSwiss

(27,137 posts)
34. Agreed.
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 03:45 PM
Jan 2014

I often spent the night in my Dad and Mom's room while they were in the hospital. After I got a family of my own, and the hospital stays became more frequent, that wasn't as easy to do.

- But I totally agree. Never leave a loved one unescorted in a hospital. There are too many things and people in those places that kill.

we can do it

(12,203 posts)
28. They killed my mom. A slow painful agonizing death. One dumbass mistake after another.
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 12:26 PM
Jan 2014

From the dickhead surgeon who "forgot" to order antibiotics after her hysterectomy (resulting in sepsis). Kidney failure followed a few years later. She did manage to get a transplant, which made things good for a little over 5 years. When that failed (took them 3 months to figure this out) they bungled get her start on dialysis, even dropping her on the way to get a port put in which caused her to get cellulitis in her leg. They never told us that most transplant recipients develop cancer due to the anti-rejection drugs - so it took her quack family practice dr. a while to find out she was full of cancer - (OVARIAN! - she had a total hysterectomy and still got ovarian cancer) then they forced (when my sister or I weren't there) and tried to force one test after another on her after another. Why? Just to make money - disgusting, ineffective imbiciles.

I am still burning mad and sick to my stomach when I think about it.

 

DeSwiss

(27,137 posts)
31. I can relate to your experience.
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 03:13 PM
Jan 2014

I had to watch both parents wither away from our medical system. Although the advances in the ways they could kill a patient had increased exponentially between 1986 when my father died, and 1999 when my mother died. It still took my own experience and an actual NDE and an OBE to make me finally see.

- What the takeaway was: ''Take charge of your life.''

 

hrmjustin

(71,265 posts)
30. My mother was in the hospital in mid December and had four procedures to remove clogs in her
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 12:51 PM
Jan 2014

Arteries. Her first one they made a mistake and she was awake. They tried to play it off but my mother would not let him.

 

DeSwiss

(27,137 posts)
32. What I've found is that most people continue consuming what they did.......
Thu Jan 2, 2014, 03:28 PM
Jan 2014

...before they got sick. And living their lives as close to possible to exactly what it was like before they got sick. Not making the connection that maybe that was what made them sick to begin with. It happens so slowly that we often miss the connection by the time our lifestyles catch up to us.

So rejection of the crap being handed out as medicine these days, isn't enough. The foods one eats, the fluoridated and chemically laden water one drinks, the environment one lives in, and all those personal care products one uses and consumes, they are all working together in slowing -- inch by inch -- and inextricably lowering our body's ability to fight off disease. Which accelerates the natural aging process and is why there seems to be so many ''young'' middle-aged people who can look like like death walking.

So you have to change all that too. EDC's are probably the worst. They get so close to us from direct use and consumption by ingestion, and application onto our bodies in the form of personal care products that most think that they are benign. Safe. Nothing could be further from the truth. Which why agencies like the FDA and CDC and EPA are essentially useless to us. They work for others. Not us.

One has to decide how far one can go. Obviously, living an unprocessed life can be more expensive and/or time-consuming. And we Americans love the idea of popping pills or shooting magic bullets to fix our problems.

- That's the lie we've been led to believe in. And it's killing us......

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