Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

markpkessinger

(8,401 posts)
Thu Dec 19, 2013, 12:25 PM Dec 2013

A friend, a former Libertarian, realizes he's become a liberal

So there's this guy I know on Facebook -- we met through mutual Facebook acquaintances -- who I met a couple of years ago. Younger guy, early 30s, father of two young children, lives in the same Pennsylvania county in which I grew up. Like me, he posts a lot of political commentary. Unlike me, he was self-identified as a libertarian (albeit not a fan of the Ron and Rand Paul pseudo-Libertarian cult). But we have often found areas of substantial agreement, and often commented on one another's postings. On issues of civil liberties, LGBT issues and issues of racial injustice, we were typically in complete agreement. He is a pretty outspoken atheist, having grown up as the son of a fundamentalist pastor and having at one time embraced his father's ultraconservative religious worldview, but having come to view such views as emotionally and psychologically toxic based on his own life's journey. But when it came to issues of economics, he was still more inclined to a more conservative, libertarian point of view (but, refreshingly, never dogmatically so).

From when we first became acquainted, however, I noticed a difference between him and most others who don the "libertarian" mantle. The thing that struck me about him initially was his willingness to grapple with issues and engage in civil argument in a consistently honest way, at times calling out some of his much more extreme libertarian acquaintances on the absurdity of some of their arguments. He was certainly atypical in that his thinking was far more complex and nuanced than anybody I've ever met who called himself or herself a libertarian. Thus, even when we disagreed, I enjoyed my exchanges with him. During the earlier stages of the 2012 campaign, he urged me to look at Gary Bauer's website. I did. I reported back to him that while I appreciated some of Bauer's stances on social issues, when it came to economics, I saw little daylight between him and any of the Republican candidates. He conceded I had a point.

More recently, I've noticed an increasing tone of compassion -- and passion -- in his posts. Increasingly, I've notice a greater and greater concern for issues of social and economic justice, a greater level of criticism directed at the assumptions of capitalism that too often go unchallenged, and a growing, profound concern for the kind of planet his children will grow up in. And I noticed he was departing from the views of some of his libertarian acquaintances more and more sharply and with greater frequency. I had a pretty good idea that his politics were evolving. Then, the other night, I logged onto Facebook to find this status update from him (which I share with his permission):

Well, I went and did it. After all those warnings from conservatives like Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity, I got in touch with my liberal bleeding heart. It was a little rough at first weeding out all those political cobwebs in my mind that I had let take up residence because of my background both culturally and demographically, but I managed.

What I have discovered in my transition from christian conservative to atheist devil worshiping liberal is that the difference between liberalism and conservatism on a psychological level is the level of empathy involved in decision making. Conservatives, like the religion of their heritage, prefer to govern by arbitrary rules set into motion by other men but codified as an objective standard for our society both politically and morally.

Liberals, on the other hand, realize that even those standards were subjective and the only true guide to policy is how it impacts our fellow human beings. The criticism of conservatives is often targeted at this quality which is humanity's only true moral compass: empathy.

Conservatives and many Americans who agree with them on economic issues, tell us we need to have an emotional dissonance with policy regarding the markets. They see this as an element that would interfere with the market and our economy...well, that's what they say, anyway. What is really happening is we are divorcing our moral compass from our economy, from our justice system, and from nearly every aspect of our government.

And we wonder why things are so corrupt? What do you expect when you detach the source of your morality as a species from the execution of its governmental actions toward one another? How could we ever expect anything less than the devaluation of our humanity for immoral gain and greed when we shut out the only barometer we have for judging right and wrong actions?

Could we really be this emotionally ignorant of not only ourselves, but the Hell we are creating for our fellow human beings? As someone who has wandered over from the other side, I have to say, yes, we most certainly are.


What a joy, and how utterly gratifying, to watch a friend so completely and thoroughly "get it," as this friend has! Privately, he told me that our conversations had been "a comforting respite from the debates with my now former libertarian colleagues." That made me feel really good. And the whole thing has served as a reminder to me of how important it can be to maintain civil dialogue, even with those whose politics seems to be very different from our own, whenever possible, because it might just be the case that the person is, much like my friend, in the process of evolving.
7 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
A friend, a former Libertarian, realizes he's become a liberal (Original Post) markpkessinger Dec 2013 OP
One voter at a time! bullwinkle428 Dec 2013 #1
Indeed -- but I shouid add . . . markpkessinger Dec 2013 #2
It's very rare to see this level of in-depth self/society analysis anywhere, let alone on Facebook. Arugula Latte Dec 2013 #3
Rare indeed! markpkessinger Dec 2013 #4
I made that transition myself. denverbill Dec 2013 #5
A Libertarian who can do his thinking in a logical manner will soon come to realize that taking Ikonoklast Dec 2013 #6
The non-Randist libertarians do have useful things to contribute starroute Dec 2013 #7

markpkessinger

(8,401 posts)
2. Indeed -- but I shouid add . . .
Thu Dec 19, 2013, 12:34 PM
Dec 2013

. . . that he is not ready to join the Democratic party. He has some very serious (and in my view very legitimate) criticisms of the two-party system. But just seeing someone shed all that right-wing baggage is itself a gratifying thing!

 

Arugula Latte

(50,566 posts)
3. It's very rare to see this level of in-depth self/society analysis anywhere, let alone on Facebook.
Thu Dec 19, 2013, 12:39 PM
Dec 2013

Good for him.

denverbill

(11,489 posts)
5. I made that transition myself.
Thu Dec 19, 2013, 12:47 PM
Dec 2013

I was a dyed-in-the-wool libertarian in my mid-twenties after reading Atlas Shrugged.

Anyone who actually takes the time to examine how libertarian would actually work in the real world should eventually grow out of it, unless they are complete amoral asswipes.

Ikonoklast

(23,973 posts)
6. A Libertarian who can do his thinking in a logical manner will soon come to realize that taking
Thu Dec 19, 2013, 12:59 PM
Dec 2013

care of the least among us in society, seeing that they, too can get offered an opportunity to take advantage of, make for themselves a better life and become a contributing member of society, no matter in how small a manner, is not only better for the individual getting that help but benefits ALL members of our society because the return and that small investment reaps huge rewards for everyone, even Libertarians.


It would seem your friend has used logic in coming to a rational decision.

starroute

(12,977 posts)
7. The non-Randist libertarians do have useful things to contribute
Thu Dec 19, 2013, 01:46 PM
Dec 2013

A focus on small business and entrepreneurship isn't a bad thing -- as long as you don't use it to promote giant corporate monopolies.

A skepticism about rushing to enact new government programs and regulations as the solution to every social ill can be a reminder of where our priorities should lie -- as long as it isn't used as an excuse for doing nothing or privatizing the commons.

An insistence that freedom sometimes trumps security is refreshing -- as long as you apply it to NSA surveillance and not to little old ladies trying to survive on Social Security.

Libertarianism has become a shield for the 1% to hide behind, but if it's wrested out of the hands of the corporatists, and given a healthy dose of altruism to cancel out its innate self-centeredness, it can be a good balance for the occasional statist tendencies of some so-called liberals.

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»A friend, a former Libert...