Student Fires AR-15 Mounted on Chino Police Motorcycle, Injuring 3

[Arkansas Granny]

http://ktla.com/2013/10/23/3-students-hurt-when-cops-gun-discharges-at-school-safety-demo/#axzz2ieWr9h8W

Two students were taken to local hospitals Wednesday after a student fired a police rifle during an officer’s drug-awareness presentation at a Chino elementary school, authorities said.

A student pulled the trigger on an AR-15 that was mounted on a police motorcycle that was on display during an event for students, according to Tamrin Olden, a spokeswoman for the Chino Police Department.

“The rifle was…secured in the mount on the motorcycle during the incident,” Olden said at an evening news conference. “The child did approach the mounted rifle.”

Two students were taken to local hospitals for minor injuries after the 11:14 a.m. incident, Olden said.


More at link.

WTF! I don't know anything else to say

[Aristus]

1. Yeah, it's a good thing the police are well-trained and responsible enough to prevent

misuse and mishandling by civilians...

[seveneyes]

2. Some feel that only the police should carry weapons

Here's one more, soon to be forgotten negative against such feelings.

[Eleanors38]

3. Sounds like the officer left a round chambered with safety "off."

The 15-yr-old is most likely unschooled in gun safety. The LEO in this situation has a lot of explaining to do.

[IveWornAHundredPants]

6. To whom?

The world is a dangerous place. I'm not sure you really appreciate that. The time it takes to prepare the gun for firing might have meant life or death in a sudden lawbreaking situation at that school. The risk and the injuries sustained by the students (MINOR injuries!) are simply the price we pay for this necessary vigilance.

[trumad]

8. Really?

Loaded AR 15 in a school.... and you defend this?

[kcr]

12. Are you serious?

You have to be joking.

[IveWornAHundredPants]

15. Well, not joking, but not exactly serious either.

I sometimes try to channel the thoughts of the gun-loving folk - to walk a mile in the other fellow's moccasins, so to speak. I myself dislike guns, can't understand the appeal at all, and am completely mind-boggled that such a rifle should be anywhere near a school, much less ready to fire.

[kcr]

16. Okay. I thought it sounded like that, but you can never be too sure on the internet

[FLyellowdog]

30. Use the smilies as needed.

Such as " ".

[Bandit]

13. Republican Mantra......Be Afraid, Be Very Afraid..

I am not afraid and I do not carry a weapon, let alone one that is locked and loaded..

[Eleanors38]

24. I was unaware of the great amount of time to chamber a round & release the safety.

How long does it take?

[IveWornAHundredPants]

26. As a popgun enthusiast, this is something you should know.

Remedial gunsmanship courses are available in your state and or township.

[Eleanors38]

37. How long does it take to chamber a popgun, and release its safety?

Any faster than an AR-15? I am unaware of "gunmanship" courses for popguns. From your experience, which are the best ones?

[IveWornAHundredPants]

42. Terry Dunlap Sr. of Lancaster, Ohio, offers a pretty good one.

Or, if you live in Van Zandt County, Texas, you might try Jim Lynch of Tactical and Defensive Texas. There's Fred Peterson in Winona, MN, and Eugene Kenny in New Haven, Connecticut. No doubt there is equally enlightening instruction available all over the country.

[Half-Century Man]

76. Time to load and fire an AR15

If you leave the magazine out, safety off, and have the bolt locked in the open position, you can insert a mag and hit the bolt release in about 5 seconds.
If you have the magazine out, the safety on, and the bolt closed; you have to insert the magazine, manually cycle the bolt, and flip the safety to fire, so about 10 secs
To get the rifle out of any the locked rigs I have seen on motorcycles, maybe 15 secs, if you have the key.

[Eleanors38]

90. Sounds about right.

[NickB79]

82. AR-15's have a bolt release tab on the side

So, you can have a full mag in the weapon, but the bolt locked back.

It takes less than a second to hit that release with your index finger, not even requiring you to take your hand off the gun, let the bolt slam forward, and you're ready to go.

That loud "click" you hear after he loads a new magazine right around 0:14 was the bolt release letting go and chambering a round.

[Eleanors38]

91. Thanks for the video. Appears quicker than a popgun!

[nadinbrzezinski]

44. Yup. It should have been unloaded actually.

[Eleanors38]

46. I think so as well, given the purpose of this gathering.

[NoGOPZone]

74. it sounds like the officer is the one who is unschooled in gun safety. nt

[Blue_Tires]

4. So some cop left a weapon with live ammo

mounted on an event display???

[aikoaiko]

5. They secured their AR15s on the bikes poorly.

[Historic NY]

7. Lots of different mounts...

but I still think its crazy. Some better than others. I wonder which type it was?

[Taverner]

9. And you ask us why we want to stop guns instead of "bad guys"

Here is someone who probably had more firearms training than ANYONE here on DU.

[Lizzie Poppet]

21. More training? Not necessarily.

The average police officer (not a SWAT member or suchlike) will receive solid but still pretty basic training in shooting and firearms security in their academy. After that, they may not get anything but the occasional refresher and their once or twice a year qualifying. Compared to any reasonably serious shooter (and there are many on DU, myself included), that's nothing.

Incidents like that aren't a matter of amount or degree of training. To do something like that idiot did violates basic safety and security principles you learn on the very first day of any firearms training course. More advanced training isn't going to be about basic firearms security...that's 101 stuff.

[Ranchemp.]

22. You think police, other than SWAT, get a lot of firearms training?

You couldn't be more wrong, most cops only fire their weapons once or twice a year for their annual qualification, otherwise, the gun usually stays in the holster or the shotgun stays in the mount.

[Taverner]

50. My dad was a 25 year vetran of the SJPD

He knew his way around a gun. Most big cities train their cadets to know their weapons.

That being said, accidental shootings were not uncommon

One guy blew a hole in the ground inches from his foot by re-holstering his gun wrong

This was a seasoned officer

[Packerowner740]

10. What the hell is the police dept doing with motorcycle mounted AR15s

And why the hell were they loaded on display?

Insanity!

[Hoyt]

14. Trying to outgun all yahoos stocking up on assault-type weapons, and participating in "militias"

and hate groups.

Not saying it's right.

[Packerowner740]

17. But loaded on a motorcycle on display?

That's not irresponsible, it's insane.

Maybe we need to go the way of Great Britain and disarm most of our police.

[Hoyt]

18. I think we'd need to disarm the gun cultists first.

I agree the gun on a motorcycle at an event is really dumb. Then again, so is allowing a gun in someone's pants standing in line at Chuck E Cheese.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

19. "I think we'd need to disarm the gun cultists first."

How? You're unarmed.

[Hoyt]

20. You mean you'd hide your gunz if we changed our laws like Australia and all other civilized nations?

My experience is the gun culture is law-abiding only as long as it suits them, and protects their gunz.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

23. "My experience" You mispelled 'hallucinations'

law-abiding only as long as it suits them,

Let me guess, you're such a fan of "the law" that if a woman shot a rapist/stalker you would howl for her to be locked away for the maximum sentence allowed by "the law" you want.

[Hoyt]

25. Are you a woman protecting herself against rapists? Your pro-gun posts don't sound like it.

Truthfully, if most gun cultists acted like women "afraid of rapists," we wouldn't have a gunz problem.

They usually own one gun, don't use them like the Zimmermans or cowboys, don't get all giddy over assault weapons, etc. They don't love their assault rifles, or practice shooting human targets at long distances in case they get a chance to play sniper. They don't brag about being set up to "clear a room," or tell us about their favorite guns for shooting people fleeing a hurricane, as happens in the Gungeon. Nor do they cheer every time a gun owner buys a new gun, shoots someone rummaging around in their carport, etc.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

33. But you wuld still have her locked up under the laws you champion.

[Hoyt]

34. Is that the best you've got?

[Nuclear Unicorn]

35. It's the truth and you know you can't/won't refute it.

[Hoyt]

39. You are the one that used a false premise to rationalize your love/promotion of gunz.

You were called on it and changed the topic.

But no, I would not call for her to be sentenced. But, that is different from typical gun lovers -- like Zimmerman -- walking around with a gun or two strapped to their bodies, ready to shoot an unarmed teenager. It is also different from those who own multiple weapons, carry them in public, practice shooting targets that resemble humans, promote them, support NRA backed laws (either as a member or, free-rider), applaud more gun sales and laxer gun laws, etc.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

43. Please, tell us you under what conditions you would permit guns for self-defense.

[Hoyt]

47. It's your turn. How many guns do you own, do you carry in public, including cities.

Are you an NRA member, or cheer when they get some lax law enacted by bribing legislators or threatening them?

Do you think bullies like Zimmerman are murderers or intimidators?

Do you think mass shootings, kids shooting themselves/others with daddy's precious, bullies carrying guns, bigots arming up, guns being stolen from folks like US Representative Ellmers, and worse, are just the price we have to pay so yahoos can walk around with guns in our society and amass a weapons cache?

[Nuclear Unicorn]

54. In my home we have more than 2 guns but fewer than 10

I do not carry, open or concealed, but I support the right of free people to do so at their discretion.

I am not a member of the NRA.

There are no bribes or threats. You just want to criminalize dissenting speech.

You only name Zimmerman because you want to falsely associate all gun owners. There are laws against murder. There are laws defining self-defense. You don't care 1 iota for the deceased. Martin and the rest are just puppet show props for you. If the body count ever slowed it'd be the worse day for your because you wouldn't have a reason to try and control others. You need the dead bodies more than the mass killers do because without them you have nothing.

Your every complaint about the price to pay for gun ownership can be applied alcohol. Every self-destructive, violent or health issue you can name about guns can be said of the alcohol only alcohol harms more people by orders of magnitude. However, alcohol has no use except a recreational one. Guns, on the other hand, are necessary for free people to defend themselves from criminals and people who would deprive them of their basic human rights. I understand you have an extreme phobia. That's your problem. Free people are still free people. You have to accept that.

I answered 6 of your questions. How about you show some spine and answer my 1 question.

[Hoyt]

55. I think one gun at home is enough, maybe one too many.

You really didn't answer my questions with anything other than right wing "freedom" bull.

Actually, I am not "afraid" of your gunz -- been around them, and the yahoos that love them, all my life. But, I did grow up.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

56. Well, at least you're brave enough to admit you despise freedom

We've always known this and your sort have always existed and will always exist.

[Hoyt]

57. Definitely bigoted toward gunz and the harm they cause our society.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

58. Oh, yeah, you're a real caring sort. You're just one big cuddly bundle of love.

[Hoyt]

59. Says the man who is not even sure how many gunz he owns.

Guns are not quite the same as illness, etc. But never underestimate the lengths gun cultists will go to protect their gunz.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

61. "Says the man"

My goodness but you are one big jumble of confusions and erroneous preconceptions.

[libdem4life]

11. Just another good guy with a loaded gun, safety off, in public, around children and inappropriately

attended. What could go wrong?

[Eleanors38]

27. Some want to disarm LEOs. Is that your position?

[libdem4life]

29. Uh, no. Please reread the post.

[Eleanors38]

36. Good. Then police are indeed "good guys."

[libdem4life]

40. Huh? LEOs carry guns. Check. LOEs don't leave them loaded and unattended with the

safety off at an elementary school. Not likely going to be a school shooting during their presence there. It was terrible judgment on the cops part.

I've been a teacher when the Police came (for sharing time) or we would go to the Police station. It's a big thrill for all involved. Letting little kids get in the Fire Engine, they loved to get in the cab and control the flashers, but the truck wouldn't be running where an accidental shift of the gears or something could propel it out into the street.

Same inside a patrol car, getting "in touch" is part of the whole idea. Never would they allow a child to even touch a hand weapon. Here, it was that drugs are bad and here's what can happen, etc. Cops are your friends when you behave and can protect you when in trouble...that is the message. I'm sure he was proudly showing off their new technology and unlike a hand weapon, it couldn't be holstered.

When someone is robbing my house or my bank or my convenience store, I expect those officers to come fast and packing heat. Again, it was clearly a mistake and great that no one was seriously injured.

We know plenty of good cop/bad cop stories which is not under discussion. These were good guys this day, but one made an error...they are also human. Don't know why that's so hard to grasp.

[Eleanors38]

48. I guess it was that NRA TalkingPoint about "Good Guys" with guns.

Thanks for your clarification.

[libdem4life]

49. Point taken...it was a kind of an unintended use of a meme.

[Eleanors38]

60. No problem. I don't think this officer did a "good" thing, and he/she

needs to answer for it.

[kestrel91316]

53. We all need to support the disarming of stupid, irresponsible LEOs -

by firing them and prohibiting their possessing guns in future.

[Jackpine Radical]

28. The best answer to good guys with guns is

bad guys with guns…

Oh, wait, that doesn't make any sense…

The answer is more good guys with more guns…

maybe good guys with hand grenades…

flame throwers?

Uh…

[jberryhill]

31. Crowbars

[hatrack]

63. Is it just me, or does that dude look kind of like Walter White?

[AnotherMcIntosh]

32. "Similar rifles have removed from other motorcycles used by the police department pending a

continuing investigation".

Since none of the students turned a key to start up the motorcycle, the cop must have had the good sense to remove it before putting the motorcycle on display.

Maybe it would have helped to clear the chamber before putting the AR-15 with the motorcycle on display. And maybe it would have helped further to have removed the ammo.

Now they are going to remove the AR-15s from the motorcycles? At a minimum, they should do that when showing off their toys to naturally curious teenagers.

[ileus]

41. I recommend taking the firing pin out of the BCG

When doing these types of events. Or at the very least locking the bolt back without a mag in place.

[dairydog91]

64. How often does a cop at an elementary school need a locked and loaded rifle?

Storing it with the magazine removed and no round in the chamber would be a basic safety measure, and he could have loaded the weapon in less than 5 seconds had he somehow encountered a need for it.

[Savannahmann]

45. You know, Cops are trained for these school demonstrations.

Like this.

He's the only one professional enough to carry a Glock 40.

[kestrel91316]

51. There's that Responsible Gun Owner (TM) thing again.........

[kestrel91316]

52. I assume it's perfectly normal for police to take a loaded assault weapon to show-and-tell

these days. I had no idea. I'm gonna have to get up to speed.

[Jenoch]

62. I just read this entire thread and nobody

made a point to say how stupid the kid was who pulled the trigger on that weapon.

This story just proves the point that all youth should have some gun safety training.

Of course the gun should not have had a round in the chamber. The idiot student should have been smart enough to NOT pull the trigger.

[Lars39]

65. Kids that age still have to be told to wash their hands.

The idiot is the adult who took the weapon to a school.

[Paladin]

66. Said gun safety training to be provided by...Eddie Eagle, perhaps?

Nothing like injecting the NRA into the nation's school systems with a cute cartoon figure leading the way. No thanks.

And spare us the predictable blame-the-victim diversionary tactic, OK? The police bring a loaded firearm into a situation involving kids, and you want to shift the blame to the kids? Of course kids are stupid, they're kids. The police should bear full responsibility for this, and heads should roll, career-wise.

[Jenoch]

67. Of course the cop is to blame,

but so is the kid. I knew enough as a 15 year old to NOT pull the trigger of a gun that was unattended. I never mentioned the NRA in my post, why did mention the NRA in your post? I had gun safety training as a youth and the NRA was not a part of it.

Wait a minute, the kid who pulled the trigger is a victim? He committed a crime, he's not a victim.

[Hoyt]

80. I agree that last thing we should be subjecting young kids to is NRA type propaganda/BS.

[Logical]

68. LOL, really? Gun training for kids? A priority? nt

[Jenoch]

69. I didn't write priority,

but now that you mention it, I agree.

[Paladin]

71. And I'm sure our school systems, awash in excess cash, will do your bidding.

Sarcasm alert, because it's always needed on gun threads.

[Logical]

73. The posters needs it explained simple! Good post! nt

[Paladin]

75. My pleasure, as always. (nt)

[Jenoch]

77. I never mentioned school either.

The school system had nothing to do with the gun safety training program I went through.

[Paladin]

79. Tell you what: let's just pretend you never posted anything in this thread at all.

You're welcome, and....don't mention it.

[Jenoch]

81. That is your prerogative.

You're welcome, and....don't mention it.

[Logical]

72. Chain saw safety? Ladder safety? nt

[Jenoch]

78. You certainly live up to your user name.

I think anyone using a chainsaw and/or a ladder should know how to safely use those items.

[Logical]

85. Wait, now you only think kids that USE guns need training! Nt

[Jenoch]

87. Where did I write that?

I think all youth should go through gun safety training. I don't know how old the kid was in this story, probably too young for a thorough gun safety training course, but not too young to be taught to keep his/her hands off guns. I believe everyone should know about gun safety.

There are a lot of 'accidental' gun deaths because people don't know enough about gun safety. There are too many gun deaths because somebody thought a semi-auto gun was unloaded because the magazine was removed.

[Logical]

89. You really are not making any sense....

"I think anyone USING a chainsaw and/or a ladder should know how to safely use those items."

So you think kids using a ladder needs training but kids who never plan on using a gun needs gun safety training?

Look up accidental death causes by type and let me know if you really want to spend time on gun safety. Then you will realize why your suggestion is silly.

There are much better more useful things to teach children.

[Jenoch]

92. Of course anyone using a chainsaw or a ladder need to know the safety issues involved.

I think every kid should be told to stay away from chainsaws, and ladders without supervision.

Now, let's leave the chainsaws and ladders behind and speak about the topic of this thread...

Whether or not anyone plans on shooting a gun or not, they should know something about guns and gun safety. I was smart enough in grade school so that I would not have done what this kid did. This kid should have gun safety training when he is 12 years old. As he grows older he might find himself in a situation where someone is handling a gun and he will know what not to do and what to do. Just because I said everyone should be trained in gun safety does not mean they should not be taught anything else. Why would you assume such a ridiculous position?

[Logical]

93. There are much more important topics to spend timew on. I give up. n-t

[Jenoch]

94. If there are more important topics,

then why did you even read this thread?

[Blue_Tires]

83. You never did anything really dumb/dangerous at elementary age?

[Jenoch]

84. I never did anything remotley similar to this.

When I was that age, the guns in our home were hanging on the wall, but they were locked with a chain going through the trigger guards. It was not for protection against theft. It was to let our friends know that they could not touch the guns. We already knew that because we knew what our father would have to say if we touched the guns.

[Glassunion]

70. For the gun nerds

1. This officer had a chambered round in that AR. Assuming that picture of the rifle on the bike is similar to the mounting of the one that was fired. If there was not a round chambered the charging handle could not have been manipulated with the bracket holding the firearm placed where it was. The student would have been unable to chamber a round if that was the case.
2. The safety could have been on. The student may have disengaged the safety as the mount that the firearm was in, does not seem to block the safety from moving. It is a small lever on the left-hand side slightly above and forward of the grip.
3. It is very unwise to transport an AR-15 with a chambered round. Even with the safety on, the firing pin floats freely. So in an impact the firing pin can strike the primer and discharge the chambered round without the trigger being pulled and while the safety is on.
4. Cop was dumb.
5. Cop was really dumb.
6. Have I mentioned the intelligence of the officer?

[Jesus Malverde]

86. Seeing more and more of these motorcycle cops with machine guns.

[MadAndy]

88. Wondering why cops are suddenly so afraid

to be more than 1 car length from a semi/full auto rifle? They have body armor, high cap pistols, backup, etc. WTF do we have? If they need them so badly maybe we do too. In any case what kind of stupid mount doesnt have the trigger guard completely enclosed?