Cheap shot, Hillary.

[RandySF]

Hillary just reminded me one reason I did not support her in the 2008 primary. Vice President Biden gave his honest, forthright advice base on the information they we presented which, IIRC, reported only a 40% likelihood that Bin Laden was in the compound. And I admire Biden for his honesty as much as I admire the president for having the cuts to make the call.



"Former U.S. secretary of state Hillary Clinton was in town today. A few Secret Squirrels, and some not so secret, agreed to be our sources, given that her speech to the National Association of Convenience Stores was encapsulated by a cone of silence. Convention officials banned all video and sound recording, social media, and naturally, journalists.

No ears reported any mention of whatever 2016 ambitions Clinton might have. But state Rep. Tom Taylor, R-Dunwoody, said the former first lady dropped a huge hint. "I know she’s running for president now, because toward the end, she was asked about the Osama bin Laden raid. She took 25 minutes to answer," Taylor said. "Without turning the knife too deeply, she put it to [Vice President Joe] Biden."

Time and time again, Taylor said, Clinton mentioned the vice president's opposition to the raid, while characterizing herself and Leon Panetta, then director of the Central Intelligence Agency, as the action's most fierce advocates.

About 3,000 to 4,000 convention-goers packed the Thomas Murphy Ballroom in the Georgia World Congress Center to hear Clinton. The bin Laden query was the last of a Q-and-A session with the audience. "She took the rest of the time and went over, answering that question. She was ready to speak on that," Taylor said."


http://www.ajc.com/weblogs/political-insider/2013/oct/15/hearsay-hillary-clinton-theres-more-life-slim-jims/

[elleng]

1. ditto

[tularetom]

2. Very disappointing

She's still trying to suck up to the neocons and that's one reason I won't vote for her in a primary. I hope she wises up before 2016.

[monmouth3]

30. She is still very petty, I won't vote for her either..n/t

[DURHAM D]

3. What's the problem?

This is old news re: Biden.

[Flying Squirrel]

28. There's no such thing as old news during a primary n/t

[TwilightGardener]

4. Any coincidence that Leon Panetta was taking cheap shots at the administration yesterday?

Comparing Obama's shutdown to Bill Clinton's shutdown and saying that Obama wasn't showing leadership? Those Clintonites will stick together, won't they?

[freshwest]

24. Disgusting. GOP trying to eviscerate the country and this woebegotten shit gets airtime. *boo, hiss*

[Cha]

29. I don't know but one DUer gave ol Leon the

"douchebag" of the day award. It was a stupid thing to say.. it showed he had no clue what kind of terrorist assholes PBO is dealing with.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=3848733

[LittleBlue]

5. Her nastiness is showing again

I still remember her campaign's race-based attacks during the 2008 primary, and Bill's "carrying our bags" comment.

Wait until the primaries, it's only going to get worse.

[Tx4obama]

6. She was asked a question and she answered it. It is old news that Biden did not support the raid

January 30, 2012

Joe Biden Advised Against the Osama Bin Laden Raid
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/01/joe-biden-advised-against-the-osama-bin-laden-raid/

January 20, 2012

Joe Biden Opposed Osama Bin Laden Raid (VIDEO)
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/01/30/joe-biden-advised-against-bin-laden-raid_n_1242702.html

And tons more articles on the net about it last year

[quinnox]

7. Biden would be 74 years old if he ran for president

and took office, so I really doubt this was some kind of political shot from Hillary. That is a stretch. Biden is not going to run for president IMHO.

[RandySF]

8. But she belabored the point.

And used the VP as a punching bag to show how "tough" she is.

[dsc]

9. how dare that bitch take credit for a position she has

the utter nerve of her to answer a question honestly and truthfully.

[rhett o rick]

15. So I take it you dont want someone more progressive than Ms. Clinton?

You want 8 more years with the wealth gap widening.

[Volaris]

27. What's the possibility that after the last election, and the last (then, 8 years)

that she has learned not to dismiss the concerns and desires of the Democratic Party BASE?
THIS is the question that I will be looking for an answer to in the next round of primaries. If I'm not convinced, then yeah, I'll vote for someone else. But I'm not opposed to her just because.

[rhett o rick]

44. I would say the possibility is near zero that she has changed. IMO the Powers To Be

decided to back BO thinking he would be easier to run out of office in 4 years. This time around, IMO, the big money will be Ms. Clinton's. The Powers To Be want to keep a progressive candidate out.

Wall Street will be ok with 8 more years of what we have now, but can the middle class survive?

[dsc]

43. I have no opinion on her candidacy

but I think she has every earthly right to say I helped capture Osama.

[rhett o rick]

46. You dont have an opinion on her candidacy? nm

[dsc]

50. With no idea of what the other choices are how can I

[rhett o rick]

54. So you are saying that your opinion of her varies with who she will be

running against?

[dsc]

60. yes

one would hope it would. I would certainly vote for her over Cuomo and likely not over OMalley to give to examples.

[HappyMe]

48. Sure.

But we have a lot more important things to worry about now.

[AtomicKitten]

88. "I helped capture Osama" ---

Right. Plus she did it under sniper fire while she was creating peace in Ireland.

[dsc]

89. Yes she most certainly did

unless of course you feel Obama deserves no credit either, can't have it both ways.

[AtomicKitten]

90. you're forgetting something

He's the president and she's 1 voice among many that were queried that day. I doubt she broke a sweat answering "yeah war!" when asked.

[dsc]

92. whatever

you are nothing but a hypocrite. Yes he made the final decision after accepting her advice but she had nothing at all to do with it, but lets be blunt, had the positions been reversed you would be arguing that it was all sec of state Obama and none her.

[AtomicKitten]

93. you funny

It was the president's decision and his alone. It wasn't a vote. Her tenure as SOS was confined to flying around gladhanding, stupid shit like the Russian reset button, and pushing the TPP. More serious and capable people handled Afghanistan, Iraq, and the ME in general. SOS Kerry was trusted with that authority and hit the ground running.

Finally, not being honest about supporting HRC when it's so effing obvious is the very essence of hypocrisy and you're soaking in it.

[dsc]

94. I have no idea who I am voting for in 2016

and frankly no thinking person who isn't employed by a potential presidential candidate should. Tell me what the issue will be, tell me who is running, tell me what has happened in the meantime, tell me all of that, and then I can tell you who I will support. In 02, no way, no how I would have told you I would support a little known governor of Vermont. In 06, I wouldn't have told you I would support Hillary, I started with Richardson, then Biden, then Edwards, and finally Hillary. Now, I have two I won't vote for, Switzer and Cuomo. Otherwise, I haven't made up my mind. I like O'Malley but who knows what his foreign policy would be. I sure don't.

[Th1onein]

13. You're right. It's dirty. I don't like Hillary and I will NOT vote for her.

I hope she loses the primary again, and if she doesn't, I will write in a vote for someone else.

[NCTraveler]

71. "belabored the point"

If you were in a room with her wouldn't you like to hear an insider talk for 20 minutes about one of the most historical events of our lifetime? You say she used the VP as a "punching bag". Please show me where you got that information from. It is not in the article or backed up any where in this thread.

[Beacool]

82. And you know that how, because you posted what a Republican said happened at an event?

Did it ever occur to you that maybe it didn't happen as it was told to the newspaper?

Of course not, it was just another chance to take a swipe at Hillary, right?

[davidpdx]

10. I think in that instance someone had to stand up and voice a dissenting opinion

We don't want the president completely surrounded with "yes" people. President Obama asked each person their opinion and got it. It was important for someone to give that POV. He may have not been right in a sense, but he was right to make his view heard.

[elleng]

26. Of course,

but no need for her to mention it now.

[davidpdx]

40. I wasn't defending the comment

Just saying that Obama is right to have people around him who aren't afraid to give a dissenting opinion.

[elleng]

66. Absolutely, that makes REAL leaders.

[BainsBane]

11. Politics is hardball

She's sticking it to her most likely rival for the nomination for President, not head of the PTA.

[Ikonoklast]

57. And that is why she will not be the nominee. Her strategy is faulty.

The Clitonistas are all getting old and losing their political influence in a party currently skewing much younger...the next Democratic nominee won't even be from her generation.

[BainsBane]

67. Oh, she's too old

and too assertive. Women are't supposed to be like that. They should stay in their place. And God forbid they age.

[Ikonoklast]

79. You read into that what you wanted.

Read it again.

[RandySF]

91. My elderly parents say she and Biden are BOTH too old. n/t

They are 81 and 75 years old.

[SamYeager]

12. I'm all for Hillary.

Had Barack Obama not thrown his hat in the ring, I'd have been a Hillary supporter from the beginning in 2008.

GO HILLARY!

[Nye Bevan]

14. Nah. A "cheap shot" would be to say something mean about Biden's hair plugs.

In this case, she was asked about her role in the operation, and she answered the question. She deserves credit for pushing for it in the face of Biden's opposition. I hope my daughters grow up to have this kind of assertiveness and self-confidence.

[flamingdem]

16. If Hillary runs Biden will not

All parties are aware of this so I think this was a misreading.

[AtomicKitten]

19. Biden has his eye on the White House.

And having served 8 years as VP, that is most certainly his prerogative. Sounds like Clinton is already litigating the 2016 primary. I hope Joe's wearing a cup because she's already set the precedent of doing it ugly.

Confident Biden Team Sows Seeds For 2016
Political allies of Vice President Joe Biden have concluded that he can win the 2016 Democratic presidential nomination—even if Hillary Clinton enters the contest—and are considering steps he could take to prepare for a potential candidacy.

While Mr. Biden has made no decision about his future, people familiar with his thinking say, he hasn't ruled out a bid for the White House. If he runs, that could set up a titanic battle between two of the party's most prominent figures.

more at link: http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424127887323423804579020781151204004

[flamingdem]

20. Yes, I have bones to pick with her

and learned about her hawkish ways, especially in Latin America, Honduras, Cuba. However I'll support her enthusiastically since she can win, and will be pretty good at terrorizing Republicans. I love Joe more but think the deal is already set. At least I read that he won't run if she does, we shall see!

[MADem]

25. Biden will not stand in the way of history, and HRC will make history if she runs.

Biden might want to be Secretary of State, though--John Kerry was not the only one in the Senate who really lusted after that job. In fact, some say Biden would have preferred it, in some ways, to VP.

[AtomicKitten]

56. So, was he "standing in the way of history" in 2008?

Nope. He had every right to run then and now. In fact, as sitting VP (x8 years by then), it is Biden's baked-in privilege to run in 2016. It is she who should be deferring to him, not the other way around.

[MADem]

69. He was running for (pick one) Vice President or Secretary of State. He "won," as it were.

You DO realize that not everyone who "runs" for President actually expects to win?

Some run in the hopes of achieving a consolation prize.

Bill Richardson was running for VP/SECSTATE too--he didn't get either.

[AtomicKitten]

73. In your quest to discount a 2016 Biden candidacy,

... you forget he has always been upfront about wanting to be president, and he's in the enviable catbird seat now.

With an eye toward Elizabeth Warren, I don't necessarily support Biden in that endeavor, but I will stand up to the Clintonsphere donning big shoes to bully other possible contenders.

[MADem]

74. He's always been upfront about wanting to be SECSTATE, too.

But his wife didn't want him gone so much--as she told Oprah.

And Elizabeth Warren has not expressed interest in either office, in fact, she's denied any interest in national office.

The people who "adore" my Senator because they don't know her would probably move to the Warren-hating camp as soon as they figured out she wasn't as liberal as they believe...but whatever.

I'm not the only one "discounting" a Biden candidacy--the "CW" is so doing, too. Aside from his very real and not easily discounted medical history, he's in Barkley territory at his advanced age:

http://www.npr.org/blogs/politicaljunkie/2013/05/07/181338426/joe-biden-has-history-on-his-side-but-little-else-if-hillary-clinton-runs

[Sparkly]

17. According to a Republican I never heard of...

[regnaD kciN]

18. Please keep in mind that this is an account from a REPUBLICAN politician…

…who would probably like it if it got Democrats split up into "pro-Hillary" and "anti-Hillary" camps.

I'm sure she talked about the ObL raid. Whether the account is accurate is certainly open to question.

[Nye Bevan]

31. Democrats split into pro and anti Hillary camps?

No way. Never gonna happen.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

86. For the primary season? Hell yeah!

there will be blood

[fadedrose]

49. "...if..."? nt

[upi402]

21. Let the mudslinging begin

Or... restart

She is a Republican. Doesn't matter which party she's in.

Board of WalMart... Pro-NAFTA...

We just can't

[darkangel218]

22. Hillary is on the board of Walmart??

wtf..

[darkangel218]

23. Nevermind, i googled it.

She was. From 1986 to 1992.

[DURHAM D]

34. Where her focus was on employment & advancement opportunities for women

and minorities.

But fuck her for trying is the DU attitude.

[darkangel218]

76. I never said that.

[DURHAM D]

85. Sorry, did not mean to imply that you did.

It was aimed at all the trolls who shout "Walmart" over and over.

[Beacool]

83. They don't care about facts.

They are as bad as the Freepers. They hear the name "Clinton" and off they go.

[kelliekat44]

32. Can we please just hammer the GOP right now? We have over a year to attack each other. nt

[ecstatic]

55. +1 nt

[HappyMe]

33. I'll wait until the primary to decide about Hillary.

We have bigger fish to fry right now, and in 2014.

[msanthrope]

35. You swallowed the tale of a Republican politician, hook, line, and sinker. Ill-advised. nt

[TBF]

37. Great response. nt

[TBF]

36. Did we magically transport back to 2008?

Is it primary season again?

Look, the best way to fight against Hillary, if you want to do that (and think about that) is to put up a better candidate. Joe Biden is not that candidate. Elizabeth Warren could potentially be that person, there may be others who are a little younger with more charisma but I don't know if they are ready (Julian Castro is always my pick but he is local here in TX so I'm familiar with him).

But starting up with this now in the middle of a huge debt ceiling issue is probably not very effective.

Just my two cents.

[trumad]

38. Love how some in this Op are taking the word of a Republican from Georgia

[Tom Rinaldo]

39. I think it is perfectly legitimate politics. Nothing petty or nasty about it

Presidential politics isn't like a baseball league for third graders where everyone on the team is supposed to get a chance to bat and it is considered in bad form to run up the score. It is the literal pursuit of national power, people kill each other doing the same in some parts of the world. If her version is accurate it is fair for her to assert it and ultimately she would be a poor candidate for President if she failed to press an honest perceived advantage over anyone positioned as a plausible opponent. No doubt Joe can and will find key choices and policy decisions where the position that he took over one held by Hillary can be showcased to his advantage. That's politics, the classic if you can't stand the heat stay out of the kitchen scenario.

[bigwillq]

41. Hillary will never get my vote.

No more Clintons, please.

[rhett o rick]

42. Citizen United may have a large effect on the coming presidential election. Wouldnt it be ironic

if the Powers To Be decide to back Ms. Clinton for the Democratic nominee? It's a possibility unless they get control of the REpublican Party and get Christie or Jeb, the not so dim Bush in as a nominee.

The Powers To Be will spend a lot to keep progressive candidates out.

[KoKo]

61. Agree...

Making Hillary the inevitable Candidate works for Corporate/Wall Street interests because they know her support and her husband's (the former Pres.)for more Globalization, Unfair to Workers/Consumer's Trade Agreements and Deregulation. And, it's possible that Hillary supports the Dem Centrists /NeoLib view that "Entitlements" need to be reformed.

Then it leaves the fun and attention to the Republicans for the MSM to exploit.

[rhett o rick]

70. "Then it leaves the fun and attention to the Republicans for the MSM to exploit." and use as

a distraction.

The Republicans are acting like Hitler's Brown Shirts. They are flailing about smashing and grabbing and getting all the attention while the corporatists are picking our pockets. I want a viable Republican Party to push the Democratic Party to the left.

[Lex]

45. She's a woman and is supposed to be nice and not mention such things

I guess.

[FSogol]

47. Unrec. A mishmash of Clinton bashing by a rw author.

[okieinpain]

51. after watching these nutty repugs the last couple of

Weeks, the ”im not voting for her” statements are scary.

[uponit7771]

52. ****THE SOURCE IS A REPUBLICAN !!! *******

[B Calm]

53. It figures!

[maddezmom]

58. Not surprising

[joeybee12]

59. Thanks for posting what a Repuke said, hearsay, as gosepl truth...

One of the more pathetic Hilary-hater threads out there.

[Lex]

64. The hysterical Hilary bashing here

truly sucks.

[MADem]

75. Par for the course from some quarters, too, unfortunately.

I like HRC--I think she's the smartest person in the room.

Any room.

[MicaelS]

62. Biden isn't the candidate.

Neither is HRC. So let them go at one another. And in all honesty Biden hasn't impressed me much. I'd vote for HRC over Biden.

[yurbud]

63. the house is burning down and these two idiots are arguing about who chose the wallpaper

[Sancho]

65. I hope Hillary runs...and she was right about the raid.

No candidate is perfect. Obama is certainly better than any GOP president, but he doesn't always do what I prefer.

Hillary's international judgement is very informed and insightful and realistic. Biden has some strengths, but he doesn't have the world view that Hillary has developed over years of travel and working as Secretary of State.

If there is a better candidate then I hope they win, but Hillary bashing is not useful.

Hillary wanted a single-payer healthcare system, which I would like more than the ACA, so I also think she has demonstrated some good domestic thinking.

[NCTraveler]

68. I must not be seeing the problem.

With what we have learned, we know the raid wasn't considered to be a slam dunk. The more hawkish Hillary and Panetta were pushing for it. Biden was more skeptical. I think that shines a positive light on Biden, Hillary, and how a team works together. The article shows absolutely no cheap shots being made at Biden. Those who see one are simply blind.

[PBass]

72. I hope Biden doesn't run, so this doesn't irk me one bit.

I like the job Biden is doing as VP.

But I don't want him to be president, and I don't want a big, messy primary. I want an early Democratic consensus on who our candidate will be, so that they can be campaigning early while the GOP primary race is still in disarray.

[MADem]

77. He's a very likeable fellow, but he wasn't a big vote getter in the times he ran for Prez.

He's a good articulator of the pressing issues of the day, but that doesn't translate to votes.

Plus, he has a documented rather serious medical history, AND he'll be as old as Barkley was when he decided against using his VP cred to launch a Presidential campaign.

The conventional wisdom says that if Clinton wants it, it's hers, and Obama will help her.

[Shampoyeto]

78. Cheap sources, RandySF

The sources are "secret squirrels" (no joke) as the article notes, plus one Republican politician.

But spreading anti-Hillary rumors does not require credible sources. They are, after all, rumors.

[Beacool]

80. You may want to withhold your CDS until you read this:

Did Hillary take a swipe at Biden?

Washington (CNN) – Did Hillary Clinton take a 2016 detour on her supposedly non-political paid speaking circuit?

The Atlanta Journal-Constitution reported Tuesday that Clinton, during her latest paid speaking gig to the National Association of Convenience Stores, spent nearly half an hour discussing the story behind the 2011 Navy SEAL raid on Osama bin Laden's compound in Pakistan, specifically highlighting Vice President Joe Biden's opposition to the mission.

........

But a spokesman for the convenience store group who was in the audience said that account was misleading.

"There are a lot of problems with that story," said Jeff Lenard, a NACS spokesman. "I don't think anybody in the audience came away with that perception or recollection of the speech. It's not an accurate portrayal of what happened yesterday"

Nevertheless, America Rising PAC, a Republican group tracking Clinton's every move, flagged the comments for reporters yesterday, circulating them in an email titled, "Shots Fired: Clinton Attacks Biden Over Bin Laden Raid."

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2013/10/16/did-hillary-take-a-swipe-at-biden/?hpt=hp_t3



Typical DU, no matter how nutty an article about the Clintons may be, rest assured that someone will post it.

Pathetic..........

[Shampoyeto]

81. The original "Derangement Syndrome" was the "Clinton" kind

It hasn't die and it won't any times soon.

[Beacool]

84. The original CDS was mostly directed at Bill.

In 2007-2008 it moved to Hillary. It now refers to both Clintons. Sometimes it even includes Chelsea.

It's really disheartening to read so much crap in a so called Democratic site.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

87. So, she's to the right of Biden ...

... no surprise there.

It would be nice if a president could conduct a brainstorming and advisory meeting where the participants could speak freely without concern their ideas would be made public.