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Ichingcarpenter

(36,988 posts)
Fri Oct 11, 2013, 06:43 AM Oct 2013

Declaration of Causes of Seceding States Georgia Mississippi South Carolina Texas

For once and for all

It wasn't about State's Rights
It was about Slavery in each declaration
in fact they argued against Northern State's right to reject
the fugitive slave laws.


Enough revisionist history.


http://sunsite.utk.edu/civil-war/reasons.html

18 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Declaration of Causes of Seceding States Georgia Mississippi South Carolina Texas (Original Post) Ichingcarpenter Oct 2013 OP
Slavery was the main reason TX wanted independence from Mexico. hobbit709 Oct 2013 #1
Having studied Texas history for a story I'm writing.....it's quite a bit more complex than that. AverageJoe90 Oct 2013 #2
Texas mentions slavery FIRST and FOREMOST for its succession Ichingcarpenter Oct 2013 #3
No mention at all of slavery in the 1836 Texas Declaration of Independence GreenStormCloud Oct 2013 #13
This has nothing to do with my post about succession. Ichingcarpenter Oct 2013 #14
But everything to do with post #1 by hobbit709 GreenStormCloud Oct 2013 #15
That may have been true for 1860, that much is for sure......but hobbit's post originally referred.. AverageJoe90 Oct 2013 #16
Then why did the local Mexicans join in the revolution. GreenStormCloud Oct 2013 #12
Thanks for posting this theHandpuppet Oct 2013 #4
Its the reason I posted it to help fight that lie we see more and more Ichingcarpenter Oct 2013 #5
And what is slavery? TomClash Oct 2013 #6
Isn't that called 'Right to work' laws these days? Ichingcarpenter Oct 2013 #8
Exactly my point TomClash Oct 2013 #11
Remember that for Lincoln, the issue was not slavery, Fortinbras Armstrong Oct 2013 #7
Of course, it was slavery Prophet 451 Oct 2013 #9
if someone sayss it was about "state's rights" d_r Oct 2013 #10
Would anyone notice North Carolina Knigh Oct 2013 #17
Thank you Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Oct 2013 #18
 

AverageJoe90

(10,745 posts)
2. Having studied Texas history for a story I'm writing.....it's quite a bit more complex than that.
Fri Oct 11, 2013, 07:02 AM
Oct 2013

To be honest with you, I don't deny that slavery played at least a small role in some of this. But the whole situation isn't so simplistic: For one, Santa Anna was, sadly, a corrupt dictator and he DID screw over Texas pretty badly. And then there's the fact that Manifest Destiny was originally very much a Yankee concept: it wasn't until around 1840 or so that the South started becoming terribly interested in it(And they weren't too happy about California being admitted as a free state, either.), and there were even those prominent Southerners who immediately took issue with it anyway, John C. Calhoun perhaps being the most notable example.

And that's just an overview, really. In a nutshell, if you will.


Ichingcarpenter

(36,988 posts)
3. Texas mentions slavery FIRST and FOREMOST for its succession
Fri Oct 11, 2013, 07:16 AM
Oct 2013

She was received into the confederacy with her own constitution, under the guarantee of the federal constitution and the compact of annexation, that she should enjoy these blessings. She was received as a commonwealth holding, maintaining and protecting the institution known as negro slavery-- the servitude of the African to the white race within her limits-- a relation that had existed from the first settlement of her wilderness by the white race, and which her people intended should exist in all future time. Her institutions and geographical position established the strongest ties between her and other slave-holding States of the confederacy. Those ties have been strengthened by association. But what has been the course of the government of the United States, and of the people and authorities of the non-slave-holding States, since our connection with them?

The controlling majority of the Federal Government, under various pretences and disguises, has so administered the same as to exclude the citizens of the Southern States, unless under odious and unconstitutional restrictions, from all the immense territory owned in common by all the States on the Pacific Ocean, for the avowed purpose of acquiring sufficient power in the common government to use it as a means of destroying the institutions of Texas and her sister slaveholding States.


This is their document and declaration
you can't rewrite that....read it this is the reasons they gave
they didn't add your revisions.

GreenStormCloud

(12,072 posts)
13. No mention at all of slavery in the 1836 Texas Declaration of Independence
Fri Oct 11, 2013, 09:51 AM
Oct 2013
http://avalon.law.yale.edu/19th_century/texdec.asp

The Unanimous Declaration of Independence made by the Delegates of the People of Texas in General Convention at the town of Washington on the 2nd day of March 1836.

When a government has ceased to protect the lives, liberty and property of the people, from whom its legitimate powers are derived, and for the advancement of whose happiness it was instituted, and so far from being a guarantee for the enjoyment of those inestimable and inalienable rights, becomes an instrument in the hands of evil rulers for their oppression.

When the Federal Republican Constitution of their country, which they have sworn to support, no longer has a substantial existence, and the whole nature of their government has been forcibly changed, without their consent, from a restricted federative republic, composed of sovereign states, to a consolidated central military despotism, in which every interest is disregarded but that of the army and the priesthood, both the eternal enemies of civil liberty, the everready minions of power, and the usual instruments of tyrants.

When, long after the spirit of the constitution has departed, moderation is at length so far lost by those in power, that even the semblance of freedom is removed, and the forms themselves of the constitution discontinued, and so far from their petitions and remonstrances being regarded, the agents who bear them are thrown into dungeons, and mercenary armies sent forth to force a new government upon them at the point of the bayonet.

When, in consequence of such acts of malfeasance and abdication on the part of the government, anarchy prevails, and civil society is dissolved into its original elements. In such a crisis, the first law of nature, the right of self-preservation, the inherent and inalienable rights of the people to appeal to first principles, and take their political affairs into their own hands in extreme cases, enjoins it as a right towards themselves, and a sacred obligation to their posterity, to abolish such government, and create another in its stead, calculated to rescue them from impending dangers, and to secure their future welfare and happiness.

Nations, as well as individuals, are amenable for their acts to the public opinion of mankind. A statement of a part of our grievances is therefore submitted to an impartial world, in justification of the hazardous but unavoidable step now taken, of severing our political connection with the Mexican people, and assuming an independent attitude among the nations of the earth.

The Mexican government, by its colonization laws, invited and induced the Anglo-American population of Texas to colonize its wilderness under the pledged faith of a written constitution, that they should continue to enjoy that constitutional liberty and republican government to which they had been habituated in the land of their birth, the United States of America.

In this expectation they have been cruelly disappointed, inasmuch as the Mexican nation has acquiesced in the late changes made in the government by General Antonio Lopez de Santa Anna, who having overturned the constitution of his country, now offers us the cruel alternative, either to abandon our homes, acquired by so many privations, or submit to the most intolerable of all tyranny, the combined despotism of the sword and the priesthood.

It has sacrificed our welfare to the state of Coahuila, by which our interests have been continually depressed through a jealous and partial course of legislation, carried on at a far distant seat of government, by a hostile majority, in an unknown tongue, and this too, notwithstanding we have petitioned in the humblest terms for the establishment of a separate state government, and have, in accordance with the provisions of the national constitution, presented to the general Congress a republican constitution, which was, without just cause, contemptuously rejected.

It incarcerated in a dungeon, for a long time, one of our citizens, for no other cause but a zealous endeavor to procure the acceptance of our constitution, and the establishment of a state government.

It has failed and refused to secure, on a firm basis, the right of trial by jury, that palladium of civil liberty, and only safe guarantee for the life, liberty, and property of the citizen.

It has failed to establish any public system of education, although possessed of almost boundless resources, (the public domain,) and although it is an axiom in political science, that unless a people are educated and enlightened, it is idle to expect the continuance of civil liberty, or the capacity for self government.

It has suffered the military commandants, stationed among us, to exercise arbitrary acts of oppression and tyrrany, thus trampling upon the most sacred rights of the citizens, and rendering the military superior to the civil power.

It has dissolved, by force of arms, the state Congress of Coahuila and Texas, and obliged our representatives to fly for their lives from the seat of government, thus depriving us of the fundamental political right of representation.

It has demanded the surrender of a number of our citizens, and ordered military detachments to seize and carry them into the Interior for trial, in contempt of the civil authorities, and in defiance of the laws and the constitution.

It has made piratical attacks upon our commerce, by commissioning foreign desperadoes, and authorizing them to seize our vessels, and convey the property of our citizens to far distant ports for confiscation.

It denies us the right of worshipping the Almighty according to the dictates of our own conscience, by the support of a national religion, calculated to promote the temporal interest of its human functionaries, rather than the glory of the true and living God.

It has demanded us to deliver up our arms, which are essential to our defence, the rightful property of freemen, and formidable only to tyrannical governments.

It has invaded our country both by sea and by land, with intent to lay waste our territory, and drive us from our homes; and has now a large mercenary army advancing, to carry on against us a war of extermination.

It has, through its emissaries, incited the merciless savage, with the tomahawk and scalping knife, to massacre the inhabitants of our defenseless frontiers.

It hath been, during the whole time of our connection with it, the contemptible sport and victim of successive military revolutions, and hath continually exhibited every characteristic of a weak, corrupt, and tyrranical government.

These, and other grievances, were patiently borne by the people of Texas, untill they reached that point at which forbearance ceases to be a virtue. We then took up arms in defence of the national constitution. We appealed to our Mexican brethren for assistance. Our appeal has been made in vain. Though months have elapsed, no sympathetic response has yet been heard from the Interior. We are, therefore, forced to the melancholy conclusion, that the Mexican people have acquiesced in the destruction of their liberty, and the substitution therfor of a military government; that they are unfit to be free, and incapable of self government.

The necessity of self-preservation, therefore, now decrees our eternal political separation.

We, therefore, the delegates with plenary powers of the people of Texas, in solemn convention assembled, appealing to a candid world for the necessities of our condition, do hereby resolve and declare, that our political connection with the Mexican nation has forever ended, and that the people of Texas do now constitute a free, Sovereign, and independent republic, and are fully invested with all the rights and attributes which properly belong to independent nations; and, conscious of the rectitude of our intentions, we fearlessly and confidently commit the issue to the decision of the Supreme arbiter of the destinies of nations.

Richard Ellis, President of the Convention and Delegate from Red River.

Charles B. Stewart
Tho. Barnett
John S. D. Byrom
Francis Ruis
J. Antonio Navarro
Jesse B. Badgett
Wm D. Lacy
William Menifee
Jn. Fisher
Matthew Caldwell
William Motley
Lorenzo de Zavala
Stephen H. Everett
George W. Smyth
Elijah Stapp
Claiborne West
Wm. B. Scates
M. B. Menard
A. B. Hardin
J. W. Burton
Thos. J. Gazley
R. M. Coleman
Sterling C. Robertson
James Collinsworth
Edwin Waller
Asa Brigham
Geo. C. Childress
Bailey Hardeman
Rob. Potter
Thomas Jefferson Rusk
Chas. S. Taylor
John S. Roberts
Robert Hamilton
Collin McKinney
Albert H. Latimer
James Power
Sam Houston
David Thomas
Edwd. Conrad
Martin Palmer
Edwin O. Legrand
Stephen W. Blount
Jms. Gaines
Wm. Clark, Jr.
Sydney O. Pennington
Wm. Carrol Crawford
Jno. Turner
Benj. Briggs Goodrich
G. W. Barnett
James G. Swisher
Jesse Grimes
S. Rhoads Fisher
John W. Moore
John W. Bower
Saml. A. Maverick (from Bejar)
Sam P. Carson
A. Briscoe
J. B. Woods
H. S. Kimble, Secretary


Post #1 is talking about the 1836 revolution, not the 1860 succession.

GreenStormCloud

(12,072 posts)
15. But everything to do with post #1 by hobbit709
Fri Oct 11, 2013, 11:58 AM
Oct 2013

I readily agree with your OP. hobbit709 wanted to lump the Texas revolution in with your OP and he is wrong.

 

AverageJoe90

(10,745 posts)
16. That may have been true for 1860, that much is for sure......but hobbit's post originally referred..
Fri Oct 11, 2013, 05:34 PM
Oct 2013

to the secession from Mexico in 1836. Now that was a more complicated situation than 1860. Also, see GreenStormCloud's post on the 1836 Constitution as well.

GreenStormCloud

(12,072 posts)
12. Then why did the local Mexicans join in the revolution.
Fri Oct 11, 2013, 09:44 AM
Oct 2013

It wasn't just a white man's revolution. There were many Tejanos who fought against Santa Anna. Were they fighting for slavery?

theHandpuppet

(19,964 posts)
4. Thanks for posting this
Fri Oct 11, 2013, 07:19 AM
Oct 2013

I've had that site bookmarked for a long time now and find it comes in very handy when dealing with neoconfederate revisionist history.

Ichingcarpenter

(36,988 posts)
5. Its the reason I posted it to help fight that lie we see more and more
Fri Oct 11, 2013, 07:23 AM
Oct 2013

you're welcome

I've sent it a few times myself

Ichingcarpenter

(36,988 posts)
8. Isn't that called 'Right to work' laws these days?
Fri Oct 11, 2013, 07:44 AM
Oct 2013

I knew sharecroppers growing up in the south who had no where to go.

With low wages its hard to pull up roots and start a new.

TomClash

(11,344 posts)
11. Exactly my point
Fri Oct 11, 2013, 08:38 AM
Oct 2013

If you are a worker with low wages and few benefits and can't really move from your current job, aren't you just a slave?

Fortinbras Armstrong

(4,473 posts)
7. Remember that for Lincoln, the issue was not slavery,
Fri Oct 11, 2013, 07:34 AM
Oct 2013

It was preserving the Union. As he wrote to Horace Greeley in August 1862 in response to an editorial by Greeley urging immediate emancipation in all states,

As to the policy I ‘seem to be pursuing,’ as you say, I have not meant to leave any one in doubt. I would save the Union. I would save it the shortest way under the Constitution. The sooner the national authority can be restored the nearer the Union will be ‘the Union as it was.’ If there be those who would not save the Union unless they could at the same time save slavery, I do not agree with them. If there be those who would not save the Union unless they could at the same time destroy slavery, I do not agree with them. My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone, I would also do that. What I do about slavery and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union; and what I forbear, I forbear because I do not believe it would help to save the Union.


Lincoln added that “I have here stated my purpose according to my view of official duty; and I intend no modification of my oft-expressed personal wish that all men every where could be free.” (Italics in original.)

At the time he wrote the letter, a substantial number of slaves had gained their freedom by running to the United States Army. Thus, Lincoln’s claim that he would save the Union “without freeing any slave” was mere rhetoric, designed to placate Northern conservatives and residents of the four loyal slave states. Lincoln had also just signed the Second Confiscation Act, which set out a process -- albeit a fairly cumbersome one -- to emancipate slaves of rebel masters.

More importantly, neither Greeley nor anyone else outside the president’s cabinet and inner circle knew that more than a month before he wrote this letter, Lincoln had drafted the Emancipation Proclamation. He was simply waiting for the right moment -- a major United States victory in the East -- to announce his plan to end slavery in the Confederacy. Thus, his claim that he would save the Union without freeing any slaves was shrewdly political. Lincoln was in fact planning to free more than three million slaves in the 11 states that had seceded from the Union.

Lincoln was correct, however, by noting that he might have to free some of the slaves, and leave the others in bondage. Under the Constitution, neither Congress nor the president had any power to liberate slaves in the border states that had not joined the Confederacy. But Lincoln could use his power as commander in chief to strike at slavery in those states that claimed to be out of the Union and were making war on the United States.

Finally, Lincoln made clear to friends and critics alike that he was no friend of slavery by reaffirming his “oft-expressed personal wish that all men every where could be free.” The message was unmistakable. Lincoln was personally opposed to slavery and he always had been. He was dismantling it as best he could, given the constraints of the Constitution and the necessity of winning the war. In the next month he would issue the draft of the Emancipation Proclamation.

Prophet 451

(9,796 posts)
9. Of course, it was slavery
Fri Oct 11, 2013, 08:09 AM
Oct 2013

The Confederacy put slavery in their bloody constitution!

Sadly, those who should read this won't because correcting misinformation just makes teh victim hold it all the stronger. I think it was Twain who said it is easier to fool someone than to convince them that they have been fooled.

d_r

(6,907 posts)
10. if someone sayss it was about "state's rights"
Fri Oct 11, 2013, 08:31 AM
Oct 2013

ask them "state's rights to do what?"

I once had a person say "to use their raw materials for their economic interests" so I asked "what was that raw material?" and the person said "agriculture" and I said "what agricultural product?" and the person reluctantly said "cotton." The case was closed.

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