DU has become a "warroom" for the Democratic Party...

[kentuck]

It is more united than I have seen it in a long time.

Not because everyone here is crazy about "Obamacare" but because DUers feel the need to defend our country from the extremists that would try to ignore elections and demand their way through threats and extortion. Those acts by the Republicans have united Democrats.

The folks here are on top of what is happening. It's like talk radio against the Internet...

Vigilance is the price of liberty.

[Peacetrain]

1. Since I first started here in 2008

i have not seen us as a coalition of caring citizens who are democrats, progressives, liberals, what ever label you wish to embrace..so in tune .. I guess we have to thank the Republican Tea Party Coalition for bringing our family back together.

I have been in awe today.. just in awe.

[msanthrope]

2. We always were. nt

[silvershadow]

55. We were born this way- lol. Really, DU was born this way (well, except

for the blocking feature- inside joke re: something's I said).

[joshcryer]

62. Correct.

We've always wanted to "defend our country from the extremists." Even as they credited the Republicans for health care or for ending DADT. Even as their congress has been the most inept in American history (this is not an exaggeration). Even as they tried to overturn Obamacare some 48 times. Even as they threatened to take away unemployment benefits if they didn't get their way, in the middle of a recession that threatened to usher in a new Great Depression. Even as they prevented a budget from being passed throughout all of Obama's tenure (Obama has had one budget passed, every "budget" from then forward was a "continuing resolution&quot .

[LaydeeBug]

73. Yes! And we will continue to be

I have *no* patience for people who try to discourage others from asking questions in their battles. I am *elated* when I have an answer for someone because I know how it is.

We are not in a bubble. America doesn't happen in a bubble either. It's good to engage.

It's good to prepare.

FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK the haters.

[PeteSelman]

3. It would be nice if they listened to us.

Even a little bit. There is some really sound strategy whipped up around here that would get positive results. I just question who the party wants positive results for.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

53. True that.

[calimary]

84. THIS.^^^^

GREAT one, PeteSelman!

[questionseverything]

90. du was quoted twice last night on msnbc

once by jan s from illinois and forget the 2nd one but i was surprised

the saved 6000 a year op even had the person on to be interviewed

i am happy for evry1 the aca helps but the small business person has not been listened to yet

for an income of 75 grand a yr the premium and out of pocket for a 3 person family, 50year old parents is 26% of income

how many have 26% of income not already accounted for?

[Uncle Joe]

4. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, kentuck.

[kentuck]

6. Thanks Uncle Joe!

[Uncle Joe]

7. ..

Peace to you, kentuck.

[LittleBlue]

5. Healthcare for all is a uniting idea

If only we would stick to this, I think we would clean the floor with the Rethugs at election time.

[wandy]

8. I think many understand that this goes beyond ACA.............

Government by blackmail has become more than an occasional republican hissey fit. It has become a Obsessive-compulsive disorder by which republicans serve their financial backers.

If it is not stood up to this time, where will it stop....

[awoke_in_2003]

60. Bingo. nt

[CTyankee]

9. I came here on a "high" in Oct.2004, thinking Kerry would win...

the loss was devastating. I spent the winter of 2005 in the gym and on DU and listening to Stephanie MIller and Al Franken on the radio. Boy, did that save me!

I credit DU along with the other helpers with getting me thru the worst winter I can recall...

[liberal_at_heart]

10. Don't count on it. It was the crazies that made me vote democrat in 2010.

I will need more that that to vote democrat in 2014.

[jeff47]

11. Because clearly they are far more sane now. (nt)

[liberal_at_heart]

12. I'm tired of the democrats in office using the "we're better than the other guys" defense.

If they want my vote, they can earn my vote. They can properly fund education. They can propose a living wage. They can turn ACA into single payer.

[creeksneakers2]

54. Don't hold your breath

There isn't anywhere near enough money to do all that, even if they wanted to.

How about instead of earning YOUR vote, you make your decision based on what choice would have the best outcome for all?

[jeff47]

57. So...gotta increase suffering until we agree to your demands?

Why does that sound so familiar right now?

Not saying you should withhold your opinion or tell you how to vote. But I vote for the best Democrat in the primaries. Then I vote for the Democrat in the general even if I have to hold my nose. And I've had to vote for Feinstein. Repeatedly.

Why? Because my chance to drag the party left is in the primary. In the general, the Democrats react to losing by moving right. They assume people like you are a lost cause, and try to pick up Republican votes.

[liberal_at_heart]

61. oh, you want to talk about demands. I have been told by my fellow democrats that I better vote

democrat or it will be my fault the republicans win. It will be my fault that people suffer. Sounds to me like it is the democrats putting demands on me. I have been bullied into voting for people I don't believe in for too many years now. I will not be bullied anymore. You can vote for whomever you want to. So will I. So go ahead and accuse me of not caring if people suffer. I can just as easily accuse you of not caring that students are suffering. You go your way. I'll go mine. You vote for who you want. I will vote for who I want. Maybe if we're lucky we'll have some good liberal candidates and we'll end up voting for the same people. But if not so be it.

[jeff47]

63. Again, your plan has been tried for the last 20 years.

Lots of (former) Democrats have followed your plan for the last 20 years - Clinton and descendants were too far right, so they withheld their vote. How's it worked? Not so well. Because again, Democrats react to losing general elections by moving right.

The Republicans have done the opposite plan for the last 40 years - drag the party right in the primary, hold nose and vote R in the general. How's it worked? It took the party that created the EPA and dragged it to a party that now wants veterans to starve to prevent poor people from getting health care.

So....we know "Plan B" works, and works extremely well. Yet you are insisting on continuing "Plan A" that has failed so you don't have to vote for an icky Democrat.

And people wonder why we haven't dragged the party to the left.

[mopinko]

68. "the world is run by the people who show up"

howard dean.


nobody but nobody cares what the people who don't vote, or vote for that years loon, think. you haven't taken care of your country. why should it take care of you?

[treestar]

69. Amen! Very well stated!

Absolutely. And then they act the martyr when we point out that Plan A does not work. They are harming themselves, not the Republicans. All for a little emotional vent at those who are closer to them, being on the left but just not far enough.

[BrotherIvan]

70. Sorry to disagree

But making demands and withholding votes is EXACTLY how the Rs have been pulled so far right. Remember all the wingers who stayed home because McCain was too moderate? How do you think the Teapubs have gotten so much damn power?

The trouble is, women and minorities are often given the middle finger and told, "Where else you gonna go?" and somehow shamed out of their votes. It's an awful strategy and one that leads to things like 2010 -- Democrats win election landslide on liberal promises, turn around and flip off base then DARE them to vote for anyone else.

We actually could learn a whole lot from the teaidiots, because they get their whacko politicians to do what they want them to do.

[jeff47]

71. Not quite

You seem to be missing that there are two kinds of elections, primaries and general elections.

But making demands and withholding votes is EXACTLY how the Rs have been pulled so far right.

In the primary. In the general election, they mostly hold their nose and vote R. Then when that person runs in the next primary, they vote for the other guy again. And now Bob Bennett isn't a Senator anymore.

The trouble is, women and minorities are often given the middle finger and told, "Where else you gonna go?" and somehow shamed out of their votes. It's an awful strategy and one that leads to things like 2010 -- Democrats win election landslide on liberal promises, turn around and flip off base then DARE them to vote for anyone else.

Which we should fix by voting against them in the primaries. If they survive that, we vote for them in the general and vote against them again in the next primary.

We actually could learn a whole lot from the teaidiots, because they get their whacko politicians to do what they want them to do.

By voting against them in the primaries.

Right now, the government is shut down because gerrymandering has made many house seats "safe" in a general election. Those seats are not safe in a primary election. So the "sane" Republicans are going along with the plan because they fear the teabaggers will eliminate them in a primary more than they fear a Democrat will unseat them in the general election.

[BrotherIvan]

75. In Theory

See Blanche Lincoln. And as someone with the reprehensible DiFi as my senator, I can tell you, the thought of voting for her makes me physically ill. But there she sits, heading committees and feeding off the blood of soldiers like a tick. The Democratic Party supports Corporate Dems, entrenching them in cushy positions and squashing liberal primary challenges. They know this attitude, that we must vote for whomever, no matter their disgusting record, because the Rs are so damn bad. But this attitude has done nothing but move the party not just to the right, but to the $$. If we are powerless to stand up for our demands and must dutifully vote for a slightly lesser rascal, how on earth do we expect any of that to Change?

There must come a time when we decide to change course. Letting the Rs rule is not the solution, but allowing Dems to rule like Rs is not the answer either. Of course, gerrymandering and public financing are a good start, but who in Congress will vote for it? It's the vicious cycle and it will take some backbone and creativity to fix it.

[jeff47]

93. Yeah, only theory. It's not like we're seeing the results right now.

After all, the Republicans are so sane and centrist that they'd never shut down the government.

And as someone with the reprehensible DiFi as my senator, I can tell you, the thought of voting for her makes me physically ill.

As did I when I lived in CA. I'd have been just as proud to vote against her as I was to vote against Helms when I moved to NC. But I held my nose and did it.

But let's pretend DiFi loses to a Republican. What happens in the next election? A Democrat even further to the right. Democrats have been avoiding primaries against sitting office holders. We need to stop that.

The Democratic Party supports Corporate Dems, entrenching them in cushy positions and squashing liberal primary challenges.

And those same people will push the party further right if those Corporate Dems lose. Because that's what's been going on for the last 40 years.

To stop that, we need to stop letting them squash liberal primary challenges. The currently "corporate" Democrat doesn't have to lose their primary. They just have to fear losing their primary. After all, even DiFi is further left than when I had to vote for her in the 90s.

If we are powerless to stand up for our demands and must dutifully vote for a slightly lesser rascal, how on earth do we expect any of that to Change?

Because we aren't powerless. We're dissuaded from voting in primaries. We need to fix that part.

There must come a time when we decide to change course.

And we can do that by getting primary turnout above its currently pathetic 20%. Really doesn't take any creativity - the Republicans already showed us how to do it.

"The powers that be" don't want Democratic primaries, because they know it will drag the party left. So they've worked very, very hard to not have them. We need to start working on having them.

Your proposal (withhold general election votes) is actually the status-quo - disillusioned liberals not showing up or not voting D in general elections.

[cui bono]

19. Did the crazies make you say "democrat"

instead of Democratic?

[liberal_at_heart]

23. oh my god really? lol. Thanks for the laugh. I have been a democrat for 19 years.

I am no longer one of course. I am now an independent. But for you to bring up the fact that I said democrat is laughable, but whatever. I don't really care anymore. When the next election comes around I will look for liberal candidates to vote for. If there are no liberal candidates who knows.

[tavalon]

72. Oh, come on, I'm a socialist and even I know how to correctly use the

terms Democrat and Democratic. We caucus with the Dems so we should show our respect.

[name not needed]

21. Look at 2014 as a chance to send the crazies back to their meth labs.

[kentuck]

22. I just write what I observe...

And I observe them being more crazy than they were in 2010...

[valerief]

47. What does 'vote Democrat' mean?

[athena]

78. It means 'not vote Republic'. (n/t)

[valerief]

80. Badda bing!

[DisgustipatedinCA]

13. I am foursquare behind the President when he's fighting for us.

I'm not behind him when I don't believe he's behind me. I would hope that those who have accused left-wing liberals of being just like teabaggers, etc, will keep this in mind. When the President is doing right by liberals, he has no stronger defenders than those very liberals.

My thanks and appreciation to President Obama for holding the line against the jackals. Keep it up, Mr. President.

[Liberalynn]

64. +1

[mnhtnbb]

14. People here understand that this goes beyond "Obamacare". It is about destroying

our form of government.

[winter is coming]

24. ^^ This. n/t

[DCBob]

38. +1

This political tactic being used by the GOP is way beyond anything acceptable.

[SomeGuyInEagan]

87. While stealing the silver on the way out.

Also, love your avatar - I really miss Molly's writing.

[mnhtnbb]

88. And Paul Wellstone graduated from UNC-Chapel Hill.

There is a nice memorial bench for him on the campus.

I got to sit next to Molly one time when she came to speak at a Jefferson/Jackson dinner
when we were living in Lincoln, NE. Quite the wit. Wonderful woman.

[Scuba]

15. Agreed. Thanks kentuck.

[SomethingFishy]

16. I thought that yesterday..

Then I showed up again this morning...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023760454

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=3759440

Only to realize that we are never going to be united.

[Uncle Joe]

36. I will wager

that this thread of unison will get far more reccomendations than those threads of division.

The first one has 9 so far and the second 33 at this time.

[SomethingFishy]

58. Yeah I did one as well that got a bunch of recs...

Laying the blame on the Republicans. Where it belongs.. I have to admit as the day went on things got a little better, those threads dropped and it felt more like the previous few days where we were all on the same page.. I really like this place when it's not all sniping...

[Uncle Joe]

59. Well we should give some credit to the Republicans for that.

Their; total lack of moral, political and just good old common sense ethics, does on occasion make the prospect of uniting against them much easier.

Peace to you, SomethingFishy.

[carolinayellowdog]

17. I want to believe you, but made the mistake of looking at DU without logging in

and saw the nastiest progressive-bashing BS post in a long while by one of the most usual suspects re endless DU divisiveness

on edit-- I see Something Fishy had the same "oh, not more of this shit now!" moment about the same nasty thread, one minute ahead of me. They never stop.

[KoKo]

20. A String of those kind of posts...........

But, one's "Ignore List" can grow quite long with such outbursts.

They are a magnet for the "5 Hidden Posts" rule that goes into effect 90 days from now.

Mostly, it seems they do "Re-Do Posts" of issues that were settled...but, when tempers get HOT one is ohhh so tempted. Sometimes it's better not to read "Re-Hash" when there are so many important issues going forward that it becomes a distraction.

[gopiscrap]

18. Good

[Bernardo de La Paz]

25. Blackmailers never stop. Give in on this debt blackmail & get blackmailed on the next debt round. nt

[formercia]

37. Never Negotiate with Terrorists

That is all.

[WHEN CRABS ROAR]

26. Let's push back with a general strike.

Just think about that for a second.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

44. Yeah, a second is all it takes to know that is a bad idea. Hold the economy hostage? Nuts. nt

[Tarheel_Dem]

27. Good one!

[Half-Century Man]

28. Pass the good stuff along

Everything here you find of value, pass along to other sites. I have passed stuff to TYT before and plan to blanket my Senators, Representatives, the state democratic party, and alternative left wing or center web sites in Wisconsin.
Become active beyond current levels.

[KoKo]

30. We are often amazed at how little they know in the time they have to report....

So Good Stuff!... Thanks for the post and reminder to target Reporters on Twitter and make info go viral.

[Half-Century Man]

33. Not on twitter, facebook or any social media site

Sorry that was a lie. I have a facebook page, I had to set one up for a media class. I've been there once in three years.

I'm here quite often though.

[Taverner]

29. Liberty or death!

[hrmjustin]

31. K&R!

[liberal N proud]

32. Reminiscent of the early days

[Politicub]

34. I agree, kentuck

Unlike the quickly falling apart GOP, we democrats are united.

What comes to mind for me is:

"And all the king's horses and all the king's men, couldn't put Humpty together again."

I finally understand what that nursery rhyme means.

[AAO]

35. Damn straight, kentuck, ground zero is wherever you stand.

[DontTreadOnMe]

39. Consumer boycotts work

It's the ONLY thing that gets immediate attention. It makes the news. It hurts "their" wallets.
It worked at killing off Limbaugh advertisers.

Everything Koch related should have been boycotted for years... they make many national paper products.

Can "we" all here on DU get organized and start hitting them where it hurts, their wallets.

[DCBob]

40. The unintended consequence..

In their zeal to derail this President they have united us more than we have been since the 2008 inauguration.

[kentuck]

41. I think you may be right.

You can feel it.

[Lonr]

42. TPTB

appear to have succeeded in polarizing our country politically. Divide and conquer...

[world wide wally]

43. It's human nature to rally together in the face of a common threat such as

these mindless Republican dweebs. Do you remember how the country rallied together after 9/11?

Thank you, Republicans. We needed that.

[corkhead]

45. Happy to see us all on the same side again. We have always been; we're just bickering siblings. eom

[fadedrose]

46. I pour out all my anger

and give the tea party my low opinion of them here daily. Thanks for DU. My family and neighbors don't have a clue.

[ChiciB1]

48. Been Her Since 2004... Dropped Out For Some Time...

My heart & soul haven't changed. My beliefs about what "we the people" can do just kind of died. OUR Democrats didn't seem to have a spine and I couldn't stand how lame things had gotten. I would love to see cohesion again, so my fingers are crossed that we can stand United again.

My wish would be that we can show them and the whole country who we are and what should really matter. I thought it was the UNITED States of America, but it sure has slid way, way off the rails! I don't know where my country went, but I do know it's going to take a lot of heavy lifting to get back on track.

I wonder if we can make them hear us now.

[JDPriestly]

49. It's the ACA. How in the world can people claim to be Christian or compassionate and

seriously argue that those poorer than themselves should not have access to their own health care because those poorer people might become addicted to it.

That is what Michelle Bachmann and Ted Cruz have suggestions.

The Republicans have shown their true nature: cruel, sadistic and mean.

And we DUers are fed up with it.

The Republican answer to every need, every issue, every problem is to make the weak pay. Beat 'em up is their response to the petitions of the poor and needy.

They are just so disgusting. Every Democrat is incensed. That is what is uniting DU. Sheer disgust with the Republican monsters.

[zeemike]

50. Why would anyone think we would not unite on this?

The divisions here are not about party but policies...Does anyone believe that we who oppose a policy that our leadership promotes would drive us into the GOP arms?

Even the trolls that may be here will be on our side for fear of blowing their cover...but will fan the differences when they come up...that is how the game is played.
The crazies are the third side of the triangulation and serve that purpose.

[bvar22]

76. ^^^Exactly!^^^

It is about POLICY!
Why is that so hard for some to see?

It is possible to SUPPORT President Obama and the Democratic Party for taking a United Stand AGAINST the Republicans here,
and still OPPOSE the coming FreeTrade Deals, The Keystone Pipeline, WAR in Syria,
and a host of other ISSUES.

I've never understood those who insist that Party comes before Policy,
or that opposition to bad policy = hater/racist.

[zeemike]

77. Well I understand it in two ways.

One is the authoritarian mind set, that there must be total support for the leaders or else chaos will ensue.
And the other is those that seek to use this mind set to heard people in the way they want them to go...to create the bum rush to policies they want.

[Suburban Warrior]

51. I purchased a Star Membership because I like what I see here...

[gordianot]

56. It can get a little contentious at times, just wait then it turns around quickly.

Right now from what I see on DU people are really united and fired up. Welcome to DU.

[Orsino]

65. I wish.

The concerns expressed on DU may overlap with those of party officials, but they are also concerned with pleasing or placating lobbyists (not to mention the egos of party officials).

[Vashta Nerada]

66. It has, but will it produce tangible results?

[mopinko]

67. it like the story - at the anarchists convention

this is the link to the original that i heard many years ago, but i think you can find it out there for free somewhere. it is worth either the time of the $3. i think of it often around here, and it makes the ups and downs a little less serious to me.

http://store.symphonyspace.org/products/at-the-anarchists-convention-by-john-sayles-mp3-download

[madfloridian]

74. Kentuck, they are still harming education badly. That issue won't go away.

The Democrats are leading the way in destroying the traditional public school system. It is their policy, they need to own it.

The reason we are together on this issue of the shutdown is that it is very obvious who is at fault. I just posted an op ed by a Republican who is calling her own party out. She is right to do that.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023766928

I plan to speak out again on the education fiasco and the harm being done by Democratic policies. But on the issue of the shutdown it is obvious.

In fact it is good to see our party not budging on this.

[michigandem58]

79. Wait until a deal gets cut

and the wailing will begin.

[gejohnston]

91. the important thing is who does the wailing

I prefer it to be more them than us.

[michigandem58]

92. Agreed

But some will be upset at any give and take, no matter how miniscule.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

81. Great,...the "Alien Invasion School Of Unity".

[Phlem]

82. "Vigilance is the price of liberty."

Spot on!

The first word I have a unique connection to and it is Truth!

-p

[Mr.Turnip]

83. This is about more than just policy now, this is about our system of government

and its continued ability to function as a republic, we have to fight to stop a monsterous precident from being made.

[avaistheone1]

86. I agree.

k&r

[edbermac]

85. "You can't fight in here! This is the War Room!"

[Warpy]

89. If it isn't, it should be

It's the one site where you don't have to wade through acres of rubbish to find a gem.