You don't have to be Gay to support the LGBT Community.

[William769]

You only have to be human.

[Swamp Lover]

1. You absolutely right.

And remember, as Smokey says, "Only you can prevent forest fires."

[YoungDemCA]

2. Agreed. People who don't support the LGBT Community..

...are either bigots, or cowards (IMHO, of course. )

[Nye Bevan]

7. Agreed. Imagine if the President said "I believe marriage is for two people of the same race....

... God is in the mix". His stance on gay marriage is equally bigoted.

[SunsetDreams]

3. K&R!

[MarianJack]

4. I'm a happily married straight man.

My wife, my almost 12 year old son and I fully support the LGBT Community. We will happily stand with our LGBT friends this November to finally attain mariage equality here in Maine.

PEACE!

[William769]

5. ...

[MarianJack]

47. Thanks William769...

...and a , a , a and a big back atcha!

PEACE!

[Carla in Sequim]

40. My husband and I stand for equality as well

We have been married almost 32 years. All committed couples should have the same benefits.
The only shame is how long it will take battling the raging right.

[MarianJack]

49. You are so right, Carla in Sequim!

Justice delayed is justice denied!

PEACE!

[timesup]

6. The sad part to me really is....

That there had to be a 'community' in the first place.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

10. why? people with similar lives and interests always form community

why is that so sad?

[YoungDemCA]

11. My guess is that timesup is referring to the lack of support LGBT people get...

from the "mainstream".

Now, that is changing to some extent, as more and more straight people are realizing the injustice that has been done to LGBT people.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

15. i suppose that i don't think we'll ever stop being a community even if we have equal rights

just like any other minority community

i don' think there is anything sad about that.

[stevenleser]

31. I think about that kind of stuff a lot. I guess I personally wish we had situations where...

people passed between the various communities like socializing at a party of welcoming people and moving from group to group and chatting.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

36. people do that even now. not all my friends are queer.

but most are, because we have unique cultural experiences/needs/wants/desires etc that make us naturally have more in common

[Deep13]

8. Well, naturally.

You don't have to be female to be a feminist. You don't have to be a racial minority to pro-civil rights.

[one_voice]

9. Truth.

K&R

[HockeyMom]

12. Believe in CIVIL RIGHTS for ALL Americans

that is all it takes.

[Zalatix]

14. +1,000,000

[William769]

24. ...

[a la izquierda]

13. Right on!

I'm a straight, married woman. But I grew up in a family in which my mom came out when I was a teenager, and I've pretty much always known that my uncle is gay.
People like Santorum, et al., make my blood boil.

[fishwax]

16. k/r

[jwirr]

17. I am straight and I support the LGBT as do many of my family.

[William769]

56. ...

[hamsterjill]

18. Hetero Here

I simply want my gay and lesbian friends to have the same rights that I do. I see no reason why they shouldn't.

[get the red out]

19. Nope

Discrimination and mistreatment of any one group of people harms the entire country.

Personally, my oldest friend friend on Earth is gay (among other friends), we grew up together and were inseparable from about 8 years old until I went off to college (I'm a year older). The idea that there are still plenty of people around that would want to cause problems for he and his partner in any way, and that we live in a state that won't let them get married, just pisses me off!

[SmellyFeet]

20. Kind of preaching to the choir, no?

[William769]

22. You would think.

[MANative]

21. So very true!

I was lucky to be raised in a very accepting family, and my early life and work exposures brought me into close partnership with at least as many gay people as straight ones (working in theater and fashion, which both tend to be very accepting of people of all stripes)! When you choose to just know people as individuals, rather than as the label that society places on them, it's really, at least for me, impossible to not form close, life-long bonds. I'm as straight as an arrow, have been in a monogamous, heterosexual marriage for thirty years (as of April!) and I've drawn considerably more gay friends into my life than straight ones. The longest standing friendship with a person I knew to be gay began when we were both nine years old, and he's my very best bud, apart from my hubby, my brother and my sister. He was a huge influence in me learning that being gay was no different from being anything else, and I'm so grateful that at the young age of eleven, he was honest with me about who he was. What a grand, and long-lasting gift he shared!

[William769]

23. Thanks for sharing that.

[stopwastingmymoney]

50. You gave him a wonderful gift too

That of having someone he could be real with

I think that's so important

[stevenleser]

32. ?

[zappaman]

26. Big k & R! nt

[William769]

28. Thank you.

[jeff47]

29. Human? Well I guess that excludes Mitt. (nt)

[Lugnut]

30. Spot on, William!

I'm straight but not narrow.

[William769]

51. Good to know.

[lunatica]

33. Well I've always supported the gay community so I guess I'm human

I can't imagine not supporting people's rights.

[dembotoz]

34. well duh and i mean that as a gentle friendly well duh

as in i would have hoped that this was obvious


seems not?

[Saturday]

35. I agree.

I'm a human straight old lady and I support the LGBT community. Who can be anti a rainbow?

[kickysnana]

37. You'd think so if you tried to post in that forum.

[TeeYiYi]

38. What does that mean? ...

”You'd think so if you tried to post in that forum.”

TYY

[La Lioness Priyanka]

46. only if you are a bigot, if not, you should be fine

we even have some straight hosts of the lgbt forum.

if you have problems with the group, it likely has more to do with you

[yewberry]

57. "only if you are a bigot"

I won't post there, and I've been shown that I'm not welcome there, and it sure as heck isn't because I'm a bigot.

My moms are lesbians. The LGBT group here has no use for us COLAGs, and clearly no use for "breeders." When asked not to refer to our LGBT parents as 'breeders,' you yourself said:

"cry me a fucking river

poor opressed majority with every right and dignity afforded to you. "

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=221&topic_id=42420&mesg_id=42420

So whatevs, pri. You want to hate us, you go for it. You think my Mom isn't lesbian enough for you? FUCK YOU. My mom is lesbian enough for her family, okay? Is that okay with you?

This ain't got nothing to do with me, Missy. You're judging my Moms and our families. Please get a grip. We're REAL families. REAL people.

So suuuure, it MUST have to do with ME. I *must* be a bigot.

Right.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

63. if you dont see the ridiculousness of this sentence, you shouldnt be allowed to post

"It is no more appropriate for a gay person to call a straight person a breeder than for a straight person to call a gay person a faggot."

[yewberry]

68. That disgusting thread championed calling LGBT parents 'breeders.'

And you applauded.

While I won't agree with the sentence that you cited from the OP, I will unabashedly call bullshit on every single person in that thread who ignored the fact that the OP stated at the outset that she was a child of a gay family when she asked that DUers not use the term, and who then ripped her apart for it.

That was the thread that taught me that the DU LGBT forum had no use for LGBT families or allies, even the most natural allies: children of LGBT families. That was when I learned that, on DU, it's acceptable and even HILARIOUS to call my moms 'breeders.' My moms, products of the post-war generation, protestors for the ERA, hiding their lives because they live in a right-to-work state, good people who fought against cultural and societal demands and decided to live as who they are... ha ha ha, let's call them 'breeders' because they had... me.

And you applauded.

If you don't see the reason I might take offense at that, you shouldn't be allowed to post.

Please, if you ever have children, I hope you will prepare them for this kind of welcome from the most short-sighted, self-centered members of the community.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

69. comparing faggot to breeder is beyond ridiculous and denigrates

people who have suffered real oppression.

where should i not be allowed to post because i dont think straight people are oppressed?

[yewberry]

70. You're ignoring the point AGAIN, Priyanka.

I have never, ever suggested that straight people are oppressed. If you think I have, please link.
I have never, ever compared faggot to breeder. And I wouldn't.

However, the OP I referenced was from a COLAG asking that the term 'breeder' should not be used, presumably at least in some part because her (gay) parents had obviously bred. The LGBT forum roundly mocked and tore her apart. I'm not suggesting her OP was 100% dead on. I *am* saying that the posters in the DU LGBT forum completely ignored the fact that they were referring to a gay couple as 'breeders' and PILED ON.

Please understand that kids of LGBT families might be sensitive to people calling their parents names. I'm still pissed about this, even years later, because members of the LGBT forum seemed to think it's okay (and even funny) to call my moms 'breeders.' That term is incredibly offensive to me, and to my moms. And I am very proud of my moms.

Shout it from the rooftops, my moms are LESBIANS.

Yes, that's right, my moms are lesbians, and if you call them 'breeders' to my face I will challenge you until I am out of breath.

THAT is why I feel unwelcome in the LGBT forum on DU. It ain't only bigots who are unwelcome, as you suggested earlier. The forum that day judged and rejected GLBT parents and their children. Go back and read it, please.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

71. no one calls lesbians breeders. lets be real about that to begin with

not even if they have a child together.

i dont think you understand that bigotry comes in many subtle forms. one form is when you try to compare the oppressed groups transgressions as equal to that of the completely un-oppressed group.

for instance the n-word is not comparable to cracker. breeder not comparable to faggot. is breeder slightly derogatory, sure. is it comparable to faggot, no.

so yes, anyone trying to make that comparison should be laughed out of the lgbt forum.

[yewberry]

72. Really?

Go back and read the thread that I'm referring to. Several people, including yourself, cheered the use of the term 'breeder' in reference to anyone who has bred. That includes EVERYONE who has children. Children of LGBTQ families are not wrong to challenge judgment of their families by anyone. In all honesty, if some fundamentalist jackass challenges my moms or the validity of my family, I go for the throat. Same thing here; if LGBTQQI DUers challenge my moms or the validity of my family, I will react. That's what happened in that thread.

I don't think YOU understand that I am well aware that comparing transgressions by an un-oppressed group to transgressions by an oppressed group is wildly offensive.

The OP of the thread in question was not dead on in her request. She was, in the view of the forum, speaking for the non-oppressed to the oppressed, and I get that that's why she was received the way she was. At the same time, she was also coming from a place from which the conflation of gay/lesbian+parent=breeder. This is very uncomfortable for us, and please take a minute to understand that.

I am deeply uncomfortable with my moms being called breeders. I expect that the OP of the thread in question felt the same way about her gay dads. It's not okay for homophobes and haters to judge our parents for being LGBTQQI; it's also not okay to have our parents treated as though they're not lesbian or gay enough by members of the community.

Maybe if ever have a daughter, she'll be able to explain it to you.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

73. Yes, really. Breeder is specific to straight people. People who pretend that it is just as powerful

as the word fag, deserve to no longer be allowed to post in the LGBT forum. It means they have their head so far up their ass, they don't understand the very basics of straight privilege.

I did go back to that thread and stand by what i said.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=221x42420#42694

[yewberry]

74. You've contradicted yourself.

"Breeder is specific to straight people."
"i will call those that breed breeders"

These positions are contradictory.

Seriously, WTF? Are you really that stupid?

EVERYTHING I've posted on this topic has been about referring to LGBTQQI people as BREEDERS! If you call all people who have bred 'breeders,' you are referring to LGBTQQI parents as BREEDERS.

My entire objection, in small words, for those who cannot comprehend abstractions:

Priyanka says that "i will call those that breed breeders."
My lesbian Moms bred me & my siblings.
Thus Priyanka calls my lesbian Moms 'breeders.'

Please fucking stop calling my lesbian moms 'breeders.' PLEASE.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

75. LOL

you are determined to take offense when there is none. maybe you want to feel outrage at the queer community for something and this is the best you've got.

again, no one calls queer people who have kids breeders. its just not used in that way.

so yeah get all upset at your lesbians moms oppression at my hand, but you're being extremely delusional

[yewberry]

77. Whatever, missy.

I take offense because you posted that you feel you have the right, for some reason, to categorize LGBT parents as breeders, and you failed repeatedly to explain why, other than disparaging me. I took offense because your repeated defense of calling LGBT parents 'breeders' is, frankly, offensive. Claiming that members of the community who make choices that differ from your choices are somehow lesser members of the community is shitty, and THAT is what you have been arguing in favor of. Can you actually feign shock that someone might call you on that?

I've got no issues with the queer community; I do have issues with you. And I'm aware that most people have more sense than calling my family breeders, but you and other members of the DU2 LGBT forum cheered it. Loudly and without qualification.

I've been clear all along about what my point was in this discussion has been; the escalation and continued discussion has been because you insisted upon ignoring what I have been actually posting about, and answered instead with self-evident edicts about what should and shouldn't be said on a LGBTQQI board, If you missed my point, that's your lookout.

And if you think I'm being delusional, three cheers for you. You've been defending diminishing LGBT parents as 'breeders' throughout this discussion. Proud, are you?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

79. i have never called lgbt parents breeders. why you continue to lie about this i cannot understand

i have repeatedly said NO ONE CALLS LGBT PARENTS BREEDERS. The word BREEDERS IS ONLY USED FOR STRAIGHT PEOPLE.

SO STOP LYING ABOUT ME.

[yewberry]

82. Uh huh. Please stop accusing me of lying.

You have in the last 2 days backpedalled regarding your statement that anyone who breeds should be called a breeder. You have apparently just recently noticed that ALL of my posts on this issue have been about calling LGBT parents breeders.

I'M NOT LYING.

If your intent was not clearly conveyed, fine, say so. Look over everything I've posted on this topic. I think I've been pretty clear in my reference to LGBT family members, and if you misunderstood my intent, say so. I'M NOT FUCKING LYING.

And on edit: if you insist on accusing me of lying, please post a link.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

83. YES you are. Look in the fucking original thread, even pnwmom admits that she

has never heard gay parents being referred to as breeders

so just stop being a crazy liar.

[yewberry]

84. Post a link if I've lied.

Otherwise, please stop with your accusations.

I've been clear and specific in my posts. If you've misunderstood, please acknowledge that and move on.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

85. post a link where i said, LGBT parents should be called breeders. if i have not said it

stop lying about me.

[yewberry]

89. "I will call those that breed breeders"

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=221&topic_id=42420&mesg_id=43892

And please stop your lies. The OP, years ago, was a child of gay parents. She may have been misguided in her OP, but your response "Cry me a fucking river"
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=221&topic_id=42420&mesg_id=42694
was not exactly a cum-by-yah for those of us who have grown up in LGBT families.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

90. those were specifically directed to straight people who are the ONLY people

who are called breeders, which i have said 100 times to you by now.

i am bored with this. i think you are full of crap and are looking for whatever reasons to get offended with the LGBT community. honestly, i am putting you on ignore so whatever you say to me following this, i wont be able to read.

you are deliberately misconstruing what i said. i also find it interesting that you are ONLY misconstruing what i said, and not what almost every other lGBT person said on that thread.


i dont know, i dont care anymore. lie to yourself and to others about me as much as you want because frankly thats all you are doing: LYING.

[Bluenorthwest]

76. That link is from 2006. I was not on DU then.

In my family and circle of friends, gay parents are as numerous as straight parents, or nearly. So disrespect toward gay parents or their children would not go well around me. I don't use words like that at all. I can only recall hearing it a few times in my life, once as an insult to straights, none of whom were present and to which I took exception, a few times straight people mention the word, as was the case in that thread, and in this one, actually. A gay relation who was on child three once ironically used the term for herself.
That thread from 2006 also tried to make it seem like the word is common, when it is not., and it attempted to claim that if 'a gay person' uses a term, we all somehow own that action. If that is the case, I'll gladly trade you any of the many terms straights coined and used endlessly toward gay people. If 'a straight' said it, that means they all did, or does that logic only apply to gay people in your world? See, if gay people who do not use language like that need to get your wrath, then what of all those straight people who do not use nasty language against us? Are they also guilty in a proxy sort of way? 'One of you said f****t, so I hold it against all of you'? Is that fair? That's what you are doing. And holding that grudge for years against people who did nothing.
So I say if a person offends you, deal with that person, do not take that offense to others 'like' the person who offended you and claim they are also guilty. That is prejudice.

[yewberry]

78. I agree with what you're saying.

First, I have to acknowledge that my sensibilities are shaped by being a child of a lesbian family. I completely submit to the fact that I am perhaps oversensitive to judgment of my family by outsiders. We've always, always been the anomaly, anecdotal.

I agree that I don't hear the term 'breeder' often, and frankly, I don't care if it's used to refer to me. I'm a straight married woman, so I don't find myself in the position of having to defend myself. I'm the norm. However, in the thread in question, some people actually championed using the term 'breeder' in reference to anyone who'd had kids. That was my problem in that discussion. Put simply, I don't think it is acceptable to refer to my brave lesbian moms as breeders.

No, no one is guilty by proxy. Only people who defend further fragmentation and stratification of the LGBTQQI community are guilty of hating. In my opinion, some members of the DU2 LGBT board specifically chose to categorize some members of the queer community as 'breeders'-- sometimes people feel the need to ally themselves with the more powerful players in a given dynamic... and LGBT parents are maybe not the power group.

We are in agreement on this issue, I think. Thanks for your post.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

80. WHY are you lying about this?

that thread was about LGBT people calling STRAIGHT people breeders.

it was NOT about lGBT people calling other LGBT parents breeders.

STOP LYING.

[yewberry]

81. I am NOT lying.

That thread WAS about LGBT people calling straight people breeders. Those LGBT people then went on to assert their right to call ALL people who had children breeders, and YOU cheered and agreed. When I attempted to address the issue of using the term against people like my moms, specifically from the viewpoint of a person from a LGBT family, that was ignored.

I expressly and specifically stated that my problem with calling people breeders is that LGBT parents should never be called breeders, and you continued to disagree, stating that you stood by your assertion that anyone who breeds is a breeder.

Apparently, 2 days ago, you bothered to read what I was posting and accused me of manufacturing offense because, well, gosh, obviously, you didn't mean that your statement should actually apply to lesbians. Apparently you somehow meant that you can all anyone who breeds a breeder, except when you wouldn't call them a breeder, or something. Imagine that, suddenly when you've bothered to notice what I'm talking about you backpedal.

And I'm a liar?

Please, read what other people post before making accusations. Your blinders are a bit of a problem.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

86. yes you are a liar and you distort what happened. which makes you both manipulative and a liar. nt

[yewberry]

87. Pfft.You can't find a lie because I don't lie.

I think you only recently realized what I was talking about, and are embarrassed about not bothering to read what I was posting about.

I surely couldn't understand why you were so vehemently arguing for your right to call LGBT parents 'breeders,' because that's sort of nuts. But okay, you've cleared up that little misunderstanding by accusing me of manipulating and lying... gee, thanks.

In the future, you might be more careful with your words. I'm not a liar, and I sure as heck didn't manipulate you into saying that you feel free to call anyone who has children 'breeders.' Consider being more careful if you're going to talk shit about other people's families.

BTW, I'm done.

Best wishes, and hope we don't talk again soon.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

88. You can't in one spot prove that I called lGBT parents breeders. which is what you are accusing me

of. Hence stop lying about me.

[AsahinaKimi]

39. Mochiron!

Absolutely correct!

[DefenseLawyer]

41. But what about the roving bands of gays that roam the countryside

dragging straight married men off to their world of gayness? Shouldn't I be afraid?

[William769]

44. Only if you are afraid of a intelligent conversation & a good fashion sense.

[The Straight Story]

42. You don't have to be a woman to support adults making their own choices

On everything from abortion to whom you can have a drink with - you just have to be human and believe in a simple ideal of choice.

Choice in abortion, who you can marry, who you can sleep with, who you can have a drink with, etc.

[Skittles]

43. WOOT!!!

LONGTIME HUMAN SUPPORTER HERE!!! Yes INDEED!!

[great white snark]

45. K&R.

Well said William769. Thank you.

[Vehl]

48. well said! K&R

[Starry Messenger]

52. None of us have rights if all of us don't have rights.

Solidarity.

[William769]

53. +1.

[TBF]

58. +1 nt

[Rhiannon12866]

54. Gay rights are civil rights!

[Iggo]

65. I enthusiastically agree!

[csziggy]

66. +1000000

[Kennah]

55. When they came for the gays and lesbians, I didn't stand up because I wasn't gay.

Niemöller didn't say it, but given the hatred being expressed by some of the Frothier GOP candidates, we all need to stand up.

[Kablooie]

59. My daughter belonged to the Gay/Straight Alliance in high school.

She's not gay but always hated any kind of discrimination.
I was always proud of her for that.

[obamanut2012]

60. I know we have some DUers who are active in PFLAG

That is a terrific way to support the community, but even just not allowing friends, relatives, and coworkers to be homophobic and transphobic means so much. Just BEING THERE for someone is so important, especially a teenager.

[William769]

64. +1.

[Iggo]

61. Duh.

[LynneSin]

62. I think everyone has a bit of gayness/straightness in them

I mean to me I think I'm pretty much heterosexual but I have never ruled out a relationship with someone of the same sex.

[Ohio Joe]

67. K&R - nt