Egypt is a Mess!

[MineralMan]

The US has announced that they are halting the delivery of some fighter jets to the Egyptian military. You can read about that at this link:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014547317

That's our message of objection to the military's deposing of Morsi and the aftermath.

But that's not the issue, really. Egypt is complicated, and we don't understand it very well at all. The country, like many countries in that part of the world, is deeply divided, and there is no clear consensus about how it should be governed. That's been the case for a long time.

After the uprising there, Morsi became the leader. That didn't work so well for many people in Egypt. Others supported him. Finally, the Egyptian military, which has really been in control all along, took him out of power and installed a new puppet head of state. Morsi supporters aren't happy about that, but Morsi opponents think that's just fine.

The United States is not in the business of deciding who should lead Egypt. Or, at least, it should not be. We don't do well in directing the affairs of any Middle Eastern country, and should stop doing that. It is, finally, up to the Egyptians to figure out how their country is governed. Right now, the military is still in charge, as it has been for a very long time.

Things are ugly in Egypt. People are being killed, most of them Morsi supporters. So, the US has sent a message by withholding delivery of some much-desired fighters. That message is: Hey! Knock that shit off!

Will the Egyptian military listen? Hard to say. In any case, none of us here on DU are in Egypt. None of us has any role in Egyptian government or politics. We don't have jets we can withhold, but we can let the Egyptians figure out for themselves what their government should be.

I don't know. I doubt anyone here knows. Frankly, it's not our country. Let the people of Egypt decide. We have our own mess to fix, right here in the United States. The Egyptians will eventually get the government they get, with or without our advice. Some will like it. An equal number will probably not. This process will repeat itself more than once more.

Let's fix the US. Let Egypt work on its own problems. We aren't competent to do that.

[think]

1. It is a mess. It was a coup. And we should end military aid. (JMO)

[SoCalDem]

2. The end of empire is always ugly and with protracted violence

Our own extrication from the UK was not pretty, and lasted many years. We only have the history written by the eventual winners..

Our civil war took many years and many lives, and is not really over, even now.

[Warpy]

3. Not only that, but they had a brilliant civilization

thousands of years ago when my ancestors were still painting themselves blue and clubbing each other over the head.

Whatever eventually shakes out, people tend to tire of fighting and retire to lick their wounds sooner or later. Conflicts like this one never die completely, and resentments will be transmitted to the younger generation for use in the future. That's what the Egyptians need to fight, not the military or Morsi.

Reconciliation programs like that in post apartheid South Africa can destroy those seeds. I hope the Egyptians eventually realize that.

I have online friends there. I hope they are all right.

However, I don't have a dog in this fight. I hate to see militaries take over and form dictatorships. I hate it when theocrats have done the same, especially when winning an election got them there. They soon cancel all but low level, local elections.

They were capable of civilization before we were. I think we need to let them try to achieve it again.

[Comrade Grumpy]

4. US law requires that we end assistance to the military government.

Mealy-mouthed weasel words from the Obama administration notwithstanding.

By the way, we stopped the planes BEFORE the latest massacre began. It began AFTER the State Department said it wasn't going to call the coup a coup. Looks kind of like we gave 'em a great big green light, no?

[aquart]

5. So you have no idea what's going on but you've decided what to do.

Well, ain't you helpful.