I don't get it

[malaise]

I am an Obama supporter and I also believe that international law was violated re the President of Bolivia.

I am an Obama supporter and I have no problems with violations of constitutions or international law anywhere being exposed by whothefuckever is willing to do so.

On the other hand while all this one side or the other madness is taking over DU, the RWs are introducing their own versions of Sharia Law against the women of America.

Wake the fuck up DUers!

[hobbit709]

1. It's what the clowns that should be shortened want.

Rile up one issue voters to vote in paid stooges for the corporations. Meanwhile the other side is so busy being outraged, they're not taking the time to think and see what's really going on.

[malaise]

62. Bingo

[MH1]

2. I don't know what happened re: Pres of Bolivia

But I strongly believe the most impact, most immediately, will be felt by those subject to American Sharia as currently being enacted by the republican party everywhere they can get away with it, which has been lots of places so far.

Sure, we should be talking about some of the stuff that has been raised about the national security state. WE NEVER SHOULD HAVE STOPPED TALKING ABOUT IT.

But, when we get to real, immediate impacts on real people, right now? This American Sharia crap - along with the cutting of social welfare programs, hobbling of unions, etc. - that is killing and maiming people RIGHT NOW and will kill and maim many more. AND WE KNOW IT. It isn't some guess that it might happen in the future. WE KNOW IT. IT IS ALREADY HAPPENING NOW.

[malaise]

64. You are correct

[ananda]

3. I think that most DUers can multi-think.

And Obama needs criticizing in a rational and thoughtful manner.

But even more, the rightwing corporatism that pervades government
needs dismantling.

[Nictuku]

4. United We Stand, Divided We Fall.

[Andy823]

5. It's all about 2014

The republican party is in a state of civil war. The tea party nuts have been trying to take over the party, and they are doing all the can to accomplish that. The right wing leaders used a divide and conquer tactic back in 2010, and it seemed to work for them. They are using an updated version of the same plan, divide and conquer. Scandal after scandal for months now trying to find something that will work for them. The Snowden thing seems to be working. Right wing trolls and Paulbots have been doing a bang up job of dividing DU, along with the long time Obama haters. If they can keep people from voting next year, then they win again.

It seems like whenever something like the war on women gets posted, it gets pushed off the board by more and more threads about Snowden. It doesn't take long for those who wish to keep the subject on "their" points to jump in and do their KR on every thread they can find to bring the Snowden discussion back to the top.

Sadly it seems to be working.

[zeemike]

14. And yet the right wingers support the surveillance state.

And we must too because it will hurt Obama?...who by the way will not be on the ballot.
I don't think there is a single person here who will vote GOP because of Obama's failures...and if they do they are sock puppets or fools sent here to fool us.

[Andy823]

80. Yes they do support it

And I am sure that if they win more seats, it will be much harder to stop any abuse of power has been going on in these programs.

No we do not have to support it because it will hurt Obama. President Obama will have to face the music on his own no matter what is revealed in any investigations that point to illegal surveillance.

I agree with you that the only ones here who would vote for the GOP in 2014 are the ones that come here to fool us into thinking they are upset liberals. The ones I worry about are the ones who don't vote at all because they let these "fools" that come here work them up and make them so angry they just stay home, I believe that happened in 2010, and it could happen again.

[zeemike]

85. What will make them stay home is no one to vote for.

If our candidates are right light you can count on it.
And they seem to be good at convincing us we have to be more like them to win.

[rhett o rick]

88. And if it turns out to be Ms. Clinton vs. Gov. Christie, a lot of people will stay home. nm

[Buzz Clik]

6. Gratefully, DU represents NOTHING and NO ONE but the people here

DU does not represent Democrats. DU does not represent liberals/progressives.

This place is a mix of extreme left wing reactionaries; dozens upon dozens of rightwing trolls and moles; bored people who are always waiting for the next "outrage" to make them feel alive.

Critical thinking is rare. Science comes to DU to die. Focus is replaced by blurred vision, and attention spans are immeasurably short. DUers are notorious for having closed minds. Hysteria and hyperbole reign supreme.

[90-percent]

8. My snarky response to post #6 above

DU's population is subject to the rules of THE BELL CURVE just like any other population with measurable characteristics.

As an average person with average critical thinking abilities, I think your observations are accurate on the fringes, but, in general, (about 90% of the area in the middle of the Bell Curve) I think DU'ers are good at critical thinking and are very well informed on most things, except for the obscure stuff I like - like Zappa, MST3K and nostalgia nitro front motor dragsters.

Flame away, but I get most of my news from DU, as OP opinions or links to other good sources of info, like Thom, Amy, Palast and other non-corporate-propaganda journalists.

By the way, does Dick Armey pay you by the word or letter to post such observations at DU?

-90% Jimmy

[Buzz Clik]

10. "By the way, does Dick Armey pay you by the word or letter to post such observations at DU?"

I was ready to argue against your post until your gem that I quoted in my response title. You settled the argument for me.

Thanks!

[burnodo]

19. Is that why you're here posting every day?

If the you hate the place so much...

[Buzz Clik]

20. Another inspired post.

Well done.

[burnodo]

21. More evasion and nonsense

I guess you're part of the problem you lament

[Buzz Clik]

23. Evasion? Your post had NOTHING to do with mine.

Your post deserved only derision and ridicule. I was happy to oblige.

[burnodo]

24. You contradict yourself with every post

My post spoke directly to your post

[Buzz Clik]

27. Ok. So I'll answer your question, and then you must answer a question from me.

I post here every day because, hidden among all the stupidity, are some brilliant people. I learn from them.

Your turn: How do your posts demonstrate a departure from the attributes of the typical DUers that I criticized so heavily? Did you show insight? An open mind? Analytical thinking? Focus? Knowledge? Or, were you simply being a bitter, snarky person looking for an excuse to bite someone on the ankles?

[burnodo]

33. I'm sorry, what was the question?

[Buzz Clik]

36. You are a cliche.

Congrats. Give my best to the sphincters back at the cavern.

[burnodo]

37. Another evasion

There are brilliant here, and you're not one of them.

[Buzz Clik]

38. Now insults? How low are you going to go?

You have captured -- intentionally? -- everything wrong with DU.

Now, if you are "moling", then all is forgiven. Is that what you're doing?

[burnodo]

41. You insult people every time you post.

I guess your contradictions know no bounds

[Buzz Clik]

43. This has been truly inspirational.

Normally I cut off the mindless chatter after two responses. I gave you more rope, but you still chose to hang yourself with your own words.

Now, you get the last word. Impress us.

[burnodo]

45. I get the last word? Somehow I doubt that

Speaking of mindless...

[burnodo]

52. HAHAHAHAHAHA!

Looks like you lost

[DisgustipatedinCA]

47. Extreme left is said to be radical. Extreme right is said to be reactionary

And no, the "meet in the back of the circle" theory doesn't hold water.

[Buzz Clik]

49. Have you not been entertained by the FDR-worshipping DUers?

It's a real treat.

[Jamaal510]

96. ^^^^^^This. ^^^^^^^

[Freddie]

7. I agree

As a female, all these other issues are insignificant compared to our right of self-determination. If I have no control of my body I have no control of my life, period. And it makes my blood boil that these RWNJ woman-haters would prefer to see a woman die than to have life-saving medical treatment. Talk about being devalued as a human being.
This isn't really my fight anymore as I am beyond childbearing age; this is for my daughter and granddaughter, and all women.

[madokie]

12. Being a male

I actually can see where you girls are coming from believe it or not. Around me with the people who I know the ones who are pushing for this the strongest is the religious peeps.
How do they square that?
Damn I'm happy that I don't believe in any of that religious stuff and haven't for years now.

When I die it will be no different that when that bug hits the windshield at 60 mph, I'll simply be dead. No hell, no heaven, no after life of any kind, simply dead. Graveyard dead.

[heaven05]

16. ok

I prefer light speed. If this is all there is, we're FUCKED!!! No rhyme, no reason and no godamn purpose to our existence. Hope you're wrong.

[madokie]

17. Yup its no rhyme, no reason

just that man evolved

[madokie]

46. Why is it so important for some to have to believe

in what I see as a fantasy. I mean where is there any proof of there being anything after that hit on the windshield, so to say.
I don't mean to be demeaning to you in any way, shape or form for your beliefs as its really none of my business and I don't want it to be, just musing

Just think if there really is a heaven who is there. As a kid in the church my family went too we were taught that if you didn't belong to that kind of church, (Baptist) you were destined to go to hell. I went to my friends church (Church of God) once which was a different denomination and guess what, they were teaching the same thing. If you didn't belong to their church you weren't going to heaven. I think that was about the time that I decided I didn't need this crutch in my life so I've been free pretty much since. In my mind I just couldn't square that round hole
Spent 15 months in 'nam and never once did I break down and start praying either no matter how many rockets the NVA sent our way, for those who believe there is no atheist in foxholes.
Anyways have a glorious and happy fourth of July.
My apologies if I've been out of line

[heaven05]

72. Oh

Last edited Sat Jul 6, 2013, 12:59 PM - Edit history (2)

I'm not looking for heaven or hell, anymore. I'm looking for light speed. Energy and this body. Body DIES, rots and gone. Energy, can't "die". I just want something different after being trapped on this little, stinking and dying ball of spinning dirt while putting up with very vicious beings who have greed, presumed race, financial or class superiority over others less fortunate as their only reason for living. Starving people when there should be no one on this planet without food and housing. Greed keeps that from happening. The false value of money, paper not worth a goddamn thing causing a universe of grief. Human beings killed over oil? Closed minds need religion as described above in your thread. I don't have a religion, just the universe I live in. I'm convinced that it's too vast to mean nothing to us, as we humans are so far the only sentient beings discovered. Light speed baby! That's what I hope for with the passing of this shell of flesh from this plane of existence. If not, I won't know, so it won't mean a goddamn thing anyway. Have a good one.

[madokie]

79. Sounds like a healthy outlook

that I could embrace.
Some how I never got that greed gene. Being raised in a poor environment maybe did that, I don't know.
I do know what hunger is and what doing with out is. My hope is to not be there again but who knows it very well could be in my future.
I do share a lot of the, feelings/thoughts, like in the picture you painted so well.
Funny thing in life when I was a very young kid I used to think that I'd lived before and that I'd live again, long before I understood the teachings of a heaven and a hell so maybe for me, and for you and for all of us there is a place we've been and a place we're going too.
In the mean time I'll make the most of what I have here which is life. Love. A sense of contentment.
Peace

[dkf]

81. R v W stems from the 4th. If they can rationalize blanket surveillance what protects RvW?

[madokie]

9. Smoke and mirrors

malaise

[sheshe2]

11. I agree with your wake up call, malaise!

And I can surely understand your frustration. It's time to stand up for the real issues at hand!

"There's something happening here..."

As regular readers here know, I've been talking for awhile now about how what we're witnessing is the white male patriarchy in its death throes. Yesterday 5 Justices on the Supreme Court were the latest to lash out when they basically issued a ruling that guts the Voting Rights Act.

What I've also been suggesting is that we are in the midst of a third wave of a movement to remedy this country's original sin of slavery and racism. Of course the first was the Civil War that ended slavery and the second was the Civil Rights Movement of the 1950's and 60's that ended Jim Crow. In both of those movements white people gave African Americans legal standing. Over the course of the last 50 years, they've used those legal rights to raise themselves up. The challenge white people are facing today is that it is finally time to look African Americans (and other people of color) in the eye - face to face as equals. And even occasionally see them as our leaders. That's not going down real well. And so the dying beast is lashing out.

snip

For quite a while now President Obama has been trying to light a fire under us - telling us that we need to engage as citizens in this democracy. I'd say its time we started watching the good people of Texas and the folks participating in North Carolina's Moral Monday movement. As the song says..."There's something happening here. What it is ain't exactly clear."

Somebody noticed.

http://immasmartypants.blogspot.com/2013/06/theres-something-happening-here.html

I posted that here...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251313382

[malaise]

65. I hope so

Good post

[sheshe2]

95. I feel it malaise,

I really do.

It will take time, however people are paying attention. They are waking up and are making themselves heard.

[Skidmore]

90. I heartily agree with your thoughtful assessment.

Thanks for that post.

[Fumesucker]

13. The NSA arguments here on DU would never have happened in 2006

Other than freeper trolls DU was united against government spying.

It's those who are arguing *for* government spying who are keeping the issue so hotly contested here, there isn't a similar contingent arguing for an anti-choice position on abortion, if there were then abortion would be much more of a hot button topic.

[alarimer]

25. It's because it's "our" side that's doing.

For a lot of people (but by no means all or even most), "It's okay if a Democrat is doing it." This is disheartening to me. I had no idea there were so many people so tied to party affiliation that they would accept anything that party would do. I mean, I expect that from Republicans, but Democrats? I thought they were smarter than that. I guess not.

[randome]

30. And you think you have some kind of higher moral ground, is that it?

Is this why you referred to those holding different opinions as 'People? Assumes facts not in evidence.'

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023160893#post34

You may want to apply some duct tape to that glass house of yours.

[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]I'm always right. When I'm wrong I admit it.
So then I'm right about being wrong.[/center][/font]
[hr]

[Fumesucker]

39. I was being generous and assuming that no thinking person would post something that stupid

My post was also somewhat in jest, based on the news that software exists specifically for the purpose of invading forums with lots of sock puppets for propaganda purposes.

Interesting that you didn't dispute my assertion that there wouldn't have been an argument about government spying here in 2006, just like the anti-choice position isn't argued for here today.

[randome]

42. It was a poor jest. And I couldn't care less about 2006. This is 2013.

Facts and evidence are what matter. Now and always.

[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]I'm always right. When I'm wrong I admit it.
So then I'm right about being wrong.[/center][/font]
[hr]

[Fumesucker]

44. The fact is that the argument about government spying is because of who holds the executive

If it was Romney in the Oval Office the conversation over government spying would be greatly different here on DU and everyone knows it.

I guess an OP laughing over whatever it was that happened to Morales plane was in better taste?

[randome]

48. No, it was not. Neither are the posts celebrating 'authoritarian angst'...

...or 'watching authoritarian gatekeepers'.

There are culprits on all 'sides' and it has reached a point where the only 'points' being made are tallied as warnings for newcomers to avoid DU.

[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]I'm always right. When I'm wrong I admit it.
So then I'm right about being wrong.[/center][/font]
[hr]

[sibelian]

63. Actually, if anything...

The place appears to have become somewhat more attractive to newcomers.

There's life in the old gal yet.

[randome]

66. It would be interesting if the admins could give us monthly numbers.

And comparisons with previous months/years.

Just for curiosity's sake. I don't think that information is available anywhere, is it?

[hr]
[font color="blue"][center]I'm always right. When I'm wrong I admit it.
So then I'm right about being wrong.[/center][/font]
[hr]

[rhett o rick]

92. Dont wrestle a pig in mud. Just sayin. nm

[heaven05]

15. yep

good for you. +1000 on "wake the fuck up DUers!"

[nadinbrzezinski]

18. I will ask you this

You think we are not paying attention?

The goal of republicans is to get a case to SCOTUS to overturn roe...this is is what all these laws are about.

[malaise]

58. Some folks are not paying attention

Same shite went down in 2010

[ProSense]

22. No one

wants to have a rational discussion.

It's all hyperbole and personal attacks.

I mean, what is the point of demanding the President abandon his entire cabinet? That's beyond futile.

The entire Snowden incident has become an international tug of war by design. Snowden left the country intentionally to shift the focus. The goal was never really a debate about the NSA. It was to try embarrass the U.S. internationally.

Without the international aspect, a reasonable debate would likely have happened.

Domestically since 2010, other than a blame game about why Republicans won, there are those who refuse to focus on the RW. Everything wrong in their frame is Obama's doing. The focus is so intense that they spend their energies even trying to destroy any credit for positive things the President does. It's all about destroying his character and framing him as a failure, and they are very loud about it.

The President just won re-election in a landslide, but he will still continue to be criticized. That is to be expected. What's bizarre is the focus on tearing him down when the next elections are again about preventing RW gains and reversing the attacks on minorities, the poor and women.

[malaise]

26. 2014 is the focus

and we'd better remember that. Divide and rule is the usual con.

[alarimer]

28. The media's focusing on Snowden is a diversionary tactic and you are falling for it.

We need to be discussing what he and others have revealed about the security state this nation has become and not focusing on the personalities involved.

Do you not care that we are a police state? That your government apparently thinks the Constitution is little more than window-dressing? Do you think they should be able to spy on us without regard to civil liberties? And our allies? THAT is what we should be discussing.

Look at Mannning's treatment. Look at the way Obama has treated other whistle-blowers (while, I might ass, allowing leaks that show him in a good light).

[ProSense]

31. Oh please,

"The media's focusing on Snowden is a diversionary tactic and you are falling for it."

...everyone is "focusing on Snowden."

Greenwald, Wikileaks, Amnesty...everyone.

The posts that declare him a hero and/or deserving of asylum are all "focusing on Snowden."

He made himself the story.

[Blanks]

97. I thought everyone already knew the government was spying on us.

Of course Snowden is the story, the debate seems to be over whether he is a hero or a moron.

Anybody that thinks that the government couldn't track you every minute of the day if they wanted to; should watch more television.

The Snowden story demonstrates one thing though. While they can follow our every move, when it comes to using that information to (for example) keep us from moving freely about the world - apparently they are just piling up the information and using it to stop real life criminals is still in the future.

If anything that's what we've learned from Snowden. Irony is still alive and well.

We need to spend more time talking about getting these bat-shit crazy anti-abortion state legislatures back in the hands of people who want to make it a better world. We need to discuss how we can take advantage of the fact that the republican controlled house spends all their time holding votes to repeal obamacare instead of working for the people. These are the important issues IMHO.

We need a Snowden forum so that the obsessed have some place special to play.

[nradisic]

29. Amen

I agree wholeheartedly...

[spanone]

32. k&r...

[malaise]

57. Hi there

Long time no see

[spanone]

59. hey malaise....

working too much to participate...i'll be back!!!!

[99Forever]

34. I can walk AND chew gum at the same time.

And I'd like to think I'm not the only one capable of doing so.

The really bad shit going on, on several fronts, that's no news flash.

There's a fair number of us that have been WIDE AWAKE for years but have been told to STFU 'cuz "our hair is on fire."

Welcome to the club.

[PADemD]

35. Islam and Abortion - When abortion is permissible

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_and_abortion#When_abortion_is_permissible

Among Muslims, the permissibility of abortion depends on factors such as time and extenuating circumstances.

Before four months of gestation
Threat to the woman's life
Rape
Fetal deformity

[Motown_Johnny]

40. Exactly what international law are you referring to?

As I understand it, airspace is cleared for heads of state as a courtesy and not by law. It may have been a breach of protocol to deny his plane entrance into their airspace but I don't think it was a violation of law.

[Amonester]

50. We have plenty 'amateur' prosecutor, 'amateur' judge & 'amateur' jury.

They 'amuse' themselves while the tearorists burn down the house.

[progressoid]

53. We're awake, thank you very much.

[DirkGently]

54. That's because you think critically & put principle over politics. Silly.

[morningfog]

55. I agree with this 100%. Every word.

[Kurovski]

56. K&R

Reps offices need to hear from us, and the time to organize against those responsible is now.

They lie and they pass this anti-woman crap in the dead of night.

[malaise]

61. Hi there CL

[Kurovski]

67. Happy Fort!

[malaise]

68. LOL

What to a slave is the Fort???

Enjoy my brother

[Kurovski]

70. You can make one with cushions, or barring that...

cardboard boxes.

happy belated Junteenth! We're due another one any day now.

[malaise]

71. Getting up off the floor

[Kurovski]

75. You

always cheer me up, you sweet sugar beet.

An extra ration of potatoes and cracked bulgur for the malaise commune.

And beets!!

[malaise]

77. Wel I won't blow up the BBQ with those

Hehehehhe

[Skittles]

60. you're a THINKING Obama supporter

not a swooner

[Kurovski]

76. You make me swoon!

And skittle.

[Skittles]

78. YOU WANT I SHOULD KICK YOUR SWOONING ASS, KUROVSKI???

[Kurovski]

91. Of course!

[Major Hogwash]

69. Sharia don't like it!!!

Rock the Kasbah!
Rock the Kasbah!

[freshwest]

73. Agree with all of it. It's been my point exactly.

[RainDog]

74. amen n/t

[Number23]

82. I've not read anything yet by anyone I consider to be even remotely credible that suggests that

the president had anything to do with Morale's plane.

But I agree with the rest of your statement especially about the RW madness that is taking over while people nit pick and worry about the stupidest things here. And there has been very little discussion about what the Repubs are doing right now, but I sincerely believe that is exactly the intent.

[felix_numinous]

83. There is only one sane party

to belong to, so with the Democratic Party now accommodating a wider spectrum of ideologies, this has created infighting amongst members who all feel their brand of D is more authentic.

But what is needed is for the US to have at least 2 viable parties so that people from each place on the spectrum can petition for representation directly.

See what has happened? One party melts down( I say it has gone into stealth mode) while the other party is thrown into an identity crisis.

This is how I see it.

[malaise]

84. The Democratic Party has always been a big tent party

The problems are linked to ReTHUGs pretending to be Dems

[felix_numinous]

86. Yes

I'm trying to find a respectful way to say it. My parents were Republicans, not racist, for fiscal responsibility, moderation in all things, religious but tolerant, loved science, for preservation of environment--and fairly reasonable... But they were definitely not liberals.

Now the liberals are being pushed out by our own party-- so where do we go?

[malaise]

87. In a few historical moments it will be very cool to be liberal again

Humanity will not accept this madness

[felix_numinous]

89. That is music

to read-- I certainly HOPE so! And soon!

Happy 4th malaise!

[Art_from_Ark]

94. I wish I could share your optimism

But I have been waiting for that magic moment for 30+ years, and when it finally seems to materialize, like in 1986 or 1992, it, like the Big Band Revival, seems to fizzle out pretty fast.

[Blue_Roses]

93. ...the voice of reason...

Thank-you!