LOL - The Tale of the Re-Routed Bolivian President's Plane Is Falling Apart

[Cali_Democrat]

I'm sure even more will come out. Will I stop debunking the fake Bolivian plane scandal?

Not a chance!!!

From the Atlantic:

The Tale of the Re-Routed Bolivian President's Plane Is Falling Apart
PHILIP BUMP JUL 3, 2013

As you may have heard by now, Bolivian president Evo Morales supposedly had a tough time flying from home from Moscow last night after France, Portugal, Italy, and Spain refused to allow his plane to enter their airspace and Austria forced his plane to land and searched it. Except: Much of that reporting comes from a single source, the Bolivian government, and some of it has been contradicted.

<...>

Two officials with the French Foreign Ministry said Wednesday that Morales' plane had authorization to fly over France. They would not comment on why Bolivian officials said otherwise. They spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to be publicly named according to ministry policy.

An official with Spain's foreign ministry said Wednesday that the country on Tuesday authorized Morales' plane to fly within its airspace and to make a refueling stop. The official said Bolivia asked again this morning for permission and got it.

http://www.theatlanticwire.com/global/2013/07/tale-re-routed-bolivian-presidents-plane-falling-apart/66838/

Cheers!

[Tarheel_Dem]

1. Gee, I wonder why they would report false news? Hmmmm. The plot thickens....

Was it a head fake? Since there have been no sightings, do we know if Comrade is still in Russia? Was it an attempt to enter the fray? I mean, how often does anyone talk about the President of Bolivia? Maybe he & Correa are vying to replace Chavez as Latin America's most vocal anti US zealot? I hear it's all the rage.

[MADem]

30. People made shit up is what happened. Evo's pilots were low on fuel.

They asked for a flight plan deviation. Euro ATC doesn't like those, and they probably WERE suspicious that Evo might try to dump Snowden on them, given all of his yukking about it back in Moscow.

The pilot never declared an emergency, just that he had a low fuel state, so the ATC sent the plane to the nearest airport able to handle all their requirements (foreign plane with a dignitary on it):

http://www.flightradar24.com/2013-07-02/16:35/FAB1

They were probably irritated that they had to backtrack a bit, but they were the ones who demanded a deviation from their filed flight plan.

Additionally:

Update, Thursday: According to a statement from Portugal's Ministry of Foreign Affairs excerpted by Negocios Online (and translated by a reporter that contacted us), Portugal and Bolivia went back and forth for two days over how Morales' plane might use Portuguese airspace. On Monday, Portugal told Bolivia it could fly over Portugal but not stop and refuel in Lisbon due to "technical reasons." The Bolivia pilots insisted on including that stop in their flight plan; Portugal again said it wasn't possible. Eventually, the Bolivian plane asked to fly over Portuguese territory to land in Las Palmas, a territory of Spain of the West African coast. That request was granted.

The Ministry of Foreign Affairs ends its statement by saying, in essence: Sorry for the inconvenience, but you had 24 hours to develop an alternate route, and didn't.

http://www.theatlanticwire.com/global/2013/07/tale-re-routed-bolivian-presidents-plane-falling-apart/66838/

This did 'up' Evo's Q Score by leaps and bounds--no wonder he's smiling:

[HiPointDem]

2. yeah, everyone is lying but the us media. those noted purveyors of wmds and other facts.

[Tx4obama]

3. IMO, best part is the AUDIO on link in the OP - pilot requested to land due to fuel gauge problems

Control tower: Do you need any assistance?

Pilot: Not at this moment. We need to land because we cannot get a correct indication of the fuel indication so as a precaution we need to land.

So, basically Morales and pilots spent the night in Austria while the plane was being fixed

Happy 4th everyone

[Cha]

7. But, please tell me how Pres Obama made that

happen?

[Tx4obama]

8. I'm afraid I can't help you will that, but maybe some of the Snowdenbots have a theory ;)

[fasttense]

54. Those anti-Snowdens, NSAbots, just like to create distractions

So no one talks about how the NSA contractors illegally spied on all Americans. It keeps everyone talking about Snowden and NOT talking about how America has become a country where political dissidents have to run from instead of run to.

[treestar]

59. Do you realize how absurd that sounds?

Political dissidents are in the US running their mouths day and night and nothing happens to them.

Snowdenbots are the ones posting the most threads on how poor President Morales had to make a fuel stop in his private plane and why it's the fault of the US.

[MNBrewer]

60. Do you fail to see the difference between a political dissident and a whistleblower/leaker?

[treestar]

64. You did not read the post I responded to

which referred to the alleged political dissidents running away to asylum in other countries (like China/Russia, etc., where political dissidents are better controlled.)

[Cali_Democrat]

17. Thanks, Tex

People think they can stop all discussion on this and intimidate other DUers.

Not. A. Fucking. Chance.

No Ma'am.

Happy 4th!!

[freshwest]

65. Simplifies it. Happy 4th to you, too.

[HangOnKids]

4. Evo thanks you for caring so deeply

How is Hong Kong Eddie?

[Douglas Carpenter]

5. Snowden case: France apologises to Bolivia over plane row

Source: BBC

France has apologised to Bolivia for refusing to allow President Evo Morales' jet into its airspace, blaming "conflicting information".

Bolivia accused France, Italy, Spain and Portugal of blocking the plane.

It said some wrongly believed US fugitive Edward Snowden was on board.

Speaking in Berlin, French President Francois Hollande said he granted permission as soon as he knew it was Mr Morales' plane.

President Morales was flying back to Bolivia from Moscow when the plane was forced to stop in Vienna.

Angry reactions

The French foreign ministry issued a statement on the incident.

Ministry spokesman Philippe Lalliot said: "The foreign minister called his Bolivian counterpart to tell him about France's regrets after the incident caused by the late confirmation of permission for President Morales' plane to fly over territory."


Read more: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-23174874

[Hekate]

6. The plot thickens. Now let's see: who does it serve to peddle one fake scandal after another?

I'd like to have a substantive discussion about the NSA et al., minus the apocalyptic hysteria and amnesia regarding anything before January 2009.

In the meantime, one fake scandal after another seems to keep Short Attention Span Media and their audiences (including DU) preoccupied.

So, who does that serve?

[Tx4obama]

9. The REPUBLICANS !!! :)

LOL

[pnwmom]

66. Don't forget the Libertarians! n/t

[Spitfire of ATJ]

11. "So, who does that serve?"

Have you noticed nobody is talking about background checks or high capacity magazines any more?

[Hekate]

13. Indeed

[Number23]

15. EXACTAMUNDO

[markpkessinger]

10. Perhaps you should check the later updates to this story . . .

. . . Just sayin'.

[Tx4obama]

14. There is an update on the link up in the OP and there is also AUDIO of the pilot. n/t

[markpkessinger]

19. So what did France apologize to Bolivia for exactly? n/t

[MADem]

40. They "regretted" giving late permission for a "fly over."

But nothing is being said about landing and refueling--and they didn't have permission to do that.

They also didn't have permission to refuel in continental Spain, OR Portugal.

So...where else are they gonna go? They're IN Austria, they need fuel--they were rerouted to the closest airport able to accommodate them (and likely the closest one with VIP facilities, as well).

[rusty fender]

12. If Evo Morales is lying about his plane being denied

permission to fly through 4 countries' air space, and having his plane searched, then why would the U.S. present Bolivia with an extradition request for Snowden?

And, why would France apologize to Bolivia for denying Morales's plane passage through its air space if Morales made it all up?

http://actualidad.rt.com/actualidad/view/99109-eeuu-bolivia-solicitud-extradicion-snowden

[Tx4obama]

18. I thought I read somewhere that The USA has issued extradition requests to several countries?

Regarding Portugal...

Update, Thursday: According to a statement from Portugal's Ministry of Foreign Affairs excerpted by Negocios Online (and translated by a reporter that contacted us), Portugal and Bolivia went back and forth for two days over how Morales' plane might use Portuguese airspace. On Monday, Portugal told Bolivia it could fly over Portugal but not stop and refuel in Lisbon due to "technical reasons." The Bolivia pilots insisted on including that stop in their flight plan; Portugal again said it wasn't possible. Eventually, the Bolivian plane asked to fly over Portuguese territory to land in Las Palmas, a territory of Spain of the West African coast. That request was granted.

The Ministry of Foreign Affairs ends its statement by saying, in essence: Sorry for the inconvenience, but you had 24 hours to develop an alternate route, and didn't.

http://www.theatlanticwire.com/global/2013/07/tale-re-routed-bolivian-presidents-plane-falling-apart/66838/

Good info also on the link above regarding France.

[MADem]

32. LOOK at your source!! It is Russia Today En Espanol!

The very SAME Russia Today that has Correa calling the Guardian Newspaper a bunch of big fat liars...!

http://actualidad.rt.com/actualidad/view/99156-rafael-correa-snowden-asilo

So....who's stirring the pot, here?

Keep in mind, nothing goes in RT that Pootie Poot doesn't approve. Nothing. It is a wholly owned subsidiary and propaganda arm of the Russian government--no matter what language it is published in.

[Democracyinkind]

16. The fact that France closed its airspace is not in dispute.

They freely admit it. The part in question is the motivation for doing so.

[MADem]

43. Because the pilot was declaring a low fuel state.

The pilot had permission to fly OVER France, not land and refuel.

And since the pilot did not have permission to refuel in Spain proper, or Lisbon, letting him transit France would be passing the fuel issue on to those countries.

The best solution was for the a/c to top off before continuing on, and that's what they told him to do--top off in Austria, which is where he was when all this went down.

[muriel_volestrangler]

55. No - see my reply to you in the other thread

The audio shows that when the pilot says he needs to land as a precaution, the plane is already heading for Vienna - they reply "continue your current heading". The recording is after the plane has turned back.

[Tx4obama]

20. Morales, a leftist, has long been a fierce critic of U.S. policy toward Latin America...

LA PAZ, Bolivia (AP) -- Bolivian President Evo Morales called the rerouting of his plane over suspicions that National Security Agency leaker Edward Snowden was aboard a provocation to Latin America and urged European countries to "free themselves" from the United States.

His presidential plane arrived home in Bolivia's capital late Wednesday night following an unplanned 14-hour layover in Vienna. His government said France, Spain and Portugal all refused to let it through their airspace, forcing it to land in Austria. He had been flying home from a summit in Russia.

-snip-

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/L/LT_NSA_SURVEILLANCE_BOLIVIA?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2013-07-04-03-56-33

Bull !!!

He was NOT forced to land in Austria.

His pilot requested to land in Austria due to fuel gauge problems! The request is on tape!

I wouldn't believe anything Morales says.

[AtheistCrusader]

24. I notice you steadfastly refuse to acknowledge any post that brings up France's apology

to the Bolivian President over the airspace CLOSURE.

Nice try though.

[Scootaloo]

28. You'll keep noticing it, too

At least they're not claiming the moscow roadmap is the flight path, like that other poster was.

[Aerows]

61. That was an epic

spectacular fail.

Then watching other posters jump in and try to "explain" what it really meant ...

[Ash_F]

31. It's kind of amazing isn't it?

But if you keep repeating a lie, people will believe. Well some of them will. Maybe they consider that much as having been effective.

[Ash_F]

36. That's why lawyers, PR agents and sociopaths know not to ever apologize, btw

Even if the facts are obviously against a persons case, they can maintain some small deniability if they never apologize. Even if it only convinces 1 in 10 people, that's better than 0 in 10. Who cares if you lose all self-respect in the process?

[Spider Jerusalem]

21. Nice try, but, no

The President of France, commenting on the issue:

“There was conflicting information about the passengers who were on board,” said the French president, François Hollande. “When I knew it was the plane of the Bolivian president, I immediately gave permission for it to fly” over French territory, he said.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/04/world/snowden.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

There are important things to note in this statement. First, "conflicting information about...who was on board". Second, "I immediately gave permission". In the first place, it's hard to imagine why an aircraft with a filed flight plan would be denied entry to French airspace, unless...they thought Snowden was on the plane, and they were complying with a US request. Second, it's hard to imagine that something of this nature would be so high-level as for the president to be the one making the call, personally, unless, again, they thought it was Snowden and were complying with a US request. The French statement is entirely consistent with what Morales has said.

[annabanana]

38. +1 ... n/t

[Ash_F]

22. Care to change your thread title, in light of recent revelations? /nt

[Cali_Democrat]

23. The thread title is the title of the article

And Morales' story is completely falling apart. They stopped in Austria because of fuel gauge issues.

[temmer]

25. and the Earth is flat. Amen.

[Cali_Democrat]

27. The audio lies?

Right.

[AtheistCrusader]

44. The audio doesn't tell the whole story.

It doesn't tell us what the original flight plan/fuel range was. Doesn't tell us how long they loitered in the air burning fuel.

It especially doesn't tell us why France has formally apologized for the whole thing.
France wasn't talking about the fuel gauge when they issued that apology.

[MADem]

35. Something's a bit flat, all right--like the protestations of a certain Bolivian...

Two officials with the French Foreign Ministry said Wednesday that Morales' plane had authorization to fly over France. They would not comment on why Bolivian officials said otherwise. They spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to be publicly named according to ministry policy.

An official with Spain's foreign ministry said Wednesday that the country on Tuesday authorized Morales' plane to fly within its airspace and to make a refueling stop. The official said Bolivia asked again this morning for permission and got it. She spoke on condition of anonymity because of department rules.

http://news.yahoo.com/snowden-case-france-denies-blocking-bolivia-plane-090257428.html

[Ash_F]

37. Old story. Here is a newer one

"France has apologised to Bolivia for refusing to allow President Evo Morales' jet into its airspace, blaming "conflicting information"

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-23174874

[MADem]

39. The problem was that he had a flight plan to fly OVER France, not land, and

the pilot was declaring a low fuel state. That was the "conflicting information" no matter what spin they try to put on it.

Portugal, for whatever reason, told Bolivia they could overfly but not refuel in Lisbon. Nonetheless, the pilot tried repeatedly to push for a fuel stop in Lisbon. Portugal told them to pound sand, that they'd told them previously no, and 'no means no.'

It is my firm belief that a lot of this imbroglio has as much to do with squirrelly flight plans, and unauthorized deviations (under the umbrella of Snowden suspicion) as anything else.

What was the end result of all this? Who has a higher profile? Who's 'WINNING!' Cui bono?



Born at night...but not last night! The catbird seat is plenty comfy! The publicity this guy managed to garner is far better than anything Paris Hilton or one of those Kardashians could dream up...

At the end of the day, though, it's still less likely than more that he'll offer Moscow Eddie room at the inn...

[Ash_F]

41. I don't know about that

"At the end of the day, though, it's still less likely than more that he'll offer Moscow Eddie room at the inn"

I think all this just makes them more likely to do so, not less. Not just out of spite, but out of the notion that Snowden was right about these nations abusing their power. Make no mistake, the US and former colonial European countries still have a lot of power over Latin America.

If not Ecuador, then possibly another Latin American country. They seem pretty united on this.

[MADem]

48. Time will tell.

They don't seem united at all. Correa has told him to piss up a rope, essentially, and Maduro has weasel-worded, but he's not jumping to help the guy out, either.

Eddie brings nothing but trouble with him. He's a malcontent and his "story" isn't holding together very well.

Evo knows who his largest non-energy trading partner is...and it ain't Snowden.

I think Eddie will have a need to learn Russian before he ever needs to learn Spanish. That's if he doesn't throw in the towel and come home, or go to North Korea.

[Ash_F]

29. Wow, you are commited.

"They stopped in Austria because of fuel gauge issues."

OK, and your point is?

This is not disputed nor relevant to anything the French NOR the Bolivians have said. Do you fully comprehend the story? Or are you just grasping?

[Ash_F]

34. France has already apologized for CLOSING its airspace.

Whether or not the plane needed repairs is completely irrelevant to that issue. Actually, it makes France look worse if the plane was having problems.

But do try to keep up.

[Ash_F]

45. I am slightly annoyed that the poster was hidden because I wanted to see their answer to this.

Oh well, it probably would not have made sense anyway.

[AtheistCrusader]

47. That was probably intentional.

[AtheistCrusader]

46. Now I understand the 9/11 twoofers.

Nevermind that France has formally issued an apology for closing their airspace. That doesn't matter/didn't happen because the FUEL GAUGE.... and oh yeah, there's audio taken out of context of the pilot talking about the gauge and not closed airspace, so therefore the airspace wasn't closed even though the PRESIDENT OF FRANCE APOLOGIZED and admitted issuing a direct order to OPEN that airspace to that aircraft.

it was all the fuel gauge man.


argh

[cantbeserious]

26. My Take - There Is Significant Backpedaling In Play By The West

eom

[East Coast Pirate]

42. This is how religions get started.

Willful misinformation.

They rerouted his plane. Why make stories up?

Bolivian plane rerouted on Snowden suspicions

MOSCOW — NSA leaker Edward Snowden's prospects for political asylum abroad narrowed rapidly Tuesday after he withdrew his request to Russia and almost half of the 21 countries on his request list have turned him down.

Meantime, France and Portugal refused to let a plane carrying Bolivian President Evo Morales into their airspace because of suspicions that Snowden, a former National Security Agency contractor, was on board. The plane was rerouted to Austria, said Bolivian foreign minister David Choquehuanca. The official denied Snowden was on board.

"We don't know who invented this lie, but we want to denounce to the international community this injustice with the plane of President Evo Morales," Choquehuanca said.

The developments involving Snowden continued globally. The former contractor abandoned his request for asylum in Russia after President Vladimir Putin said Monday that he must stop his anti-American activity.

More: http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2013/07/02/snowden-russia-asylum/2481831/

[MADem]

49. That is two days old. The facts are that the pilot tried to deviate from his filed flight plan,

and Euro ATC wasn't having it. He kept trying to get a refuel in Lisbon, and Portugal had told him twice that the answer was NO.

That's what the story is behind this, and it is pretty well borne out by what is in this article: http://www.theatlanticwire.com/global/2013/07/tale-re-routed-bolivian-presidents-plane-falling-apart/66838/

[East Coast Pirate]

50. Refused to let a head of state's plane land because of a technicality?

Please.

[MADem]

51. Please, indeed. I have personal experience with European Air Traffic Control.

And you'd better be declaring an emergency if you deviate from your flight plan, and it doesn't matter who in hell you are.

[East Coast Pirate]

53. Yes it does matter who you are.

Why else would we have diplomatic immunity?

[jeff47]

62. Diplomatic immunity does not extend to flight plans. (nt)

[Luminous Animal]

67. Not much on DU makes me laugh out loud but that did. Thanks.

[idwiyo]

52. Another one of Epic Fail OPs. Keep ignoring the facts though! Well done!

[Iliyah]

56. Thanks Cali_Democrat!

And you are correct.

And HAPPY 4TH OF JULY where the true meaning of "Tea Party" and "Paul Revere" are honorable re: freedom, patriotism, and love of country and its people.

[Bonobo]

57. This reminds me of how Fox News viewers live in their own reality. nt

[Warren Stupidity]

58. you have to admire someone who not only doubles down, but triples down, even after

having been humiliated by the facts, those stubborn facts.

And having your very small chorus too!

But who are you fooling? Nobody here anymore.

[DisgustipatedinCA]

63. How's the tale of France's apology doing?